[ESHOP launched] Trezor: Bitcoin hardware wallet

[sillywhim]

For those of you considering a Trezor:


DON'T.


My funds are now locked in mytrezor and I can't send any thing out. What started two days ago as a hack of mines to get things out of mytrezor has now progressed to a total lockout of my BTC funds in two sub-accounts in mytrezor.

I've come to the belief that trezor is a trinket novelty that most other wallets won't spend any time implementing. Why do I say this? Well Slushy Sticks let my reports on their ticketing system just lay around. Yea they asked for a private key TWO DAYS ago which I gave.

No progress at all. Now, two days later, everything is locked! I can not send any btc out of mytrezor in the two accounts involved. Slushy Sticks have let this thing crash and burn.

I told them in their trouble ticket system that I am willing to help them troubleshoot this i.e. setup some kinda time where I will attempt to send out btc and they can monitor on their end.

Nope, no response from them. I respond to Slushy Sticks ticket support system and NOTHING GETS DONE.

If Slushy Sticks have problems implementing their very own trezor product into a wallet, what does this bode to other wallets' implementations of Trezor?

So far, Trezor is a limited use device, proof of concept only. Not for real heavy duty use. If I had known, I would never have bought this stoopid Jackinabox trinket.

[slush]

Yea they asked for a private key TWO DAYS ago which I gave.

We did NOT ask for private key. We asked for master public key, just to be able to realize where the problem is.

No progress at all. Now, two days later, everything is locked!

We're working on it, as I already informed you on email. Things are not so easy to debug, especially when you hit some corner case which is not so easy to replay when we don't have your private keys.

We need some time to prepare scenarios on our side to find out what is wrong. However no coins are lost, it is just about some bug in transaction preparation. It will be resolved.

Nope, no response from them.

Sometimes I need to sleep...

I respond to Slushy Sticks ticket support system and NOTHING GETS DONE.

...but it does not mean that other developers (who has no access to ticket system) are not working on it.

[xeroc]

So far, Trezor is a limited use device, proof of concept only. Not for real heavy duty use.

Never was intended for that purpose .. It's a device for cold-storage! maybe medium-hot storage .. but for sure not for hot-storage!!

[slush]

Never was intended for that purpose .. It's a device for cold-storage! maybe medium-hot storage .. but for sure not for hot-storage!!

Actually I'm using Trezor as common wallet as well; there's nothing wrong on that and what sillywhim found is certainly a bug. But there's no need of panicking, we're going to fix it, as well as we already fixed some multisig-related bugs in firmware 1.1.0.

[sillywhim]

Well I now realize it is my fault for pointing the ponzi scheme payouts to the mytrezor wallet. Hundreds and hundreds and hundred of deposits currently (two per hour, since I got two ponzi streams coming in) that's piling up in just a few weeks time. And it broke their mytrezor system.

Hopefully I'll get the two ponzi payout streams re-directed today to CEX.IO whom are extremely capable of handling hundred of thousands of mining deposit transactions everyday. So I should be able to sneak in these tiny micro-payments into their system, and be able to spend it without insane bitcoin transfer fees associated with these hundreds of transactions deposited to mytrezor (or any bitcoin wallet not just mytrezor.)

With CEX.IO it is either 0.001 BTC fee for manual transaction sends or totally free to any configured external btc address during their daily random sweeps. I like free.

CEX.IO is the economical way to go for your repetitive hourly btc deposits.

[BurtW]

Well I now realize it is my fault for pointing the ponzi scheme payouts to the mytrezor wallet. Hundreds and hundreds and hundred of deposits currently (two per hour, since I got two ponzi streams coming in) that's piling up in just a few weeks time. And it broke their mytrezor system.

Hopefully I'll get the two ponzi payout streams re-directed today to CEX.IO whom are extremely capable of handling hundred of thousands of mining deposit transactions everyday. So I should be able to sneak in these tiny micro-payments into their system, and be able to spend it without insane bitcoin transfer fees associated with these hundreds of transactions deposited to any bitcoin wallet, not just mytrezor.

With CEX.IO it is either 0.001 BTC fee for manual transaction sends or totally free to any configured external btc address during their daily random sweeps. I like free.

CEX.IO is the economical way to go for your repetitive hourly btc deposits.

First, I think pointing these two streams of hundreds of micro deposits to you CEX.IO account is a very good idea.

Second, your post made me laugh out loud.  In my twisted little mind your post is an attempt at an ad for the Ponzi schemes you hope many other (suckers) will ask you about and join ("look at my problem too many deposits of totally free money, woe is me") in much the same way that the warning "If you get an erection that lasts for more than four hours..." is actually a very effecitve ad for Viagra.

Third:  It looks like your stress test actually found a bug - which is a very good thing.

what sillywhim found is certainly a bug. But there's no need of panicking, we're going to fix it

[slush]

Deterministic builds of Trezor firmware:

https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/trezor-dev/5MCyweTY4UA

[klokan]

Deterministic builds of Trezor firmware:

https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/trezor-dev/5MCyweTY4UA

Nice job 

All we need now is a security expert who will look at the code and confirm there is no cheating from the devs side. Any volunteers?

[slush]

All we need now is a security expert who will look at the code and confirm there is no cheating from the devs side. Any volunteers?

+1

[crazyearner]

Tempted to have one of these myself however for the price is too much and to expensive bring down to something more realistic priced and I might just buy if their still available to buy.

[cor]

Tempted to have one of these myself however for the price is too much and to expensive bring down to something more realistic priced and I might just buy if their still available to buy.

You are probably referring to the 1 / 3 BTC in our crowdfunding campaign which aimed to collect funds from enthusiasts in order to finance the early development of the device .   
We agree that at current exchange rate that pricing would not make the device available..

[crazyearner]

Tempted to have one of these myself however for the price is too much and to expensive bring down to something more realistic priced and I might just buy if their still available to buy.

You are probably referring to the 1 / 3 BTC in our crowdfunding campaign which aimed to collect funds from enthusiasts in order to finance the early development of the device .   
We agree that at current exchange rate that pricing would not make the device available..

So do you have any plans on bringing the prices down to something more attractive or are these no longer available as I been out of the filed in these. Sort of stopped looking into them due to the price at the start but had another look over this device again.

[klokan]

Tempted to have one of these myself however for the price is too much and to expensive bring down to something more realistic priced and I might just buy if their still available to buy.

You are probably referring to the 1 / 3 BTC in our crowdfunding campaign which aimed to collect funds from enthusiasts in order to finance the early development of the device .   
We agree that at current exchange rate that pricing would not make the device available..

So do you have any plans on bringing the prices down to something more attractive or are these no longer available as I been out of the filed in these. Sort of stopped looking into them due to the price at the start but had another look over this device again.

Satoshilabs plan to launch classics retail in July. The preorder price for these started at 1BTC when 1BTC was 120USD. They refuse to announce the retail price at this moment (maybe because of BTC price fluctuations) and I'm not familiar with it. Nevertheless, let me speculate a bit. If 120USD was "enthusiast price" I expect that the retail price will be in the 50-80USD range (or July BTC equivalent).

[cor]

Tempted to have one of these myself however for the price is too much and to expensive bring down to something more realistic priced and I might just buy if their still available to buy.

You are probably referring to the 1 / 3 BTC in our crowdfunding campaign which aimed to collect funds from enthusiasts in order to finance the early development of the device .  
We agree that at current exchange rate that pricing would not make the device available..

So do you have any plans on bringing the prices down to something more attractive or are these no longer available as I been out of the filed in these. Sort of stopped looking into them due to the price at the start but had another look over this device again.

Satoshilabs plan to launch classics retail in July. The preorder price for these started at 1BTC when 1BTC was 120USD. They refuse to announce the retail price at this moment (maybe because of BTC price fluctuations) and I'm not familiar with it. Nevertheless, let me speculate a bit. If 120USD was "enthusiast price" I expect that the retail price will be in the 50-80USD range (or July BTC equivalent).

klokan we cannot be setting the price of a hardware according to the exchange rate of bitcoin. unfortunately, as we saw perfectly on our crowdfunding case, bitcoin in not there yet.
rather try this formula: components and machinery tools, hw development and testing, 1,5 years of sw development, certifications, taxes, lawyers and accountants, offices, staff, marketing, plus some margin would be nice so we can do more nice things and features in the future.

[kkurtmann]

All we need now is a security expert who will look at the code and confirm there is no cheating from the devs side. Any volunteers?

+1

my post gets deleted on this thread for the exact same reply
thanx Slush, way to repay a 3 year veteran on your pool and an early funder of your projects

[cor]

All we need now is a security expert who will look at the code and confirm there is no cheating from the devs side. Any volunteers?

+1

my post gets deleted on this thread for the exact same reply
thanx Slush, way to repay a 3 year veteran on your pool and an early funder of your projects

maybe some mysterious forces between your Enter and the forum server..
why would one do that unless you were posting some inappropriate photos like posing naked with your trezor..?

[slush]

my post gets deleted on this thread for the exact same reply

We don't have admin rights to delete thread posts...

[klokan]

klokan we cannot be setting the price of a hardware according to the exchange rate of bitcoin. unfortunately, as we saw perfectly on our crowdfunding case, bitcoin in not there yet.

I know. That is the reason why I estimated the price in USD and I based it on the USD price of the device at the preorder launch. But still, I hope you will accept bitcoin purchases!

rather try this formula: components and machinery tools, hw development and testing, 1,5 years of sw development, certifications, taxes, lawyers and accountants, offices, staff, marketing, plus some margin would be nice so we can do more nice things and features in the future.

This formula has too many unknowns for the people asking for the price. That is why we are speculating and guessing what the result might be.

[sillywhim]

My final thoughts on the Trezor.

BTC withdraw issues still continue at mytrezor.com regarding my problem of withdrawing btc based on hundreds of incoming hourly deposits from a ponzi service. Very hit-or-miss. Mytrezor currently can not reliably handle this kind of influx.

Regardless of this, my feelings of Trezor have changed a lot since receiving my device. To make this Trezor idea actually viable in the real world, you would have to BUY TWO TREZORS; one for daily use and the other as a hot spare in case you lose your first one.

Right now, if I lost my Trezor (also configured with password protection), I would be unable to access my btc funds at mytrezor until I get a replacement Trezor. So even if Trezors are readily available (which it isn't right now), I'd still have to wait a few days to receive my new Trezor in the mail. That's why I recommend TWO Trezors to make things work.

I dunno if I want to purchase an additional Trezor. Sheeze so limited usage as Trezors will now only work with Mytrezor.com. Not very inspirational at all.

I would suggest to others to wait until Trezors are used outside of Slushy Sticks' world in a way to your liking.  Then go buy two Trezors.

But for now, hold off buying. Wait and see who else implements it.

[slush]

BTC withdraw issues still continue at mytrezor.com regarding my problem of withdrawing btc based on hundreds of incoming hourly deposits from a ponzi service. Very hit-or-miss. Mytrezor currently can not reliably handle this kind of influx.

As I wrote you many times, we're currently hunting bugs on mytrezor backend, so the problems are just temporary.

To make this Trezor idea actually viable in the real world, you would have to BUY TWO TREZORS; one for daily use and the other as a hot spare in case you lose your first one.

That's absolutely irrelevant. One Trezor can handle unlimited accounts, unlimited keys and unlimited balance. Again, you're refering to temporary problems on mytrezor backend.

Right now, if I lost my Trezor (also configured with password protection), I would be unable to access my btc funds at mytrezor until I get a replacement Trezor.

Not true. Even today there's Wallet32, Android application compatible with myTREZOR. If you lost Trezor and want to recover funds ASAP, you can use this free Android app. And other trezor-compatible applications are coming. Don't forget that the device is using bleeding edge technologies and other wallet software is a bit behind with their development.

I dunno if I want to purchase an additional Trezor. Sheeze so limited usage as Trezors will now only work with Mytrezor.com. Not very inspirational at all.

Feel free to email developers of Multibit, Electrum, Armory, Bitcoin-qt to add support of Trezor. There's nothing what we can improve ourselves, we already provide full support for those who want to integrate Trezor into their software.