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Author Topic: [1500 TH] p2pool: Decentralized, DoS-resistant, Hop-Proof pool  (Read 2030069 times)
bitpop
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January 28, 2014, 05:35:45 AM
 #7601

So to setup my AntMiner S1 on a p2pool node I just select any from the list here: http://p2pool-nodes.info and then how do I create the miner for one of these pools?

You can choose second from the top node - http://lenny.dnsd.me:9332, I am this node operator. 2nd largest p2pool node online with 3TH/s onboard. It's very well connected and have higher chance for valid share than other nodes (less orphans). Running unmodified p2pool software on dedicated server. Anyone is invited to try my node.

Is this you? http://www.reddit.com/r/itslenny/

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January 28, 2014, 10:20:14 AM
 #7602

So to setup my AntMiner S1 on a p2pool node I just select any from the list here: http://p2pool-nodes.info and then how do I create the miner for one of these pools?

You can choose second from the top node - http://lenny.dnsd.me:9332, I am this node operator. 2nd largest p2pool node online with 3TH/s onboard. It's very well connected and have higher chance for valid share than other nodes (less orphans). Running unmodified p2pool software on dedicated server. Anyone is invited to try my node.

Is this you? http://www.reddit.com/r/itslenny/

No, it's not me. Also, this LennyCoin thing is not mine, just a coincidence with name;)
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January 29, 2014, 09:04:34 AM
 #7603

The current luck is painful...

roy7
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January 30, 2014, 01:51:22 AM
 #7604

Ok so I just amused and entertained myself by reading the past ~5 months of posts in this topic. I have some thoughts if anyone would care to comment and some questions at the end, and a thought experiment on setting the miner difficulty level to maximize keeping smaller miners in the share chain.



Setting up a vanilla public node as a pseudo-pool for people who don't want (or can't) run their own p2pool is kinda a waste of time. There are plenty of good ones already. I toyed with the idea of setting up a pool about 8 months back but getting enough hash to join to actually find blocks didn't seem realistic. I ended up setting up a TRC pool instead, which was fun. (I took HHTT's sockthing pool software, wrote a DGM payment algorithm for it, and set that up for in-coinbase payment for all fees like Eligius which was one of my inspirations to set up a pool. Then I had to code a front end from scratch. At the time I knew very little about p2pool.)

Setting up a new BTC pool these days either means you have tons of hash power of your own, or hooking into p2pool's existing hash power to reduce local miner variance. But even setting up a latency routed network of nodes so people are directed to the nearest one to them doesn't matter much, since they likely already use a public node already that is "near" them with low latency already. (I was thinking about, just as a fun project, setting up 8 public nodes in each of Amazon's data centers around the world and latency routing people to the fastest one for them.)

To make setting up a public node have some sort of purpose, what you need to provide is something of value compared to other centralized pools. This could be anything from paying merged mining to the miners, improved stats/graphs/info, worker offline notifications, some sort of value added thing like multipool's coin switching, a system for reduced variance for small miners, etc. Since many nodes already run at a low to zero fee, it boils down to providing non-financial value added services or features?



Are shares on the p2pool share chain limited to only a single payment address? If so, is this an intentional design decision?

If not, it seems if a node wanted to run as a mini-pool to help smaller miners they could track stats however they choose to internally but put all of the pending payment info for their miners into the share being worked on. So if the share is found, all miners are paid their portions of the node's share (as if the node had collected the payment itself then re-paid it out). There's still the trust issue about calculating the amounts due to each local miner, but you keep the coinbase payout feature and smaller miners get paid with less variance since the share isn't limited to only the one miner that found it. Coins are also never held by the node, which helps reduce hacker incentive. (Coinbase payouts was a core design goal of my TRC pool. I never, ever, wanted to be holding someone else's money.)

This would also mean a share being worked on could include the pool fee (-f) with each share found, at the exact amount, instead of taking that % of shares in full. ie: If you run -f 1 and miner A finds a share, the share you send out to the network has payments of 99% of the total to Miner A and 1% of the total to the pool payment address. I'd think this would be much more intuitive to the node operator/miners/etc, and I'm guessing the only reason it doesn't work this way is that the share chain restricts each share to a single payment address?



Also, a question / thought. Did anything ever come of lenny_'s suggestion to increase a large miners difficulty higher so they only find (at most, on average) one share every hour? Personally I'd suggest cranking that up even higher as a default. The miner can override it back down with /diff if they insist. The purpose of this is to try and allow more, smaller, miners to fit into the share chain. By lowering global share difficultly, as well as individual miners having less total blocks. I realize the 1.67% or so adjustment is already in there but that's still 149 shares out of 8640. How little variance does a large miner actually need in reality? As long as you are on the share chain you are getting paid each time a block is found.

1 giant fat share is as good as 149 shares that add up to the same amount. It just smooths your payments out, between when giant fat share drops off and the next giant fat share comes on. I wouldn't suggest trying to actually scale large miners to only have 1 share every 3 days (they would in effect be more similar to how small miners are today then). But if we were to say that 6 large shares on the chain on average is enough to give them acceptably low payment variance (I'm pulling this number out of the air so I have someplace to start), then that frees up 143 shares for other miners...

Organofconti can chime in with his real math-fu if he likes (please do!), but as far as I can reverse engineer from my pool's stats calculations the magic would be this (we want to target a share every 12 hours on average, to aim for 6 blocks in the share chain)

Average time to find a block (share) in minutes = Difficulty * pow(2,32) / Hashrate / 60

720 Minutes * 60 * Hashrate / pow(2,32) = Difficulty

So given a worker's average hashrate, set their difficulty to the above.

For an example I took the biggest miner on the biggest public node. Their hash rate is reporting as 3142484404906. (3.1 TH) Share difficulty is at 651000. Right now their average time to find a share is:

652000 * 2^32 / 3142484404906 / 60 = 14.85 minutes

I don't know what local difficulty p2pool is serving them, but it should be higher than 652000 so they will only end up with around 1.67% of the shares. They will get about twice that if they are only getting difficulty 652000 work.

Solve for 1 block every 12 hours on average:

(720 * 60 ) * 3142484404906 / 2^32 = 31608000 Difficulty

So if we give this 3.1TH miner 31608000 difficulty work, his average time is 720 minutes (12 Hours)

50% CDF = (31608000 * -ln(1.0 - .50) ) * 2^32 / 3142484404906 / 60 = 499 minutes (8.31 Hours)
95% CDF = (31608000 * -ln(1.0 - .95) ) * 2^32 / 3142484404906 / 60 = 2156 minutes (35.93 Hours)
99% CDF = (31608000 * -ln(1.0 - .99) ) * 2^32 / 3142484404906 / 60 = 3315 minutes (55.25 Hours)
99.752% CDF = (31608000 * -ln(1.0 - .99752) ) * 2^32 / 3142484404906 / 60 / 60 = 4319.64 Minutes (71.99 Hours)

Which means, given 72 hours of work at this hash rate and miner difficulty level (the time it takes for the share chain to be totally new, correct?) the miner will fail to have found at least 1 share only .348% of the time. And as long as they have at least 1 share in the chain (at this way higher difficultly level) they are still getting paid on every block the p2pool network finds. The amount of payment will have some variance (since there are so few total shares), but whether or not they get paid at all is a virtually zero chance of getting nothing.

Obviously if 6 shares is too few or the .348% risk of having no shares in the chain too high, it can be adjusted however you want. But do even medium size miners need 10+ shares per day on the chain? Does a giant miner need 149 shares?

RoyalMiningCo: Pools retired. Was fun!
mvalley
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January 30, 2014, 02:25:03 AM
 #7605

The current luck is painful...

Yeah, I was used to the 1-2 pay outs per day...
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January 30, 2014, 02:39:22 AM
 #7606

Obviously if 6 shares is too few or the .348% risk of having no shares in the chain too high, it can be adjusted however you want. But do even medium size miners need 10+ shares per day on the chain? Does a giant miner need 149 shares?

As tiny followup, say we want the 3.1 TH miner to have a .01% chance of having 0 shares in a 72 hour period. Don't want him to be upset. Wink Difficulty 20590000 does that.

(20590000 * -ln(1.0 - .9999) ) * 2^32 / 3142484404906 / 60 / 60 = 71.99 Hours

Average time to find a share:

20590000 * 2^32 / 3142484404906 / 60 = 469 Minutes (7.81 Hours)

Or about 9.2 shares on the sharechain. A savings of 140 shares while keeping the risk of big miners getting no payment at all effectively at zero. (Just more variance in how much their actual payments are, to help lower variance for smaller miners.)

Edit: I didn't consider the orphan/DOA rate in p2pool's sharechain network. If you only submit a small # of giant shares, and one of them is orphaned, that could actually end up a sizable blow to your income?

RoyalMiningCo: Pools retired. Was fun!
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January 30, 2014, 04:58:06 PM
 #7607

Other than port 9333 and 9332 is there any other ports that need to be opened on the firewall?

I find when I had one of my miners using my external IP that the table under the hashing table would not update, as soon as I set my miner to the LAN IP of my pool and connected it to my LAN the table updates. Last night I moved my miner off site and its now pointed to the external IP and the table isn't updating. Though the hashing table above it is updating. So I wonder if this is a bug or if I need to open some other port to allow the table to properly update?

Thanks,

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January 30, 2014, 05:25:06 PM
 #7608

Other than port 9333 and 9332 is there any other ports that need to be opened on the firewall?

I find when I had one of my miners using my external IP that the table under the hashing table would not update, as soon as I set my miner to the LAN IP of my pool and connected it to my LAN the table updates. Last night I moved my miner off site and its now pointed to the external IP and the table isn't updating. Though the hashing table above it is updating. So I wonder if this is a bug or if I need to open some other port to allow the table to properly update?

Thanks,



No try ctrl f5

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smoothrunnings
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January 30, 2014, 06:58:12 PM
 #7609

Other than port 9333 and 9332 is there any other ports that need to be opened on the firewall?

I find when I had one of my miners using my external IP that the table under the hashing table would not update, as soon as I set my miner to the LAN IP of my pool and connected it to my LAN the table updates. Last night I moved my miner off site and its now pointed to the external IP and the table isn't updating. Though the hashing table above it is updating. So I wonder if this is a bug or if I need to open some other port to allow the table to properly update?

Thanks,



No try ctrl f5

Doesn't change.

Check it yourself.. p2pool.smoothrunnings.ca:9332
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January 30, 2014, 11:56:51 PM
 #7610

Is the opening of ports 9333 and 9332 on the firewall only TCP or does UDP need to be open as well?

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January 31, 2014, 12:46:40 AM
 #7611

Is the opening of ports 9333 and 9332 on the firewall only TCP or does UDP need to be open as well?

No, just TCP
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January 31, 2014, 01:34:13 AM
 #7612

Is the opening of ports 9333 and 9332 on the firewall only TCP or does UDP need to be open as well?

No, just TCP

Then I am not sure why the bitcoin graph on one of my miners doesn't update when the miner is outside my network, but it does update when the miner is inside the network. The hashing graph works while the miner is inside and or outside the network?

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January 31, 2014, 01:43:07 AM
 #7613

Is the opening of ports 9333 and 9332 on the firewall only TCP or does UDP need to be open as well?

No, just TCP

Then I am not sure why the bitcoin graph on one of my miners doesn't update when the miner is outside my network, but it does update when the miner is inside the network. The hashing graph works while the miner is inside and or outside the network?

Almost certainly some other kind of network configuration problem.  Firewall still not right, bad gateway, netmask, etc.
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January 31, 2014, 02:33:01 AM
 #7614

Is the opening of ports 9333 and 9332 on the firewall only TCP or does UDP need to be open as well?

No, just TCP

Then I am not sure why the bitcoin graph on one of my miners doesn't update when the miner is outside my network, but it does update when the miner is inside the network. The hashing graph works while the miner is inside and or outside the network?

Almost certainly some other kind of network configuration problem.  Firewall still not right, bad gateway, netmask, etc.

Well all I can think of is that there is some extra port that needs to be opened for the traffic to be allowed in as it works inside the LAN, but only hashing works from the outside, not the bitcoin graph which is supposedly related to shares according to someone else on github, if that's the case than why would miner get shares inside the network but not from the outside connection?
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January 31, 2014, 08:05:04 PM
 #7615

Anybody care to answer my question?

i've setup my node and iam hashing with two ants and everything went well execpt my fee setting doesnt seem to work.

Code:
python run_p2pool.py --fee 1.0 --address 18SeaFycUrSprGT7VejWTNhRaRP4Nf5Mgx

the address mentioned is on its own wallet, the income from the ants goes to another wallet. so it can not be an wallet feature. :-)
what iam doing wrong?

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January 31, 2014, 08:09:32 PM
 #7616

Anybody care to answer my question?

i've setup my node and iam hashing with two ants and everything went well execpt my fee setting doesnt seem to work.

Code:
python run_p2pool.py --fee 1.0 --address 18SeaFycUrSprGT7VejWTNhRaRP4Nf5Mgx

the address mentioned is on its own wallet, the income from the ants goes to another wallet. so it can not be an wallet feature. :-)
what iam doing wrong?


Nothing you must wait. Be patient Smiley

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roy7
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January 31, 2014, 08:10:22 PM
 #7617

Anybody care to answer my question?

i've setup my node and iam hashing with two ants and everything went well execpt my fee setting doesnt seem to work.

Code:
python run_p2pool.py --fee 1.0 --address 18SeaFycUrSprGT7VejWTNhRaRP4Nf5Mgx

the address mentioned is on its own wallet, the income from the ants goes to another wallet. so it can not be an wallet feature. :-)
what iam doing wrong?


Remember that p2pool isn't set up to pay the fee on a per-block basis. What happen is 1% of your pool's shares will be paid in full to that address, and 99% of the pool's shares will go to the miner's address. If you just recently started it up, is it possible you haven't found enough shares for the 1% to end up in the pool's name yet?

RoyalMiningCo: Pools retired. Was fun!
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January 31, 2014, 08:22:16 PM
 #7618

Anybody care to answer my question?

i've setup my node and iam hashing with two ants and everything went well execpt my fee setting doesnt seem to work.

Code:
python run_p2pool.py --fee 1.0 --address 18SeaFycUrSprGT7VejWTNhRaRP4Nf5Mgx

the address mentioned is on its own wallet, the income from the ants goes to another wallet. so it can not be an wallet feature. :-)
what iam doing wrong?


Remember that p2pool isn't set up to pay the fee on a per-block basis. What happen is 1% of your pool's shares will be paid in full to that address, and 99% of the pool's shares will go to the miner's address. If you just recently started it up, is it possible you haven't found enough shares for the 1% to end up in the pool's name yet?

thank you both for your answer but i am not sure if i understand you correctly. i am mining on the node since 5 days or the last three blocks were found and this could be a to short timeframe? because the 1% is calculated on the whole p2pool submited shares and not 1% of my miners shares?

roy7
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January 31, 2014, 08:27:08 PM
 #7619

thank you both for your answer but i am not sure if i understand you correctly. i am mining on the node since 5 days or the last three blocks were found and this could be a to short timeframe? because the 1% is calculated on the whole p2pool submited shares and not 1% of my miners shares?

I guess it depends on how many total shares your node has found. That's the % that relates to node fee payment. For example, if in the last 5 days you found 200 shares, then about 2 of them should be in the node's name and 198 in the miner's name. Apologies for sometime saying "pool" instead of "node", I tend to think of nodes as pools, but that is confusing. Wink


RoyalMiningCo: Pools retired. Was fun!
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January 31, 2014, 08:41:12 PM
 #7620

thank you both for your answer but i am not sure if i understand you correctly. i am mining on the node since 5 days or the last three blocks were found and this could be a to short timeframe? because the 1% is calculated on the whole p2pool submited shares and not 1% of my miners shares?

I guess it depends on how many total shares your node has found. That's the % that relates to node fee payment. For example, if in the last 5 days you found 200 shares, then about 2 of them should be in the node's name and 198 in the miner's name. Apologies for sometime saying "pool" instead of "node", I tend to think of nodes as pools, but that is confusing. Wink



hehe no problem, i think it is clear now. i havnt found enough shares then. so to get a payout of 1% of the shares i have to submit no less than 100 valid shares from this node. thank you very much! :-)

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