[ANN] [QRK] Quark | Core 0.10 upgrade

[silvermetal]

@maok, can you provide me a reference about the amount of bitcoins present at exchanges? I couldn't find it....

@digitalindustry, you mentioned that the Quarkaddress in your profile is not from Kolin Evans but from "digitalindustry" and you explained that that is not a person but some sort of company? How big is your company (how much persons are working for you)? and what is the main purpose of that company?

[digitalindustry]

No it isn't JUST that people don't want to store their QRK (or XYZ or ABC) on an exchange out of fear of losing the coin...they do not have them on the exchange because they have no plans to sell in a short term time period that would require them having their coin on an exchange.

What makes Silvermetal a weirdo is the existing hypocricy between his proposed inability to understand the concept of long term holding of an investment, and his name silvermetal...with silver being about as much as a buy and hold for the long long term bury it and forget it item than anything.  Silver is at a 700 day low...should all metal holders be selling now...fuck no unless you are an idiot, or absolutely have to cash out to pay a bill.

 In fact many metal holders are not even in it for fiat profit, they buy silver as a counter to a collapse of the dollar.  Bill Still recommended the same kind of 'survivalist' mentality as a reason to buy and hold some Quark.  Personally I don't think along those lines but I think there was a number of people that did buy Quark as a counter to a fiat collapse, so they will be completely uninterested in selling until that scenario plays out.. I do not expect to see that QRK traded around on an exchange much at all which if anything is a genuine reduction in the amount of liquid QRK which actually makes upward price movement easier if/when buying demand increases.

I can field the first part, when they were chatting on to each other they decided to make up "Precious metals" "investment" type names.

as this is where a lot of investment in Quark came from.

so you have the "silvermetal" troll, and the moak already openly admitted they are trying to destroy Quark, its fun for them I guess as they wouldn't be doing anything else all day.


Silver is a Buy.

Quark is a Buy.

Yuan is a Buy.

one can get access to Yuan appreciation through Quark.

[digitalindustry]

@maok, can you provide me a reference about the amount of bitcoins present at exchanges? I couldn't find it....

@digitalindustry, you mentioned that the Quarkaddress in your profile is not from Kolin Evans but from "digitalindustry" and you explained that that is not a person but some sort of company? How big is your company (how much persons are working for you)? and what is the main purpose of that company?

every part of the earth.

[digitalindustry]

No it isn't JUST that people don't want to store their QRK (or XYZ or ABC) on an exchange out of fear of losing the coin...they do not have them on the exchange because they have no plans to sell in a short term time period that would require them having their coin on an exchange.

What makes Silvermetal a weirdo is the existing hypocricy between his proposed inability to understand the concept of long term holding of an investment, and his name silvermetal...with silver being about as much as a buy and hold for the long long term bury it and forget it item than anything.  Silver is at a 700 day low...should all metal holders be selling now...fuck no unless you are an idiot, or absolutely have to cash out to pay a bill.

 In fact many metal holders are not even in it for fiat profit, they buy silver as a counter to a collapse of the dollar.  Bill Still recommended the same kind of 'survivalist' mentality as a reason to buy and hold some Quark.  Personally I don't think along those lines but I think there was a number of people that did buy Quark as a counter to a fiat collapse, so they will be completely uninterested in selling until that scenario plays out.. I do not expect to see that QRK traded around on an exchange much at all which if anything is a genuine reduction in the amount of liquid QRK which actually makes upward price movement easier if/when buying demand increases.

hahahahahahaha
pfff
What a nonsense...I like "silver" because my name is "silvermetal"
I have heard stranger things...that I like metal music and that kind of things.
That I like silver is new from me

You like to flux all day?

Ok creating confusion...that is what you like Why do I forget those things sometimes....

Great response lol.. Waste of my time responding to a idiot with incoherent english.  Your evasion only solidifies you as a troll....and a laughable one at that.  You have been provided with straightforward common sense reasons to your idiot question why volume on an exchange is not equal to the total amount of Quark existing instead of digesting it like someone who asked the question in good faith would, you instead retort with a post that makes you look like a dumb cunt.  Congrats ding ding level40 you get a mount!

he slipped up and jumped back to "normal troll" there.... Silvermetal compose yourself.

[silvermetal]

@maok, can you provide me a reference about the amount of bitcoins present at exchanges? I couldn't find it....

@digitalindustry, you mentioned that the Quarkaddress in your profile is not from Kolin Evans but from "digitalindustry" and you explained that that is not a person but some sort of company? How big is your company (how much persons are working for you)? and what is the main purpose of that company?

every part of the earth.

Ok, you like to think you have control over the whole world, just popped up in my head. However that was not my question (maybe you misunderstood me).

How many people are working for di? And what is di doing?

[quarkfx]

Ok, you like to think you have control over the whole world, just popped up in my head. However that was not my question (maybe you misunderstood me).

How many people are working for di? And what is di doing?

Keep asking him that, Orm. Maybe you´ll eventually force him into another public demonstration of multiple personality disorder From the last pages I can see that you are seriously becoming DIs personal therapist. Don´t forget to charge him.

[digitalindustry]

keep your chin up you are making progress guys.

don't let the man get you down.


Quark is a great decentralized asset.

what happened with the "burn" Pete?

you seemed like you had 2 or 3 users interested there for a while?

[nixon99]

COULD YOU GUYS PLEASE SLING MUD AT EACH OTHER VIA PERSONAL MESSAGES?!
STOP SPAMMING THIS THREAD

[silvermetal]

Ok, you like to think you have control over the whole world, just popped up in my head. However that was not my question (maybe you misunderstood me).

How many people are working for di? And what is di doing?

Keep asking him that, Orm. Maybe you´ll eventually force him into another public demonstration of multiple personality disorder From the last pages I can see that you are seriously becoming DIs personal therapist. Don´t forget to charge him.

Hm seems that the company "digitalindustry" isn't interested to share any business information.
Is there one time a company interested in Quark....do we not even know where the business stands for and how big it is.

I have always worked for Quark on a voluntary basis, I dont want to change that. I like to work for a good cause.
My diagnosis was not correct by the way, Peter. I think this article, which was send to me, describes it better: http://betabeat.com/2013/03/me-and-you-and-everyone-we-know-the-many-many-many-faces-of-internet-multiples/

On a more serious note, I have no ambition to become a therapist. I just try to get some clarity.
To me it is not logical that the millions of Quark which are dumped last month seems evaporated.

I don't buy stories that Quarks feel more comfortable (or in his words; are happier) in Chinese wallets. Maybe I believed those stories 9 months ago, but not now anymore :-)

[maok]

@silvermetal Bitcoin volume in normal days is around 15-20K, you can check on http://bitcoincharts.com/ or on http://coinmarketcap.com/currencies/bitcoin/

Quark available volume on exchanges is normal and as you've seen last week when a new investor comes the volume will increase as well. Its a matter of price and the fact that people don't feel the need to leave their coins on the exchanges(even the exchanges don't recommend it). If you do keep your quarks on the exchanges my suggestion is to withdraw them immediately if you don't plan selling at the current prices of 1,500-2,500 satoshis

[silvermetal]

@silvermetal Bitcoin volume in normal days is around 15-20K, you can check on http://bitcoincharts.com/ or on http://coinmarketcap.com/currencies/bitcoin/

Quark available volume on exchanges is normal and as you've seen last week when a new investor comes the volume will increase as well. Its a matter of price and the fact that people don't feel the need to leave their coins on the exchanges(even the exchanges don't recommend it). If you do keep your quarks on the exchanges my suggestion is to withdraw them immediately if you don't plan selling at the current prices of 1,500-2,500 satoshis

Maok, sorry to be so "critical", but in my opinion this doesn't reflect the volume Bitcoins present at exchanges. For a better estimation you also have to count all btc in the buyorders for the different alts at cryptsy, mintpal etc (because all alts can be bought with btc). That is why I think you can't compare QRK with btc or ltc.

Maybe for this case I can compare QRK best with a pre-mined coin like NXT, what also has no problems with miners who dump the mined coins at exchanges.

Thanks for the tip to withdraw my quark. Good suggestion

[maok]

Maok, sorry to be so "critical", but in my opinion this doesn't reflect the volume Bitcoins present at exchanges. For a better estimation you also have to count all btc in the buyorders for the different alts at cryptsy, mintpal etc (because all alts can be bought with btc). Therefore I think you can't compare QRK with btc or ltc.

Anybody an idea why the amount Quark for sale is so low at the exchanges?

Are we talking about the volume or available for sell ? Your initial investigation was about the amount of Quark available for sell and I've taken few minutes to see the exact figures.

Some facts(not opinion):

btc38.com total quarks available for sell: 1,631,344 QRK (http://www.btc38.com/trade_en.html?btc38_trade_coin_name=qrk)
cryptsy total quarks available for sell: 347,410 QRK (https://www.cryptsy.com/markets/view/71)
bter total quarks available for sell: 332,711 QRK (https://bter.com/trade/qrk_btc)

Only taken the 3 most important exchanges, total QRK available for sell: 2,311,465 -> out of 248,233,803 total QRK ~= 0.93%

Bitcoin top 3
BTC China : They don't present the order available for sell to non-registered users but I've taken their volume of 30,000 BTC
Bitstamp: 4,000 BTC available for sell(https://www.bitstamp.net/market/order_book/)
BTC-e: 9,554 BTC available for sell(https://btc-e.com/)

Total 43,554 BTC, out of 13,303,700 total BTC ~= 0.32%

Bitcoin available for sell almost 3 times lower than Quark.

Mostly crypto investors start to become nervous when prices drop for such a long period, and at a sudden point they take their losses and you notice large dumps at exchanges.

Bitcoin price trend resembles Quark's from January onwards so you could ask why aren't the `nervous` bitcoiners heading straight to the exchanges ? Well again its only a matter of price and the fact that people don't like to keep their coins at the exchanges if they aren't going to trade them at current prices. When the price is right you'll see an increase in volume.

[silvermetal]

Maok, sorry to be so "critical", but in my opinion this doesn't reflect the volume Bitcoins present at exchanges. For a better estimation you also have to count all btc in the buyorders for the different alts at cryptsy, mintpal etc (because all alts can be bought with btc). Therefore I think you can't compare QRK with btc or ltc.

Anybody an idea why the amount Quark for sale is so low at the exchanges?

Are we talking about the volume or available for sell ? Your initial investigation was about the amount of Quark available for sell and I've taken few minutes to see the exact figures.

Some facts(not opinion):

btc38.com total quarks available for sell: 1,631,344 QRK (http://www.btc38.com/trade_en.html?btc38_trade_coin_name=qrk)
cryptsy total quarks available for sell: 347,410 QRK (https://www.cryptsy.com/markets/view/71)
bter total quarks available for sell: 332,711 QRK (https://bter.com/trade/qrk_btc)

Only taken the 3 most important exchanges, total QRK available for sell: 2,311,465 -> out of 248,233,803 total QRK ~= 0.93%

Bitcoin top 3
BTC China : They don't present the order available for sell to non-registered users but I've taken their volume of 30,000 BTC
Bitstamp: 4,000 BTC available for sell(https://www.bitstamp.net/market/order_book/)
BTC-e: 9,554 BTC available for sell(https://btc-e.com/)

Total 43,554 BTC, out of 13,303,700 total BTC ~= 0.32%

Bitcoin available for sell almost 3 times lower than Quark.

Mostly crypto investors start to become nervous when prices drop for such a long period, and at a sudden point they take their losses and you notice large dumps at exchanges.

Bitcoin price trend resembles Quark's from January onwards so you could ask why aren't the `nervous` bitcoiners heading straight to the exchanges ? Well again its only a matter of price and the fact that people don't like to keep their coins at the exchanges if they aren't going to trade them at current prices. When the price is right you'll see an increase in volume.

Thank you!
Will have a closer look to it when I come home. When I count quick at btc38 and look to the top 30 (did not find out how to see complete list), I count about 600-700k. The amount you counted at cryptsy and bter is comparable what I counted.

I was indeed looking for the amount of Quark for sale not volume.

[maok]

When I count quick at btc38 and look to the top 30 (did not find out how to see complete list), I count about 600-700k

There are 693,457 QRK as buy orders not for sell.

P.S. If you want to make it easier, this is the regex I've used:

Code:

\.(\d*)	(\d*?\.\d*)

You take group 2 out of it and

Code:

$nrs = "60514.149174
31163.65702
...
...";
$count = explode("\n", $nrs);
$total = 0;
foreach($count as $nr) $total += trim($nr);
	
echo $total;

[silvermetal]

When I count quick at btc38 and look to the top 30 (did not find out how to see complete list), I count about 600-700k

There are 693,457 QRK as buy orders not for sell.

P.S. If you want to make it easier, this is the regex I've used:

Code:

\.(\d*)	(\d*?\.\d*)

You take group 2 out of it and

Code:

$nrs = "60514.149174
31163.65702
...
...";
$count = explode("\n", $nrs);
$total = 0;
foreach($count as $nr) $total += trim($nr);
	
echo $total;

Cool!

Yeah looked in the wrong column lol
Thanks again, also for the formulas!

[silvermetal]

@maok, maybe you can also help me with the following.

There is one Quarkaddress with 4,2M Quark on it: http://qrk.blockr.io/address/info/QRHb2CTvGnwwrf6GHrxgQcH2tTAUoGhnC2

At 08 January there was 33M Quark on that address. There have been much speculation and discussion about this address in the past.
First was thought it was from an exchange, but we can exclude that after today's calculations (and data from Bronevic) that one exchange had once 33M Quark.

Most probably it is of an early miner. I don't bother very much that (s)he has still 4,2M Quark on it (At one side that person is capable to destroy the complete Quark market, as we have just calculated that the buy orders are not more than about 700.000 Quark at btc38. At the other side there will be of course new buy orders when the price drops).

What I find strange is that this person is sending and receiving almost daily from January 04 till September 20 100.000 Quark from and to this address.

Do you have any idea why one person would send/receive almost daily 100.000 Quark? What is your opinion about this?

[maok]

@maok, maybe you can also help me with the following.

There is one Quarkaddress with 4,2M Quark on it: http://qrk.blockr.io/address/info/QRHb2CTvGnwwrf6GHrxgQcH2tTAUoGhnC2

At 08 January there was 33M Quark on that address. There have been much speculation and discussion about this address in the past.
First was thought it was from an exchange, but we can exclude that after today's calculations (and data from Bronevic) that one exchange had once 33M Quark.

Most probably it is of an early miner. I don't bother very much that (s)he has still 4,2M Quark on it (At one side that person is capable to destroy the complete Quark market, as we have just calculated that the buy orders are not more than about 700.000 Quark at btc38. At the other side there will be of course new buy orders when the price drops).

What I find strange is that this person is sending and receiving almost daily from January 04 till September 20 100.000 Quark from and to this address.

Do you have any idea why one person would send/receive almost daily 100.000 Quark? What is your opinion about this?

Based on the sheer number of incoming and outcome tx'es from a plethora of addresses I can tell you its either a mixing service(which i don't know it exists in Quark) or an exchange. Your confusion regarding the 100,000 in and out is very easy to clear simply by looking at the outgoing tx you'll see it doesn't sends the fix sum of 100K but it sends X amount to an address(most likely a customer or a lower end of security manager/server) and the rest is the change that the quark protocol automatically sends to a new address. Due to the security levels involved in most exchanges they will have managers/servers with different levels of security, which after a while they'll send back to the main/higher lever address in form of a fix 100K sum gathered from all the lower end points.

After looking a bit further I can tell you this service, most likely an exchange, has entered the market around 1-5 Dec 2013 so you must think which exchange adopted Quark on that date or announced that it will adopt Quark(most likely btc38)

Also after a bit more digging(public blockchain is doing wonders) I can tell you this exchange also has a cold storage address with 18 millions in it(2nd largest in Quark). Most likely that cold address is only accessible from the high end security level probably the owners of btc38 which they'll use it when extra funds are required. Similar to them at quarktalk.org we also have a cold storage address which is the public one(QUARK957iywYSpgkYi9gbW3pFtLszeU7wQ) and the rest of lower end levels are kept on the servers for the payouts. Once I'll use the cold storage address and expose my pubkey then I'll move the funds to another cold storage address, just in case the sha256 algo gets broken ;-)

No one can destroy a crypto currency by selling their coins, what they'll do is 1. deliberately financial self-harm and 2. open up the market to new adopters which will take advantage of the low price. This is the reason you see all the struggle with Bitcoin price going back and forth this year from the $400-$500 levels, this used to happen when it was $10-$11, it used to happen when it was $100, eventually you'll see that no one will commit financial suicide, especially in Quark whose full emission has already taken place(the extra 1 million minable quarks per year aren't sufficient to harm the price by an evil entity, like for example mining conglomerates can and are harming Bitcoin price)

[silvermetal]

@maok, maybe you can also help me with the following.

There is one Quarkaddress with 4,2M Quark on it: http://qrk.blockr.io/address/info/QRHb2CTvGnwwrf6GHrxgQcH2tTAUoGhnC2

At 08 January there was 33M Quark on that address. There have been much speculation and discussion about this address in the past.
First was thought it was from an exchange, but we can exclude that after today's calculations (and data from Bronevic) that one exchange had once 33M Quark.

Most probably it is of an early miner. I don't bother very much that (s)he has still 4,2M Quark on it (At one side that person is capable to destroy the complete Quark market, as we have just calculated that the buy orders are not more than about 700.000 Quark at btc38. At the other side there will be of course new buy orders when the price drops).

What I find strange is that this person is sending and receiving almost daily from January 04 till September 20 100.000 Quark from and to this address.

Do you have any idea why one person would send/receive almost daily 100.000 Quark? What is your opinion about this?

Based on the sheer number of incoming and outcome tx'es from a plethora of addresses I can tell you its either a mixing service(which i don't know it exists in Quark) or an exchange. Your confusion regarding the 100,000 in and out is very easy to clear simply by looking at the outgoing tx you'll see it doesn't sends the fix sum of 100K but it sends X amount to an address(most likely a customer or a lower end of security manager/server) and the rest is the change that the quark protocol automatically sends to a new address. Due to the security levels involved in most exchanges they will have managers/servers with different levels of security, which after a while they'll send back to the main/higher lever address in form of a fix 100K sum gathered from all the lower end points.

After looking a bit further I can tell you this service, most likely an exchange, has entered the market around 1-5 Dec 2013 so you must think which exchange adopted Quark on that date or announced that it will adopt Quark(most likely btc38)

Also after a bit more digging(public blockchain is doing wonders) I can tell you this exchange also has a cold storage address with 18 millions in it(2nd largest in Quark). Most likely that cold address is only accessible from the high end security level probably the owners of btc38 which they'll use it when extra funds are required. Similar to them at quarktalk.org we also have a cold storage address which is the public one(QUARK957iywYSpgkYi9gbW3pFtLszeU7wQ) and the rest of lower end levels are kept on the servers for the payouts. Once I'll use the cold storage address and expose my pubkey then I'll move the funds to another cold storage address, just in case the sha256 algo gets broken ;-)

No one can destroy a crypto currency by selling their coins, what they'll do is 1. deliberately financial self-harm and 2. open up the market to new adopters which will take advantage of the low price. This is the reason you see all the struggle with Bitcoin price going back and forth this year from the $400-$500 levels, this used to happen when it was $10-$11, it used to happen when it was $100, eventually you'll see that no one will commit financial suicide, especially in Quark whose full emission has already taken place(the extra 1 million minable quarks per year aren't sufficient to harm the price by an evil entity, like for example mining conglomerates can and are harming Bitcoin price)

Thank you I really learn a lot from you . What is your background, how do you know so much about cryptocoins?
Also what a relief...It is possible to have an open and informative discussion about Quark at bitcointalk without any distraction (that I have plans to fork Quark or something )

Sounds logic what you tell. Why do you think that btc38 needs such a large cold storage? Is that normal for an exchange? and do you think they have that large cold storage for every coin they trade? And how did btc38 obtain those coins?

What are conglomerates? I missed that story...

[coinerer]

... especially in Quark whose full emission has already taken place(the extra 1 million minable quarks per year aren't sufficient to harm the price by an evil entity, like for example mining conglomerates can and are harming Bitcoin price)

The main cause is very much bigger market capitalization of BTC compared to QRK.

[maok]

Sounds logic what you tell. Why do you think that btc38 needs such a large cold storage? Is that normal for an exchange? and do you think they have that large cold storage for every coin they trade? And how did btc38 obtain those coins?

What are conglomerates? I missed that story...

we can't tell for sure if its btc38, but its an exchange or a mixing service. The educated guess tells me it could be btc38 but why would they buy so much Quark ? Well lets say you want to provide liquidity to your markets so that you attract a large portion of traders of that currency, how would you do that if not by using your own resources(look at VOS, coins-e, etc little liquidity => few customers). There are lots of linked addresses with that one from 1-5 December so most likely they bought the quarks back then until opening their service(Qrk was #3 back then if i;m not mistaken)

mining conglomerates are those powerful miners which have contracts for selling their mined coins off-exchanges at premium cost and also doing lots of shady activities(mainly manipulating price). This can be seen perfectly in Bitcoin in recent months when good news after good news and still the price was under control by these forces which can profit from weak hands in the market. In Quark we don't have this kind of problem so we're one step ahead, however our network effect is so small that it doesn't matter that we offer an improvement version of Bitcoin because the train has already left the station so we have lots of catching up to do, especially since Quark hoarders are doing nothing to support the coin even from the background, even a small contribution, they just sit on their quarks without promoting it, without getting 1 finger involved in any activity..