MtGox withdrawal delays [Gathering]

[ibox]

sturle I just read that thread really carefully and I have to say that your logic make really sense to me.
The arguments, the figures, the answers properly built, no problem for me, you nailed them.

But your last post...

Would you be kind engouh to explain me how can you defend that hard MtGox without having done any SEPA withdrawal before?

Because considering I'm cynical, users saying the withdrawals worked on this topic didn't bring no proof at all (if I want I can copy paste the same kind of bullshit) so the only stuff which was keeping me interested was your arguments about MG solvability, but with this last post I'm a little bit confused =)

Even if I did a withdrawal, it would be only one example of a successful withdrawal.  I think it is important to get the facts right.  So far all delays have been explained, and within expected limits.  There are plenty of people reporting successful withdrawals.  You don't need another one.

A short summary of what we currently know about withdrawals:

• JPY domestic is next day
  • one extra delay recorded due to misspelling of Japanese name
  • one day extra recorded due to extraordinary volume (JPY withdrawal volume was > 1 million USD yesterday)
• EUR via SEPA is less than one week
  • maximum per user is one withdrawal per 20 days
  • very large withdrawals can be delayed up tp two weeks
• International withdrawals are very slow.
  • Only 10 standard international withdrawals are processed daily.
  • Queue is strictly FIFO, unclear if FIFO is per user or per withdrawal.
  • It is possible to make an express manual withdrawal via another payment provider for a fee.

Any counterexamples?

> First of all, I'm just interested by SEPA withdrawals to avoid any other long quotes.

> Second I don't need counter examples when there is no example to counter.

> Then, I disagree, what we currently know for sure is :
             - the delay written on MG website and
             - some people (not that much I hope you will follow me on this or post examples) who claim withdrawals worked.
And I'm sorry to point it but nothing's proven.


But you didn't answer my question : Why did you spend so much time to defend something you didn't even try yourself?

[mrnejc]

• EUR via SEPA is less than one week
  • maximum per user is one withdrawal per 20 days

Where the hell did you find this? First time I hear of it ... 

[sturle]

But you didn't answer my question : Why did you spend so much time to defend something you didn't even try yourself?

I did: I think it is important to get the facts right.  Many people have lost a lot of money due to the FUD people spread about withdrawals.  I could have joined in and spread more FUD to make even more on arbitrage, but that would go against my principles.  Have you never defended something you didn't try yourself?

[sturle]

• EUR via SEPA is less than one week
  • maximum per user is one withdrawal per 20 days

Where the hell did you find this? First time I hear of it ... 

Scroll back a few posts.

[mrnejc]

Where the hell did you find this? First time I hear of it ... 

Scroll back a few posts.

Oh I see, not an official statement or it would be posted to their website, right? 

Then can someone explain how come they allow us to set withdrawal limits to 10k daily & 50k monthly - monthly limit is actually never reachable ...

[sturle]

Then can someone explain how come they allow us to set withdrawal limits to 10k daily & 50k monthly - monthly limit is actually never reachable ...

Not at the current limit.  The queue has shortened over the last couple of months, and I hope the ~20 days between withdrawals will be reduced as well.  You could apply for trusted status, of course, and withdraw 100k in one go.

[Resetif]

who ever received money in August?

[ardana123]

who ever received money in August?

a lucky few
Gox isn't really issuing SEPA nor wire transfers, they just give them now and then to random people while they stack up their profits, just like a ponzi scam artist does.

[Nagle]

Gox isn't really issuing SEPA nor wire transfers, they just give them now and then to random people while they stack up their profits, just like a Ponzi scam artist does.

That may well be the case.

Many people on here have been taking the position that it's OK if Mt. Gox won't pay out USD, as long as they will pay out Bitcoins.  Of course, there's a 10% or so spread loss when you do that. But beyond that, when does Mt. Gox run out of Bitcoins? There's no reason anybody should put Bitcoins into Mt. Gox at this point; you're on the wrong side of the price spread and can't get money out if you sell. There are about 30,000 Bitcoins for sale on Mt. Gox today, down from previous weeks, with about twice that on the buy side. At some point, those Bitcoins will be gone, or priced out of the market.

[cedivad]

No, not until everyone is sure that gox won't pay.
Until when they keep paying a SEPA each 2 and every YEN transfer people will keep having trust in it.

Btw, who need to cashout if the price skyrockets? (what is happening?)

[FreeTrade]

Waiting since 2nd July 2013 06:54:11 for USD withdrawal to European Bank.

Support have not been able to provide a date when they expected to be able to process the withdrawal.

[sturle]

who ever received money in August?

Gox isn't really issuing SEPA nor wire transfers, they just give them now and then to random people while they stack up their profits, just like a ponzi scam artist does.

Why do you keep spreading those lies?  You can't find ONE SINGLE EXAMPLE of someone not getting a SEPA transfer in time according to the rules I just gave.  How much are you making on arbitrage by discouraging people to withdraw fiat?

[sturle]

who ever received money in August?

A long list of people, just read backwards in this thread and others.

[sturle]

Gox isn't really issuing SEPA nor wire transfers, they just give them now and then to random people while they stack up their profits, just like a Ponzi scam artist does.

Many people on here have been taking the position that it's OK if Mt. Gox won't pay out USD, as long as they will pay out Bitcoins.  Of course, there's a 10% or so spread loss when you do that. But beyond that, when does Mt. Gox run out of Bitcoins? There's no reason anybody should put Bitcoins into Mt. Gox at this point; you're on the wrong side of the price spread and can't get money out if you sell. There are about 30,000 Bitcoins for sale on Mt. Gox today, down from previous weeks, with about twice that on the buy side. At some point, those Bitcoins will be gone, or priced out of the market.

Yesterday alone people withdrew more than 100 million JPY from MtGox.  Presumably to do arbitrage.  You can't do arbitrage without depositing BTC.  I deposited 80 BTC myself recently, bought from other exchanges, to do arbitrage, and will deposit 80 more as soon as my withdrawal arrives.

Btw, there are about 53k BTC in open asks at MtGox.  It has been below that many times before.  E.g. in April this year.

[sturle]

Waiting since 2nd July 2013 06:54:11 for USD withdrawal to European Bank.

Support have not been able to provide a date when they expected to be able to process the withdrawal.

You should cancel it and withdraw EUR via SEPA instead.  You will have your money in less than a week.

See:

A short summary of what we currently know about withdrawals:

• JPY domestic is next day
  • one extra delay recorded due to misspelling of Japanese name
  • one day extra recorded due to extraordinary volume (JPY withdrawal volume was > 1 million USD yesterday)
• EUR via SEPA is less than one week
  • maximum per user is one withdrawal per 20 days
  • very large withdrawals can be delayed up tp two weeks
• International withdrawals are very slow.
  • Only 10 standard international withdrawals are processed daily.
  • Queue is strictly FIFO, unclear if FIFO is per user or per withdrawal.
  • It is possible to make an express manual withdrawal via another payment provider for a fee.

Any counterexamples?

(There are NO known counterexamples.)

[FreeTrade]

Thanks, that's very helpful. I'll try to get set up for the SEPA withdrawal.

[advanced]

I'm in the exact same situation (waiting for international transfer from 2nd July).
I'm not sure how to 'cancel' the operation on MtGox, I'll try right away and keep you posted.

Thanks!

Waiting since 2nd July 2013 06:54:11 for USD withdrawal to European Bank.

Support have not been able to provide a date when they expected to be able to process the withdrawal.

You should cancel it and withdraw EUR via SEPA instead.  You will have your money in less than a week.

See:

A short summary of what we currently know about withdrawals:

• JPY domestic is next day
  • one extra delay recorded due to misspelling of Japanese name
  • one day extra recorded due to extraordinary volume (JPY withdrawal volume was > 1 million USD yesterday)
• EUR via SEPA is less than one week
  • maximum per user is one withdrawal per 20 days
  • very large withdrawals can be delayed up tp two weeks
• International withdrawals are very slow.
  • Only 10 standard international withdrawals are processed daily.
  • Queue is strictly FIFO, unclear if FIFO is per user or per withdrawal.
  • It is possible to make an express manual withdrawal via another payment provider for a fee.

Any counterexamples?

(There are NO known counterexamples.)

[Serpens66]

I'm in the exact same situation (waiting for international transfer from 2nd July).
I'm not sure how to 'cancel' the operation on MtGox, I'll try right away and keep you posted.

Thanks!

--->

One question:
How to cancel a withdrawal on Mtgox?

Chat with or email support.

@sturle:
I'm excited to hear about your withdrawal and if you will get ur money in less than one week.

[acoindr]

If you requested a withdrawal anytime after July 1st you can cancel that request and sell your BTC elsewhere at a premium probably.

No, because if you cancel your withdrawal request you still have only USD or EUR in you account - and not BTC.

You'd still have to exchange USD -> BTC on MtGox before you can move it to another exchange.

Yes, that's my point. You cancel your withdrawal request and get USD/EUR back into your account. You then buy BTC and move BTC somewhere else to sell. Before it made little sense to buy an asset with falling price, but now the price is rising and it's more favorable to own BTC.

Mt.Gox doesn't owe anyone the ability to sell BTC for fiat cash. If someone bought BTC then that's their decision to invest in that asset.

[sturle]

If you requested a withdrawal anytime after July 1st you can cancel that request and sell your BTC elsewhere at a premium probably.

No, because if you cancel your withdrawal request you still have only USD or EUR in you account - and not BTC.

You'd still have to exchange USD -> BTC on MtGox before you can move it to another exchange.

Yes, that's my point. You cancel your withdrawal request and get USD/EUR back into your account. You then buy BTC and move BTC somewhere else to sell. Before it made little sense to buy an asset with falling price, but now the price is rising and it's more favorable to own BTC.

If you need the fiat, and you can withdraw either JPY to a Japanese account or EUR to an account within SEPA (EU + EEA + Switzerland and Monaco), you should sell at MtGox and withdraw from there.  The price is better there than on all other exchanges.