[XMR] Monero Speculation

[Ultros]

Wouldn't it be amusing if XMR and BBR would merge at some point in the future, to create the one, definitive CN coin?

I like to think competition is healthy for both coins and CN's evolution in general. I rather see one coin absorb most of the market-cap of the other because "everyone" decided it's the definitive CN-coin instead a centralized, planned, monopolistic merge. Also, I like choices.  

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[aminorex]

Didn't you hear?  jl777's SuperNET is going to unite all the crypto, so every crypto now has equal value.  It's the greatest arbitrage opportunity in history.

[rpietila]

Making new coins was not profitable for some time, but now it is coming again..?

Definitely worth following!

[oda.krell]

Didn't you hear?  jl777's SuperNET is going to unite all the crypto, so every crypto now has equal value.  It's the greatest arbitrage opportunity in history.

Care to give a tl;dr of what the angle is of that one? I googled it, and my eyes glazed over at the wall of text I found being, well, imprecise in what this is supposed to be. Surely he can't propose equal valuation of different cryptos?

[Its About Sharing]

Didn't you hear?  jl777's SuperNET is going to unite all the crypto, so every crypto now has equal value.  It's the greatest arbitrage opportunity in history.

Care to give a tl;dr of what the angle is of that one? I googled it, and my eyes glazed over at the wall of text I found being, well, imprecise in what this is supposed to be. Surely he can't propose equal valuation of different cryptos?

Not sure about equal valuation, but the way I understood it was that on the "shared highway" you could use other cryptos "strongpoints" - e.g. BBR's CryptoNote. I'd like to say XMR's CryptoNote, but apparently BBR is better AND got their first. James was asked if XMR would be there and he answered any crypto with something to offer and if XMR doesn't have anything to offer it won't be accepted. I sense a bit of hostility regarding XMR. I'm surprised he is holding it against the XMR devs what the XMR community said (well, he siad that but I didn't see all the talking down to.)

I do have to say however that I have envisioned Cryptos organically being able to sort of "merge" at some time in the future. Perhaps what James is doing is the first step in that direction.

IAS

[oda.krell]

Didn't you hear?  jl777's SuperNET is going to unite all the crypto, so every crypto now has equal value.  It's the greatest arbitrage opportunity in history.

Care to give a tl;dr of what the angle is of that one? I googled it, and my eyes glazed over at the wall of text I found being, well, imprecise in what this is supposed to be. Surely he can't propose equal valuation of different cryptos?

Not sure about equal valuation, but the way I understood it was that on the "shared highway" you could use other cryptos "strongpoints" - e.g. BBR's CryptoNote. I'd like to say XMR's CryptoNote, but apparently BBR is better AND got their first. James was asked if XMR would be there and he answered any crypto with something to offer and if XMR doesn't have anything to offer it won't be accepted. I sense a bit of hostility regarding XMR. I'm surprised he is holding it against the XMR devs what the XMR community said (well, he siad that but I didn't see all the talking down to.)

I do have to say however that I have envisioned Cryptos organically being able to sort of "merge" at some time in the future. Perhaps what James is doing is the first step in that direction.
IAS

Interesting background. Thanks.

Bolded is what I had in mind more or less in my ha ha only serious post above about a merge of XMR and BBR. Not going to happen, of course, but at the same time, if in 10 years from now we don't have a precedence of two major coins merging, I'd be seriously surprised.

[othe]

The key holdings are:
64% of sharkfund0, which in turn owns 11% of BTCD and 10% of BBR, and other assets. I post the breakdown in the Sharktales thread about the sharkfund0. Most notably it has 20% of NXTprivacy, 10% of InstantDEX, 12% of JLH, ~10% of coinomat

Thats the reason, he holds a shitton of bbr and btcd.
No idea why BBR should even use that, it makes absolutely no sense as bbr already has anonymity.


Now back to topic dudes

[Its About Sharing]

Didn't you hear?  jl777's SuperNET is going to unite all the crypto, so every crypto now has equal value.  It's the greatest arbitrage opportunity in history.

Care to give a tl;dr of what the angle is of that one? I googled it, and my eyes glazed over at the wall of text I found being, well, imprecise in what this is supposed to be. Surely he can't propose equal valuation of different cryptos?

Not sure about equal valuation, but the way I understood it was that on the "shared highway" you could use other cryptos "strongpoints" - e.g. BBR's CryptoNote. I'd like to say XMR's CryptoNote, but apparently BBR is better AND got their first. James was asked if XMR would be there and he answered any crypto with something to offer and if XMR doesn't have anything to offer it won't be accepted. I sense a bit of hostility regarding XMR. I'm surprised he is holding it against the XMR devs what the XMR community said (well, he siad that but I didn't see all the talking down to.)

I do have to say however that I have envisioned Cryptos organically being able to sort of "merge" at some time in the future. Perhaps what James is doing is the first step in that direction.
IAS

Interesting background. Thanks.

Bolded is what I had in mind more or less in my ha ha only serious post above about a merge of XMR and BBR. Not going to happen, of course, but at the same time, if in 10 years from now we don't have a precedence of two major coins merging, I'd be seriously surprised.

It is more like an intuition than a thought for me at this point. I can only imagine that AI comes into the Cryptos, at some basic level. Eventually they should be able to "communicate" with one another. What does that entail? Interesting to extrapolate out that far with variables that we are not even yet aware of. At some further point I can only see a mixing of coins, much like on Earth how we have a mixing of races. Eventually, we, uhhh, get Greycoin, ehhe, kidding, but you get my idea. Just as how atoms have a Neutron with electrons/protons revolving around them, so do Solar systems have movements that are quit similar. I can only surmise that throughout our systems, we should look for overlays to other more universal ones (metaphorically speaking). Hope that made sense, a bit hard to English. I just can't imagine money, much less Crypto being anything like it is currently, years from now.

[Its About Sharing]

I have been wondering, if XMR's emission rate is around 21,024 (14.6 per minute X 60 X 24hours) and the daily volume on Poloniex is often 200-300 BTC, then why isn't the price moving more upwards? We have pretty huge volume, consistently.

To "buy" 21,024 XMR  at the current price of .0044 BTC per would be around 92.5 BTC a day.
I realize it requires more BTC as the price goes up to buy the same amount so we can't really say an average price exists. But what is causing this?
Is it just trading? Can whales be moving coins between one another to add the apparence of volume? (If they wanted to move the price higher they could do a better job.)
Is there a large holder who is continually dumping?

Ideas?

IAS

[othe]

Are you serious?!

counter question
How much Bitcoin or Ltc get minded per day and how much volume does it have?

[klee]

Negative. Price turns down due to news or no news, coupled with great dumps that smash the support currently at ~400. If no support is found until 290, it breaks the rising bottoms trend, leading to further insecurity. Also Bitcoin starting to rise dramatically could lead to this outcome just because alts typically follow suit a little later. Likelihood 5-10%.

What is your opinion on the effect of BTC continuing lower? In the past few weeks we've seen BTC give up 600 after staying roughly in that range for a while (since May), and now it seems it might be giving up 500. I wonder what the effect of this might have on Monero.

Well personally it has made me buy more of it.. don't know about the others

Perhaps this is a rationalized response to the primal urge to sell BTC, which cannot be done due to my resolution of not selling below 3000. Switching to something that is still crypto, has things going, and is going up, is not strictly breaking of the promise, right? 

Are you open to disclosing the order of magnitude of Monero you own? (as you have for Bitcoin).

Of course, feel free to ignore my question (I personally would not disclose it in the public forum).

Well, the following statement does not give any new information to the NSA as it is only parsed from public sources with necessary conversions:

- With Bitcoin, I have always since 2012-1-1 owned more than BTC2,400 although always less than BTC35,000.

- With Monero, I own more than 30,000 XMR but less than 227,000 XMR.

The usual "taxman disclaimer": "I" probably does not mean any entity that you can tax.

I hope you have hired some bodyguards - seriously bro stay safe...

[oda.krell]

I have been wondering, if XMR's emission rate is around 21,024 (14.6 per minute X 60 X 24hours) and the daily volume on Poloniex is often 200-300 BTC, then why isn't the price moving more upwards? We have pretty huge volume, consistently.

To "buy" 21,024 XMR  at the current price of .0044 BTC per would be around 92.5 BTC a day.
I realize it requires more BTC as the price goes up to buy the same amount so we can't really say an average price exists. But what is causing this?
Is it just trading? Can whales be moving coins between one another to add the apparence of volume? (If they wanted to move the price higher they could do a better job.)
Is there a large holder who is continually dumping?

Ideas?

IAS

Let's compare it:

XMR
30d volume = 5,800 BTC
650,000 XMR mined, 30d SMA 0.0037, 2,405 BTC equivalent mined
ratio volume to supply: 2.4


BTC volume is more problematic. Arbitrage links between exchanges are well established, so in principle, all volume (USD, CNY, EUR) counts, but I am not willing to count CNY volume 1:1. There are smarter ways to discount some of the zero-fee volume, but for simplicity sake I'll just say that we probably can agree that Chinese "real" (i.e. human) volume is probably not much lower than USD volume, so I will just double USD volume for the sake of this calculation and be done with it.

BTC
30d volume 840,000 BTC (in USD), x 2
108,000 BTC mined
ratio volume to supply: 15.6

So, by volume alone: no, I don't think we're undervalued.

[rpietila]

I hope you have hired some bodyguards - seriously bro stay safe...

I would not like to be the guy who wrongs / tries to harm me. I believe in personal responsibility.

[wachtwoord]

I hope you have hired some bodyguards - seriously bro stay safe...

I would not like to be the guy who wrongs / tries to harm me. I believe in personal responsibility.

In some parts of the world people kill each other for a few bucks ...

[wachtwoord]

What the hell is this about? You are free to make whatever piece of software you like to. Giving an ultimatum to a group of non-united people who do not speak for each other is rather dumb and pretty pointless. If you don't like XMR go post in another thread.

[Brilliantrocket]

jl777 quote

So because BBR is being added to the core, does this mean that Monero can not be part of the core because it does not bring any new features that BBR hasn't already added? And Monero, if it gets added will be in an arm spiraling off the core somewhere?

The monero camp (not its devs) mistreated me. At least I felt very insulted, especially when my thoughtful post on the XMR observer thread was totally ignored, until one person made a positive comment. Then I am accused of using a sockpuppet! Of all things to attack my integrity. Then my writing is ridiculed. I am incompetent to write a whitepaper, I know this. I only wrote the draft text and hired a professional writer for making it better. I liked the pirates to make it easy to understand for normal peoples. It was supposed to be split into two documents, one just with pirates and one without. I just dont have time for "GUI" things and I rely on others to just do what is needed. I also dont have time to micromanage or pester people. So a lot of things, they are unfinished. I am not a cryptographer, this also is used to dismiss my Teleport. So, making disparaging comments about my integrity, my intelligence, my tech, my coin.

Even I have my limits.

So, I revisit my BBR friends and realize to my horror that it had been beaten down out of top 100! To 1/40th of XMR price. Now nobody really knows who is doing this, but when a coin that has arguably better tech (let us not argue if it is actually better, BBR dev has made changes to the blockformat itself, clearly he is not a mechanic fiddling with settings, he is full blown engine designer!) and making new releases, including user friendly GUI, I wont list all the tech changes, please dont start a debate on which tech is better. Just try them both yourself and you decide which is better. Fair enough. Dont take my word, use your own judgement.

Anyway, the BBR price it turns around, but now there is all sorts of chatter to try to hurt it, but with knowledge the BBR is rising back to a more reasonable 1/5 value. If BBR tech is really as good or microscopically better than any other cryptonote, then what is the right price ratio? What is the right marketcap ratio? I let the market decide. So, now there is these large buying of XMR and some flashing of 1000 BTC buy orders. Clearly big whales are backing XMR and their advocates keep namecalling against BBR. So I feel big sympathy for poor little BBR. I am no big whale, I have not much BTC at all. Then I realize maybe I am able to raise some BTC with SuperNET. And actually this is likely some part of the reason I have started SuperNET. The other is I am still waiting for a release from other dev so I can debug Teleport. The other is a kind PM from noashh that reminded me I was getting a bit stressed and should take some time off. So, I took the weekend off and made this SuperNET. It is really just something that has to be done to counteract the fiat forces and I think the universe has conspired to make all these things happen. So I am lightning rod with all this but that is all, I just happened to be "lucky" enough to be hit by this lightening. Now I have to work so much before I can return to my preferred zen mode...

Anyway, as far as XMR goes. I like the BBR tech better than XMR and I certainly dont like the constant negativity from the XMR camp. Maybe there is nothing the XMR devs can do, but if this is indeed some coordinated smear campaign controlled by some XMR devotees, then they can stop the hostilities and make cooperation. I am not sure if they are able to do this and until they do, I wont have to think about whether XMR can be integrated into SuperNET core. I am a simple C programmer, but when I am personally attacked and get ridiculed when I am asking for the help, I do have a bit of a temper and the universe seems to help me out to defuse this anger in me. Sometimes in very unexpected ways.

So, conditions for XMR are to immediately stop any and all bashing of other cryptos. Talk about how good your XMR is, of course. Tech analysis of benefits, of course. Spreading rumors about personal things, not. FUD of course not.

UNITE of all crypto, this is the goal. Be part of this and of course there is a possibility of joining. But how can a culture based on zerosum hostility and "there can only be one" highlander beheadings, fit into spirit of cooperation?

If this toxic culture is indeed changed, then with the touted awesomeness of the XMR dev team I am sure there will be some tech that will be unique and valuable. I might require some significant investment in SuperNET as sort of a pennance, but I am practical guy and if XMR team will be benefit, then how can I refuse?

James

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=762346.msg8614080#msg8614080

This guy is more of a narcissist than Kanye West, FFS. Even if your comment is constructive, no one is obligated to respond to it. Seriously, go fuck yourself.

[wachtwoord]

ummm,

who are you telling to fuck off???

I am a monero supporter as well as a jl777 supporter.  Can't we all just get along?


That post was supposed to show that jl777 was still open to adding monero to the supernet core..

I thought only the first line was a jl777 quote.

Then target my response at jl777 (but he didn't post it here, why did you?)

[Brilliantrocket]

ummm,

who are you telling to fuck off???

I am a monero supporter as well as a jl777 supporter.  Can't we all just get along?


That post was supposed to show that jl777 was still open to adding monero to the supernet core..

jl777, of course. What an arrogant pig.

[aminorex]

narcissistic megalomania is in a bull trend.  personally, i am shorting it.

[Brilliantrocket]

ummm,

who are you telling to fuck off???

I am a monero supporter as well as a jl777 supporter.  Can't we all just get along?


That post was supposed to show that jl777 was still open to adding monero to the supernet core..

I thought only the first line was a jl777 quote.

Then target my response at jl777 (but he didn't post it here, why did you?)

It's signed James at the end.