[ANN][DASH] Dash (dash.org) | First Self-Funding Self-Governing Crypto Currency

[arielbit]

Two words, mixing and unscramble--explains everything.

I can manually mix something and then someone else can unscramble my mixing.
Provide some specific proof that Bitcoin Mixers can be fully traced these days.

Take time to watch the link i gave you...they got caught eventhough they used mixers...the mixings got unscambled btw

That is still one case about a Federal Prosecutor on a specific case with the full power of her office.
Does not mean all Bitcoin Mixer transactions are fully traced every minute / hour / day.

A Federal Prosecutor could most likely do that to a Monero transaction as well these days.

That's 2014...after 7 years they can apply those to exchanges.

Mixed can be unscrambled

Monero = encrypted, you can't unscramble encrypted, you have to decrypt it.(non transparent blockchain)

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[jdmcg]

Still though, I can't see any one of these 3, LTC, XMR or DASH just going away. They've all established a decent enough network effect and are all in bull markets vs USD and are all poised for an easy 7x when the time is right. It'll likely be quick, one first, within a 2 week period sometime in the coming months, then the others will follow.

What revaluation do you assume for BTC during that 7x of the altcoins?

Thank you.

Any revaluation for BTC I assume will be short-lived (relatively) but it is during this revaluation to at least test the previous high of $20K that I expect major fear and panic which will fuel the alt-season that just about every alt holder is waiting for.

But things are different this time... BTC should have done it's 30% dump at $24K or at least $27K to have a healthy correction/pause to allow it to grow organically. I worry how unhealthy this rapid growth might be long term. Maybe all these institutions have stronger hands and aren't so greedy. But ultimately I doubt it, people will want to take profit at some point and like sheep they probably will all try to do it at the same time. I just hope it is only a 30-40% correction and not a major bubble pop that occurs before any alts can recover from the last 2017/2018 bubble pop. That sequence of events perhaps could kill many alts...
 

[toknormal]

Two words, mixing and unscramble--explains everything.

I can manually mix something and then someone else can unscramble my mixing.
Provide some specific proof that Bitcoin Mixers can be fully traced these days.

Take time to watch the link i gave you...they got caught eventhough they used mixers...the mixings got unscambled btw

Both of you have lost the plot.

Mixing isn't about privacy (at least not primarily). It's about fungibility which is an acknowledged monetary property. A bi-product of hi fungiblity is greater anonymity (ability to decouple a unit of currency from its owner history). But that's just the bi-product. The primary reason is to maintain equivalence of value for each unit.

This is one aspect where Dash has got the cash archetype right and coins like Monero have got it wrong IMO. Monero actually went and encrypted the entire transacting platform itself which isn't the same thing as making the currency fungible directly. The transparency of the transacting platform is needed to maximise perceived integrity. ("Math" doesn't cut it because users have no idea whether their particular client is using "math" or not. I doubt bitcoin would have garnered the trust it has without a gazillion forensic trainspotters crawling all over its chain 24 hours a day).

Dash's mixing therefore works for high fungility whether a particular user uses it or not because they benefit from all the mixing of coins upstream of their addresses. The delistings if anything demonstrate that it's worked because the regulators are seeing Dash as "cash".....which is actually a design goal.

What Dash got wrong was allowing the chain to give up half its supply for nothing, thereby torpedoing its value-storing capacity !

[qwizzie]

Two words, mixing and unscramble--explains everything.

I can manually mix something and then someone else can unscramble my mixing.
Provide some specific proof that Bitcoin Mixers can be fully traced these days.

Take time to watch the link i gave you...they got caught eventhough they used mixers...the mixings got unscambled btw

That is still one case about a Federal Prosecutor on a specific case with the full power of her office.
Does not mean all Bitcoin Mixer transactions are fully traced every minute / hour / day.

A Federal Prosecutor could most likely do that to a Monero transaction as well these days.

That's 2014...after 7 years they can apply those to exchanges.

Mixed can be unscrambled

Looks like there is a move from Bitcoin Mixers to Bitcoin Privacy wallets connected to Tor and making CoinJoin transactions : https://www.cryptopolitan.com/privacy-wallets-their-growing-role-in-bitcoi/
I always thought Bitcoin Mixers used CoinJoin, looks like they are actually used differently :

Bitcoin Mixers are coin randomizers. They usually make sure that the value of Bitcoin exchanged between a sender and receiver differs greatly. At the end of such transactions, the mixers then make it extremely difficult for the transaction to be traced back to the wallet that initiated the transaction.

However, mixers have a litany of issues and a growing number of regulators have been able to cut their influence. The crypto scammers have seeked an alternative which is the use of privacy wallets.

[jdmcg]

Mixed can be unscrambled

Monero = encrypted, you can't unscramble encrypted, you have to decrypt it.(non transparent blockchain)

Sounds like you're arguing that Dash is like Bitcoin then and perhaps should be treated the same.

But tell me, once you deposit/trade/withdraw your XMR on an exchange which forced you to KYC how does Monero's encryption hide this activity from the relevant authorities?

Seems to me, banning privacy coins from exchanges is a misinterpretation of the new laws being put in place. In fact I would think it's better to direct XMR traffic to exchanges to be better monitored for possible money laundering and other misbehaviors.

Mixing isn't about privacy (at least not primarily). It's about fungibility which is an acknowledged monetary property. A bi-product of hi fungiblity is greater anonymity (ability to decouple a unit of currency from its owner history). But that's just the bi-product. The primary reason is to maintain equivalence of value for each unit.

This is one aspect where Dash has got the cash archetype right and coins like Monero have got it wrong IMO. Monero actually went and encrypted the entire transacting platform itself which isn't the same thing as making the currency fungible directly. The transparency of the transacting platform is needed to maximise perceived integrity. ("Math" doesn't cut it because users have no idea whether their particular client is using "math" or not. I doubt bitcoin would have garnered the trust it has without a gazillion forensic trainspotters crawling all over its chain 24 hours a day).

Good, we can still agree on something... fungibility is definitely required for sound money. As is transparency/auditability and the ability to verify the integrity of the system.

Privacy is more about human rights.

[bitwolf]

Darkcoin to the world : we are super private and super secure and super fast and super unique crypto.
Darkcoin when it gets delisted: Pls , pls we are useless simple btc cloning shitcoin like the thousands other useless btc clonings.

[arielbit]

Two words, mixing and unscramble--explains everything.

I can manually mix something and then someone else can unscramble my mixing.
Provide some specific proof that Bitcoin Mixers can be fully traced these days.

Take time to watch the link i gave you...they got caught eventhough they used mixers...the mixings got unscambled btw

That is still one case about a Federal Prosecutor on a specific case with the full power of her office.
Does not mean all Bitcoin Mixer transactions are fully traced every minute / hour / day.

A Federal Prosecutor could most likely do that to a Monero transaction as well these days.

That's 2014...after 7 years they can apply those to exchanges.

Mixed can be unscrambled

Looks like there is a move from Bitcoin Mixers to Bitcoin Privacy wallets connected to Tor and making CoinJoin transactions : https://www.cryptopolitan.com/privacy-wallets-their-growing-role-in-bitcoi/
I always thought Bitcoin Mixers used CoinJoin, looks like they are actually used differently :

Bitcoin Mixers are coin randomizers. They usually make sure that the value of Bitcoin exchanged between a sender and receiver differs greatly. At the end of such transactions, the mixers then make it extremely difficult for the transaction to be traced back to the wallet that initiated the transaction.

However, mixers have a litany of issues and a growing number of regulators have been able to cut their influence. The crypto scammers have seeked an alternative which is the use of privacy wallets.

Tor is also not anonymous.. We think it was back then. So mixing tor and coinjoin is not anonymous.

Mixed can be unscrambled

Monero = encrypted, you can't unscramble encrypted, you have to decrypt it.(non transparent blockchain)

Sounds like you're arguing that Dash is like Bitcoin then and perhaps should be treated the same.

But tell me, once you deposit/trade/withdraw your XMR on an exchange which forced you to KYC how does Monero's encryption hide this activity from the relevant authorities?

Seems to me, banning privacy coins from exchanges is a misinterpretation of the new laws being put in place. In fact I would think it's better to direct XMR traffic to exchanges to be better monitored for possible money laundering and other misbehaviors.

They know you have an X amount of xmr in your exchange account but they cannot trace where it came from and cannot trace where you  will send it.

Dash is just like bitcoin in terms of privacy, but marketed to be good enough as a privacy/anonymous coin which dash will be treated as such LOL

Two words, mixing and unscramble--explains everything.

I can manually mix something and then someone else can unscramble my mixing.
Provide some specific proof that Bitcoin Mixers can be fully traced these days.

Take time to watch the link i gave you...they got caught eventhough they used mixers...the mixings got unscambled btw

Both of you have lost the plot.

Mixing isn't about privacy (at least not primarily). It's about fungibility which is an acknowledged monetary property. A bi-product of hi fungiblity is greater anonymity (ability to decouple a unit of currency from its owner history). But that's just the bi-product. The primary reason is to maintain equivalence of value for each unit.

This is one aspect where Dash has got the cash archetype right and coins like Monero have got it wrong IMO. Monero actually went and encrypted the entire transacting platform itself which isn't the same thing as making the currency fungible directly. The transparency of the transacting platform is needed to maximise perceived integrity. ("Math" doesn't cut it because users have no idea whether their particular client is using "math" or not. I doubt bitcoin would have garnered the trust it has without a gazillion forensic trainspotters crawling all over its chain 24 hours a day).

Dash's mixing therefore works for high fungility whether a particular user uses it or not because they benefit from all the mixing of coins upstream of their addresses. The delistings if anything demonstrate that it's worked because the regulators are seeing Dash as "cash".....which is actually a design goal.

What Dash got wrong was allowing the chain to give up half its supply for nothing, thereby torpedoing its value-storing capacity !

Monero got it right and go 100% full privacy, the aim is privacy and doing 50-50 on the design will compromise the goal which is privacy. That's why monero is not trying to be bitcoin, it complements bitcoin.

That's why dash got it wrong, first trying to be anonymous coin and now trying to be ethereum too just to keep the ball rolling.

Actually dash is trying to be bitcoin in the first place, plagiarized bitcoin and coinjoin to market anonymity.

Fungibility, privacy, anonymous...we mean the same thing, not everytime we say anonymous we have to say privacy and fungible too all the time. They all go together.

[moderator's note: consecutive posts merged]

[toknormal]

the aim is privacy...

If you're part of the cult that you appear to subscribe to. Then I suppose it is.

But it's a cult. Not a monetary property  

Ordinary cash, whether its gold, paper or whatever is not "private". The transacting platform can never be "private" because that requires it to be hidden. It's fungible. What you call "50-50" is actually a decoupling of 2 separate objective. One is to make the "cash" fungible and the other is to make the transacting platform (as distinct from the cash) transparent.

[arielbit]

the aim is privacy...

If you're part of the cult that you appear to subscribe to. Then I suppose it is.

But it's a cult. Not a monetary property  

Ordinary cash, whether its gold, paper or whatever is not "private". The transacting platform can never be "private" because that requires it to be hidden. It's fungible. What you call "50-50" is actually a decoupling of 2 separate objective. One is to make the "cash" fungible and the other is to make the transacting platform (as distinct from the cash) transparent.

The aim is to become better than cash...not as good as cash, that's innovation and moving forward..a true fungible, private, and anonymous transaction.

Dash aims just as to be as good as cash..just like USDT and other stablecoins LOL

[toknormal]

The aim is to become better than cash...not as good as cash

Well you didn't succeed then. You made it worse by encrypting the entire transacting platform instead of targeting fungibility specifically.

Baby. Bathwater.

The problem is not that. The problem is that by voting to pay themselves even more of the mining reward than they already had (it was already near 50%) masternodes have all but destroyed this currency's competitiveness based on ill advised, short sighted and warped economic logic.

No other stakeholder had a vote in the matter - not regular holders, exchanges, prospective investors or merchants. However the market has the ultimate vote with the result that we're now 16 places below a joke coin in ranking at just over half its marketcap.

[qwizzie]

The aim is to become better than cash...not as good as cash, that's innovation and moving forward..a true fungible, private, and anonymous transaction.

Monero can never be better then cash, when its transactions need 10 confirmations before getting spendable.
Source : https://monero.stackexchange.com/questions/4579/is-the-10-block-lock-time-a-protocol-rule-what-rules-accompany-it

Monero can never be better then cash, when its users have the ability to timelock each transaction with very high block confirmations before getting spendable

When receiving monero, be aware that it may be locked for an arbitrary time if the sender elected to, preventing you from spending that monero until the lock time expires. You may want to hold off acting upon such a transaction until the unlock time lapses. To get a sense of that time, you can consider the remaining blocktime until unlock as seen in the show_transfers command.

Source : https://github.com/monero-project/monero/blob/master/README.md
(always interesting to see a high risk vulnerability Monero Github issue getting solved by just mentioning the risk in some readme.md on Github that few people read)

Dash transactions are spendable within seconds, secure and protected against double spending.
Source : https://www.mycryptopedia.com/dash-instantsend/

[Dahaa]

Freak, give my BTC back and I'll get out of your scam shit dash/BTC 0,0025

Did i mention this could be a bumpy ride ?
Hold on to those hats, ladies and gentlemen !!

[AzzAz]

- cant give 50% of coins with 0 cost and expect to be store of value.

Nobody outside of masternode holders has any difficulty with understanding this and it has therefore exposed a major flaw in the governance system. Turkeys & Christmas.

Its technological advances were ruined by disastrous economic decisions.

Indeed. Since there's no point in being a means of exchange without being a store of value first.

Letting MN owners to make decisions on how reward is split is conflict of interest by definition, as is letting Ryan to propose it. Except this, DASH is almost great coin.

[arielbit]

The aim is to become better than cash...not as good as cash

Well you didn't succeed then. You made it worse by encrypting the entire transacting platform instead of targeting fungibility specifically.

you just said it became worse without explaining why it got worse. LOL I win.

The aim is to become better than cash...not as good as cash, that's innovation and moving forward..a true fungible, private, and anonymous transaction.

Monero can never be better then cash, when its transactions need 10 confirmations before getting spendable.
Source : https://monero.stackexchange.com/questions/4579/is-the-10-block-lock-time-a-protocol-rule-what-rules-accompany-it

Monero can never be better then cash, when its users have the ability to timelock each transaction with very high block confirmations before getting spendable

When receiving monero, be aware that it may be locked for an arbitrary time if the sender elected to, preventing you from spending that monero until the lock time expires. You may want to hold off acting upon such a transaction until the unlock time lapses. To get a sense of that time, you can consider the remaining blocktime until unlock as seen in the show_transfers command.

Source : https://github.com/monero-project/monero/blob/master/README.md
(always interesting to see a high risk vulnerability Monero Github issue getting solved by just mentioning the risk in some readme.md on Github that few people read)

Dash transactions are spendable within seconds, secure and protected against double spending.
Source : https://www.mycryptopedia.com/dash-instantsend/

timelock - happens in what we call check transactions in traditional banking, it is a feature that can be used depending on the nature of the transaction.

10 confirmations - security, there are extra steps to secure things, like locking doors, locking vaults, typing passwords, typing 2fa etc...those 10 confirmations is the "extra step" for security.

10 confirmations vs cash = you still have to count $1,000,000 (for both payer and payee), can it fit inside your pocket? can you carry it on the streets?


did i just say monero complements bitcoin? if you want fast and small payments, how about lightning network? hehe

dash anonymity path is dead end and the fast transaction path is also a dead end...sorry....next in line is dapps?---dash will try becoming ethereum too LOL  
 

[Pang.]

It's interesting to see so much debate that a shitty centralized exchange that hardly anyone uses has shit through its pants for fear that the SEC will scold it for being bad boys.

But let's be serious gentlemen. We don't give a shit about that exchange ... nobody uses it anymore, and the volume of trade it has is run by bots to maintain liquidity.

I see two clear possibilities in what has happened:

1- that it was all an orchestrated bearish attack to throw the price of Dash, XMR, Zcash, in the middle of a bull market of BTC, and just as Dash releases its great platform that could become the event of the year for us.

2- We believe everything we read and think that Dash will be excluded from all possible exchanges, no one will use it, and its value will go to 0.

What will be the correct answer?

Well, you have to wait a few weeks and see the evolution of active master nodes.

If their number drops by 25% for example, then I will believe that this incident is very serious for Dash.

If, on the contrary, the number remains in the area that it was before that news, it will be clear that it was all an options and futures strategy to get extra money.

One of the currencies that contributes the most and innovates, is the one that has a lower revaluation compared to BTC in months. why?

No one uses Dash?

I see that there are more and more daily transactions. we have risen 50% in these months.

are they  better options LTC , Doge? ... I do not consider them better, I do not mean that they are not worse, but looking at the possibilities of each one there is something that does not add up to their valuations regarding Dash.

So far we have lost 45 active nodes in one day. We will see what happens shortly.

I see a buying opportunity, the only thing that worries me is that BTC is going to fall, and it will do strong shortly ... with what possibly drag the entire market including Dash.

Lost opportunity?

Moving the markets is in the hands of their creators, and Dash holders cannot. The CORE group is doing it in an acceptable way and better than many other currencies that double us in capitalization.

By the way, Monero users have not been barely affected by the Bittrex news, they have taught us a lesson here, they know what they have and whoever wants to use it should use it, who doesn't let it.

Dash is what it is, we just have to show it to the ignorant so they can understand it.

[qwizzie]

At this point i suspect 10-12 more percentage points with the RSI max, before Bitcoin price blow-off top materialize.



Previous Bitcoin bull markets also topped, just after reaching RSI 95-96
Disclaimer : no investment advice.

[toknormal]

By the way, Monero users have not been barely affected by the Bittrex news, they have taught us a lesson here, they know what they have and whoever wants to use it should use it, who doesn't let it.

Monero don't have half a million dollars worth of freely given away coins to dump on markets each week. Every coin mined of theirs attracts fiat that gets spent on upwards difficulty adjustments applied across the whole chain, not just half of it.

That's something the store-of-value-seeking market values.

[hd49728]

DASH current situation on the market reminds me what happened with Ethereum before it climbs silently to move $800 now.
- Ethereum began 2020 around $140 and today it stays at $865.
- DASH began 2020 around $55 and today it stays at $89.

I know the unacceptable fact for people who want to get profits in both BTC and USDT but it is life. DASH and Ethereum has interesting history in 2017 when they both rocket to more than 0.1 BTC or more than $1000 for each coin.

Ethereum has beaten all drama on their scam platform for ICos, IEOs, DeFi tokens and rallies too good in ETH/USDT.

Don't give up as it is not the time to give up. I love DASH. With big communities behind, DASH is here to stay.

[Pang.]

DASH current situation on the market reminds me what happened with Ethereum before it climbs silently to move $800 now.
- Ethereum began 2020 around $140 and today it stays at $865.
- DASH began 2020 around $55 and today it stays at $89.

I know the unacceptable fact for people who want to get profits in both BTC and USDT but it is life. DASH and Ethereum has interesting history in 2017 when they both rocket to more than 0.1 BTC or more than $1000 for each coin.

Ethereum has beaten all drama on their scam platform for ICos, IEOs, DeFi tokens and rallies too good in ETH/USDT.

Don't give up as it is not the time to give up. I love DASH. With big communities behind, DASH is here to stay.

Not only what you comment is correct, and I agree with it.

I remember years ago with ETH at $ 5, a wall was placed in poloniex, which was the reference exchange, of hundreds of thousands of ETH, which caused, together with the fears of new fork, hacks ... that ETH was weeks in a side where many holders who kept it from $ 1 sold bored and afraid of uncertainty.

I see a similar situation in Dash, it promotes things, innovates, opens markets, launches its platform, and the price not only does not go up, but it goes down and down.

I am an old dog in the markets, and my dash will not have them at these prices. I do not care if it ends up being worth 0, I go with my ROI made years ago.

Good luck with your decisions, but above all, value what you have and not what others tell you you have.

Masternodes appear to have bottomed out at 4768 and are now at 4782 from a high of 4840 before the bittrex event

[piliyouxia]

Ryan，I really can‘t thank you enough for all you’ve done.
If you want to leave early.
It would be a life-altering experience for Dash and for you.