[ANN][BURST] Burst | Efficient HDD Mining | New 1.2.3 Fork block 92000

[pinballdude]

But the change in reward is the first step to KEEP our current miners. I don't believe that the price would be affected all that much by this change, the price is already low. The cap wouldn't be hit for a while now, and the increase in reward wouldn't be all that much until the network grows anyway. The point is looking at the future.

We will only lose SOME miners, basically, when network size go to half, the remaining miners make double as much BURST each. If 3/4 of the miners go away for some reason, the remaining miners make 4 times as many BURST. If we lose 90% of the miners, the ones remaining make 10 times as much. It will stabilize at some point for sure.

[pinballdude]

The supply being unlimited just means the growth would have to match,

Yes, the growth would have to match.

Nobody wants to own an inflating coin if a non-inflating is available. Nobody that is interesting in keeping their BP at least.

Suppose you need 10% growth a month for the price to hold.  You would need 10% growth  a month just to keep the price.  After 10 months, you have the same.


Suppose the same growth happened to a noninflationary coin,

a holder would earn 10 percent a month for 10 months. that is a profit of factor  (1.10 ^10 )   that is  2.59 times the original value, or 259% gain.

So what will an investor want.  breaking even and dumping miners in the inflationary coin, or 259% gain due to features and marketing increasing coin usage.  
[/quote]


On top of that, the 259% price increase due to growth should more or less automatically lead to 2.59 times larger a network, due to miners making more money.

[BurstIncomeAsset]

I just feel that whatever we do we must keep the community together. I really disagree with forking the coin, that can destabilize everything and people will lose money that way.

So please don't even mention the forking again, or the cloning.


Otherwise , I dont agree with the block reward increase either as it can push the price even lower, but if you say that the network size risk is imminent then very well, it is doable, atleast it fixes things temporarly.


But I still believe that a good marketing is the key here, but perhaps we ran out of time.


Another method would be , that can be done simultaneously with the block reward increase, is for people to buy BURST assets.

I have made my asset free to trade, as in , I wont sell anymore to the BID price, instead the INCOME asset has already a SELL wall put in, so between the wall people can trade my asset freely. Speculators/traders/ investors are welcome into INCOME.

[ANN] Income Asset - Decentralized Referral Empire based Income


Then we got the daily ROI report of INCOME, we had a worse day than before, but given yesterday's ROI we still have a ROI over 0.1%/day

Today's ROI was: +0.09497%

[ANN] Income Asset - Decentralized Referral Empire based Income

So BURST people keep investing in BURST assets!

[crowetic]

The supply being unlimited just means the growth would have to match,

Yes, the growth would have to match.

Nobody wants to own an inflating coin if a non-inflating is available. Nobody that is interesting in keeping their BP at least.

Suppose you need 10% growth a month for the price to hold.  You would need 10% growth  a month just to keep the price.  After 10 months, you have the same.


Suppose the same growth happened to a noninflationary coin,

a holder would earn 10 percent a month for 10 months. that is a profit of factor  (1.10 ^10 )   that is  2.59 times the original value, or 259% gain.

So what will an investor want.  breaking even and dumping miners in the inflationary coin, or 259% gain due to features and marketing increasing coin usage.  



On top of that, the 259% price increase due to growth should more or less automatically lead to 2.59 times larger a network, due to miners making more money.

I hardly ever see the growth affect the price proportionally, in fact, I see many capped coins that don't grow in value at all, regardless of their other growth. There are so many other factors in play, especially in such a small market that is the altcoin scene.

[BurstIncomeAsset]

The supply being unlimited just means the growth would have to match,

Yes, the growth would have to match.

Nobody wants to own an inflating coin if a non-inflating is available. Nobody that is interesting in keeping their BP at least.

Suppose you need 10% growth a month for the price to hold.  You would need 10% growth  a month just to keep the price.  After 10 months, you have the same.


Suppose the same growth happened to a noninflationary coin,

a holder would earn 10 percent a month for 10 months. that is a profit of factor  (1.10 ^10 )   that is  2.59 times the original value, or 259% gain.

So what will an investor want.  breaking even and dumping miners in the inflationary coin, or 259% gain due to features and marketing increasing coin usage.  



On top of that, the 259% price increase due to growth should more or less automatically lead to 2.59 times larger a network, due to miners making more money.

I hardly ever see the growth affect the price proportionally, in fact, I see many capped coins that don't grow in value at all, regardless of their other growth. There are so many other factors in play, especially in such a small market that is the altcoin scene.

Bottom line, people want to make money, if they dont then they are not really interested in the coin.

Both of our assets make money, so I think there is where people should put their money in.

[Irontiga]

Guys, it's really very simple, the idea of block reward being proportional to the network capacity CAN'T work. Imagine if this had been the case with bitcoin....then due to mining equipment becoming cheaper all the time, then the value of bitcoin would ALWAYS go down. This would make it impossible to invest in, and then nobody would mine it anyway. A dead coin before it even starts. It's so obvious that bitladen doesn't give a thing about investors and users, after all, he's just a miner and dumper, why would he care?

This is actually a thing of supply and demand, as demand increases (demand for burst coins), then the quantity supplied will increase (netsize).

I don't agree, if net size increases there will not be created more burst coins, but the blockchain will be protected by harder to calculate hashes. The individual miner will get less BURST per terabyte over time. The number of BURST coming into existance is fixed, it is about 1 block reward every 4 minutes.  The block reward is reduced by 10% every month as i remember it.

What? Netsize will increase as demand for Burst increases, you said so yourself, how can you contradict that now? I didn't say that the amount of Burst being made will increase....

[pinballdude]

Guys, it's really very simple, the idea of block reward being proportional to the network capacity CAN'T work. Imagine if this had been the case with bitcoin....then due to mining equipment becoming cheaper all the time, then the value of bitcoin would ALWAYS go down. This would make it impossible to invest in, and then nobody would mine it anyway. A dead coin before it even starts. It's so obvious that bitladen doesn't give a thing about investors and users, after all, he's just a miner and dumper, why would he care?

This is actually a thing of supply and demand, as demand increases (demand for burst coins), then the quantity supplied will increase (netsize).

I don't agree, if net size increases there will not be created more burst coins, but the blockchain will be protected by harder to calculate hashes. The individual miner will get less BURST per terabyte over time. The number of BURST coming into existance is fixed, it is about 1 block reward every 4 minutes.  The block reward is reduced by 10% every month as i remember it.

What? Netsize will increase as demand for Burst increases, you said so yourself, how can you contradict that now? I didn't say that the amount of Burst being made will increase....

you wrote "the quantity supplied will increase (netsize)"

i read that as if demand rises, we get larger netsize, and thus more BURST coins into existance.
Quantity = number of BURST coins
supplied = new BURST coming into existance due to mining

I think this is the correct chain of events, if we start by assuming a larger demand, the very very first step is of course just an example of what could make demand go up


1) BURST wallet on android with barcode scanner and shower, making exchanging burst between phones as easy as with bitcoin wallet

2) a lot of people previously unrelated to BURST become BURST wallet owners and buy some BURST for their new wallets at the exchanges

3) price go up due to the buys

4) miners see ROI go up as measured in dollars, so they figure it is a good deal to buy more disk space.  New miners are attracted due to the number of BURST expected per terabyte is now worth more due to the higher BURST per dollar price

5) the new TBs of course lead to a larger network size


This works both ways :

1) when bitladen starts threthening doing a 51% attack, some BURST holders decide the risk of temporary trouble with BURST has risen so they sell off some of their burst

2) the selling pressure will take out some bids and the BURST price will go down, measured in BTC

3) the lower prices makes miner ROI look worse, so not so many new miners find it economically attractive to start mining, and existing miners will not buy more disk space as much as the otherwise would

4) the TB taken out, and the less TB coming in means network size go down





When the network size adjusts, it also adjusts the probability of hitting a block, so although the same number of BURST is mined into existence no matter what the network size, The individual miner will get more BURST for a terabyte when network size is small, and less BURST for a terabyte when network size is large.

[ltcnim]

a higher reward would just kill the coin faster since more coins would be dumped but not enough buyers are available.
I think the key is to stabilize first. get rid of all the drama, and focus on development. get a new dev who is first able
to implement all the stuff which is missing (reward assignment in a proper way integrated, marketplace etc.).

then you can think about new features.

[q327K091]

...
...

you wrote "the quantity supplied will increase (netsize)"

i read that as if demand rises, we get larger netsize, and thus more BURST coins into existance.
Quantity = number of BURST coins
supplied = new BURST coming into existance due to mining

I think this is the correct chain of events, if we start by assuming a larger demand, the very very first step is of course just an example of what could make demand go up


1) BURST wallet on android with barcode scanner and shower, making exchanging burst between phones as easy as with bitcoin wallet

2) a lot of people previously unrelated to BURST become BURST wallet owners and buy some BURST for their new wallets at the exchanges

3) price go up due to the buys

4) miners see ROI go up as measured in dollars, so they figure it is a good deal to buy more disk space.  New miners are attracted due to the number of BURST expected per terabyte is now worth more due to the higher BURST per dollar price

5) the new TBs of course lead to a larger network size


This works both ways :

1) when bitladen starts threthening doing a 51% attack, some BURST holders decide the risk of temporary trouble with BURST has risen so they sell off some of their burst

2) the selling pressure will take out some bids and the BURST price will go down, measured in BTC

3) the lower prices makes miner ROI look worse, so not so many new miners find it economically attractive to start mining, and existing miners will not buy more disk space as much as the otherwise would

4) the TB taken out, and the less TB coming in means network size go down





When the network size adjusts, it also adjusts the probability of hitting a block, so although the same number of BURST is mined into existence no matter what the network size, The individual miner will get more BURST for a terabyte when network size is small, and less BURST for a terabyte when network size is large.

what a thoughtful analysis one the best I have seen, thank you, overall this POC (capacity) is a really good idea

the whole crypto business is ultimately based on using these crypto assets , so the idea of assets market place is great too (long term)

believe you are on the cutting edge dear friends regardless of the exchange price, dont get too greedy, I mine just about anything and hold

and would not put down dev team cause many have full time jobs (or school) and they do this off hours, what has been done here in terms of wallet and overall tech is phenomenal without doing this full time, like really

aka you are making history and people will be tracing these conversations one day with amazement ....

---

wont disclose what my overall TB capacity is, but even a thought to overwhelm the network with what is said as 51% attack is down right shooting oneself in a foot, and why and what for for few hundred $ profit ? (at the moment)  

not enough to buy self a shaving cream

I liked (like) very much idea of connecting "solar panels or assets" to BURST (this is just an example, but it does make full sense due to super low energy consumption to the ratio of cryptographic complexity required..) , this is very futuristic , you are probably decades ahead in advance ...

off to scan rest of this landscape latest being Ethereum, that thing chews (that algo) so much energy it could lit the whole city (1000 miners and growing at the moment) probably wont do it as it is a hype, but people like it but it can be repeated in fact you have done it via AT transaction (that person had one day too much beer and something happened and he left, he should come back one day) you have what Ethereum has and alerady talking to Qora.. find it phenomenal and few outside of this forum knows about and  certainly not the population at large is clueless

Ethereum is mined by farms at an enormous cost and quickly dumped on the exchange , the usual pattern , the whole landscape is like that, people buy into expensive farms and then try to take % cut by recycling daily and take FIAT home..

[yellowduck2]

a higher reward would just kill the coin faster since more coins would be dumped but not enough buyers are available.
I think the key is to stabilize first. get rid of all the drama, and focus on development. get a new dev who is first able
to implement all the stuff which is missing (reward assignment in a proper way integrated, marketplace etc.).

then you can think about new features.

Totally,  absolutely agree.

[Irontiga]

a higher reward would just kill the coin faster since more coins would be dumped but not enough buyers are available.
I think the key is to stabilize first. get rid of all the drama, and focus on development. get a new dev who is first able
to implement all the stuff which is missing (reward assignment in a proper way integrated, marketplace etc.).

then you can think about new features.

Totally,  absolutely agree.

Check out wallet.burst.city, reward assignment is already integrated.

[yeponlyone]

Why be afraid of a clone or new coin-fork with some tweaks and other features? Since when has competition been bad?


Let the miners decide with their mining Capacity.

Let the investors decide with their money.

Let the alternatives attract new devs and talent, if possible.

Let's see which one has most support.

Let's - basically - see which one will survive,
 - or let both die,
 - or possibly let a third PoC coin be born out of the discussions, development, competition - and ashes.


Evolution, baby  

[bitladen]

You know guys, let's just leave it as it is. BURST is just perfect, and it's on a clear ascending trend, has no problem at all. It will soon take over the world.

It's not like I expected you would ever say yes, I just enjoy yanking your chain.

crowetic better find you another dev, I'm sure programmers are lined up waiting for an opportunity to prove their skills to the burst "community"

Considering the magnitude of your project, it being the next thing in cryptocurrencies, maybe even Linus Torvalds. He's totally unlike me, not cocky at all, and very humble.

[notabeliever]

Bitladen,
You seem upset lately and wonder why not sell your shares and leave burst for another coin.
Maybe fork it the way you wanted too. It just seems to me all this complaining isn't getting anywhere.
If you are upset at me for making this comment then you care enough about this coin to make a differance.

As for me I will mine it

Everything that was an old stable coin took a hit when they tried to fork bitcoin into XT but I don't need to complain about it.

[ajw7989]

Things need to change for BURST. Clearly the way it is now is not working. Giving a percent to the DEVS is reasonable assuming the rewards are increased or at least plateau and not consistently decreasing like it is now. The new core team looks good but making bitladen the lead dev gives me a lot of mixed feelings. He has a vested interested in this coin (with all the hashpower) and I am sure he is more than qualified to be a DEV but his attitude is a major turnoff. If we start attracting new people who start posting opinions it does not look inviting to have the lead dev posting rude comments just because he disagrees with the poster. The decentralized file storage would be similar to STORJ? Is that the end game for it or am I misinterpreting it? Like I said earlier there needs to be more utilization of the coin that is not just from an investment standpoint. A lot of people like to gamble with bitcoin so having a gambling aspect with burst could be helpful (dice games, sports betting, casino ,etc).  Hopefully its possible.

[bitladen]

Forgive me for trying to save you. I'm not offering to anymore. Find somebody else.

And me hold burst? Do you think I'm an idiot, like that? I'm not, you are

[notabeliever]

Forgive me for trying to save you. I'm not offering to anymore. Find somebody else.

And me hold burst? Do you think I'm an idiot, like that? I'm not, you are

I see you are still here and you still mine the coin. hmmm  you save the coin by trashing its thread and as for me

........By Burst community its was fun before  the likes of bitladen.


You have lost another miner

[bitladen]

You have lost another miner

excellent, soon i will have 51%

[jwinterm]

Forgive me for trying to save you. I'm not offering to anymore. Find somebody else.

And me hold burst? Do you think I'm an idiot, like that? I'm not, you are

The value of any currency comes from perceived value, i.e., trust. No dollar, yuan, ruble, drachma, etc. has any real intrinsic value; its value is derived from the trust that people have in their government that it will be worth something, generally the trust that it will be worth about the same tomorrow as it was today. You can argue for gold, but that's really more of a commodity, and in fact is probably worth so much because its perceived value as a safe haven drives the cost well above what it would be for its industrial use alone.

What I'm trying to say is: how the fuck did this whiny doucherag come so close to being in charge of development for this coin? He is constantly belittling the majority of the people in this thread for being idiots for holding the coin, not to mention threatening to attack the same coin and reduce its value to nothing. He asks for a higher reward so he can dump more faster. I mean seriously, wtf? Wtf are you smoking crowetic?

Besides that he's demonstrated zero capability of implementing any features afaik. It would be simple to change one or a few lines of code to increase the block reward, which seems to be his primary concern, but has he shown any capability to implement the other features that he's proposed? Let him release a new version or show some code or stfu (though the latter seems unlikely)...

[tonycamp]

i have no vote into the materia of the facts of coin rewards per block i have no vote on the saying that 30 satoshis its few for me to mine i just think that burst coin its geting like i suposed to be 6 months ago down a drain if theres no much more things to be done like blocks reward better taken and a pump a bit into the coin to the 60 satoshis for people ot figure out the HDD prices of 15 dolllars per TB and that can be roi into mining after like 6 months if btc and burst rises