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Question: How far will this leg take us?
$110K - 9 (8.3%)
$120K - 19 (17.6%)
$130K - 17 (15.7%)
$140K - 9 (8.3%)
$150K - 19 (17.6%)
$160K - 2 (1.9%)
$170K+ - 33 (30.6%)
Total Voters: 108

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Author Topic: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion  (Read 26931624 times)
This is a self-moderated topic. If you do not want to be moderated by the person who started this topic, create a new topic. (174 posts by 1 users with 9 merit deleted.)
JayJuanGee
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September 25, 2019, 04:01:08 PM

[edited out]

I think it is perfectly normal to have 2 plans.

We can agree to disagree, but it is possible that we are just discussing semantics rather than meaningful variance. 

Of course, any plan should not be locked in and therefore we are likely going to need to tweak or even abandoned along the way, or such plan may have branches that cause divergence based on "what if" triggering events

We all know that Bitcoin will reach 100K or more.

Anyone who asserts that s/he knows the future with certainty, especially when it comes to something like bitcoin is looney.

Of course we might assign relatively high probabilities, but even then we are going to have variant predictions between people regarding how high of probabilities that they assign.


The only unknown variable now is exactly how long this will take.

Sure, time is another variable.



The historical pattern says end of 2021 or early 2022. But nobody can be sure about that. We may need another halving to occur i.e. after 2024, or even more.

I agree more likely to occur within 1 to 2 years after the halvening, but like you said, could take longer.

In that case there will be many dissapointments and missed opportunites to become rich. And man's heart can't endure forever such bad things.


To me it seems that you are setting yourself up for failure if you don't plan for outliers.  Of course, there is an expectation that bitcoin is going to go up, but if it goes to zero, we should be both financially and psychologically prepared for that also.  Seems to me.

Considering however, that I continue to buy in all these years, I may reach my goal in terms of fiat for prices around 50K. I don't want this to happen, and I don't think it will happen, but it is theoretically possible that we are stuck at levels 20K-50K for a prolonged period of time.

With bitcoin, you should still be able to get rich, even if the price appreciation does not end up being as great as expected.  And, if you are not rich, you are at least better off for having had invested into it.    Traditional investments tend to take anywhere between 7 and 15 years to double in value, so even if bitcoin ends up falling into the realm of normal, then it should not have hurt you to have tried. 

Sure, for me, it is already nice to have nearly 10x in equity cushion (profits) in BTC, but there is still some need to consider bitcoin from the present, too.  At the present BTC price, what do you expect in the next 7-15 years?   Yes it should double, and yes it should even accomplish such doubling (or more) in a much shorter period of time, even though not guaranteed.

Let's say I have 16 BTC (they could have been much more, but in 2015 I didn't even suspect that Bitcoin price could go much higher than $200 so soon). So the 1st super duper bearish plan (based on my personal 10x profit) is:

2,00 for $36 000
2,00 for $40 000
4,35 for $44 000
4,15 for $46 000
3,50 for $48 000

Total: $700 000. If I can buy more coins before 36K, I will keep them for 100K.  

And if the year is 2025 or later, I will have may be 3-4 or more coins. Considering my expenses are $5K per year and that I can build a luxury house for 200K, this amount should be enough even if I quadruple the monthly expenses. ( I am speaking for an early retirement 10 years instead of 20 from now.)


O.k., I see that you are planning to have two tracks of coins.  One track of coins, you completely cash out by the time the price reaches $48k, and the second track of coins is still unknown because you are in the process of acquiring those second track of coins.

Personally, I believe that is planning to gamble too much based on too many unknowns, and in that regard, I would prefer to plan based on knowns rather than unknowns, and of course, you can have a plan to cash out all of your earlier acquired coins by $48k, if that is what floats your boat, but it seems a bit short-sighted, in my thinking, and maybe even too much gambling to play it that way.   

But what I am hoping for is selling based on the follwing pattern until 2022 (plus all bitcoins bought before my 1st selling point, kept for later moons above 200K). It is a tweaked version of your plan, which you gave to mindrust some time ago. It is based on the principle 10, 20, 30, 40% sells after each 50% increase. The last sell could be distributed between 120K and 150K.

Sell Price    BTC balance    PfolioBeforeValue    BTCSell Amt    PfolioAfterValue    soldValue      soldTotal
$40,000       16.00000000    $640,000             0.00000000     $640,000            $0.00           $0.00
$40,000       16.00000000    $640,000             1.60000000     $576,000            $64,000        $64,000
$60,000       14.40000000    $864,000             3.20000000     $672,000            $192,000       $256,000
$90,000       11.20000000    $1,008,000          4.80000000     $576,000            $432,000       $688,000
$135,000       6.40000000    $864,000             6.40000000     $0                      $864,000       $1,552,000

 Pretty much, I agree with the discretion that is exercised through all of the first part, but I don't see why you would have to go balls to the wall between $120k and $150k.  Yeah, you could sell some of those BTC, but do you really believe it is necessary to sell all of them?  Of course, if you really believe that a blow off top has been reached in that range, then you could use some of those last coins to buy back, but still seems a bit rash to run out of coins to sell, in my thinking.


Then I can build a beach villa which I could use or lend. And one day if I am sick of it, I surely will be able to sell it 2-3 times higher, so the initial cash out at 40K-60K won't be lost.

 Of course, using your money wisely, such as investment property is not a bad thing, so in that regard it might not matter what you do with your money to the extent that you have not become so filthy rich that you can start to throw money away and not think about whether it gives you further possible returns.


P.S. I know this looks like hopium especially to the daily traders, but this increase is only 10x from 14K this year. There were much bigger increases even for one year, not to mention for 3 years. The only question is when 100K, not if!

I don't think it looks like hopium, and I think that you are failing to sufficiently plan for further upside, but yeah, you could end up being correct and there is a blow off top in the range in which you cash out the remaining of your BTC so you end up being able to buy them back at a much reduced price.

Ultimately, these kinds of decisions are yours to make, and so we are going to come out with differing plans that are kind of tailored to our own financial situations, risk tolerances, timeline and views of bitcoin as compared with other asset classes.
jbreher
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September 25, 2019, 04:13:04 PM

^^
NP jbreher will keep pumping/supporting that one

Clearly BSV led that drop. Little ol' BTC merely caught in the wake.

or smth

Whatevs... I have all the time in the world.

One will not say that when he’s under the dirt......

No man got all the time in the world....

When one is in the catbird seat, the difference between the end of the world and 'it doesn't matter' is merely academic.

Well hopefully you are referring to you BTC investment rather than bcash or various varients of bcash, which are both likely to perform less well than bitcoin. 

Of course, if you have a smaller portion in bcash, then you still might do o.k., but not as well as if you ONLY held bitcoin. 

Past performance is not a guarantee of future results.
Febo
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September 25, 2019, 04:17:25 PM

One thing is sure by now. FED dont print those $75 billion a night to buy Bitcoin.
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September 25, 2019, 04:33:43 PM
Merited by BobLawblaw (1)

Any opinions about this theory regarding a whale dumping 1.2million btc yesterday to crash the market?

https://bitcoinist.com/bitcoin-price-plunge-came-from-1-2b-sell-data-says-amid-hashrate-row/
JayJuanGee
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September 25, 2019, 04:40:26 PM

^^
NP jbreher will keep pumping/supporting that one

Clearly BSV led that drop. Little ol' BTC merely caught in the wake.

or smth

Whatevs... I have all the time in the world.

One will not say that when he’s under the dirt......

No man got all the time in the world....

When one is in the catbird seat, the difference between the end of the world and 'it doesn't matter' is merely academic.

Well hopefully you are referring to you BTC investment rather than bcash or various varients of bcash, which are both likely to perform less well than bitcoin. 

Of course, if you have a smaller portion in bcash, then you still might do o.k., but not as well as if you ONLY held bitcoin. 

Past performance is not a guarantee of future results.

That's an evasive response if I had ever seen one.   Tongue
serveria.com
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Privacy Servers. Since 2009.


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September 25, 2019, 04:49:14 PM

Any opinions about this theory regarding a whale dumping 1.2million btc yesterday to crash the market?

https://bitcoinist.com/bitcoin-price-plunge-came-from-1-2b-sell-data-says-amid-hashrate-row/

Looks legit  Cool
Gyrsur
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September 25, 2019, 04:49:43 PM

Any opinions about this theory regarding a whale dumping 1.2million btc yesterday to crash the market?

https://bitcoinist.com/bitcoin-price-plunge-came-from-1-2b-sell-data-says-amid-hashrate-row/

so Faketoshi's attempt to destroy BTC?  Grin
JSRAW
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September 25, 2019, 04:50:11 PM

Any opinions about this theory regarding a whale dumping 1.2million btc yesterday to crash the market?

https://bitcoinist.com/bitcoin-price-plunge-came-from-1-2b-sell-data-says-amid-hashrate-row/

Oh boy $1.2 billion


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September 25, 2019, 04:50:31 PM



For those who can't stand the pressure...
Gyrsur
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September 25, 2019, 04:55:43 PM

on the way above don't look downwards too much!

Last of the V8s
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September 25, 2019, 05:01:44 PM

hey
JJG
ltc
pump
therefore
....
d_eddie
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September 25, 2019, 05:02:21 PM

Any opinions about this theory regarding a whale dumping 1.2million btc yesterday to crash the market?

https://bitcoinist.com/bitcoin-price-plunge-came-from-1-2b-sell-data-says-amid-hashrate-row/

Looks legit  Cool

They gotta tell us the addresses or it didn't happen.

Which exchange? Did that exchange actually lead the dump? Are the 1.2 million all sold already? So we gotta work hard to buy back all them cheep coinz.

Yeah, legit for sure Cool
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September 25, 2019, 05:04:38 PM
Merited by JayJuanGee (1)

hey
JJG
ltc
pump
therefore
....

...dee little tail dont wag no biggie doggie?

C'mon man, JJG hardly needs any tickling.  You're being nasty on purpose.

makrospex
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September 25, 2019, 05:05:39 PM


Now 52 BTC.
What a joke. Interest in Bitcoin isn't that high, i guess?

It resets each day.

So it is about 61 as I type.

https://www.theice.com/products/72035464/Bakkt-Bitcoin-USD-Monthly-Futures-Contract/data?marketId=6137541

The first day was about 72
The second day was 216
And so far the third day (still early in the day) is 61

Thanks, also fillippone cleared that up for me.
You know any further bakkt statistics resources, btw?
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September 25, 2019, 05:11:39 PM

Good good my man BoB is back in the house

Mostly that’s a Bull sign
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September 25, 2019, 05:16:43 PM

I'm curious how they are making money on this zero fee crypto exchange, I'm assuming it's a loss leader and they expect a typical member to also be buying stocks that do have fees?
https://cointelegraph.com/news/sofi-launches-zero-fee-crypto-trading-for-bitcoin-ether-litecoin
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According to a report by Fortune, SoFi will obtain cryptocurrencies to fulfill its customer orders from Coinbase.
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September 25, 2019, 05:32:49 PM
Merited by El duderino_ (2), JayJuanGee (1), fillippone (1)



Quote
Today's meaningless hopium...  The current 4 year CAGR implies a halving price of $23k, a peak of $700k followed by a crash to $100k.

https://twitter.com/ChartsBtc/status/1176893360688128000


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September 25, 2019, 05:41:09 PM

Good good my man BoB is back in the house

Mostly that’s a Bull sign

You forgot the #nohomo part  Grin
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September 25, 2019, 05:42:05 PM


Now 52 BTC.
What a joke. Interest in Bitcoin isn't that high, i guess?

It resets each day.

So it is about 61 as I type.

https://www.theice.com/products/72035464/Bakkt-Bitcoin-USD-Monthly-Futures-Contract/data?marketId=6137541

The first day was about 72
The second day was 216
And so far the third day (still early in the day) is 61

Thanks, also fillippone cleared that up for me.
You know any further bakkt statistics resources, btw?


As far as I know that is the only source.
I am sure there will be more in the near future (pun intended).
LFC_Bitcoin
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September 25, 2019, 05:42:52 PM
Merited by 600watt (1)

Quote
Today's meaningless hopium...  The current 4 year CAGR implies a halving price of $23k, a peak of $700k followed by a crash to $100k.

https://twitter.com/ChartsBtc/status/1176893360688128000

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