Butterflylabs Huge SCAM

[aquarat]

'There's no way a USB cable would support 120v, it would melt almost instantly the minute it touched anything.'

I have a lot of Raspberry Pis... they all use 5V PSUs. A few months back I bought some Chinese wall worts and used them with my Pis. The Pis ran fine... but when I happened to touch ground on one of the Pis and another grounded metal object nearby I got a massive continuous shock. A multimeter showed that 240vac was present between the USB charger's ground and earth. So now I make sure I test wall worts before use.

So yes, you could put 500v down a standard USB cable, the voltage isn't the issue, it's the Amps. A prolonged short circuit at high voltage will draw enough amps to destroy the cable.

I ordered a 30GH unit from BFL... I didn't think they'd deliver and it took ages... but to my astonishment they did deliver and the machine in question is working just fine. The PSU of the machine is big, more than adequately specc'ed for the purpose and certainly isn't "leaking" electricity.

My only gripe, apart from the delays, is that the unit I ordered and received didn't have a strong enough airflow to keep the chips running cool enough to avoid thermal throttling (at 21 deg C), but removal of the grilles on either side of the case fixed that problem.

BFL has made mistakes... Blackmagic Design has recently too with their incredibly late 4k cameras... but I think a lot of the issues BFL has been experiencing are self-fulfilling prophecies (our self-fulfilling prophecies).

[1715133802]

1715133802

[1715133802]

1715133802

[subseaguru]

did anyone take part in BFL's big holiday blowout??? i got a few things since the price was right. now if only they will arrive before it to late to use them 

[SplunkCOS]

I myself was VERY excited about those BFL SC things (http://www.butterflylabs.com/products/), but it sounded too good to be true. I was one step before pre-ordering the Mini Rig 'SC' for just $30k, which could deliver 1TH/s (update -> 1.5 TH/s according to the website now!). You know what? Bullshit.

Is butterfly labs mining with those ASICs at the moment? (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=110290.0)
Hell no! Do you see some huge raise in hashing power? No.
Would it be beneficial to mine on their own devices? Hell yes! More than just selling them.

If circumstantial evidence isn't enough, try simple business logic.  The price is set at $149 for a 3500MH/s chip. At current prices, they would make $149 after about 10.8 days of mining!  So why doesn't Butterfly Labs just run them for 10.8 days instead of selling them?  Then they'd have $149 and the chips lol.  I mean seriously, read those last 2 sentences again, people.  You think they're not mining with them?  I can't be the only one that realizes this.  From a business perspective, if you had an investment that would pay off 200% in a month and you sell it off instead, you're a crazy person.

You know the true reason why they are not mining with them? They can't. They don't have them.

But they have already proven legit! They fullfiled the orders and delivered FPGAs!
Sure they have. Gained your trust. And will take them back. And you will pay even more. You will loose your working FPGAs and also money. Huge money.

Trade in terms: Qualifying trade in for upgrades can be either an older generation Mini Rig or 25 older generation Singles. Once your new rig is ready for delivery (currently scheduled for November), you'll be notified to ship your trade in units to us. Upon receipt we'll release your new Mini Rig SC for shipment to you.

They still could have runned before..
They could, but why would they? Establish trust. Then run away.
They could have stolen $1M.

Now they have $30M and the hardware. Many of you fell for it.

Total Orders (By last seen)        7678
   
Orders Tracked         227
Trade-In Orders         66
   
Units Sold   
   
Jalapeno SC            225
Single SC               231
Mini Rig SC               21
   
Extended TH   
   
Jalepeno SC       0.7875
Single SC             9.24
Mini Rig SC               21
   
Grand Total of   31.0275

I still trust them.
Really? What about that the CEO is a fraduster, sentenced to 3 years in prison and is currently released and violating the terms?

September 15, 2010

UNITED STATES OF AMERICA v. SONNY VLEISIDES

...
The defendant is hereby placed on supervised release, effective immediately, for a term of three years under the following terms and conditions:
...
The defendant shall not engage, as whole or partial owner, employee or otherwise, in any business involving loan programs, gambling or gaming activities, telemarketing activities, investment programs or any other business involving the solicitation of funds or cold-calls to customers without the express approval of the Probation Officer prior to engagement in such employment.

As always, I feel terribly sorry for all you guys.

Thanks. Was thinking of their merch, but had questions too.

[pinc]

did anyone take part in BFL's big holiday blowout??? i got a few things since the price was right. now if only they will arrive before it to late to use them 

I ordered one. Seems like a pretty good deal to me.

[Fiyasko]

did anyone take part in BFL's big holiday blowout??? i got a few things since the price was right. now if only they will arrive before it to late to use them  

I ordered one. Seems like a pretty good deal to me.

/facepalm

Order a Bitfury based ASIC, you can get 5gh/s @ 5watts for $350, And you'll have it shipped to you in <3days, it will arrive in <two weeks
Did i mention that they are compleatley silent and don't need a power brick?

[subseaguru]

did anyone take part in BFL's big holiday blowout??? i got a few things since the price was right. now if only they will arrive before it to late to use them  

I ordered one. Seems like a pretty good deal to me.

/facepalm

Order a Bitfury based ASIC, you can get 5gh/s @ 5watts for $350, And you'll have it shipped to you in <3days, it will arrive in <two weeks
Did i mention that they are compleatley silent and don't need a power brick?

i already have a few of the blue fury ASIC and its hit and miss. sometimes they work and sometimes they dont. at least not all at the same time. (and they are all on separate powered USB hubs.) im just not as trusting of the Bitfury, Bi-Fury or Blue/Red Fury as i am of the Chili's or Jala's that im using.

[xandriel]

Well, I can't really complain. I have 3 x 9.5 Ghs Jally's running happily. 2 separate orders, first was pre and took forever, but second one took just a few weeks.

[MasterDigit]

So you think your asic will give you positive ROI how fast?

[NuSalvo]

I was about to preorder a Monarch and then stumbled on these forums... after seeing the mass amounts of complaints and extremely long time, I opted for some cubes instead.  Anybody receive their late 2013 preorders yet?

[xandriel]

So you think your asic will give you positive ROI how fast?

ROI is a funny thing. So far I have paid about £1000 for my various miners (erupter usb, blades, and 3 jally), and have made over 3 btc...at today's price £2100.
However, if I calculate the ROI for any individual asic I am always seriously disappointed.

[Mtinie]

So you think your asic will give you positive ROI how fast?

ROI is a funny thing. So far I have paid about £1000 for my various miners (erupter usb, blades, and 3 jally), and have made over 3 btc...at today's price £2100.
However, if I calculate the ROI for any individual asic I am always seriously disappointed.

I'm in a similar boat -- I'm above break-even, but my ROI was significantly lower than what I'd imagined when I placed my order in April, 2013. All things considered, having my BFL's have given me the ability to mine and contribute back to the network. I'm still trying to decide if I'll just deprecate the units I have until they aren't worth running due to energy costs, or if it's better to sell them know second-hand.

Selling them gives me the chance to buy into coins directly... but there's just something addictive about running hardware to mine. I know, it's not rational, but oh well.

[sid7039]

SCAM
http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=bfl

[xandriel]

SCAM
http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=bfl

BFL = SCAM?

Yeah right, which is why the 3 jally I own have paid for themselves and returned a profit...and are still mining.
So, they sold gear that actually arrived and made me a profit, not a scam as far as I can see.

I guess you didn't actually purchase which I why you complain so much, or maybe you were so stupid that you believed you would be the only BTC miner in the world.

There is no scam here, some really poor customer service and over-pricing at times, but no scam.

[Searing]

SCAM
http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=bfl

BFL = SCAM?

Yeah right, which is why the 3 jally I own have paid for themselves and returned a profit...and are still mining.
So, they sold gear that actually arrived and made me a profit, not a scam as far as I can see.

I guess you didn't actually purchase which I why you complain so much, or maybe you were so stupid that you believed you would be the only BTC miner in the world.

There is no scam here, some really poor customer service and over-pricing at times, but no scam.

when did you get you units is the rub?

Searing

[dhavin]

Here I was about to order some stuff from them..

[Searing]

Here I was about to order some stuff from them..

run away...don't buy from BFL ....it is always the customers at risk ..no refunds after 45days and they are always 4months or more late it seems
at the best imho

.the only place that offers refunds up to shipping i know about is www.kncminer.com

but then again with the way difficulty is rising their batch 3 units (knc) along with everyone else around march..
may be iffy with all the difficulty increases people expect

from cointerra ...hopefully bfl (late as usual i expect end of march) ....bitfury..hashfast etc..they all may dump the same month heh

but again KNC refunds up to shipping so a guy could buy one and then bail.... i'd use usd thou not bitcoin as most of us expect it to rise

there may be other mnfg asic companies that do refunds but most don't...at least not after 45 days ...in knc's manner ...could be wrong none come to mind

truth be told at 810 usd for btc on stamp a person should probably take those $$$ and just get btc...with the expected difficulty rises soon may be safest

my 2c worth

Searing

 

[Inaba]

Here I was about to order some stuff from them..

run away...don't buy from BFL ....it is always the customers at risk ..no refunds after 45days and they are always 4months or more late it seems
at the best imho

.the only place that offers refunds up to shipping i know about is www.kncminer.com

but then again with the way difficulty is rising their batch 3 units (knc) along with everyone else around march..
may be iffy with all the difficulty increases people expect

from cointerra ...hopefully bfl (late as usual i expect end of march) ....bitfury..hashfast etc..they all may dump the same month heh

but again KNC refunds up to shipping so a guy could buy one and then bail.... i'd use usd thou not bitcoin as most of us expect it to rise

there may be other mnfg asic companies that do refunds but most don't...at least not after 45 days ...in knc's manner ...could be wrong none come to mind

truth be told at 810 usd for btc on stamp a person should probably take those $$$ and just get btc...with the expected difficulty rises soon may be safest

my 2c worth

Searing

 

Of course poor little Searing doesn't mention that fact that BFL has been shipping from stock for awhile now.  Order today get it in a few days kinda thing... lots of happy customers as far as that goes.  But Searing wouldn't want to mention that, because it makes him look like the whiny little brat he is.

[tylenol3mit]

Yeah, it could be a scam.

[Searing]

Here I was about to order some stuff from them..

run away...don't buy from BFL ....it is always the customers at risk ..no refunds after 45days and they are always 4months or more late it seems
at the best imho

.the only place that offers refunds up to shipping i know about is www.kncminer.com

but then again with the way difficulty is rising their batch 3 units (knc) along with everyone else around march..
may be iffy with all the difficulty increases people expect

from cointerra ...hopefully bfl (late as usual i expect end of march) ....bitfury..hashfast etc..they all may dump the same month heh

but again KNC refunds up to shipping so a guy could buy one and then bail.... i'd use usd thou not bitcoin as most of us expect it to rise

there may be other mnfg asic companies that do refunds but most don't...at least not after 45 days ...in knc's manner ...could be wrong none come to mind

truth be told at 810 usd for btc on stamp a person should probably take those $$$ and just get btc...with the expected difficulty rises soon may be safest

my 2c worth

Searing

 

Of course poor little Searing doesn't mention that fact that BFL has been shipping from stock for awhile now.  Order today get it in a few days kinda thing... lots of happy customers as far as that goes.  But Searing wouldn't want to mention that, because it makes him look like the whiny little brat he is.

you have ample opportunity to prove me wrong...get your monarchs out by the 1st of Feb as you claim...I don't have a bullet run order but my order is near the top of the batch after...and you are saying..the bfl reps/site anyway... that an order (monarch) today will get you a product in march...so...Feb 1st should be doable unless you are telling folks ordering now a lie about March....esp with the 40,000 unit number you toss around...so yeah......get me my unit 1st week of Feb or so.....say by the 7th....that should be fair with your current representations on monarch orders...so I can get ROI and I'm cutting you slack from your announcement when you told us about them and stated a December shipping date....it is unlikely I will get  them then or get ROI but if I get that I'll give you a 'wash' for last years troubles....in that at least you got on product out more or less in time......and my forced update for last years (april) order crawled to ROI...barely..ain't much but more then you got going for yourself on here now.....step up get them out the door on time!

if it drags out "again" into march as I expect..then you had no realistic expectations of getting any of the monarchs out and both your last product and this current product timelines we're at best 'wishes' on your part ...with NO RISK on BFL's part ..with your "no refund" policy....and thus you had it both ways..if by some miracle your timeline was correct so be it seems to be BFL's attitude .....if not then tough luck to the customers of both generations of asic's and it would seem to be pre-planned to be this sloppy from the get go....in that BFL is covered both ways...sloppy shipping times/results/timelines and promises we're all just 'hype" with little intention of success...

so yeah..get something out in a decent timeline and I may revise my opinion of you that ALL was rigged to BFL's favor or not you are at least TRYING to get something out the door with this lot of stuff..ie you learned something (conversations here on bitcointalk not withstanding)

but if you we're at my end of this conversation with BFL and as a customer with your "sunny disposition" I'm sure you'd be a lot more to say on all this then I ever have..and likely would be just as vocal as most on here as well...

thus the problem with you, bfl and such......it seems all rigged...your failures are carried by the customers....no internal checks/consequences...and you seem clueless to the responsibility and the repercussions of such

so prove me wrong get the dang product out.....the people that felt "forced to upgrade" to a monarch last year.....get at least ROI back so that effort on your part worked...

anyway I assume the above goal is what you want on all this.....a decent shipping time for the monarchs

I could say something more but in the spirit of fairness I'll let the results speak for themselves....

time will tell

Searing

[Fiyasko]

Here I was about to order some stuff from them..

run away...don't buy from BFL ....it is always the customers at risk ..no refunds after 45days and they are always 4months or more late it seems
at the best imho

Of course poor little Searing doesn't mention that fact that BFL has been shipping from stock for awhile now.  Order today get it in a few days kinda thing... lots of happy customers as far as that goes.  But Searing wouldn't want to mention that, because it makes him look like the whiny little brat he is.

Who the hell wants to order 65nm tech that will not ROI? That product is now a POS that is Garbage at it's current price.
Thats why he didn't mention it, It's because those stupid 65nm ASIC you have were 6-8 months late, and do not ROI now (at current price+difficulty growth rate)

"You forgot that we are shipping POS's to people that don't realise it's garbage", No, he chose not to mention this Failure
What happend to "USB Powered" "Passive heatsink" "Size of a HDD", You went WAY THE FUCK beyond your stated specifications and you're doing it again with the Monarch's.

Seriously, what the fuck is that Horrifying water cooling solution you've come up with? It nolonger fits the "formfactor of a standard GPU", It's gonna take up three slots now

And what the fuck is this?!

Hey Searing... since you think it's going to be a brick, I assume you won't mind if we deliver your unit last, right?  I mean, according to you, a brick is a brick, so if you get it at the end of the line you won't mind, right?

You were not forced in to anything. If you had taken delivery of your 65nm when you were up for it, you would have ROI'd and been in the black already.  You know it, I know it... everyone knows it.  You just want to whine and bitch because that's your hobby.  So please, by all means, cry some more... everyone loves hearing you whine.

Maybe not Forced, but Extorted is the perfect word, BFLiars did a great job pretending to have the first to ship ASIC's Stealing all the potential funds from the competition before they were ready, Before BFL was even ready, It was a clusterfuck of lies that resulted in a product that missed every specification by 300% and shipped 6-8 months late

BFL lied to make it seem that if you didn't order from them, You'd lose the "bitcoin race", Yet at the time of advertising "shipping next month", They had NOTHING

And OH!, If you "made a scene" about how much you disliked BFL, You would get a Forced refund.
Basically BFL Conned ALOT of people into being Invtestors with ZERO return. Think about it, They had nothing but lies till they took our money.

Like, What the fuck is BFL doing? Look at Inaba's fucking post, He's clearly going "I don't like you, so how about because of what you said im going to Fuck your paid order over, and shove you to the back of the line, regardless of when you paid, and when I told you to expect it to ship"

Oh, Lets not forget they've had a "F" BBB rating Twice, and they keep paying the BBB ponzi scheme to change thier rating.
Whats with the FCC CE ETL certified device that has NEVER had power run through it? (Red PCB Monarch prototype) It has no fucking wiring! Yet is FCC certified?!
BULLLL SHIIIITTTT