XMR vs DRK

[generalizethis]

I might be 'blind idiot'

--Opensource projects work on donations.

--Opensource projects are subject to peer review.

--Frauds should be called out for being frauds--wherever, whenever.

--When was an official GUI release date built into a social contract? Never read that anywhere. The production dates of the new Blade Runner and Kill Bill 3 keep getting moved back, but I'm not boycotting them over it--in fact, if it makes a better product, I'll gladly wait.

So yeah, you're a little from column A and little from column B.

[Hueristic]

angry

actually Monero devs have been working on the GUI, just the important parts:



Also back in September they said GUI release was a 'Primary goal', as stated on Wikipedia.  That's only 7 months late then.

(Weirdly, this was removed on Wikipedia earlier today, now it's a 'secondary goal' apparently, hey hoe.



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CryptoNote#Monero_.28XMR.29

I changed that, Projects morph. It is good to keep wiki's up to date.

I fail to see your point. So in your mind instead of addressing issues such as chain attacks and chain bloat the Devs should have spent their time pushing out a GUI that would be worthless once the Database was written and out of beta?

You really don't live in reality do you?

[BlockaFett]

I might be 'blind idiot'

--Opensource projects work on donations.

--Opensource projects are subject to peer review.

--Frauds should be called out for being frauds--wherever, whenever.

--When was an official GUI release date built into a social contract? Never read that anywhere. The production dates of the new Blade Runner and Kill Bill 3 keep getting moved back, but I'm not boycotting them over it--in fact, if it makes a better product, I'll gladly wait.

So yeah, you're a little from column A and little from column B.

bored of arguing. i really don't care about Monero gui or lack of, just trying to show you that your devs aren't really devs because they don't deliver anything.  if you can't see this, not my issue.

[G2M]

G2M is correct. If you're able to do two-way mapping of hash functions, then everybody is collectively screwed independent of XMR v. DRK or on-chain v.

off-chain.

OK gotcha.

I wonder why people go on about the off-chain benefits....doesn't sound like any benefit at all in this case.

G2M is not correct, as he's probably not aware that Darksend doesn't reuse addresses.

Yet, the DRK I drksent to someone else is still forever recorded in my wallet with that person's public address. Even after importing it on a different computer. Imagine if they got my wallet dump?

Regardless of the inbetween, the end points are what we're talking about here. But that's okay anyways:

If my private key was capable of being compromised by TLA's, here's the transaction they would select, simply for no other reason other than that it  'looks' like a darksend transation, because it's creating darksend denominations: https://chainz.cryptoid.info/dash/tx.dws?4fbe96210f828f5fbfd1c4859217d8fd76b2d3344325ec0ceae3d0cf1efd5ffd.htm

Then, when parsing the blockchain for those output addresses, they'd deftly reveal the private key to reveal if they've been spent, or just look for it on the blockchain. Because they're a TLA, they're interested in larger amounts first. Let's pick one of the 10 drk denominations:

Here's the first denomination of 10 that's gonna be my 10 drk to drksent. I know it's mine because it's an address that was in the last transaction:

https://chainz.cryptoid.info/dash/tx.dws?7c7cde0076f0169f42b7a6ee863d4a24929d33c4558e5123a8a9cd415cc8d607.htm
    6   4fbe96210f828f5f...:26   XfeJKzKEJUtVDYvuv7vF9jJKkF3Dx23ft6   10.0001 DASH

Anyways, let's say that out of those 9, XcRHvNsezZzKB6U7sejx2EPUKjkFkrSEm3 is the address that correlates to me. It goes to this tx: https://chainz.cryptoid.info/dash/tx.dws?1655733.htm

Because we're dealing with a situation where rsa/ecc are compromisable in the first place, I'd simply just go ahead and plug into all of the masternodes because encryption is bunk. Seeing as how their IP's are easily discoverable and public knowledge, I'd simply go ahead and sign into it as a remote user, because again cryptography/encryption just doesn't hold up anymore and then I'd go ahead and reveal all of their private keys to myself.

Next, I'd take the second transaction above, that was sent to a masternode and dump the private keys for all of those transactions (for luls). We have 9 transactions, being sent off on some time interval to some other masternode

So, when I'd like to discover when a masternode has sent someone some return DRK, I can just say "OH well I received this guy's 10 DRK, then sent it off to the next node". So I'd go ahead and see where that 10 DRK got sent to, because, you know, more cryptography. Basically I'd set up a table of masternode keys and just simply walk myself through the transactions one by one, until ... it leaves the masternode addresses (it would be insanely profitable, so how could I not?).

Anyways, from there it's pretty safe to say that the output address would be the same user as the three addresses above.

Finally here, I sent 29.0 of the mixed darksend: https://chainz.cryptoid.info/dash/tx.dws?8ce9862e053bce9272f023a4c2654a30edaf6118dd430b6391e611e26ceb84b9.htm

For which, we will pick both of the 10 drk denominations which are from this transaction (also, this absolutely confirms that these inputs are from one person, which means 20 of the transactions in this are the same person): https://chainz.cryptoid.info/dash/tx.dws?8ce9862e053bce9272f023a4c2654a30edaf6118dd430b6391e611e26ceb84b9.htm

So going to the input side of that tx, just look for the only other tx that's capable of having >20 inputs, which is this transaction: https://chainz.cryptoid.info/dash/tx.dws?1655916.htm, (c7a33d66547c65fa39b9a10511c5827c0353f6507c107118adae5bbc0d65da98)

EDIT: Wow, copying and pasting is balls, sorry for what I'm sure is the flame trail after this post that I didnt even read up to yet):
  (Follow those 20 inputs to the next tx - https://chainz.cryptoid.info/dash/tx.dws?1655874.htm
  ( Then once more - https://chainz.cryptoid.info/dash/tx.dws?1655733.htm)
  (and bam link

Stealth addressing - you'd have an absolutely miserable time doing what I just did if you used stealth addresses as well. Then they'd really need to get those private keys to make the work much less harder.

Of course, this is mostly useless. Likely compromised keys would be used to just spend unspent output, and steal. Because crypto's not going anywhere fast. Nobody cares much about the private financial history of something like a DRK or and XMR user. I'm really just compromising private keys for luls, because the lack of stealth addressing and knowing that change goes to the miners makes identification of the actual money trivial to identify.

Now that I've spent this godawful amount of time doing this, can someone please return the favor and walk me through the same thing for XMR? Preferrably someone that favors DRK, yet is curious about XMR. If not that's fine.

Also, Because it took me much less time to actually trace my tx, than it actually took to complete the tx (I spent a lot of time waiting), this means real-time monitoring is a possibility, therefore not fungible if private keys are compromisable.

Oh, god, 60 replies since I started writing this. I haven't read any of them since I quoted illodin

[GTO911]

not to mention no one respects the anonymity architecture, etc....

The awkward moment when you are talking cryptography with kids

[BlockaFett]

angry

actually Monero devs have been working on the GUI, just the important parts:



Also back in September they said GUI release was a 'Primary goal', as stated on Wikipedia.  That's only 7 months late then.

(Weirdly, this was removed on Wikipedia earlier today, now it's a 'secondary goal' apparently, hey hoe.



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CryptoNote#Monero_.28XMR.29

I changed that, Projects morph. It is good to keep wiki's up to date.

I fail to see your point. So in your mind instead of addressing issues such as chain attacks and chain bloat the Devs should have spent their time pushing out a GUI that would be worthless once the Database was written and out of beta?

You really don't live in reality do you?

my point is whole Monero project is basically a marketing scam and the GUI thing is just a tiny example of how your devs don't deliver on their promises (the most important factor in investing in a digital currency).  I am not saying this as a drk investor, if i was trying to troll i would be pouring all the research i did especially on NSA-Cryptonote involvement on the Monero thread. but I ain't.  I got scammed last year on Mintpal and started my own investigation, the only reason I researched Monero was because i was just reading Monero FUD for 5 days solid on the DRK thread and thought 'that is obviously a scam, do a bit of research so you can counter what they are saying' - i'm obviously not getting through, so wasting my time here

[generalizethis]

I might be 'blind idiot'

--Opensource projects work on donations.

--Opensource projects are subject to peer review.

--Frauds should be called out for being frauds--wherever, whenever.

--When was an official GUI release date built into a social contract? Never read that anywhere. The production dates of the new Blade Runner and Kill Bill 3 keep getting moved back, but I'm not boycotting them over it--in fact, if it makes a better product, I'll gladly wait.

So yeah, you're a little from column A and little from column B.

bored of arguing. i really don't care about Monero gui or lack of, just trying to show you that your devs aren't really devs because they don't deliver anything.  if you can't see this, not my issue.

Don't worry. I'm sure you'll live to troll another day.

[saddambitcoin]

I am a Monero donator and I am happy with the work they do. They deliver quality software, when the time is right.

Ask any of these people if they are unsatisfied, I don't think they are: https://getmonero.org/getting-started/donate/hall-of-fame

[BlockaFett]

I might be 'blind idiot'

--Opensource projects work on donations.

--Opensource projects are subject to peer review.

--Frauds should be called out for being frauds--wherever, whenever.

--When was an official GUI release date built into a social contract? Never read that anywhere. The production dates of the new Blade Runner and Kill Bill 3 keep getting moved back, but I'm not boycotting them over it--in fact, if it makes a better product, I'll gladly wait.

So yeah, you're a little from column A and little from column B.

bored of arguing. i really don't care about Monero gui or lack of, just trying to show you that your devs aren't really devs because they don't deliver anything.  if you can't see this, not my issue.

Don't worry. I'm sure you'll live to troll another day.

check my sig and tell me if you think I am the kind of person to come here for trolling...plus I have been in Dash for 12 months already so it's not like I care about Dash price right now...i was calling out Moolah before Green took Mintpal offline (when I figured out he was dumping DRK using an alias on the BCT thread).  I am serious about what I am saying here, but think what you like

[illodin]

G2M is correct. If you're able to do two-way mapping of hash functions, then everybody is collectively screwed independent of XMR v. DRK or on-chain v.

off-chain.

OK gotcha.

I wonder why people go on about the off-chain benefits....doesn't sound like any benefit at all in this case.

G2M is not correct, as he's probably not aware that Darksend doesn't reuse addresses.

long post

No coins are sent to masternodes, and masternodes don't send any coins. With that information, could you rephrase what you were trying to say?

[majamina]

G2M - that was a really great post, thank you.

The thread seems to be going downhill a bit though. It would be nice if we could keep it on track with reasonable discussion of the two coin's features, technical stuff etc rather than all the potshots.

[Hueristic]

{snip}

my point is whole Monero project is basically a marketing scam and the GUI thing is just a tiny example of how your devs don't deliver on their promises (the most important factor in investing in a digital currency).  I am not saying this as a drk investor, if i was trying to troll i would be pouring all the research i did especially on NSA-Cryptonote involvement on the Monero thread. but I ain't.  I got scammed last year on Mintpal and started my own investigation, the only reason I researched Monero was because i was just reading Monero FUD for 5 days solid on the DRK thread and thought 'that is obviously a scam, do a bit of research so you can counter what they are saying' - i'm obviously not getting through, so wasting my time here

Did you even bother to read the citation link? Here
https://forum.getmonero.org/1/news-announcements-and-editorials/190/editorial-why-is-the-official-gui-wallet-not-released-yet

And as you can see in that thread I made note of the change when the change was made. There is nothing going on in this coin that is not above board and transparent. If you think it is a marketing scam then don't buy in. You are of course in the minority as the world is starting to wake up to Monero's potential.

AFA NSA involvement, please explain this to me, it's ok if you use big words I can google them. Why don't you start with the http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EdDSA and go from there. Gotta Love twisted Ed curves rite?

[generalizethis]

I might be 'blind idiot'

--Opensource projects work on donations.

--Opensource projects are subject to peer review.

--Frauds should be called out for being frauds--wherever, whenever.

--When was an official GUI release date built into a social contract? Never read that anywhere. The production dates of the new Blade Runner and Kill Bill 3 keep getting moved back, but I'm not boycotting them over it--in fact, if it makes a better product, I'll gladly wait.

So yeah, you're a little from column A and little from column B.

bored of arguing. i really don't care about Monero gui or lack of, just trying to show you that your devs aren't really devs because they don't deliver anything.  if you can't see this, not my issue.

Don't worry. I'm sure you'll live to troll another day.

check my sig and tell me if you think I am the kind of person to come here for trolling...plus I have been in Dash for 12 months already so it's not like I care about Dash price right now...i was calling out Moolah before Green took Mintpal offline (when I figured out he was dumping DRK using an alias on the BCT thread).  I am serious about what I am saying here, but think what you like

Sig? Personal past? Who cares? Your factual argumentation is weak. I think you believe it, but that is like a size 0 at JC Penny's--not in the plus department.

[illodin]

G2M - that was a really great post, thank you.

Well he assumed that masternodes are sending and receiving coins, which isn't the case. I didn't try to read and understand the rest of the post because it was built on false premise.

[BlockaFett]

{snip}

my point is whole Monero project is basically a marketing scam and the GUI thing is just a tiny example of how your devs don't deliver on their promises (the most important factor in investing in a digital currency).  I am not saying this as a drk investor, if i was trying to troll i would be pouring all the research i did especially on NSA-Cryptonote involvement on the Monero thread. but I ain't.  I got scammed last year on Mintpal and started my own investigation, the only reason I researched Monero was because i was just reading Monero FUD for 5 days solid on the DRK thread and thought 'that is obviously a scam, do a bit of research so you can counter what they are saying' - i'm obviously not getting through, so wasting my time here

Did you even bother to read the citation link? Here
https://forum.getmonero.org/1/news-announcements-and-editorials/190/editorial-why-is-the-official-gui-wallet-not-released-yet

And as you can see in that thread I made note of the change when the change was made. There is nothing going on in this coin that is not above board and transparent. If you think it is a marketing scam then don't buy in. You are of course in the minority as the world is starting to wake up to Monero's potential.

AFA NSA involvement, please explain this to me, it's ok if you use big words I can google them. Why don't you start with the http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EdDSA and go from there. Gotta Love twisted Ed curves rite?

i'm done with my free XMR due dilligance thanks - I already posted 3 times about the NSA involvement, read those maybe so i don't have to repeat myself which then people can say is trolling?

also not sure about the 'world waking up to xmr' - you probably want big exchanges like Bittrex and BTER to wake up first instead of Scamoniex with it's full time XMR 'price protection' team that lives in the trollbox....without which i estimate XMR market cap at ~$200k



(again, not trolling - this should be a BIG RED FLAG. but i feel like I am probably banging my head against a brick wall again...)

[Joshuar]

If anything, Monero usually has higher volume and better liquidity than Dash/DRK when they're not getting pumped by Otoh/Masternode. #logic Blockafett, use it.
The NSA speculation is the same as saying Bitcoin was created by the CIA and the Satoshi is really the U.S Government. Again, use #logic. If anything Dash is probably the closest thing to being involved with the NSA, it was closed source for most of it's lifetime, who knows what might have happened?(Using your own troll argument against you).
But no, you instead choose to troll with nonsensical arguments.

this should be a warning to all XMR investors: http://web.archive.org/web/20141106091836/http://www.cryptobang.com/2014/10/05/what-nsa-created-cryptonote-for/

NSA being well known for building complex vulnerabilities into systems that can then be exploited to provide backdoors...if the designer of your platform has these intentions there is no way to know what all the vulnerabilities can be.  Look at the recent Heartbleed 'bug' that went on for at least 2 years with NSA using it...http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2014-04-11/nsa-said-to-have-used-heartbleed-bug-exposing-consumers

No one in the market is going to touch a coin that is built on code that had NSA design involvement, especially people seeking anonymity.

Coupled with the fact core devs 'smooth' and 'fluffy' spout about honesty and integrity then spend a large amount of time trolling the competition, and asking for donations to 'speed up', (NTM all volume through Poloniex...) there are a lot of red flags IMO.

...

Find a source for that nsa story besides 'cryptobang' where any troller can pay 1 btc to have some dumb story written.

In fact the crypto code in monero comes from DJB the renowned cryptographer who is as close to a mortal enemy of the NSA as you will ever find.

The story is ridiculous. It's good trollbait though. If anyone cites it we know they are trolling and not doing any actual research.

[toknormal]

If anything, Monero usually has higher volume and better liquidity than Dash/DRK when they're not getting pumped by Otoh/Masternode. #logic Blockafett, use it.

I think I'll just let you burry yourself in your own clueless arguments.

[dEBRUYNE]

{snip}

my point is whole Monero project is basically a marketing scam and the GUI thing is just a tiny example of how your devs don't deliver on their promises (the most important factor in investing in a digital currency).  I am not saying this as a drk investor, if i was trying to troll i would be pouring all the research i did especially on NSA-Cryptonote involvement on the Monero thread. but I ain't.  I got scammed last year on Mintpal and started my own investigation, the only reason I researched Monero was because i was just reading Monero FUD for 5 days solid on the DRK thread and thought 'that is obviously a scam, do a bit of research so you can counter what they are saying' - i'm obviously not getting through, so wasting my time here

Did you even bother to read the citation link? Here
https://forum.getmonero.org/1/news-announcements-and-editorials/190/editorial-why-is-the-official-gui-wallet-not-released-yet

And as you can see in that thread I made note of the change when the change was made. There is nothing going on in this coin that is not above board and transparent. If you think it is a marketing scam then don't buy in. You are of course in the minority as the world is starting to wake up to Monero's potential.

AFA NSA involvement, please explain this to me, it's ok if you use big words I can google them. Why don't you start with the http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EdDSA and go from there. Gotta Love twisted Ed curves rite?

i'm done with my free XMR due dilligance thanks - I already posted 3 times about the NSA involvement, read those maybe so i don't have to repeat myself which then people can say is trolling?

also not sure about the 'world waking up to xmr' - you probably want big exchanges like Bittrex and BTER to wake up first instead of Scamoniex with it's full time XMR 'price protection' team that lives in the trollbox....without which i estimate XMR market cap at ~$200k



(again, not trolling - this should be a BIG RED FLAG. but i feel like I am probably banging my head against a brick wall again...)

Poloniex makes up around 66% of the total XMR volume, whereas Cryptsy takes up above 70% of the Dash volume. Your post, again, makes no sense at all.

[BlockaFett]

If anything, Monero usually has higher volume and better liquidity than Dash/DRK when they're not getting pumped by Otoh/Masternode. #logic Blockafett, use it.

-snip-

Monero volume/price can be whatever 'The Team' want it to be dude because it's all through Poloniex which is obviously 'on side'.  The basically 0 volumes through the big exchanges like BTER and Bittrex should be showing you that no one in the market actually wants XMR outside of Polo, take that out and demand is basically zero. i don't like saying that, but seeing so many people here blindly throwing money, and all the pious statements from the XMR camp that seem obviously hypocritical to me, it should really be said.  if you don't agree, i respect your opinion, it's fine with me.

[generalizethis]

If anything, Monero usually has higher volume and better liquidity than Dash/DRK when they're not getting pumped by Otoh/Masternode. #logic Blockafett, use it.

I think I'll just let you burry yourself in your own clueless arguments.

And when are you  (or Blockhead) gonna answer Toshi's question or GMaxwell's critique?