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Author Topic: NXT :: descendant of Bitcoin - Updated Information  (Read 2761351 times)
bitcoinpaul
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March 09, 2014, 10:33:52 AM
 #42201

I think entropy from mouse is needed for javascript (like wesley client) -- not for Java's SecureRandom

As for words, as I said, don't use cryptic words from diceware. 1626 simple words dictionary will just work fine for 128-bit entropy.


Actually, newest browsers have crypto.getRandomValues - so no mouse movement needed in those cases. Of course still necessary for older browsers.

Well, even if it is not technically necessary for most of the browsers, we should use the mouse movement because

1. With this, we make sure every user (no matter which browser) has a secure account (using mouse movement only on older browsers gives no common picture of the client on every computer. looks insecure)
2. It gives a secure feeling because the user is part of the process
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March 09, 2014, 10:35:36 AM
 #42202

What does your implementation of words.getDiceWd look like?

It picks directly from an array of words. Why?

How do you map the integer type parameter down to the range of items in the dictionary?

int & 0X1fff returns a value between 0 (inclusive) and 8191 (inclusive)


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March 09, 2014, 10:37:10 AM
 #42203

Good morning people  Cheesy .
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March 09, 2014, 10:40:39 AM
 #42204

I like the idea of parallel blockchain.

On one "fast" Blockchain:

- By limiting forging power to 1M nxt, we can ensure that at least 1000 fast nodes can manage TF with high TPS. Transaction that have to happen really fast (AM, important transaction, etc.) can take place on such blockchain. High premium quality hardware would be needed to ensure the stability of this blockchain.
 
On another "regular" Blockchain (there can be more than one):

- Transaction that don't require to be fast can unload the "fast" blockchain for which rasberrypi could be use to secure the network.

As long as in the client, the user can choose on which blockchain to broadcast his desired transaction (different cost associated to broadcasting depending one the quality of the hardware supporting the blockchain), then high TPS could happen within the nxt network if the user decide to use "fast" premium quality network for specific important transaction.

What do you think?

Nxt official forum at: https://nxtforum.org/
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March 09, 2014, 10:42:25 AM
Last edit: March 09, 2014, 11:08:32 AM by igmaca
 #42205

Only TL;DR version, coz noone would read a full one.

I like the idea of parallel blockchain.

On one "fast" Blockchain:

- By limiting forging power to 1M nxt, we can ensure that at least 1000 fast nodes can manage TF with high TPS. Transaction that have to happen really fast (AM, important transaction, etc.) can take place on such blockchain. High premium quality hardware would be needed to ensure the stability of this blockchain.
 
On another "regular" Blockchain (there can be more than one):

- Transaction that don't require to be fast can unload the "fast" blockchain for which rasberrypi could be use to secure the network.

As long as in the client, the user can choose on which blockchain to broadcast his desired transaction (different cost associated to broadcasting depending one the quality of the hardware supporting the blockchain), then high TPS could happen within the nxt network if the user decide to use "fast" premium quality network for specific important transaction.

What do you think?



yes exact but think in this  Shocked

raspberry pi node that suports TF
special hubs node that suports TPS

one Raspberry pi node to forge must be active.
if a raspberry pi node gets forge shares its fee with other nodes Raspberry Pi grouping. (which are grouped in one of the 1,000 nodes ultra hight TPS)


when raspberry pi node have success in forging special node to belonging raspberry pi node forges too. note that this is parallel blockchain but only raspberry pi node suports TF

what happens if you attack one of the 1,000 nodes?

as the power to forge remains in raspberri pi nodes the network security remains unchanged.
it may happen that momentarily not reached 1,000 TPS

note the criteria to limit the power of forging an account 1,000,000 nxt is due to 1440 blocks are generated in a day and therefore the chance is about one day.

if the number of blocks per day for example increase to 14400 per day the criteria to limit the power of forging change to 100,000 nxt account as tantamount to a chance of about one day.

why one day?
because all accounts that they want to forge if they are always active every day receive fees
keeps the interest in forging and maintain the node active
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March 09, 2014, 10:43:05 AM
 #42206

What does your implementation of words.getDiceWd look like?

It picks directly from an array of words. Why?

How do you map the integer type parameter down to the range of items in the dictionary?

int & 0X1fff returns a value between 0 (inclusive) and 8191 (inclusive)


This is like a modulo operation right? Like "(int mod 8192)". If so, it puts a (very) slight preference on the first entries in the dictionary.

I don't have a cryptographic background, but it seems like one of these tiny things cryptographic people look for. Or it's just me being paranoid..
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March 09, 2014, 10:47:04 AM
 #42207


The initial stakeholders don't owe anyone here a goddamn thing. They took the huge risk by buying in early while everyone else called NXT a scam coin. They are under NO obligation to re-distribute the wealth to all those, including me, who missed out because of cynicism or ignorance or whatever. If NXT becomes a huge success, they and they alone deserve to be hugely rewarded for taking that risk. they have every right as free citizens of planet earth to do damn well whatever they please with their windfall.

I'm not sure if you just ran out of psych-meds or if you're sucking up to the big holders, but your statements are insane.
They took a "huge risk" ? 50 dollars for 15 million NXT or so is a "huge risk" ?
*Most* of those who "missed out" was people who didn't see the thread or came too late because BCNext shutdown the IPO hastily.
I have used the arguments you are regurgitating too many times in the last 3 months of marketing and arguing with skeptics, so I know them in and out.
This isn't about big stakeholders handing out NXT to random people, but to FUND marketing, FUND development, FUND incentives for people to give a fuck of NXT's health.

And it's also about fairness. Right now most of the stakeholders are just like the CEOs of Walmart. They take all the money and let people do all the work.

How you can justify the idea that because they invested 50 dollars they have this deep deserving right to be millionaires while those who make NXT worth milliones should get none is baffling.

It sounds like you've seen a 5 minute clip of Milton Friedman and think that this trickledown economy is a law of physics. Insane.

Well this is exactly what I said 3 post above!!
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March 09, 2014, 10:48:20 AM
 #42208

I like the idea of parallel blockchain.

On one "fast" Blockchain:

- By limiting forging power to 1M nxt, we can ensure that at least 1000 fast nodes can manage TF with high TPS. Transaction that have to happen really fast (AM, important transaction, etc.) can take place on such blockchain. High premium quality hardware would be needed to ensure the stability of this blockchain.
 
On another "regular" Blockchain (there can be more than one):

- Transaction that don't require to be fast can unload the "fast" blockchain for which rasberrypi could be use to secure the network.

As long as in the client, the user can choose on which blockchain to broadcast his desired transaction (different cost associated to broadcasting depending one the quality of the hardware supporting the blockchain), then high TPS could happen within the nxt network if the user decide to use "fast" premium quality network for specific important transaction.

What do you think?


Parallel blockchains, same NXT tokens?
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March 09, 2014, 10:48:32 AM
 #42209

are you guys still buying more nxt or just waiting for it to finally go up?

im thinking of buying more but there is no buy support? why? seems like lots of good development

I am still buying and will continue to buy until I reach my 100K goal or NXT gets too expensive for me to reach it. I am only at around 77K now.

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Sebastien256
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March 09, 2014, 10:50:07 AM
Last edit: March 09, 2014, 11:02:10 AM by Sebastien256
 #42210

I like the idea of parallel blockchain.

On one "fast" Blockchain:

- By limiting forging power to 1M nxt, we can ensure that at least 1000 fast nodes can manage TF with high TPS. Transaction that have to happen really fast (AM, important transaction, etc.) can take place on such blockchain. High premium quality hardware would be needed to ensure the stability of this blockchain.
 
On another "regular" Blockchain (there can be more than one):

- Transaction that don't require to be fast can unload the "fast" blockchain for which rasberrypi could be use to secure the network.

As long as in the client, the user can choose on which blockchain to broadcast his desired transaction (different cost associated to broadcasting depending one the quality of the hardware supporting the blockchain), then high TPS could happen within the nxt network if the user decide to use "fast" premium quality network for specific important transaction.

What do you think?


Parallel blockchains, same NXT tokens?

what is the idea of NXT tokens? I did not read that before. Any link?

EDIT: sorry did not understand question at first. Yes, with SAME nxt tokens or coins on the various blockchain.

Using same nxt tokens for different blockchain seem to be compatible with the idea of CfB:

RFC: Parallel Chains concept


Nxt official forum at: https://nxtforum.org/
bitcoinpaul
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March 09, 2014, 10:51:01 AM
 #42211

NXT = coins = tokens.
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March 09, 2014, 10:53:18 AM
 #42212

I think entropy from mouse is needed for javascript (like wesley client) -- not for Java's SecureRandom

As for words, as I said, don't use cryptic words from diceware. 1626 simple words dictionary will just work fine for 128-bit entropy.


Actually, newest browsers have crypto.getRandomValues - so no mouse movement needed in those cases. Of course still necessary for older browsers.

Well, even if it is not technically necessary for most of the browsers, we should use the mouse movement because

1. With this, we make sure every user (no matter which browser) has a secure account (using mouse movement only on older browsers gives no common picture of the client on every computer. looks insecure)
2. It gives a secure feeling because the user is part of the process

Hmm, anyone else's input on this? I believe relying on system cryptography is always better than having the user doing something (mouse movement). It will be available though, for older browsers.
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March 09, 2014, 10:55:36 AM
 #42213

What does your implementation of words.getDiceWd look like?

It picks directly from an array of words. Why?

How do you map the integer type parameter down to the range of items in the dictionary?

int & 0X1fff returns a value between 0 (inclusive) and 8191 (inclusive)


This is like a modulo operation right? Like "(int mod 8192)". If so, it puts a (very) slight preference on the first entries in the dictionary.

I don't have a cryptographic background, but it seems like one of these tiny things cryptographic people look for. Or it's just me being paranoid..

I have not heard that before, please do point at any references if you know of any. If it is true it should not be used, you are right.
In that case rand.nextInt(ARRAY.length) would be the safer bet.

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March 09, 2014, 10:58:14 AM
 #42214

Good morning people  Cheesy .

Good morning , bro...!


The initial stakeholders ....*snip*..... do damn well whatever they please with their windfall.

I'm not sure ....*snip*

How you can justify the idea that because they invested 50 dollars they have this deep deserving right to be millionaires while those who make NXT worth milliones should get none is baffling.

It sounds like you've seen a 5 minute clip of Milton Friedman and think that this trickledown economy is a law of physics. Insane.

Unique is being blunt as fuck here, but he does have a point. More big stakeholders opening their wallets would be good, even if only to show that they do give a fuck. But we've down this road before without much results, we can't force people to fund NXT even if it is in their own best interest to do so. So lets put selfish stakeholders on the list of things to ignore, for the moment.

 
I've got a lot of catching up to do in this thread, also.  For now, I will say a few things off the top of my head.  

First, we have got to pay more attention to NXT as a 1st generation coin, and call it a coin, without parentheses or apologies.  We need vendors to accept it and people to want it.

*snip*

TF and 1000TPS is what sold me on this coin and is the ONLY feature we have that is above and beyond all Bitcoin clones and even Etherium on the horizon.  I get that 1000TPS would take dev work, but I thought TF was a done deal.  Now it's not?

Third, we have got to pull together as a team and FOCUS.  FOCUS.  FOCUS.  Maybe the funding committees are the start of this.  I hope so.   I would go so far to say that there needs to be yet another committee election, for a leadership committee, one with no money or unspent NXT behind it at all, just the raw power to say "NXT IS GOING TO DO THIS."  and whose members then can stand up on a stage, virtual or real, in front of people and tell them that NXT is on a course to SOMEWHERE.

Maybe I'm just in dictator withdrawal from pushing the election over the goal line.   Maybe sleep will help.  G'nite.



I believe in dictatorship. Democracy will fail (and fall) in the coming decades. Collective ownership is bullshit, because noone feels responsible for anything. A lot of great ideas are getting thrown in the round every day in this thread, but almost all remain without action. It´s like fartig in a room with full off people and then closing the door and leaving: it´s an interesting experience, but pointless and after a while even disturbing.

I still believe that this project needs a project manager. Look at all the other successfull cryptos: they all have carismatic leaders. A big project like this can´t only rely on a few self-sacrificing people.

I hate dictators and charismatic leaders....but we do seem to need some pushing to get shit done. Look at RJ and the committee elections.


Password security integration stuff looks promising, guys, lets make it happen. Which committee has responsibilty for clients?

Got to run, brb in an hour or 2.

Nulli Dei, nulli Reges, solum NXT
Love your money: www.nxt.org  www.ardorplatform.org
www.nxter.org  www.nxtfoundation.org
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March 09, 2014, 11:00:03 AM
 #42215

What does your implementation of words.getDiceWd look like?

It picks directly from an array of words. Why?

How do you map the integer type parameter down to the range of items in the dictionary?

int & 0X1fff returns a value between 0 (inclusive) and 8191 (inclusive)


This is like a modulo operation right? Like "(int mod 8192)". If so, it puts a (very) slight preference on the first entries in the dictionary.

I don't have a cryptographic background, but it seems like one of these tiny things cryptographic people look for. Or it's just me being paranoid..

I think the simplest way to do it is to just generate  a 128-bit random number, then represent ('convert") it to to base 1626 (1626 word dictionary).

Nomi, Shan, Adnan, Noshi, Nxt, Adn Khn
NXT-GZYP-FMRT-FQ9K-3YQGS
https://github.com/Lafihh/encryptiontest
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March 09, 2014, 11:05:34 AM
 #42216

Hmm, anyone else's input on this? I believe relying on system cryptography is always better than having the user doing something (mouse movement). It will be available though, for older browsers.

I'm just speaking from a user standpoint. If it is technically not good, don't use it. Didn't thought though that mouse movement is insecure?!
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March 09, 2014, 11:08:04 AM
 #42217

I have not heard that before, please do point at any references if you know of any. If it is true it should not be used, you are right.
In that case rand.nextInt(ARRAY.length) would be the safer bet.

I don't have a reference, but say you want to map a random value R between 0 and 15 to a value P between 0 and 9 and use P=(R modulo 10):

Code:
R   P
0   0
1   1
2   2
3   3
4   4
5   5
6   6
7   7
8   8
9   9
10  0
11  1   
12  2
13  3
14  4
15  5

As you see, having the input value R completely random, doesn't mean that P is as random, since you will get values 0 to 5 twice as often as values 6 to 9.

I picked the example to show the problem. With the very large ranges for R (e.g. integer) and very small ranges for P (e.g. 0 to 8191), the problem might just be a very theoretical one.
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March 09, 2014, 11:09:48 AM
 #42218

New iNxt version 1.0.8 in AppStore

Changelog:
New exchange:Cryptsy, Poloniex
Now exchange are sorted for Volume (03/03/14)
App now uses POST instead of GET (more secure)
New API to know if account is forging
Bug fix


Download link:
https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/inxt/id802351888?l=it&ls=1&mt=8


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no price of Cryptsy?
There is cryptsy
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Ian Knowles - CIYAM Lead Developer


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March 09, 2014, 11:13:08 AM
 #42219

Parallel blockchains, same NXT tokens?

No - different tokens (NXT and NXG in my illustration).

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GPG Public Key | 1ciyam3htJit1feGa26p2wQ4aw6KFTejU
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HEAT Ledger


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March 09, 2014, 11:17:35 AM
 #42220

the problem might just be a very theoretical one.

Maybe. But you proved your point. Thanks.

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