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Author Topic: NXT :: descendant of Bitcoin - Updated Information  (Read 2760181 times)
Jerical13
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March 08, 2014, 08:56:50 PM
 #42061


If it is possible to speed up the network, in a resource efficient manor that wasn't out of balance with the purpose for speeding it up I say "Hell Yeah! Do it". If not , there are other options.

To use your words 'Hell Yeah' this is the way I would try to do it... and it is about infrastructure if you consider this to be how NXT works as a whole, but its not about H/W or shouldn't be (other than N/W).

What ever works. I see NXT as opportunity in infinite forms. To me that is its infrastructure. The more solutions and variants the better. The more observations from different points of view the better. Really there is nothing to rule out both suggested solutions being implemented simultaneously.

Plus this kind of conversation is just interesting. Cheesy

What do you mean by H/W and N/W ? missed that.
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Eadeqa
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March 08, 2014, 09:01:26 PM
 #42062

All: Please watch this video about the future of Nxt and comment it (here), thank you very much!

http://youtu.be/RtTWUwRL9mQ


Nxt Decentralized Internet video - alfa version:
http://youtu.be/RtTWUwRL9mQ

(created between 20 Feb-8 March)

I would be very grateful for any comments and suggestions. It still needs some time, but it already can be commented

Based on the paper:
http://justpaste.it/decentralized-internet
(created between 12-18 Feb)

And good night, its almost 6 AM here Cheesy

There is no evidence Nxt is ever going to implement zerocoin. It's incompatible  with 1000 TF

Zerocoin has a number of serious limitations:
- It uses cutting-edge cryptography which may turn out to be insecure, and which is understood by relatively few people (compared to ECDSA, for example).
- It produces large (20kbyte) signatures that would bloat the blockchain (or create risk if stuffed in external storage).
- It requires a trusted party to initiate its accumulator. If that party cheats, they can steal coin. (Perhaps fixable with more cutting-edge crypto.)
- Validation is very slow (can process about 2tx per second on a fast CPU), which is a major barrier to deployment in Bitcoin as each full node must validate every transaction.
- The large transactions and slow validation also means costly transactions, which will reduce the anonymity set size and potentially make ZC usage unavailable to random members of the public who are merely casually concerned about their privacy.
- Uses an accumulator which grows forever and has no pruning. In practice this means we'd need to switch accumulators periodically to reduce the working set size, reducing the anonymity set size. And potentially creating big UTXO bloat problems if the horizon on an accumulator isn't set in advance.

parallel blockchains would make it possible

In other words, it's complete fiction right now with no evidence that anyone is even working on it to implement on Nxt and how it's going to be implemented. Not only there is no code, but how it will be implemented is unclear speculation.  Plus there is no evidence  it will work. We should stop making Youtube videos about Nxt having zerocoin "feature" as if it's implemented working feature. .

salsacz delete your youtube video immediatly.





NXT-GZYP-FMRT-FQ9K-3YQGS
https://nxtforum.org
Sebastien256
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March 08, 2014, 09:03:27 PM
 #42063


In other words, it's completely fiction right now with no evidence that anyone is even working on it to implement on Nxt and how it's going to be implemented.
Plus there is no evidence  it will work. We should stop making Youtube videos about Nxt having zerocoin "feature" as if it's implemented working feature. .

salsacz delete your youtube video immediatly.


please look at nxtcash on the list of thread:
http://www.nxtcoins.nl/bitcointalk-threads/

EDIT:

If zerocoin/mixing is only an option for those who want to use it and do not become the standard of nxt core, then i see no problem. It would be the best of the two world. I just hope that  zerocoin/mixing  will simply be a layer on top of nxt for which user will have the choice to use it or not. Legal business will then simply not use the zerocoin/mixing functions.  


parallel blockchains would make it possible

My point of view is that nxtcash should not be implemented in the nxt core, but as an optional layer over the core. Using Parallel block chain for nxtcash is a very good idea.

Nxt official forum at: https://nxtforum.org/
Jerical13
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March 08, 2014, 09:06:25 PM
 #42064

 

[/quote]
Could you point me to that solution of yours?
[/quote]

I was talking about the use of prepaid credit cards for use in point of purchase transactions as a way of possibly bypassing having to figure out how to make instant transactions possible through the network.
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March 08, 2014, 09:09:59 PM
 #42065

Ripple (which puts these selling points first as well) has been around longer than Bitcoin or at least nearly as long I believe.

Huh

Fact check: Ripple was founded in 2004 by Ryan Fugger

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ripple_(payment_protocol)

NXT: 4957831430947123625
Emule
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March 08, 2014, 09:10:22 PM
 #42066

Nxt Decentralized Internet video - alfa version:
http://youtu.be/RtTWUwRL9mQ

(created between 20 Feb-8 March)

I would be very grateful for any comments and suggestions. It still needs some time, but it already can be commented

Based on the paper:
http://justpaste.it/decentralized-internet
(created between 12-18 Feb)

And good night, its almost 6 AM here Cheesy

CRAP! and copyright violation! == theft

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copyright_infringement

when u finally going to do something usefull for this community?
wesleyh
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March 08, 2014, 09:12:58 PM
 #42067

New version of NxtWallet for Mac available:

http://nxtra.org/mac/NxtWallet.zip

Shows blockchain download progress. Tomorrow or monday I will release the same version for windows.

It connects to TestNet at first start. you can switch to Main Net via tools menu. I suggest you test everything out in TestNet first as there may be bugs. We need someone to do an audit of the web code.

If you want the old interface, simply go to http://localhost:7875 (main net) in the browser when the app is running.

My Nxt id is : 8189784314684138350 - thanks for any donations.


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March 08, 2014, 09:13:19 PM
 #42068

Thanks  Smiley

You're welcome.

(I'm killing me)

and me....  Grin

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March 08, 2014, 09:15:03 PM
 #42069


In other words, it's complete fiction right now with no evidence that anyone is even working on it to implement on Nxt and how it's going to be implemented. Not only there is no code, but how it will be implemented is unclear speculation.  Plus there is no evidence  it will work. We should stop making Youtube videos about Nxt having zerocoin "feature" as if it's implemented working feature. .

salsacz delete your youtube video immediatly.


This goes for all the promotion out there promising instant transactions and transparent forging. I feel like I've been suckered in somewhat with a bait and switch.

NXT: 4957831430947123625
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March 08, 2014, 09:17:02 PM
 #42070

Since the second transaction has a higher fee, it will get on the next block with higher priority, right? Since the first payment won't be confirmed, how can the double-spend succeed?

Only 1/10 is allowed to spend.
chanc3r
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March 08, 2014, 09:20:21 PM
 #42071


If it is possible to speed up the network, in a resource efficient manor that wasn't out of balance with the purpose for speeding it up I say "Hell Yeah! Do it". If not , there are other options.

To use your words 'Hell Yeah' this is the way I would try to do it... and it is about infrastructure if you consider this to be how NXT works as a whole, but its not about H/W or shouldn't be (other than N/W).

What ever works. <snip...>
Plus this kind of conversation is just interesting. Cheesy

What do you mean by H/W and N/W ? missed that.

For next computation is not the issue but we cannot do much about data volumes... we can make the communication more efficient by compressing/turning it into binary, but once done then the more transactions you have the more data nodes need to exchange so N/W or network could become an issue. Its not an issue today we don't need nodes with huge pipes but in my experience the way you stop something like this being an issue or costing a lot to fix is to solve it when the system is small.

Also we talk about NXT (singular) and think about 1 node, there is value in thinking of it as a network and a sequence of nodes...

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March 08, 2014, 09:21:13 PM
 #42072

Since the second transaction has a higher fee, it will get on the next block with higher priority, right? Since the first payment won't be confirmed, how can the double-spend succeed?

Only 1/10 is allowed to spend.

The more I think about this idea the more I don't like it. If I want to have 100 NXT to spend on hand I have to commit 1000 NXT to be unaccessible? If a security bug becomes known or there's some bad news that causes NXT price to plummet I have no way to react.

I don't think most people will be willing to do this.

Just my .5 NXt

I like the parallel blockchain idea much better if it's feasible.

NXT: 4957831430947123625
chanc3r
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March 08, 2014, 09:21:49 PM
 #42073

Since the second transaction has a higher fee, it will get on the next block with higher priority, right? Since the first payment won't be confirmed, how can the double-spend succeed?
Only 1/10 is allowed to spend.

Please help us me to understand - what is the reason for the 1/10 ratio? or is it completely arbitrary?

EDIT: Cfb - what about the reserve balance approach I posted in your other thread?

EvilDave
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March 08, 2014, 09:23:08 PM
 #42074

Don't know if anyones posted this here yet....but there's another password cracker going thru the NXT blockchain:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=506298.msg5580350#msg5580350

There's a reference in the thread above to a 1 megaNXT account with a 4 character password. Smells like FUD to me, but have a look for yourselves.....I'm going to carry on plowing thru this thread.

Nulli Dei, nulli Reges, solum NXT
Love your money: www.nxt.org  www.ardorplatform.org
www.nxter.org  www.nxtfoundation.org
bitcoinpaul
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March 08, 2014, 09:25:07 PM
 #42075

Fact check: Ripple was founded in 2004 by Ryan Fugger

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ripple_(payment_protocol)

Didn't know!
Sebastien256
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March 08, 2014, 09:25:49 PM
 #42076

Since the second transaction has a higher fee, it will get on the next block with higher priority, right? Since the first payment won't be confirmed, how can the double-spend succeed?

Only 1/10 is allowed to spend.

The more I think about this idea the more I don't like it. If I want to have 100 NXT to spend on hand I have to commit 1000 NXT to be unaccessible? If a security bug becomes known or there's some bad news that causes NXT price to plummet I have no way to react.

I don't think most people will be willing to do this.

Just my .5 NXt

I disagree on "If a security bug becomes known or there's some bad news that causes NXT price to plummet I have no way to react.". Right now, bad news could happen anytime to plummet NXT price. You should think NXT feathure for long term ideology. NXT is not a final product.

Overall, I believe that "If I want to have 100 NXT to spend on hand I have to commit 1000 NXT to be unaccessible" is good idea if all the thing is secure and can be work out.

Nxt official forum at: https://nxtforum.org/
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March 08, 2014, 09:43:42 PM
 #42077

Don't know if anyones posted this here yet....but there's another password cracker going thru the NXT blockchain:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=506298.msg5580350#msg5580350

There's a reference in the thread above to a 1 megaNXT account with a 4 character password. Smells like FUD to me, but have a look for yourselves.....I'm going to carry on plowing thru this thread.

Best comment in that thread:

You just opened a Pandora's Box ...

Perhaps Nxt can actually be "mined", after all.  Grin


Seriously though, this is pretty scary. You can brute force the ENTIRE network at once. It's the equivalent of someone walking though the neighborhood (at high speed) checking every door for a weak lock and methodically steal EVERYTHING from anyone who has the wrong kind of lock.

It would be nice to be able to tie your account to a MAC address if you want to, or to a list of MAC addresses. 2FA might help as well but don't see that as feasible at the core level.

NXT: 4957831430947123625
Emule
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March 08, 2014, 09:45:18 PM
 #42078


In other words, it's complete fiction right now with no evidence that anyone is even working on it to implement on Nxt and how it's going to be implemented. Not only there is no code, but how it will be implemented is unclear speculation.  Plus there is no evidence  it will work. We should stop making Youtube videos about Nxt having zerocoin "feature" as if it's implemented working feature. .

salsacz delete your youtube video immediatly.


This goes for all the promotion out there promising instant transactions and transparent forging. I feel like I've been suckered in somewhat with a bait and switch.

hell yeah you see it finally

almost april and......

Let sum up what we have finished here:

- Decentralized Alias System / DNS: yes but not Complete
- Basic DDoS Protection: Complete?
- Decentralized Asset Exchange / Colored Coins:NO
- Transparent Mining:NO
- Transparant Forging:NO
- Arbitrary Messaging: Complete but absolete
- Instant Transactions:NO
- Decentralized Marketplace / Auction:NO
- Distributed Storage:NO
- Multi-signatures:NO
- Blockchain Shrinking:NO
- Two-phase Payments:NO
- Voting System:NO
- Reputation System:NO
- Decentralized Mixing Service:NO
- Distributed Computing:NO
- Smart Contracts:NO
- Hardware Wallets:NO
- Advanced DDoS Protection Project Kharo:NO
- white paper: NO
- Client:NO

What do we have:

bloated Blockchain that uses GB's of traffic that no one can afford!
hot air
unclaimed coins
12 laughing rich initial founders and 15 sitting on a pile of nxt they never can sell
rats leaving the sinking ship already
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March 08, 2014, 09:47:36 PM
 #42079

Since the second transaction has a higher fee, it will get on the next block with higher priority, right? Since the first payment won't be confirmed, how can the double-spend succeed?

Only 1/10 is allowed to spend.

The more I think about this idea the more I don't like it. If I want to have 100 NXT to spend on hand I have to commit 1000 NXT to be unaccessible? If a security bug becomes known or there's some bad news that causes NXT price to plummet I have no way to react.

I don't think most people will be willing to do this.

Just my .5 NXt

I disagree on "If a security bug becomes known or there's some bad news that causes NXT price to plummet I have no way to react.". Right now, bad news could happen anytime to plummet NXT price. You should think NXT feathure for long term ideology. NXT is not a final product.

Overall, I believe that "If I want to have 100 NXT to spend on hand I have to commit 1000 NXT to be unaccessible" is good idea if all the thing is secure and can be work out.

It's what I like to refer to as a "weird" solution. It might work but it's not elegant. If a bank gave you a debit card that worked this way you'd laugh in their faces.

NXT: 4957831430947123625
pandaisftw
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March 08, 2014, 09:48:06 PM
 #42080

Asset Exchange Enhancement Proposal

https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1FsyumJLmQ9ckLNkHlmW1oPRGOoK3oAg_pVjFz3s0fNw/edit?usp=sharing

With even more feedback, some have suggested that perhaps relying on an external website is not good (although it *should* be secure, perhaps someone can find a way to abuse this?)

With this in mind, I added slides 5-7 to show how this could be done without external URLs, only using Aliases. NXT already provides all the tools needed for this to work, clients just have to be able to interpret it. If people think this is a good idea, hopefully we can have a discussion going on the standard formatting.

IMO, this is important because it removes the ability of squatters to hold important asset names at ransom from the community.

Pandaisftw

Okay, another update to address an issue of phonies. Also, just thought of new uses for external URLs, such as audio (for music artists to put up samples) and videos (for game companies like Steam to show trailers). It should be a pretty robust system now. Of course, and feedback is appreciated!


Also my contribution earlier to this discussion:

Now that I think about it, parallel chains is a very nice way to achieve the 1000 TPS goal. It is highly unlikely that everyone needs to use all the parallel chains at once, so by providing many, many chains, people would only have to secure the ones they are interested in. NXT as a whole could have 1000 TPS, but a regular user would probably only need to secure at most 100 TPS on the chains he/she is interested in.

It is unlikely someone in India using NXTIndia will need to secure the NXTChina parallel chain (although both would secure the master chain). So with just 10 countries using NXT at 100 TPS, you got your 1000 TPS without the entire network having to have super-mega-fast internet speeds.

Add in specialized services with their own chain, and this number could be much higher than 1000 TPS.

Pandaisftw

NXT: 13095091276527367030
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