Butterflylabs Huge SCAM

[ilikehero]

true

[Frizz23]

[Kuzushi]

I'm very very new at all this so if this post seems a bit naive then yes.....guilty as charged.

Everyone that preorderd a BFL ASIC device must have understood that they were taking a chance on an emerging technology.  I know how frustrating it can be to wait, and we all secretly wanted the mail man to ring our doorbells product in hand the day after we pressed the "Buy Now" button, but waiting is part of the game, it's part of the risk of being an early adopter.

Yes....I said early adopter because if you think the BFL preorder list is big now just wait and see what happens after we get our orders filled and this forum lights up like a tree at Christmas with people saying....I just got my order!!!   When that happens the order list will grow by 30 to 50 times and the company will have no choice but to raise their prices in an effort to balance the order flow with their ability to deliver.

Also, if we're talking about risk then we should also look at the risk/reward ratio.  With the potential loss being about $60 or less per GH and the potential gain being many times more then the cost, it's a bet that makes sense.  Add to the fact that you can get a full refund just by asking and the risk/reward ratio looks even better, especially since we're betting on a company that has successfully delivered cutting edge mining products in the past.  

I'm curious...when BFL first announced that they were coming out with their FPGA miners did they also have to take all this heat?

It makes good business sense to spread your mining budget over a few companies to further reduce your risk, so I for one am rooting for these guys.

I wish I could find a casino game that would give me a chance to gain while allowing me a full refund.

[creativex]

I'm very very new at all this so if this post seems a bit naive then yes.....guilty as charged.

No offense intended, but you were spot on here...then you just trailed off.

BFL reps lie constantly about everything, THAT'S the problem, not that new technology is risky or that there are delays. Back in October of 2012 Josh was endlessly spouting off about how this delay or that delay wouldn't be a problem because of all the "extra padding" built into their "worst case scenario". Guess how all that turned out? It's like this at every turn...everything BFL related takes 10x as long as what they say and different reps cite different delivery schedules. They're a total mess, unable even to keep their lies straight.

[Frizz23]

[lots of bullcrap deleted]
...
Yes....I said early adopter because if you think the BFL preorder list is big now just wait and see what happens after we get our orders filled and this forum lights up like a tree at Christmas with people saying....I just got my order!!!   When that happens the order list will grow by 30 to 50 times and the company will have no choice but to raise their prices in an effort to balance the order flow with their ability to deliver.
...
[lots of bullcrap deleted]

You BFL shills have no shame, have you?

Trying to lure even more people into this pre-order pyramid scam.

- speechless -

[Exoskeleton]

I wish I could find a casino game that would give me a chance to gain while allowing me a full refund.

This is a terrible analogy to what BFL is putting its customers through.

How about a casino game where you are promised a win, then the rules change and you don't get paid. But you get your money back and are told that the new rules guarantee a win if you leave your money at the casino for another two weeks. Then two weeks later the same thing happens. This same thing happens every two weeks for a year. Keep in mind that you are in a line with over 10,000 other players waiting to get paid. Would you feel cheated? You always had the chance to get your money back. But you were lied to every two weeks about the rules of the game.

Meanwhile, people are making huge profits playing at every single other casino.

The problem is that most people who believe in bitcoin, myself included, look at mining as our major investment vehicle this year. When you only have under 20btc to your name today this kind of decision can make or break you in the next year.

I know that peope should be aware of the high risks involved with mining bitcoins but I also think people should be able to get honest information on those risks.

[Kouye]

I'm very very new at all this[...]
[...] we all secretly wanted [...] it's part of the risk of being an early adopter.

Ok, so you're very very new to this AND an early adopter ?

[...] I'm curious...when BFL first announced that they were coming out with their FPGA miners did they also have to take all this heat? [...]

[...] I wish I could find a casino game that would give me a chance to gain while allowing me a full refund. [...]

Haha, this looks like pure, perfect textbook scamming!

[XenonofArcticus]

Well, I have a BFL pre-order in. I think they'll deliver it, eventually. I suspect it will be worthwhile in the long run, but thie is Research and stuff does have problems.

[Exoskeleton]

creativex, Frizz23, thanks for the quick shutdown of Kuzushi. I was hesitating to call him a BFL shill but its quite obvious. They are everywhere on this forum. I think we need to keep this thread honest because people are still falling for the BFL scam to this day. I was going to pull the trigger on a BFL unit a while back untill I had the good luck to find this site and read up on the company.

People on this forum saved me from being one of the "lost generation" of bitcoin miners.

A big "Thank You" to everyone on this forum who allowed me to see behind the curtain. 

[Frizz23]

creativex, Frizz23, thanks for the quick shutdown of Kuzushi. I was hesitating to call him a BFL shill but its quite obvious. They are everywhere on this forum.

I was often wondering what all those BFL employes (from this company video) do all day. Surely they can't assemble ASIC miners - since those are still in prototyping phase.

But when you go to http://forums.butterflylabs.com/ you know what they do all day: Keeping a clean and positive "aura", praise and cheer BFL to the skies ...

[Kuzushi]

Yeah, I had a feeling you guys would be passionately in love with my post  

But the question remains:

When BFL first announced that they were coming out with their FPGA miners did they also have to take all this heat?

[Gamelord]

So has anyone ever received anything from BFL?  Or has anyone ever seen one of these machines in action in person?

[scab]

I suspected them the whole time.

[BTCoder]

Good read.

[creativex]

Yeah, I had a feeling you guys would be passionately in love with my post  

But the question remains:

When BFL first announced that they were coming out with their FPGA miners did they also have to take all this heat?

They didn't have to take heat, they chose to by being dishonest. BFL lied about their timetable for delivery of FPGA mining gear and they also lied about power consumption of that gear, just as they've done with ASIC mining gear. They're deceitful at every opportunity, because it's how they roll.

[scab]

Who else other then me suspected this for the longest time?

[Mazakguy]

I have read this entire thread and many others on the whloe BLF circlejerk, as we would have said in the service.

To all you who are pissed, this is an idea I have not seem even mentioned yet.

Now I have not ordered from them so have no dog in this fight.

I keep hearing that the person who runs this company is a convicted felon on probation.
Has anyone called and talked to his supervision officer themselves. You all know that this is a matter of public record.
All you have to do is look it up and make a couple of phone calls. OR just call the nearest federal courhouse to where he is and ask to speak to the agent in charge.

As a retired community intergration officer (ie. probation officer), I can tell you how interested I would have been if it had been brought
to my notice that one of my probationers was involved in something like this.
I can say that I would have had him infront of a judge so fast, he would have wondered what happened.
I am willing to bet the judge would have revolked on the spot, and back to jail you go.

Soooo, maybe one of you with a dog in the fight minght want to try that.

Let me know how it goes.

[redlight]

Its a scam.

[Exoskeleton]

OK you guys want to see some shit, check this out.

http://www.wired.com/wired/archive/14.10/gizmondo.html

I read this a while back and the first thing I thought of when I heard the historys of the people involved in BFL was "gizmondo..."

From the article:  "In just a few years, it seems, Eriksson went from languishing in a European jail cell to making millions as a tech executive"

Its a long read but a good one. To sum it all up there was a company a few years back a lot like BFL that promised a product with specs that were impossible to deliver on. They then got a bunch of investor money because people beleived it could be delivered. It got delayed and delayed because they lied about how fast they could make it. By the time it came out it was terrible and failed. But the CEOs and scammers who started the company got away clean because in the end they did deliver a product so it "was not an illegal scam". They paid themselves enough to afford $1,000,000 sprots cars (ferrari enzo) and got away with financial murder.

This is exactly what is going to happen with BFL

[MooC Tals]

The scam is in the pre-order and refund cycle. If a company had money it would not need to collect pre-orders until they had a working proto-type and NOT FOR A FULL YEAR!!

Money was taken in and used for research and development, all the while telling you all that deliveries were to begin soon if X was done.

There are laws against this. BFL states the money is not being used for research and the money made from the previous product is the money that is funding their operation.

People who didn't like waiting send in their refund. When the money goes low they put pictures of their progress to generate more pre-orders. That is the scam and this is why Josh just says ask for a refund.

Now there is a product (that pre-adopters have funded). I guess it is a good time to raise prices but then again the power figures and low prices were to attract pre-orders and kill competition.

The intention of making and delivering was always there it was the funding of their company to get to the finished product.

My opinion from my experience and from what I have read here and on their forums.