[DVC]DevCoin - Official Thread - Moderated

[realdantreccia]

The recent interest in Devcoin was obviously sparked by Dan Treccia’s Medium articles. Other than calling him names nobody has refuted his theory. Can MarkM or Unthinkingbit comment on his research regarding DVC, here I primarily refer to https://medium.com/@danieltreccia/devcoins-are-bitcoins-newly-generated-coins-66ef6795fe39

My name is actually Mark S. Miller.

[1714233854]

1714233854

[Vlad2Vlad]

The recent interest in Devcoin was obviously sparked by Dan Treccia’s Medium articles. Other than calling him names nobody has refuted his theory. Can MarkM or Unthinkingbit comment on his research regarding DVC, here I primarily refer to https://medium.com/@danieltreccia/devcoins-are-bitcoins-newly-generated-coins-66ef6795fe39

My name is actually Mark S. Miller.

Wut??   

You’re missing some high grade on-topic conversations in the DVC telegram group. 

[ctya]

The recent interest in Devcoin was obviously sparked by Dan Treccia’s Medium articles. Other than calling him names nobody has refuted his theory. Can MarkM or Unthinkingbit comment on his research regarding DVC, here I primarily refer to https://medium.com/@danieltreccia/devcoins-are-bitcoins-newly-generated-coins-66ef6795fe39

Hello DeVCoin community!

Coinwarz stopped tracking DeVCoin in 2016
Several exchanges and mining pools use the Coinwarz API for up-to-date exchange data.
We need to get this back.  It will help us get more exchanges and pools to support DeVCoin.

Let Coinwarz know you want DeVCoin tracked!   

Fill out the contact form https://www.coinwarz.com/contact

...and visit the page to get the visitor stats up.  https://www.coinwarz.com/cryptocurrency/coins/devcoin

Cheers!

ctya

[Qtera]

The recent interest in Devcoin was obviously sparked by Dan Treccia’s Medium articles. Other than calling him names nobody has refuted his theory. Can MarkM or Unthinkingbit comment on his research regarding DVC, here I primarily refer to https://medium.com/@danieltreccia/devcoins-are-bitcoins-newly-generated-coins-66ef6795fe39

Hello DeVCoin community!

Coinwarz stopped tracking DeVCoin in 2016
Several exchanges and mining pools use the Coinwarz API for up-to-date exchange data.
We need to get this back.  It will help us get more exchanges and pools to support DeVCoin.

Let Coinwarz know you want DeVCoin tracked!   

Fill out the contact form https://www.coinwarz.com/contact

...and visit the page to get the visitor stats up.  https://www.coinwarz.com/cryptocurrency/coins/devcoin

Cheers!

ctya

Done ctya! Thank you for bring this up!

[kurbeks]

Does devcoin have discord?

[realdantreccia]

The recent interest in Devcoin was obviously sparked by Dan Treccia’s Medium articles. Other than calling him names nobody has refuted his theory. Can MarkM or Unthinkingbit comment on his research regarding DVC, here I primarily refer to https://medium.com/@danieltreccia/devcoins-are-bitcoins-newly-generated-coins-66ef6795fe39

Hello DeVCoin community!

Coinwarz stopped tracking DeVCoin in 2016
Several exchanges and mining pools use the Coinwarz API for up-to-date exchange data.
We need to get this back.  It will help us get more exchanges and pools to support DeVCoin.

Let Coinwarz know you want DeVCoin tracked!   

Fill out the contact form https://www.coinwarz.com/contact

...and visit the page to get the visitor stats up.  https://www.coinwarz.com/cryptocurrency/coins/devcoin

Cheers!

ctya

Just filled out form and visited.  Good luck.

[logictense]

The recent interest in Devcoin was obviously sparked by Dan Treccia’s Medium articles. Other than calling him names nobody has refuted his theory. Can MarkM or Unthinkingbit comment on his research regarding DVC, here I primarily refer to https://medium.com/@danieltreccia/devcoins-are-bitcoins-newly-generated-coins-66ef6795fe39

He seems to be a loony. Utterly weird utterly wrong "theories".

At least if you're still on about the same guy who rants about IXCoin secretly creating bitcoins and weird stuff like that?

-MarkM-

Yeah but, you're Canadian and I own a boatload of "DeVCoin" so you're utterly screwed.

A boatload of DVC? Is it not basically a dead project? I mean, can you point an article on a major newspaper, exchanges, shops accepting it, etc.. And the price? Still 0.000000? I don’t get it

Theres an exchange though. Vicrurex. I dont like how retarded idiot realdantreccia worded it. Reading his post makes me wanna get a seizure and fall dead. What kind of word is this? Saying that u got a boatload of something is more retarded than pitching ur catheter off the genitalia and using it as thunderbolt cord for ur iphone. The second thing I want to add is Im out on vacation thereby this thread will not be monitored my eyeballs.

[realdantreccia]

The recent interest in Devcoin was obviously sparked by Dan Treccia’s Medium articles. Other than calling him names nobody has refuted his theory. Can MarkM or Unthinkingbit comment on his research regarding DVC, here I primarily refer to https://medium.com/@danieltreccia/devcoins-are-bitcoins-newly-generated-coins-66ef6795fe39

He seems to be a loony. Utterly weird utterly wrong "theories".

At least if you're still on about the same guy who rants about IXCoin secretly creating bitcoins and weird stuff like that?

-MarkM-

Yeah but, you're Canadian and I own a boatload of "DeVCoin" so you're utterly screwed.

A boatload of DVC? Is it not basically a dead project? I mean, can you point an article on a major newspaper, exchanges, shops accepting it, etc.. And the price? Still 0.000000? I don’t get it

Theres an exchange though. Vicrurex. I dont like how retarded idiot realdantreccia worded it. Reading his post makes me wanna get a seizure and fall dead. What kind of word is this? Saying that u got a boatload of something is more retarded than pitching ur catheter off the genitalia and using it as thunderbolt cord for ur iphone. The second thing I want to add is Im out on vacation thereby this thread will not be monitored my eyeballs.

Maybe you need to take more vacations.

[Unthinkingbit]

Taxes on crypto are getting too complicated and dangerous:
https://www.reddit.com/r/tax/comments/9tcnu8/did_i_ruin_my_life_by_trading_crypto/

The problems are the following:

1. The tax code for crypto is ambiguous, there is no widely agreed upon way to calculate taxes.
2. When exchanges fail, the trading information is lost, so it can be impossible to calculate trading gains and losses.
3. Accounting fees can be very high for crypto trading, sometimes more than the actual money made.
4. It is possible to owe more in taxes than was actually cashed out.
5. The rules change, and some of those changes are retroactive, so even if taxes are filed correctly today, in future tax collectors can claim that the taxes were not filed correctly and impose arbitrary penalties.

Devcoin is worth very little, but the accounting fees and risks are still high. It's a lot of hassle for little gain.

Because of this, unfortunately, I am going to resign from devcoin, until taxes are simplified or there's a big tax free cryptocoin jurisdiction, which I don't expect to happen for a long time if ever.

I don't want anyone to get in trouble because of something I'm doing or developing. I'll do the accounting for round 94, after that devcoin developers can handle the receiver files however they want.

I'm sorry for leaving. I wish there was another way, but I don't see one.

[Vlad2Vlad]

When moon,when tesla?

Dan said - soon, imminent and now - last year.  I think he just wants to fit in. 

Sorry to see you go unthinkingbit, you’re a good person and a good dev.

[ctya]

Taxes on crypto are getting too complicated and dangerous:
https://www.reddit.com/r/tax/comments/9tcnu8/did_i_ruin_my_life_by_trading_crypto/

The problems are the following:

1. The tax code for crypto is ambiguous, there is no widely agreed upon way to calculate taxes.
2. When exchanges fail, the trading information is lost, so it can be impossible to calculate trading gains and losses.
3. Accounting fees can be very high for crypto trading, sometimes more than the actual money made.
4. It is possible to owe more in taxes than was actually cashed out.
5. The rules change, and some of those changes are retroactive, so even if taxes are filed correctly today, in future tax collectors can claim that the taxes were not filed correctly and impose arbitrary penalties.

Devcoin is worth very little, but the accounting fees and risks are still high. It's a lot of hassle for little gain.

Because of this, unfortunately, I am going to resign from devcoin, until taxes are simplified or there's a big tax free cryptocoin jurisdiction, which I don't expect to happen for a long time if ever.

I don't want anyone to get in trouble because of something I'm doing or developing. I'll do the accounting for round 94, after that devcoin developers can handle the receiver files however they want.

I'm sorry for leaving. I wish there was another way, but I don't see one.

Unthinkingbit,

You are much revered and much appreciated in the DeVCoin community.  Thank you for all of your service to this project for so many years.
Since this decision is tax-driven, is it possible you can continue until the end of your current tax year?
The additional time will allow us to communicate and vote of the options available for continuation of the receiver file functions.

ctya

[weisoq]

Taxes on crypto are getting too complicated and dangerous ...

...Devcoin is worth very little, but the accounting fees and risks are still high. It's a lot of hassle for little gain.
Because of this, unfortunately, I am going to resign from devcoin

Thanks for your efforts UTB, and for what was a promising idea.

You're right in inferring that many don't properly consider tax issues. I was careful about where and how traded but it still took a long time to collate past info to calculate potential liability. Not something I want to do again (or even could do given how many exchanges have disappeared) and it's one reason I don't play any more.

All the best

[MarketMagic]

I'm sorry for leaving. I wish there was another way, but I don't see one.

Sorry to hear this and good luck with future.Will Devcoin project survive in your opinion?

[FuzzyBear]

Taxes on crypto are getting too complicated and dangerous:
https://www.reddit.com/r/tax/comments/9tcnu8/did_i_ruin_my_life_by_trading_crypto/

The problems are the following:

1. The tax code for crypto is ambiguous, there is no widely agreed upon way to calculate taxes.
2. When exchanges fail, the trading information is lost, so it can be impossible to calculate trading gains and losses.
3. Accounting fees can be very high for crypto trading, sometimes more than the actual money made.
4. It is possible to owe more in taxes than was actually cashed out.
5. The rules change, and some of those changes are retroactive, so even if taxes are filed correctly today, in future tax collectors can claim that the taxes were not filed correctly and impose arbitrary penalties.

Devcoin is worth very little, but the accounting fees and risks are still high. It's a lot of hassle for little gain.

Because of this, unfortunately, I am going to resign from devcoin, until taxes are simplified or there's a big tax free cryptocoin jurisdiction, which I don't expect to happen for a long time if ever.

I don't want anyone to get in trouble because of something I'm doing or developing. I'll do the accounting for round 94, after that devcoin developers can handle the receiver files however they want.

I'm sorry for leaving. I wish there was another way, but I don't see one.

Sorry to hear you are leaving us Unthinkingbit, your work and devotion to devcoin will be missed but I want to say a huge thank you for all your efforts over the years and completely understandable your decision to step down now rather than getting into trouble with the tax man further down the road.

If there is anything we can do as a community to help the transition of you leaving please let us know.

Many thanks again

Fuzzybear

[Wekkel]

Also a big thank you from me. You've made a great contribution to Devcoin.

[realdantreccia]

Someone call Bahrain I hear they have a carousel full of funds for us.

[Vlad2Vlad]

Someone call Bahrain I hear they have a carousel full of funds for us.

Imminent!

[markm]

Hmm does anyone else remember when politicians were talking about taxing things like magick swords in online fantasy games?

The argument was that since someone managed to sell such a sword on E-bay, everyone who obtained such a sword in such a game should pay tax on it.

Which of course is insane since past performance is no proof of future performance so it was not even known whether anyone would ever manage to find a buyer for such a sword again, let alone at such a price.

Thus really it only makes any sense to measure how much fiat currency you pay to play online games (such as altcoin trading games as well as other games, whether or not the game itself includes various currencies of its own) and how much fiat currency you end up taking home at such time as you manage to sell some of your game "stuff" for fiat.

Until you actually get fiat back to a bank account or physical cash or something held by some kind of licensed or registered (and insured) "custodian" you really don't have a thing.

Even if you get cryptocoins home into a wallet of your own where you are the only person who has the keys you still don't really have a thing, since as we have seen over and over and over again you cannot know whether you will ever manage to sell any of it for any fiat.

It is all basically just virtual crap, game stuff, that might or might not ever have a buyer. Finding a buyer might even involve a lot of marketing on our part, or bribing a so called "exchange" to "list" the thing and then hoping the "exchange" isn't just going to run off with it all.

You could have billions of magick swords, but what is the chance you will be able to sell them all? And how much will the last few be worth once you have flooded such market as there might be with the first few billions of them? It is all just virtual crap until you receive something "real", which let's face it you might never do.

Sure it makes sense that the guy who sold one magick sword on E-bay pay tax on that income. If playing the game it was in was a business rather than a hobby to him he probably should also be declaring whatever he had to pay to play the game, probably including some portion of his internet connection fees, as business expense. But how many magick swords he ever had, how many dragons he had to kill to get it, and even whether he actually got it by trading a magick shield for it in the game, is crazy to even try to keep track of.

One by one maybe some ultra-special cryptocoins might end up being regarded as in some sense "real money", but even bitcoin might not be there yet and certainly the vast majority of coins will likely never get there. Digitised securities might get there much sooner to the extent that they truly represent something real, the way some so-called stablecoins claim to do.

But it makes no sense to count your purported "balances" in unregistered, uninsured so-called "exchanges" as in any way real until they actually get stuff back to you before running off with it or supposedly getting "hacked".

That is my position and so far the income tax folks seem to accept it even though I am way behind in paying income tax on the actual fiat that actually did manage to end up arriving at my bank.

I do not even know, and CANNOT know, how many cryptocoins I actually HAVE until various possible future things happen, such as Cryptsy reporting whether they have any of my coins still and whether they are ever going to send them to me, and Cryptopia similarly, and gosh I have lost count of how many other "exchanges" that "flew by night", and of course even if I had disks in safe-deposit boxes I have enough experience with disks, and "backups", to know that I cannot even be sure any of those disks are even readable, let alone are backups of uncorrupted data, until I try to recover the data on them and actually use it. Then as mentioned previously I do not know whether there will even be any market for that data even assuming it IS uncorrupted. So I literally do not know how many coins I even own, of what kinds.

All I really CAN know is how much I paid for computers, electricity to power them, rent for rooms to keep them in, internet connections for them, repair and maintenance of them, and how much cash and bank-deposits in fiat eventually resulted from my use of such things.

The U.S.A. seems a bit insane though. I wonder, if they knew Satoshi's heir(s) were in the U.S.A. would they be trying to tax them on the purported value of all the bitcoins that they, as his or her or their heirs, presumably "inherited", regardless of whether they ever actually manage to find and use the keys to those addresses and sell any of those coins for fiat?

-MarkM-

[realdantreccia]

Someone call Bahrain I hear they have a carousel full of funds for us.

Imminent!

I don't have Sunkeys I'm sorry

[Unthinkingbit]

..Since this decision is tax-driven, is it possible you can continue until the end of your current tax year?
The additional time will allow us to communicate and vote of the options available for continuation of the receiver file functions.

ctya

I am willing to do the accounting for at least a few more months, if necessary. I will certainly stop by the end of the current tax year. Lately, there has not been a change in devcoin work, for example the account_93.csv file is identical to the account_94.csv file.