Bitcoin Forum
May 01, 2024, 10:46:34 AM *
News: Latest Bitcoin Core release: 27.0 [Torrent]
 
  Home Help Search Login Register More  
  Show Posts
Pages: « 1 ... 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 52 53 54 55 56 57 58 59 60 61 62 63 64 65 66 67 68 69 70 71 72 73 74 [75] 76 77 78 79 80 81 82 83 84 85 86 87 88 89 90 91 92 93 94 95 96 97 98 99 100 101 102 103 104 105 106 107 108 109 110 111 112 113 114 115 116 117 118 119 120 121 122 123 124 125 ... 212 »
1481  Other / Politics & Society / Re: Anyone following the ebola outbreak? on: September 04, 2014, 07:03:29 PM
http://www.livescience.com/47685-ebola-outbreak-duration-prediction.html

"Grim Ebola Prediction: Outbreak Is Unstoppable for Now, MD Says"

Quote
A doctor who just returned from treating Ebola patients in West Africa predicts the current Ebola outbreak will go on for more than a year, and will continue to spread unless a vaccine or other drugs that prevent or treat the disease are developed.

Zero chance of that.  Vaccines take a long time to develop, and then you have to grow, produce, test and distribute them.  Not going to happen within a year even with massive investment.

Quote
"I don't believe that our traditional methods of being able to control and stop outbreaks in rural areas … is going to be effective in most of the cities," Lucey said yesterday (Sept. 3) in a discussion held at Georgetown University Law Center that was streamed online. While the World Health Organization has released a plan to stop Ebola transmission within six to nine months, "I think that this outbreak is going to go on even longer than a year," Lucey said.

Yes, longer than a year, and it is likely that it will spread.  There is a lot of misplaced anger.  People think that America is in control of everything and should have "done something".  Others will blame EU or China (they are heavily invested in Africa) or whomever is getting the natural resources.  There will be angry infected people who need serious help but are not going to get it.
The medical resources are already stretched thinly, this is going to break them.  It kills doctors and nurses more than anyone.

Those with the capability to do something and are thinking that this is "someone else's problem" are wrong.  If you are in a city, it will be your problem sooner or later.

Quote
This large Ebola outbreak could have been prevented with an effective public health response at the beginning, said Lawrence Gostin, director of the O'Neill Institute for National and Global Health Law at Georgetown University. But the weak health systems of the affected countries left them unprepared to respond to the outbreak, Gostin said.

The international community should have been more generous in supporting poorer countries so they could develop the response capacities needed to contain the outbreak, Gostin and colleagues wrote in a recent briefing for the O'Neill Institute.

To help with the current outbreak, and prevent future ones, Gostin called for the establishment of an international "health systems fund," which would be supported by high-resource countries. The money would be used to strengthen the health systems in those countries, he said.

Oh yeah, give governments your money.  As if they need it and don't have as much as they can print already, as well as the ability to take it from everyone they want to.   If you are going to make a difference, you are going to have to do something yourself.  If you have the will and a way to do that, then "Government" may throw some of that money at you and give you the responsibility to choose who lives and who dies.  This is already deeply into triage due to resource constraints (mainly human resource).  Waiting for "government" to solve it isn't going to help until too late.  Not until their voters care and an election is looming and by then it will be far too late.
1482  Economy / Speculation / Re: Gold collapsing. Bitcoin UP. on: September 04, 2014, 05:02:38 PM
What happened to the shorts vs usd swaps chart?

looks like an opportunity to me:



This post was worth more to anyone that heeded it than anything else that happened this week.
I think we all owe our OP OG host some serious props for sharing the wealth of information.

Thank you Dr. Cypherdoc, this was a prescription that just had to be filled for a healthy balance sheet.  Thanks for looking out for us.
Did I mention, thank you?
Oh yeah, thanks.

thanks, but no need to ever thank.  we're all in this together and i'm just trying to help.

this was another major reason i dc'd the newsletter; i wanted to be able to open up once again and share to all.  what's going on is too important to bottle up to a select few.

Go Bitcoin!
Just in case folks missed it, and for posterity, lets put this image in a post along with it.


Ignore the Dr's orders at your own peril.
1483  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Altcoin Discussion / Re: [XMR] rpietila Monero Economics thread on: September 04, 2014, 04:56:14 PM
Fortune is favoring the bold.
1484  Economy / Speculation / Re: Gold collapsing. Bitcoin UP. on: September 04, 2014, 04:42:29 PM
What happened to the shorts vs usd swaps chart?

looks like an opportunity to me:



This post was worth more to anyone that heeded it than anything else that happened this week.
I think we all owe our OP OG host some serious props for sharing the wealth of information.

Thank you Dr. Cypherdoc, this was a prescription that just had to be filled for a healthy balance sheet.  Thanks for looking out for us.
Did I mention, thank you?
Oh yeah, thanks.
1485  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Altcoin Discussion / Re: rpietila Altcoin Observer on: September 04, 2014, 04:29:38 PM
Sounds like AnonyMint is a tinfoil hat if he is suggesting that a centralized crypto currency like Equadors state currency, will over take Bitcoin.


Yeah, they need to do something... but don't think this is the best method.  They would be better off with both.  Bitcoin is not a crime.
1486  Economy / Speculation / Re: Gold collapsing. Bitcoin UP. on: September 04, 2014, 03:14:00 PM
It's really striking how all we ever get from you pos guys are ad hominem attacks instead of real technical responses to a post like Peter's.

Why do you expect technical responses to the post that implies NXT is crap. If you call something that other people value crap, you don't deserve any meaningful response. NXT people don't call Bitcoin crap by the way, they just call it the first stage crypto that bootstraps other crypto technologies. This will be obvious further down the road. Bitcoin is just software, well, there is other software it is in competition with. It's innovate or die.

A technical response is what was sought in the first instance.  It was not found.  What was found was marketing statements about something that is hoped for (and yes, we all hope for it, we just don't have it yet, at least not from NXT).

1) He didn't call NXT crap, he said the explanation of it was meaningless to him.
2) You added no meaning, so its still meaningless to him. Just promises and hyperbole, and you added a big dose of enmity.
3) There isn't any competition.  You either add value or you don't.
4) You are attacking and accusing others of doing so, when they aren't.
5) If you look for enemies everywhere, you will find enemies everywhere.

This is meant to be helpful to you, to assist you in gaining the empathy needed for you to fulfill what appears to be your goal.

If instead your goal is to create NXT haters, carry on as you are doing.  Most of us won't form an opinion either way without code to review, but you might trap up some emotional reactions with your negativity and manage to create a few more NXT haters then there were before your posts.
1487  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Altcoin Discussion / Re: rpietila Altcoin Observer on: September 04, 2014, 02:57:51 PM


It might satisfy it, I don't really know what Supernet is.  Very possibly it does, from what I've read of it.  Ethereum has perhaps a similar issue.
Certainly none of the other items on offer at poloniex would satisfy that test.
Open sourced distributed developed software money is neither a common enterprise, nor does it depend solely on the efforts of#4.
Centralized development can become problematic however as it pushes the line closer to #4.

#2 Expectation of profits...  There seems to be quite a bit of that being promulgated.

Not trying to be super picky with your post...I respect your thoughts immensely.

There is one other item at Poloniex, "JLH", that is basically a basket of NXT exchange assets collected by jl7777, that I think might also satisfy the test. 

Again, not trying to be a jerk and I wouldn't expect anybody to be familiar with every obscure listing on Poloniex.  But that one might also fit.

Good catch, I don't know anything about what they are doing with that.
You may well be right about this.  It will depend on the facts.
If Poloniex is putting together these baskets, or has an interest in them, or is involved in some way other than merely posting bid and ask prices, they could have problems.
If these are just items that someone else, jl777 maybe, is putting up for sale, and poloniex is merely acting as the electronic communication network, they could very well be in the clear on this too.

If I were their legal adviser I might suggest that they seek out a No-Action letter from the SEC and clearly define their involvement with the questionable issues.
1488  Bitcoin / Legal / Re: Can my TSB bank account be closed for trading bitcoins? on: September 04, 2014, 02:49:08 PM
The banking agreements we sign in the USA give either party (customer or bank) the right to close an account for any reason, or even for no reason.
There is no obligation on either side to provide a reason, and there is strong incentive not to provide a reason for the bank.
Bank policy is typically to provide some notice, but it is not a requirement.

If they told you they closed the account because of bitcoin, that would be very interesting.  I suspect that is just your guess and that they didn't say it outright?
1489  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: [XMR] Monero - A secure, private, untraceable cryptocurrency (mandatory upgrade) on: September 04, 2014, 12:20:56 PM
That's interesting.

All transactions after fork have been included in blocks on both blockchains.

As example TX ef7aba30ff92401067824d066cda071d885beda411d60df993b34e8af3804881

On the right blockchain:
http://chainradar.com/xmr/transaction/ef7aba30ff92401067824d066cda071d885beda411d60df993b34e8af3804881
Block # 202619   2014-09-04 04:29:05

And on the wrong:
http://monerochain.info/tx/ef7aba30ff92401067824d066cda071d885beda411d60df993b34e8af3804881
Block # 202615   2014-09-04 04:42:06

So, if you send coin, even on the wrong blockchain, you get payments on both forks )))

This is quite a development.
There are some complexities with doing such a consolidation that are worth taking a close look at.  Fast block chains are more likely to have forks and longer ones, so this may not be the last time such code is useful.
1490  Economy / Speculation / Re: Gold collapsing. Bitcoin UP. on: September 04, 2014, 12:16:27 PM
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-09-04/shocking-move-ecb-cuts-10-bps-sends-deposit-rate-further-negative-territory


At today’s meeting the Governing Council of the ECB took the following monetary policy decisions:
*The interest rate on the main refinancing operations of the Eurosystem will be decreased by 10 basis points to 0.05%, starting from the operation to be settled on 10 September 2014.
*The interest rate on the marginal lending facility will be decreased by 10 basis points to 0.30%, with effect from 10 September 2014.
*The interest rate on the deposit facility will be decreased by 10 basis points to -0.20%, with effect from 10 September 2014.

Looks like QE is coming, not much room left.
1491  Economy / Economics / Re: The Export-Import Bank on: September 04, 2014, 12:13:03 PM
It regulates how quickly the oversupply comes into the market. The exim bank is able to wait longer to sell the supply of a good so they can price the good appropriately. If a company is forced to sell their product to meet cash/liquidity needs then they would sell their goods at an unwarranted discount.
This sounds like a job for a company, not for a government entity.
Let Overstock do it.  Or let them buy insurance.
If its not a viable business, then its not a viable business.  Let the people do something productive instead.
Taxes ought not be taken by force of law from the widows and orphans to pay for the subsidy of business decision failures by protectionistas.
The markets price goods appropriately, not a government.
The guarantees that the ex-im bank provides are not free, it essentially acts as insurance. Many of the goods that are sold and guaranteed by the ex-im bank are not things that can be sold on overstock, and when they can be sold the quantity is much larger then what overstock is built for. For example if a foreign airline were to order 10 boeing airplanes and then file bankruptcy then boeing would be out of the cost to build the airplane but would have little to no way of selling it. The market for airplanes is not such that an airplane can be easily sold quickly. 
Yes, Overstock customers are a different set of customer, but the point stands. 
Boeing has the same way of selling their extra airplane as anyone else does.  The ExIm is a crutch that enables bad business decision making and socializes risk while privatising profit.
I'm just not a fan of government insurance for a select few elite "too big too fail" constituencies.
It gives the moniker of "white collar welfare" that gets applied to aerospace and others too much credence.
1492  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Altcoin Discussion / Re: [XMR] rpietila Monero Economics thread on: September 04, 2014, 11:52:45 AM
If there is such panic, why no significant dumps on hitbtc or Mintpal?

I doubt there is much dumping so long as the dev team rises to the challenge.

I love dumps. Lots of panic buying on the way back up.

I'm surprised that the price on mintpal is remaining stable.

In Poloniex alone, there are 5000+ monero accounts, add all the other exchanges to the number. USA is sleeping. This thread is visited by 100 people. Maybe not BTC->XMR people, but everyone else coming to Monero, has seen forks before and don't care.

Yes, not so worried about the fork, Monero forks/orphans very frequently given the fast blocks, this is the longest fork tong by a big margin, >30 some blocks forked.
It may stimulate some interesting developments in the code for fast block resolution and consolidation.

It would be a good development if fork consolidation were advanced. 
For example if Dead fork tx that were not respent in the live fork before consolidation time may be retransmitted and spent within the good fork without manual intervention.
1493  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Altcoin Discussion / Re: rpietila Altcoin Observer on: September 04, 2014, 11:40:07 AM
...
It might satisfy it, I don't really know what Supernet is.  Very possibly it does, from what I've read of it.  Ethereum has perhaps a similar issue.
Certainly none of the other items on offer at poloniex would satisfy that test.
Open sourced distributed developed software money is neither a common enterprise, nor does it depend solely on the efforts of#4.
Centralized development can become problematic however as it pushes the line closer to #4.

#2 Expectation of profits...  There seems to be quite a bit of that being promulgated.

When it comes to Ethereum the ether itself may of may not meet the test, but I fail to see how the promise to create or deliver the ether in the winter or 2015/2015 does not meet the test.

Quote
Also, please note that before the release of the Genesis Block in the winter of 2014/2015, ether will not be usable in any way, in fact it won’t technically be created until that point in time.
https://www.ethereum.org/

Yes, promises to deliver in the future are a problem point with regulations, and very often with civil action.

Some distinction should be made between the offering parties (coin-makers) and the exchange.  Those doing securitization are bearing the bigger risks.
The Exchanges as a group tend to get a lighter hand though, unless they partake in the offerings in a material way.
They tend to get a pass on the Electronic Communication Network exclusions.  There are a bunch of "No-Action Letters" for Instanet and BATS System because the SEC repeatedly rules that it is an ECN communicating quotes for asks and offers.  Taking a commission on the trades from system subscribers is fine.
It starts to cross the lines when Broker and Dealer activities begin.  If an ECN is trading its own book, or making any sort of financial advisement, its trouble.
1494  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Altcoin Discussion / Re: rpietila Altcoin Observer on: September 04, 2014, 04:38:48 AM
To my untrained eye, there are a few more "coins" on poloniex (the only exchange I pay attention to) that satisfy the same test. 

Are they closed source, or centrally developed?
1495  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Altcoin Discussion / Re: rpietila Altcoin Observer on: September 04, 2014, 04:35:28 AM
That gate wasn't constructed until centuries later.  The reinterpretation is thus erroneous.
The experts disagree, so can we.  Maybe it was babbling nonsense, maybe it was profound.


Quote
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Securities_and_Exchange_Commission_v._W._J._Howey_Co.

Key phrase: "broad array of contracts and other schemes to raise capital in a way to secure some income or profit from the use thereof"

This case would apply to derivatives contracts, and futures contracts.

No, that is not right at all. Did you read the article? It involved a leaseback scheme, not derivatives or futures at all.

The "investment contract" interpretation has been used to prosecute all manner of "investment schemes."
Yes, I am familiar with the case and its subsequent applications.
It does not apply to trading and exchange of capital.
It does apply to offerings which entail the use of capital by others, futures, derivatives, contracts for difference, or securities, and it emphasizes substance over form with the test which you articulated well:

Quote

The test is:

Quote

1. investment of money due to
2. an expectation of profits arising from
3. a common enterprise
4. which depends solely on the efforts of a promoter or third party

I don't really see how supernet could fail to satisfy that test.

It might satisfy it, I don't really know what Supernet is.  Very possibly it does, from what I've read of it.  Ethereum has perhaps a similar issue.
Certainly none of the other items on offer at poloniex would satisfy that test.
Open sourced distributed developed software money is neither a common enterprise, nor does it depend solely on the efforts of#4.
Centralized development can become problematic however as it pushes the line closer to #4.

#2 Expectation of profits...  There seems to be quite a bit of that being promulgated.
1496  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Altcoin Discussion / Re: rpietila Altcoin Observer on: September 04, 2014, 03:58:04 AM
That gate wasn't constructed until centuries later.  The reinterpretation is thus erroneous.
The experts disagree, so can we.  Maybe it was babbling nonsense, maybe it was profound.


Quote
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Securities_and_Exchange_Commission_v._W._J._Howey_Co.

Key phrase: "broad array of contracts and other schemes to raise capital in a way to secure some income or profit from the use thereof"

This case would apply to derivatives contracts, and futures contracts.  Or to a security.  So I don't see it as a problem for Poloniex though it may keep Risto from coming to the USA, sigh...
If the SuperNet is a security of some sort it could bring trouble.
I don't really know what it is, it is difficult to determine from what is written in the Supernet treads I've come across.
It seems to mostly be promises, which could put its issuer in hot water depending on how it is handled.

Edit: Calling it an IPO (or even an ICO) is likely a mistake.  It may confuse the regulators against the interests of those involved.
1497  Economy / Speculation / Re: Gold collapsing. Bitcoin UP. on: September 04, 2014, 03:28:09 AM
He didnt give any technical documentation of how multigateway works until it was very near finished i dont think.. And that turned out far far better than expected. Just because he hasn't given a technical explanation of how it will work doesn't mean he doesn't know what he is doing.

True, it merely means that no one else knows what he is doing.
We'll have to wait for the code before we will know.
Satoshi did it similarly, except he didn't talk about it much before the code was done.
In the mean time, as usual folks will buy the rumor and sell the news.
1498  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Altcoin Discussion / Re: rpietila Altcoin Observer on: September 04, 2014, 03:19:54 AM
I remember what Jesus is quoted as saying, "Render therefore unto Caesar the things which are Caesar's; and unto God the things that are God's".

I'm no expert but wasn't he saying in the first verse to give Ceaser whatever he wanted when it comes to money control and in the second ... didn't that have to do with morals and crap ... not crypto???
Actually the first half was about paying the taxes to the Romans.

I also seem to remember something about a rope passing through the eye of a needle...
I think it was a camel ...
That is now assumed to be a translation error, the original words for 'rope' and 'camel' (in Aramaic?  Greek?) being very similar.

The eye of the needle was a famous gate in Jerusalem.  It was so named because it was very small.  A rich man going to heaven being like a camel going through the eye of the needle was particularly apt to his contemporary audience.  Not only was it very difficult, but you'd have to remove the packs and possessions, then the camel would have to bow down and be on its knees.  The lesson was one of humility, not of impossibility.
1499  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Altcoin Discussion / Re: rpietila Altcoin Observer on: September 04, 2014, 03:13:19 AM
True.  But I think the "ICO" is very clearly in violation of the law.  This creates a liability when they are sued by investors who lose money as a result.
Which law specifically do you think is violated?
The Securities Act of 1933, section 5(a) for one.  There are others which may also pertain, but I am not a domain expert, and prefer to mention only the one which seems relatively straightforward in its application.

Is Poloniex doing anything at all with securities?
Even Bitshares and XCP aren't traded there as securities. 
Nothing they sell is a share of a company, or anything like that, is there?
Again, I am in now way intimate with their business practices, but I'd imagine that would be a hard one to stretch into applying to their business.
They may run into trouble with the CFTC once the Winklevoss do their thing, because then they would run into issues if anyone traded what might amount to a basket, but most of what I see there is pretty small volumes.
1500  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Altcoin Discussion / Re: rpietila Altcoin Observer on: September 03, 2014, 08:11:20 PM
Poloniex is registered with USA FINCen nationally as an MSB in the state of Montana.
If they stay in compliance, and don't get in hot water with the SEC, they should be OK unless the legal landscape changes.

True.  But I think the "ICO" is very clearly in violation of the law.  This creates a liability when they are sued by investors who lose money as a result.


Which law specifically do you think is violated?

Lawsuits are civil matters, one could be sued for anything at any time.  This liability exists with all business and is a different matter entirely than lawbreaking.

Some problems that they don't have:
The primary defense for poloniex is as the service provider, they are not an adviser or broker, they provide no financial advice.
For currency exchanges in particular in the State of Montana no Money Transfer license is required.  Not even USForex has one in the state:
http://www.usforex.com/about-us/legal#MT

They seem in compliance, but I have no special information regarding their operations so don't take my word for anything, ask them if you have a concern.

If they start offering Securityies with the BitsharesX stuff, they may need to register under Section 6 of the SEC Exchange act of 1934.
Pages: « 1 ... 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 52 53 54 55 56 57 58 59 60 61 62 63 64 65 66 67 68 69 70 71 72 73 74 [75] 76 77 78 79 80 81 82 83 84 85 86 87 88 89 90 91 92 93 94 95 96 97 98 99 100 101 102 103 104 105 106 107 108 109 110 111 112 113 114 115 116 117 118 119 120 121 122 123 124 125 ... 212 »
Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.19 | SMF © 2006-2009, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!