Butterflylabs Huge SCAM

[charleshoskinson]

Maybe one day the guys from BFL will announce they are Satoshi Nakamoto

I was totally thinking Josh was Gerald Casale from Devo:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jadvt7CbH1o

Because I tell you no one is ever going to get satisfaction with BFL.

[tondaS]

Let's see, I played 63 btc ($1299) for a single 13/14 months ago... a refund would pay me 10 btc at best. Excellent deal! I'll just hold out and Holt they deliver a 17 July order within 2 weeks...... where have I heard that before? Hahaha

So true. It is effectiely a scam because all I can do is wait and HOPE for delivery

[darkmule]

Maybe one day the guys from BFL will announce they are Satoshi Nakamoto

I was totally thinking Josh was Gerald Casale from Devo:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jadvt7CbH1o

Because I tell you no one is ever going to get satisfaction with BFL.

One of my favorite things about Devo is the best Devo song ever was actually written by Weird Al.  And this is it.  And I think BFL took the advice in it a little too seriously.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SMhwddNQSWQ

[darkmule]

Are you implying that we should file a class action lawsuit against BFL to win our money back and make Bitcoin look a little more organized?

I'm in!

Actually, no.  Unless you know good class action counsel.  Even to file such a suit, you generally need a lawyer with previous experience in such cases because just to get a class action lawsuit into a court, you need to certify both the class and the lawyer as being qualified to represent such a class. 

Also, in an alarming number of class action cases, the only ones who make any money out of it are the lawyers.  Class members get something ridiculous, like a buck or a bunch of coupons from the very company that ripped them off in the first place.  Do you want to wait a few years for a nickel or a certificate for $10 off a vaporware "Monarch" unit?

[Viceroy]

Head to the legal forum and look for M Santori... he takes bitcoin.

[terrapinflyer]

https://www.dropbox.com/s/eh22z6r1u8fzrdn/Screen%20Shot%202013-08-27%20at%202.05.41%20AM.png

Winning.

[TooDumbForBitcoin]

Based on today’s 8.83 minutes between found blocks …..
If Bitcoin value does not increase for 22 months, you will gross $544 from mining (including $0.03 on day 678), and pay $224 for electricity over the next 22 months, based on $0.06/kWh, 6W/Gh/s chip power draw, and 200W additional rig power draw.
Your $274 would be $574 22 months from now if you had bought BTC instead.
If Bitcoin value doubles every year, you will earn $671 from mining in the next 22 months, and your $274 would be worth $1288 had you bought BTC.
Your vendor owes you $222 today for your loss of network hashrate percentage between your order day and your delivery day.
Your vendor earned $26 in BTC over the 110-day shipping delay from the rise in BTC value over that period.
Your vendor earned $4.82 each day he tested your miner.

If you had received your miner the day after you bought it, you would gross $2500 in 22 months from mining, assuming no rise in BTC value over those 22 months.

EDIT:  Show electricity assumptions, clarify gross mining earnings, add one-day delivery earnings.

[GpuWorks]

They have shipped units, how is it a scam lol

But they shipped after 1 year. Do you think it is ok for any product delivery?

[CoinsMiner]

Although they are delivering the devices but they actually scammed with us. When we paid for our devices difficulty of BTC was low but now it is very very high.

[m3sSh3aD]

Maybe someone can help with this

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=283081.0

I'm interested to see if they are actually stopping people from signing up AND HIDING THREADS! Seem's pretty conclusive from where im sitting!

[QuestionAuthority]

https://www.dropbox.com/s/eh22z6r1u8fzrdn/Screen%20Shot%202013-08-27%20at%202.05.41%20AM.png

Winning.

Fucking idiot.

rofl

[Ytterbium]

https://www.dropbox.com/s/eh22z6r1u8fzrdn/Screen%20Shot%202013-08-27%20at%202.05.41%20AM.png

Winning.

Fucking idiot.

Huh?  They got a refund on a jalapeno, how does that make them an idiot?

[FloridaBear]

Sorry Floridabear, your math is off.  At $0.15 kw/h power cost, a Single is still profitable to a worthwhile degree even at 900 million difficulty.  It's going to be a bit of time before we see 900 million difficulty, from 19 million now.

You really have to define "a bit of time." I defined it clearly in my post, and my math is not off based on the assumptions I posted. Please don't accuse me of being wrong when I provide all of the assumptions I used for the calculations, unless you've done the math with those assumptions yourself (and you can prove I did them wrong).

My math is correct according to the assumptions I gave and I stand by it. A 50 GH single will only ever produce about 28 BTC ($2800) if delivered in September and my assumptions prove correct.

If you want to argue about 18% increases every retarget being too pessimistic from Sept '13 to March '14 (when all currently available BFL devices become unprofitable at $0.11/KWh) , that's fine, but don't just say "your math is off." However, I don't think 18% is at all unreasonable. When GPUs were rolling out, we saw difficulty go from 19 to 9000 in about 5 months. And that's an order of magnitude greater than the change we're talking about (19M to 900M). If ASICs come on line at that rate, we'll be at 9 billion by February (except that none are profitable there, so it won't happen). But I don't think 900M is unreasonable by Jan 1. Granted we will see some leveling off after that as less efficient ASICs become unprofitable. But if 28 nm products are real and rolling out, they will quickly obsolete everything less efficient. This is a pretty inevitable path we're going down.

My entire point is that delays are extremely costly going forward. Progress is relentless.

Damn, I hate being right all the time. Well, actually, I wasn't "right"--I was too optimistic. A 50 GH single delivered in September now only will make about $1600 over its useful (but unprofitable) life.

We will almost certainly hit 900M difficulty in January.

There is now no profitable BFL device that you can currently order, assuming a 1 month or longer wait. That includes Monarch.

Of course, there isn't any profitable ASIC that you can currently order, as far as I can tell. If you can get an ASICMINER blade, that might make a few BTC.

[QuestionAuthority]

Sorry Floridabear, your math is off.  At $0.15 kw/h power cost, a Single is still profitable to a worthwhile degree even at 900 million difficulty.  It's going to be a bit of time before we see 900 million difficulty, from 19 million now.

You really have to define "a bit of time." I defined it clearly in my post, and my math is not off based on the assumptions I posted. Please don't accuse me of being wrong when I provide all of the assumptions I used for the calculations, unless you've done the math with those assumptions yourself (and you can prove I did them wrong).

My math is correct according to the assumptions I gave and I stand by it. A 50 GH single will only ever produce about 28 BTC ($2800) if delivered in September and my assumptions prove correct.

If you want to argue about 18% increases every retarget being too pessimistic from Sept '13 to March '14 (when all currently available BFL devices become unprofitable at $0.11/KWh) , that's fine, but don't just say "your math is off." However, I don't think 18% is at all unreasonable. When GPUs were rolling out, we saw difficulty go from 19 to 9000 in about 5 months. And that's an order of magnitude greater than the change we're talking about (19M to 900M). If ASICs come on line at that rate, we'll be at 9 billion by February (except that none are profitable there, so it won't happen). But I don't think 900M is unreasonable by Jan 1. Granted we will see some leveling off after that as less efficient ASICs become unprofitable. But if 28 nm products are real and rolling out, they will quickly obsolete everything less efficient. This is a pretty inevitable path we're going down.

My entire point is that delays are extremely costly going forward. Progress is relentless.

Damn, I hate being right all the time. Well, actually, I wasn't "right"--I was too optimistic. A 50 GH single delivered in September now only will make about $1600 over its useful (but unprofitable) life.

We will almost certainly hit 900M difficulty in January.

There is now no profitable BFL device that you can currently order, assuming a 1 month or longer wait. That includes Monarch.

Of course, there isn't any profitable ASIC that you can currently order, as far as I can tell. If you can get an ASICMINER blade, that might make a few BTC.

And the laughs just keep on coming!

[m3sSh3aD]

Get this one, I got in bfl labs forum for a moment in the end. I went to the thread where someone as had there bit stamp & my box accounts hacked. I wanted to post about oclhashcat which can crack up to 55 character (not letter) pass codes in less than 2 days on a ati 6990! Yes, that means it can brute force just about anything! Its a total game changer in many ways!

Anyways, I proceeded to post but it wouldn't let me. I guess when bfl go home they turn the auto mod up! Anyways, I went onto the shout box and said about oclhashcat and I was then abused by Ivan and grbgr.... whatever this fools name is. Not only did they not want to listen to some good advice but they continued to slander and banned me for basically wanting to help the dude who had his accounts hacked!

When you got arse lickking mis information spreading shit spreaders like these, who needs to moderate the forums! A miriade ofbrainwashed zombies everywhere! Why do iI always feel I'm a really the main character in walking dead these day? O right yes, cause I'm surrounded by sheeple!

Word of warning though, oclhashcat is some serious bit of software! The only way avoid it is none traditional characters!!!

You've been warned!

[Frizz23]

[DoNotMineD]

Accepting pre-order is legit but their delivery time is very very long. So, I think we can declare that, they are scam.

[Coin4Future]

I don't think they scammed with anyone. They are delivering all products now.

[darkmule]

[01BTC10]

Get this one, I got in bfl labs forum for a moment in the end. I went to the thread where someone as had there bit stamp & my box accounts hacked. I wanted to post about oclhashcat which can crack up to 55 character (not letter) pass codes in less than 2 days on a ati 6990! Yes, that means it can brute force just about anything! Its a total game changer in many ways!

lol cracking outdated MD5 hash maybe. Have fun with modern SHA2 and bcrypt hash. You also need to  find a vulnerability on the website to get the password hash in the first place. Odds are that his computer was simply infected with a keylogger.