I do, thanks. The usd only refunds was added only during the last month, anyway.

They went on for months saying that the refund would have been of the same BTC amount, and they never said the opposite for batch 1. What changed is the ToS for new customers.
However, this is a non issue, they will deliver the first batch. The problem is the MPP.

They must have been influenced by the competition, the Terraminer.
(i thought that it was wanted when i read it)

99.999% that they will deliver by the end of the year. We should have had our address changed to Antarctica to hope that DHL couldn't reach us in time.

I don't know, but this is how i see it:
If a company screws it's customers and then closes shop, customers can go against what the company owns. The company can't give what he owns away to it's shareholders, because the shareholders are part of the company and are part of the people that have to pay for the company screwing customers.

I mean, you can't stole the candies and then says that you can't get the candies back because i you to give them to the people who sent you to stole candies.

Ok, then we will organise group buys at costs from TSMC after that we have taken away a little % to recover our HF losses...
Would you mind to expand your answer? Thanks.

@jspielberg, if they didn't do everything necessary to have every single component needed by november at the latest, they have lost.

Remeber that the PCB was designed and manufactured and they where gonna send us pictures of it in a few days (back in middle OCTOBER), but that moment never come due to... NDA contracts whose contracts where covered by a NDA as well? It's freking ridiculous, and it's oblivious that this is an incredible starting point for us.

If we are not gonna get every single BTC that we paid back, we are __all__ gonna use __fractions__ of the revenues to pay for first class lawyers to rip them off.

Worst case scenario? We will own the IP of the chip and it will be the first open source RTL (maybe we could just organise group buys directly to the FAB, where every detail is public and we get a % to recover our losses).

What makes me wonder the most about HF? Their stupidity about continuously releasing proofs to use against them. I mean, there must be a reason for that. They must be really self confident. (and that must be john, but don't worry john, we will fix that).

Yes, i also think that contract to be our best and easiest way to definitively prove their intentions.
Personally, i think that it will be really easy to have a judge to force them to so, i mean, what's the problem with sharing the delivery date TSMC promised on the contract if they have nothing to hide?
I can't see anyone in good faith denying you to do so, especially after all of the BS they told us that we can prove.

I mean, they have lost even before starting.

That's also true.

So what's the goal of that point in the contract, apart from scaring possible customers from participating in a class action against them and finally have them to be even more angry at you?

This is so much fun. So the contract says that they can't have any class action against them? Am i reading it correctly? This is really so much fun...
To bad that there are at least 10 customers out there that will happily go on by their own, even if that point had anything legal in it...

Can we sue them for putting illegal points on their terms of sales terms and conditions of sales, too?

HF_CL must be a complete idiot.

He thinks that he can calm down the community this way, but the only thing he does is to give the community even more reasons to be afraid of the future. With this rise on the bitcoin price, and with this many customers that ordered several machines, it will be awesome to see how this evolves.

Who cares about this topic? I won't ever reference this topic, that's for sure... And btw, given the right amount of "willingness", this thread isn't that bad to read.

BS and you know it.

I think that they do have a good idea of what is gonna happen on the legal side once that it will be evident to everyone how much they screwed us by delaying the MPP as well. Everyone, and by everyone i mean everyone, will want to sue HF. I'm not day dreaming, it's the plain and simple truth.

No. They are out sourcing the assembly in canada. That's all. All what you will find is an outsurced assembly house. Do you really want to go there?

They have nothing in canada. Don't waste your time.

No, i changed my sign today, so that can't be the case. Actually, i changed it twice today, from lied to laid and from laid to lied again (i got it right the first time). Anyway, this is just a bit of an useless ot

E' la magia del bitcoin miner. E' una cosa assurda, e ci cascano tutti, dal primo all'ultimo dei cretini (io stesso, da grande cretino).
Sarà una qualche sindrome da investitore, non so.

color: red was beaten by background-color: lightgreen.

Can you believe that i went to this page before writing it and yet i got it wrong? http://web.ku.edu/~edit/lie.html
I guess that this time i will just use google translate. Thanks.

@Jutarul, while i understand and i agree completely with you (i'm just waiting for them to see when they ship the MPP to decide whenever or not i should pay the retainer), i think that while HF should be less talky talky and more shippy shippy, we customers should be less talky talky and more "sue" sue-tty them.

If we don't do that, well, why should they even bother? They got it completely right, the results they got from studying BFL was perfect.