Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion

[realr0ach]

You can't mine just 1 bitcoin for $6k. You could try. Otherwise, the price is indeed determined solely by traders. Some miners are also traders. Some miners are not.

Of course you can mine "just 1 bitcoin".  It's called 'pool mining'.  Why are you trying to trick people into believing the price of Bitcoin can go to infinity without mining massively expanding along with the price?  The price CANNOT go to $100k while having a $6k post-halving cost of production because nobody would buy your $100k coin if they can mine one for $6k instead.  And mining is already too huge to increase by an order of magnitude or higher to buffer prices that elevated or it would use more power than the entire United States.  People claiming the price can go to $100k after halving are retard scammers.

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[serveria.com]

Ballet - The World’s First Multicurrency, Non-electronic Hardware Wallet.

Complete with scratch off private key.  Erm lol thanks Bobby Lee. 




https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/balletcrypto/ballet-cryptocurrency-hardware-wallet

what the actual fuck??

not your keys folks...jesus

You can't even prove that somebody else stole the coins. They'll accuse you instead and there is nothing you can do about it. This is perfect for selective scamming. Scam every 10.000th person and nobody will give a fuck about him.

It's actually enough to scam just ONE person with enough coins. Who's going to believe your story? 

[realr0ach]

Another day of shitcoin scammer Micgoossen's lies and dipshittery.  Here's what's actually occurring in that picture.  First of all, "shells" aren't money - they do not have the qualifying traits, and they were never ubiquitously used as such either, so it's stupid to even include them in the chart.  They're not fungible, they're not durable, etc, etc.  The instances of people attempting to use things like rice as money were probably ENORMOUSLY higher than anyone ever using 'shells', but shitcoin scammer idiots like Nick Szabo INSIST on using 'shells' as an example to make it SEEM like anything can qualify as money when it's not the case.

Out of your personal example of "shells", gold, and gold coins, all three are used as both a transactional unit (currency) and a settlement system (money) at the same time.  In the case of the latter three: notes, bank accounts, and Bitcoin, those are all solely transactional units (currency) and NOT settlement systems (money).  It's a complete apples vs oranges comparison.  No form of settlement has EVER taken place in all of history without a real world object being exchanged because digital 1's and 0's are completely useless to humans.  A real world object must be transferred at some point for settlement to occur.

[becoin]

The price CANNOT go to $100k while having a $6k post-halving cost of production because nobody would buy your $100k coin if they can mine one for $6k instead.

Of course, it CAN!
The price of a $100 bill is $100 while production cost is just 17 cents!

[realr0ach]

The price CANNOT go to $100k while having a $6k post-halving cost of production because nobody would buy your $100k coin if they can mine one for $6k instead.

Of course, it CAN!
The price of a $100 bill is $100 while production cost is just 17 cents!

That's called seigniorage fee, which is a TAX.  It's a TAX forced on you by the barrel of a gun.  Nobody can force anyone to use Bitcoin to extract seigniorage fee because 'Bitcoin' has no fucking military or nuclear weapons. Unless you're claiming the US govt created Bitcoin and will attempt to make you use it by force.  Even if that was the case, nobody gives a flying shit about ANYTHING govt says now.  

The only way the price of Bitcoin can be $100k while only having a $6k cost of production is if mining is a completely centralized monopoly, which you tards are hesitant to admit that's what your banking on because it would mean Bitcoin is a complete scam of zero value.  And good job VB1001 for meritting becoin's idiotic answer.  Typical shitcoin scammer lies and buffoonery on display 24/7 in this thread.

[becoin]

The price CANNOT go to $100k while having a $6k post-halving cost of production because nobody would buy your $100k coin if they can mine one for $6k instead.

Of course, it CAN!
The price of a $100 bill is $100 while production cost is just 17 cents!

That's called seigniorage fee, which is a TAX.  It's a TAX forced on you by the barrel of a gun.  Nobody can force anyone to use Bitcoin to extract seigniorage fee because 'Bitcoin' has no fucking military or nuclear weapons.  Unless you're claiming the US govt created Bitcoin and will attempt to make you use it by force.  Even if that was the case, nobody gives a flying shit about ANYTHING govt says now.

Nobody can force anyone to use Bitcoin to extract seigniorage fee. People are doing it voluntarily because fucking military or nuclear weapons are useless against Bitcoin!

[realr0ach]

Like I said before:

The only way the price of Bitcoin can be $100k while only having a $6k cost of production is if mining is a completely centralized monopoly, which you tards are hesitant to admit that's what your banking on because it would mean Bitcoin is a complete scam of zero value.

So fucking tired of you jackass scammers.

[mindrust]

The price CANNOT go to $100k while having a $6k post-halving cost of production because nobody would buy your $100k coin if they can mine one for $6k instead.

Of course, it CAN!
The price of a $100 bill is $100 while production cost is just 17 cents!

He has a point. I normally don't respond to roach posts but since you quoted him... and I see he has a point... I'll explain.

$100k is not where bitcoin will be stable.

It will go to $100k from $3k, just like it went to $20k from $300. How many days did bitcoin stay at $20k? 1? 2?

$100k will be similar. (I keep saying $100k but maybe it will be $80k. Nobody knows) Only a handful of people will he able to sell from the new ATH. Most will be paralyzed while looking at their monitors. Some will expect it to go higher, some will sell below the ATH. Some will sell a lot there and curse themselves for not holding longer. Some will sell so little at the ATH and curse themselves for not selling more after the bubble pops. Some will just hodl through (that's me)

We all think we'll do the right thing this time but it keeps happening over and over again and we still fail. (I do at least, not completely thanks to my DCA strategy)

How many of you went all in when it was 3.1k-4k range? It happened just months ago.

Find yourself a strategy similar to JJG's and you won't be missing much. I am pretty sure you'll get more profits if plan yourself a selling strategy just like when you were buying.

Tldr; it may go to $100k but if $100k will be where it tops, it won't stay there. Most likely to go back to somehwere between 25-40k later on.

[mindrust]

Another thing, why do you think the network fees went nuts while the ATH was happening in 2017?

People were literally outbidding each other by paying more fees to send their coins faster to the exchanges so they could dump!

[realr0ach]

He has a point. I normally don't respond to roach posts but since you quoted him... and I see he has a point... I'll explain.

$100k is not where bitcoin will be stable.

It will go to $100k from $3k, just like it went to $20k from $300. How many days did bitcoin stay at $20k? 1? 2?

LOL.  It's called a Bitfinex criminal fraud pump and dump scam using Tethers and cooking the books Enron accounting.  You're trying to pretend Bitcoin just magically went to $20k in a natural manner when everyone and their mom knows that is not the case.  Now you're claiming it's inevitable another giant, Bitfinex Tether fraud occurs to send it to $100k.  

I'll tell you, it's simply fucking amazing Giancarlo and the rest of these scammer fags at Bitfinex that literally steal customer deposits are not in prison yet, so hell if I know, maybe Bitfinex fraud is a front for the govt manipulating the price upwards because they want you to use cashless society slavery system tokens where you cattle are tracked and monitored in real-time instead of using physical metals.  That's the only explanation I have for why nobody at Bitfinex is in jail.

[becoin]

Another thing, why do you think the network fees went nuts while the ATH was happening in 2017?

People were literally outbidding each other by paying more fees to send their coins faster to the exchanges so they could dump!

People were outbidding each other just to make ANY bitcoin transaction. The reason for high fees in 2017 were BCH crooks trying to clog bitcoin network and promote their point by sending hundreds of spam transactions to be included in every block. There are no spam transactions now because those same crooks need every bitcoin they mine now to support the price of Bitmain's corporate coin (aka Bcash).

[mindrust]

Another thing, why do you think the network fees went nuts while the ATH was happening in 2017?

People were literally outbidding each other by paying more fees to send their coins faster to the exchanges so they could dump!

People were outbidding each other just to make ANY bitcoin transaction. The reason for high fees in 2017 were BCH crooks trying to clog bitcoin network and promote their point by sending hundreds of spam transactions to be included in every block. There are no spam transactions now because those same crooks need every bitcoin they mine now to support the price of Bitmain's corporate coin (aka Bcash).

I don't deny that but I can't really say it was %100 Bitmain/Vermin Co. Still can't be sure though. Maybe they were %100... but then... why don't they do it now? Or why they didn't do it before the ATH? Maybe they wanted to combine their spam with the real demand to increase the effects. I still believe there were some real hardcore demand in 2017 for the on-chain transactions.

[Negotiation]

Give it some time and you'll learn who's a cunt and who's not. Read your local board on bitcointalk, but don't trust them till you're sure.
Despite being Italian, fillippone is not a total cunt. Read his beginner's guide. No short cuts, read it all
these 3 are honest social media types
https://twitter.com/lopp
https://twitter.com/brian_trollz
https://twitter.com/MrHodl
they have enough knowledge and acumen to keep newbies going for a long time.

Thanks @Last of the V8s carefully read and follow everything all over help for learn.

[becoin]

Another thing, why do you think the network fees went nuts while the ATH was happening in 2017?

People were literally outbidding each other by paying more fees to send their coins faster to the exchanges so they could dump!

People were outbidding each other just to make ANY bitcoin transaction. The reason for high fees in 2017 were BCH crooks trying to clog bitcoin network and promote their point by sending hundreds of spam transactions to be included in every block. There are no spam transactions now because those same crooks need every bitcoin they mine now to support the price of Bitmain's corporate coin (aka Bcash).

I don't deny that but I can't really say it was %100 Bitmain/Vermin Co. Still can't be sure though. Maybe they were %100... but then... why don't they do it now? Or why they didn't do it before the ATH? Maybe they wanted to combine their spam with the real demand to increase the effects. I still believe there were some real hardcore demand in 2017 for the on-chain transactions.

I have already explained why.
Another reason is to not induce accelerated development of the Lightning Network which actually is the Bitcoin killer app.

[realr0ach]

Another reason is to not induce accelerated development of the Lightning Network which actually is the Bitcoin killer app.

You have no idea whatsoever how Lightning Network works if you think that's the case.  It's 100% useless because the only manner in which it can function in the real world (when on-chain transactions are prohibitively expensive) is each user only having a single channel open to a well-connected bank who routes all their transactions.  You cannot afford to open a channel to every person in the world you *potentially* might need to send money to, nor can you fund each of those channels with proper liquidity because channel liquidity is not fungible with one another to make larger purchases.  

It will just be you connected to a bank in a permissioned ledger.  100% fucking useless:

[Cryptotourist]

Tell me r0ach, why are you constantly trying to scam us into PM's, whilst trying to scam us out of BTC?
Impressive. I mean your shill narrative - is scam you all the way. Biggest scammer I've seen anyways.

#

~
Another reason is to not induce accelerated development of the Lightning Network which actually is the Bitcoin killer app.

I'd love to hear why if you don't mind.

[VB1001]

Another thing, why do you think the network fees went nuts while the ATH was happening in 2017?

People were literally outbidding each other by paying more fees to send their coins faster to the exchanges so they could dump!

People were outbidding each other just to make ANY bitcoin transaction. The reason for high fees in 2017 were BCH crooks trying to clog bitcoin network and promote their point by sending hundreds of spam transactions to be included in every block. There are no spam transactions now because those same crooks need every bitcoin they mine now to support the price of Bitmain's corporate coin (aka Bcash).

I don't deny that but I can't really say it was %100 Bitmain/Vermin Co. Still can't be sure though. Maybe they were %100... but then... why don't they do it now? Or why they didn't do it before the ATH? Maybe they wanted to combine their spam with the real demand to increase the effects. I still believe there were some real hardcore demand in 2017 for the on-chain transactions.

I have already explained why.
Another reason is to not induce accelerated development of the Lightning Network which actually is the Bitcoin killer app.

Exact was a cumulative of circumstances that coincided with the fork BCH, SegWit, CME futures, FOMO

[mindrust]

Another thing, why do you think the network fees went nuts while the ATH was happening in 2017?

People were literally outbidding each other by paying more fees to send their coins faster to the exchanges so they could dump!

People were outbidding each other just to make ANY bitcoin transaction. The reason for high fees in 2017 were BCH crooks trying to clog bitcoin network and promote their point by sending hundreds of spam transactions to be included in every block. There are no spam transactions now because those same crooks need every bitcoin they mine now to support the price of Bitmain's corporate coin (aka Bcash).

I don't deny that but I can't really say it was %100 Bitmain/Vermin Co. Still can't be sure though. Maybe they were %100... but then... why don't they do it now? Or why they didn't do it before the ATH? Maybe they wanted to combine their spam with the real demand to increase the effects. I still believe there were some real hardcore demand in 2017 for the on-chain transactions.

I have already explained why.
Another reason is to not induce accelerated development of the Lightning Network which actually is the Bitcoin killer app.

Exact was a cumulative of circumstances that coincided with the fork BCH, SegWit, CME futures, FOMO

Exactly I kinda feel like becoin's view on this matter is very one-dimensional. It was a series of events all happening at once.

There wasn't any segwit adoption > high fees
No LN > high fees (we don't know how much LN helps right now though)
High demand > naturally high fees
Bad miners > high fees
No batching from the exchanges > yep you guessed right.

You can't explain it that simple by saying it was all Roger. Nope, it wasn't that simple.

[realr0ach]

trying to scam us into PM's, whilst trying to scam us out of BTC?

All man-made currencies are scams, while real world, physical commodities are not, as I've already explained:

All man-made monetary units (aka currencies) are artificial, Keynesian scams whose 'value' is brief and transitory.  The value of every currency that's ever existed starts at a value of zero and always returns there - every single one.  In other words, it's a game of hot potato or musical chairs where the act of using them at all can be considered nothing more than knowingly signing up to defraud other humans on purpose.

Why knowingly become a party to fraud by using currencies such as the US dollar, Bitcoin, or Chuck E Cheese tokens when you don't have to and can use actual physical commodity money instead like silver, gold, and copper that doesn't have this issue?  Currencies are valueless; always have been, always will be.  Their 'value' is not derived from usefulness, only how many people you can attempt to scam into taking it before it's value inevitably implodes like every other currency.  It's impossible not to be a party to fraud while using ANYTHING classified as a currency instead of physical commodity money.  

Promoting a world where everyone attempts to commit fraud by using currencies instead of money is the same thing as promoting a world where everyone should be able to freely kill one another.

[becoin]

Another reason is to not induce accelerated development of the Lightning Network which actually is the Bitcoin killer app.

You have no idea whatsoever how Lightning Network works if you think that's the case.  It's 100% useless because the only manner in which it can function in the real world (when on-chain transactions are prohibitively expensive) is each user only having a single channel open to a well-connected bank who routes all their transactions.  You cannot afford to open a channel to every person in the world you *potentially* might need to send money to, nor can you fund each of those channels with proper liquidity because channel liquidity is not fungible with one another to make larger purchases.  

It will just be you connected to a bank in a permissioned ledger.  100% fucking useless:

I know how LN works as I'm using it. You don't because you don't use it.

You don't have to open a channel to every person in the world you *potentially* might need! Most people would need 5-6 channels opened where they make payments on regular basis.