[BitcoinMax.com] Closed

[ineededausername]

Oh look, lower interest rates.  This should shut those ponzi folks up... the ones yammering about 7% not going to last for one year.  It sure didn't, but pirate still isn't running a ponzi

[ErebusBat]

In any case, since Bitcoinmax is the largest PPT by far, it should ask a better treatment from Pirate IMHO.

4.9% a week is still insanely great.  I think we should be happy and not be sniveling over ~5% a week.

[hgmichna]

Oh look, lower interest rates.  This should shut those ponzi folks up... the ones yammering about 7% not going to last for one year.  It sure didn't, but pirate still isn't running a ponzi

Quite to the contrary, it means that the pirate can no longer pay out 7% to those on auto-payout of their interest. The auto-payouts are eating into his stash. It is a sign that the Ponzi scheme is nearing its end.

Also, 7% is too big an incentive for more of the early takers to go to auto-payout, once they feel that they have accumulated enough wealth.

The downside of his gamble is that lowering the rate may also make some "investors" withdraw right now. If that happened, then it would be over next week.

Not to mention that pirateat40 instantly loses his Vandroiy bet if he does not announce the interest rate change 30 days in advance. But he doesn't even think about that, because he has already written off the bet he never intended to win.

[Michail1]

A 5000BTC bet is minimal in the entire picture.   So, he probably doesn't care too much about just 5000BTC.

Also, the change in interest is not a default.  (So, bet is still active)
You might want to reread what was actually defined as a default.

[Clipse]

Oh look, lower interest rates.  This should shut those ponzi folks up... the ones yammering about 7% not going to last for one year.  It sure didn't, but pirate still isn't running a ponzi

Quite to the contrary, it means that the pirate can no longer pay out 7% to those on auto-payout of their interest. The auto-payouts are eating into his stash. It is a sign that the Ponzi scheme is nearing its end.

Also, 7% is too big an incentive for more of the early takers to go to auto-payout, once they feel that they have accumulated enough wealth.

The downside of his gamble is that lowering the rate may also make some "investors" withdraw right now. If that happened, then it would be over next week.

Not to mention that pirateat40 instantly loses his Vandroiy bet if he does not announce the interest rate change 30 days in advance. But he doesn't even think about that, because he has already written off the bet he never intended to win.

You sir are wise beyond years, my grand dad had the same logic before he got booked in an old age home for dimentia.

[John (John K.)]

Oh look, lower interest rates.  This should shut those ponzi folks up... the ones yammering about 7% not going to last for one year.  It sure didn't, but pirate still isn't running a ponzi

Quite to the contrary, it means that the pirate can no longer pay out 7% to those on auto-payout of their interest. The auto-payouts are eating into his stash. It is a sign that the Ponzi scheme is nearing its end.

Also, 7% is too big an incentive for more of the early takers to go to auto-payout, once they feel that they have accumulated enough wealth.

The downside of his gamble is that lowering the rate may also make some "investors" withdraw right now. If that happened, then it would be over next week.

Not to mention that pirateat40 instantly loses his Vandroiy bet if he does not announce the interest rate change 30 days in advance. But he doesn't even think about that, because he has already written off the bet he never intended to win.

You sir are wise beyond years, my grand dad had the same logic before he got booked in an old age home for dimentia.

Okay, this made me LOL out loud. I don't profess to support either side, by the way.

[Philj]

A 5000BTC bet is minimal in the entire picture.   So, he probably doesn't care too much about just 5000BTC.

Also, the change in interest is not a default.  (So, bet is still active)
You might want to reread what was actually defined as a default.

You might want to read the other section of the bet that states that Pirate must give 30 days notice for any change in interest. Pirates original change was stated in July to be active in August and was fine, but now he has only given 1 week notice to the new lower rates

[Raoul Duke]

A 5000BTC bet is minimal in the entire picture.   So, he probably doesn't care too much about just 5000BTC.

Also, the change in interest is not a default.  (So, bet is still active)
You might want to reread what was actually defined as a default.

You might want to read the other section of the bet that states that Pirate must give 30 days notice for any change in interest. Pirates original change was stated in July to be active in August and was fine, but now he has only given 1 week notice to the new lower rates

You might want to read this

FYI, here is my interpretation.

Since the existing ToS includes the provision for pirate's ability to change interest rates "with notice", this latest change in interest rates does not violate the terms of the bet contract, even though it did not itself have a 30 day notice. The term "interest rates" was only used as an example of terms that may change in ToS; the list of examples was not intended to be either exhaustive or necessarily-inclusive. The point of the ToS changes section and advance notice thereof, was to make sure that users are given ample notice for any unexpected material changes.

For your easy reference, link to bet contract:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=91661.msg1013589#msg1013589

[uuidman]

Oh look, lower interest rates.  This should shut those ponzi folks up... the ones yammering about 7% not going to last for one year.  It sure didn't, but pirate still isn't running a ponzi

Quite to the contrary, it means that the pirate can no longer pay out 7% to those on auto-payout of their interest. The auto-payouts are eating into his stash. It is a sign that the Ponzi scheme is nearing its end.

If the rates are getting lower maybe some think its time to join the train before the ride stops. Seeing it as a business venture soon to end.

[miscreanity]

There was also the initial rumbling of lowered rates a few weeks ago, which was stayed at that point. That could be construed as notice.

[conspirosphere.tk]

If the rates are getting lower maybe some think its time to join the train before the ride stops. Seeing it as a business venture soon to end.

According this logic, they must be in the business of catching falling knives then.

[hgmichna]

There was also the initial rumbling of lowered rates a few weeks ago, which was stayed at that point. That could be construed as notice.

Not necessary. Read nanotube's evaluation. Interest rate changes do not have to be announced 30 days in advance. Changes in the Terms of Service have that requirement, but they state that interest rates may change.

Not that this will change the outcome of the bet.

[DutchBrat]

wondering what the last 20 or so posts have to do with bitcoinmax 

[hgmichna]

wondering what the last 20 or so posts have to do with bitcoinmax 

Bitcoinmax is an integral part of the BullShit Trust Ponzi operation.

[Ilikeham]

Interest rate change is of next to zero importance, the fact that Payb.tc as one of the largest (or largest) trust accounts and didn't get a heads up and hasn't yet clarified is of more concern.

I'm fine with risk, I flee from sloppy communication.

[Otoh]

We've got until Monday on the old rates, we'll know for sure before then - there's a lot at stake, too many ppl were moving too large amounts in & out unpredictably & it was adversely effecting pirate's profit, quit whingeing & flee I suggest

[Haplo]

While I agree that 7% wasn't sustainable, giving his larger passthru's the option of more interest for only withdrawing once a week would give him stability, and let people keep their higher return.  It looks like his problem was stability, if bitcoinmax can offer that, why not keep it at the current rate?  Deposits at bitcoinmax would skyrocket.

Not nessecariy... I prefer the ability to get at my coins.  Iwoulld almost certainly withdraw if that change were made.

I can see this as well.  What if the price of coins fell through the floor, etc?  So, I guess I would say that "some" would want that for the interest/greed position.  Others would want more liquidity, such as you suggest.  I'm on the fence, but 4.9% is pretty good too.

The best solution would be to offer CDs so that those willing to give up liquidity for interest could do so, without restricting those who prefer liquidity. Lowering interest doesn't really solve the problem of too much activity.

[drakahn]

While I agree that 7% wasn't sustainable, giving his larger passthru's the option of more interest for only withdrawing once a week would give him stability, and let people keep their higher return.  It looks like his problem was stability, if bitcoinmax can offer that, why not keep it at the current rate?  Deposits at bitcoinmax would skyrocket.

Not nessecariy... I prefer the ability to get at my coins.  Iwoulld almost certainly withdraw if that change were made.

I can see this as well.  What if the price of coins fell through the floor, etc?  So, I guess I would say that "some" would want that for the interest/greed position.  Others would want more liquidity, such as you suggest.  I'm on the fence, but 4.9% is pretty good too.

The best solution would be to offer CDs so that those willing to give up liquidity for interest could do so, without restricting those who prefer liquidity. Lowering interest doesn't really solve the problem of too much activity.

It solves the problem of too much activity cutting into profits while also allowing people the same access to their coins

[miscreanity]

There was also the initial rumbling of lowered rates a few weeks ago, which was stayed at that point. That could be construed as notice.

Not necessary. Read nanotube's evaluation. Interest rate changes do not have to be announced 30 days in advance. Changes in the Terms of Service have that requirement, but they state that interest rates may change.

Agreed, just pointing out that the earlier instance of rate reduction announcements might be used as a reference point if the 30 day frame became an issue.

[zyk]

Why the hell Vandroi is not now commenting in here?
Would be the first time bitcoinmax lenders would appreciate and be very interested in his appearance