[ANN][VRC] VeriCoin Proof of Stake-Time Currency | New Roadmap Released

[Monkeys]

So here is my question, and it means everything to people's current investment.

Is their any plans to improve PR and or marketing? Not a "it's coming soon" But a real plan? If this is as good as it gets. I think 23k is a great price to get out and save a couple bucks.

You cannot go mainstream without a plan. Simply saying you to want to be mainstream, and making products with no demand, and very little attempt to create it looks.. well bad. I would be more than happy to do anything I can, but the lack of organization for such efforts is crazy.

Build it (the infrastructure) and they will come (customers, investors)

I've been toying with an idea to help get Vericoin, or any crypto, adopted by the masses or at very least the majority of the wider crypto community. How about some form of incentive for people to actually USE Vericoin?

I'm talking some form of remuneration to retailers to accept vericoin, and possibly even some for buyers too. Also, how about some sort of referral program?

I'm sure these are not original ideas, but I've not seen them implemented in any crypto in a viable way.

If we could incentivize the use and spreading of the vericoin community then we could reall achieve what this coin is designed to do!

How about we brainstorm some ideas for how to make this work? Feel free to criticize too, but constructively would be appreciated.

How about, higher staking interest for retailers that accept vericoin?

How about, higher staking interest and / or one time rewards for getting a new retailer to accept Vericoin?

How about a referral program for getting new users to adopt (and buy) Vericoin and to stake their coins? With accumulative my higher interest for people who refer more users?

Just brainstorming with these ideas, I realize that referrals and the likes can be easily exploited if not implemented carefully, but still something needs to be done to encourage people to adopt Vericoin, move away from other cryptos and start the push to the mainstream.

Thoughts?

I like where you are at giving further incentive to use the network. I was one of the first 1 million paypal accounts created. So I started using paypal from the very start.

What they did was give 1.5% cashback to use the card. What this did was make you pull out your paypal card over your visa, debit, ect. What that did was get attention from every clerk I came up to. Some of the first ones actually had to double check to make sure it was a real card. But you know what? I kept using it everyday, for everything. In my time using the card I know impressions where made and people remembered Paypal.


We need to figure out a way to get VeriCoin as a preferred payment method for merchants. Using technology others are scared to use in our wallets, and creating brand awareness are 2 of the keys to our success.

Make a "POM" code to add in or something "Proof of Merchant" Perhaps small incentives could be given from the network to support this, and that could help with mainstream adoption. As this would give a true incentive to have VeriCoin over X-shitcoin  Maybe we could hash into the algo, a % of coins go directly to the merchant pool accepting VeriCoin. Then use this pool in somehow to promote vericoin.


Or perhaps, every time you make a purchase with vericoin you "hash" a attempt at free vericoin from the network? Ideas from more technically capable people?

Yes! I love the idea of having at attempt at generating coins every time you pay with a Vericoin! Of course the more you pay the more attempts you get at generating and being rewarded with coin. This would help to overcome the problem of "hoarding" which is inherent in Bitcoin, and could become with Vericoin too due to it's staking incentives. If people were rewarded with a higher likelihood of generating coin every time they use it that would be a great solution!

What about a referral program of sorts? Encourage users to tell their friends to adopt Vericoin and be rewarded? It could be somehow tied in with the payment rewards system, where the referrer would earn a small percentage of any coins that their referees earn from payments? This would help to eliminate fraudulent wallets and referrals that can occur when people try to exploit referral programs.

I like where this is heading. Could we get some thoughts from the developers?

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[majeis]

It's a big block of text, so I won't quote it, but please don't recommend to the developers that they implement Proof of Transaction from Fluttercoin.

[lootz]

I have a question regarding the mining. Is it better to point all the miners to 1 address including cpu's, gpu's, asics having different difficulties or should I use and different VRC address for each which is what I am doing now ?

I would use the same address. There's no benefit to using multiple addresses.

When I get home from work I will try it and see if there is a difference I was thinking since they all had different difficulties 1 may affect the other

[ofp]

Yes! I love the idea of having at attempt at generating coins every time you pay with a Vericoin! Of course the more you pay the more attempts you get at generating and being rewarded with coin.

Despite the fact that I also like the idea, we have to take into account that paying with VRC is the same as transferring from an address to another address. This means that I could set 2 wallets and spend the day transferring coins from one to the other.

It can't be compared to paypal or CC because those paying methods charge a higher fee per transaction.

But the concept of creating an incentive is valid. It's just a matter of finding the right way to accomplish it.

[eiskalt]

When the FUDers arrived here after the hack I defended the decision to fork the blockchain and I felt closer to this community because of it.

But when the DEVs announced, that they cannot do this again, I felt disappointed. [...]
The decision was right and will be right in the future.

I do (somewhat hesitantly) believe that the recent rollback was the right thing to do, but only because the coin is still very immature. I doubt very much that I'd support a rollback in the future, however.

I think the majority of the people are willing to accept that, during its infancy (prior to being widely distributed and used) a coin may encounter a crisis situation that requires drastic measures to resolve; measures that would never even be considered once the coin is more mature. From what I have seen, it's mostly the extreme crypto die-hards (along with a few mindless lemmings) that aren't willing to accept this; unfortunately, these people also happen to be the most vocal.

This MintPal hack/theft has happened just two short months after VeriCoin was created. The coin is not yet widely distributed and there are only a small handful of vendors that accept it directly (non of which had any transactions between the time of the theft and the time of the rollback). The blockchain shows that there were minimal transactions between the time of the theft and the time of the rollback. The rollback simply did not impact many people beyond the annoyance of having to install a new wallet.

Once VeriCoin is more mature, more widely distributed, and directly accepted by numerous vendors, the daily volume will be much higher. Under these conditions, such a rollback would have extremely negative ramifications; it'd be a very bad idea, IMO.

On the other hand, with the wider distribution, it's pretty unlikely that we'd see an accumulation of 8 million coins in a single wallet...

OK, so the argument against forking the blockchain in the future because of theft are from a technical perspective ?

[buy4crypto]

Yes! I love the idea of having at attempt at generating coins every time you pay with a Vericoin! Of course the more you pay the more attempts you get at generating and being rewarded with coin.

Despite the fact that I also like the idea, we have to take into account that paying with VRC is the same as transferring from an address to another address. This means that I could set 2 wallets and spend the day transferring coins from one to the other.

It can't be compared to paypal or CC because those paying methods charge a higher fee per transaction.

But the concept of creating an incentive is valid. It's just a matter of finding the right way to accomplish it.

To be a merchant partner perhaps we would need some sort of verification / legal framework to set up. This is a thing most cryptos would cringe upon. But, in the world of business, its something that is required for them. So what do we do if we want to go mainstream? We have to cater to business and the framework that surrounds them. If a business needs x amount of security, we need to have it. If a business needs incentives to get them to use it, we need to figure out a way to give them the incentives they require.

I like where this convo is headed. Debate and constructive criticism is very welcome.

[Monkeys]

Yes! I love the idea of having at attempt at generating coins every time you pay with a Vericoin! Of course the more you pay the more attempts you get at generating and being rewarded with coin.

Despite the fact that I also like the idea, we have to take into account that paying with VRC is the same as transferring from an address to another address. This means that I could set 2 wallets and spend the day transferring coins from one to the other.

It can't be compared to paypal or CC because those paying methods charge a higher fee per transaction.

But the concept of creating an incentive is valid. It's just a matter of finding the right way to accomplish it.

Yes this issue had occurred to me also. I guess the incentive would have to be limited in some way to control for this possible exploit. Perhaps some way of analysing the transfers to determine if they are genuine or not? Ie, not to the same address and back again in similar amounts. Or as part of the merchant reward program, merchants might have to become "registered" and then only when coins are sent to registered merchants can coins be earned? Or perhaps in a similar way that staking only works with mature coins, that only mature coins can earn a chance at generating new coins?

I'm sure that someone with much greater technical knowledge than myself could devise a remards system which is fairly resistant to exploitation.

[socal]

Check out VRCRadio.com, I've taken over and I am taking questions!!

[Monkeys]

Yes! I love the idea of having at attempt at generating coins every time you pay with a Vericoin! Of course the more you pay the more attempts you get at generating and being rewarded with coin.

Despite the fact that I also like the idea, we have to take into account that paying with VRC is the same as transferring from an address to another address. This means that I could set 2 wallets and spend the day transferring coins from one to the other.

It can't be compared to paypal or CC because those paying methods charge a higher fee per transaction.

But the concept of creating an incentive is valid. It's just a matter of finding the right way to accomplish it.

To be a merchant partner perhaps we would need some sort of verification / legal framework to set up. This is a thing most cryptos would cringe upon. But, in the world of business, its something that is required for them. So what do we do if we want to go mainstream? We have to cater to business and the framework that surrounds them. If a business needs x amount of security, we need to have it. If a business needs incentives to get them to use it, we need to figure out a way to give them the incentives they require.

I like where this convo is headed. Debate and constructive criticism is very welcome.

I've also discussed this issue of "anonymity" which some in the crypto world seem to hold so dear. I do believe that this is precisely what is holding the crypto world back! Why not take it in the other direction, and have VERIFIED wallets, in the same way that you would have to verify your identity with Paypal, Pokerstars, or pretty much any other institution which involves the deposition and withdrawal of money.

Now this would not need to be mandatory, but optional for those that want to conduct business transactions with Vericoin and would like to know that the person they are dealing with has verified their identity in some way.

This really is the only way forward I believe.

Sure lets keep the transactions anonymous for personal and 'other' activities, but for professional business transactions do you really want to be sending money to a completely anonymous entity, or even receiving money from a completely anonymous entity for that matter?

Keep the idea coming =)

Also, just as an aside, I transferred some Vericoin from Mintpal the other day, man was it fast! Once I figured out that I needed to click the link in the withdrawal confirmation email that is =P

[ofp]

To be a merchant partner perhaps we would need some sort of verification / legal framework to set up. This is a thing most cryptos would cringe upon. But, in the world of business, its something that is required for them. So what do we do if we want to go mainstream? We have to cater to business and the framework that surrounds them. If a business needs x amount of security, we need to have it. If a business needs incentives to get them to use it, we need to figure out a way to give them the incentives they require.

I like where this convo is headed. Debate and constructive criticism is very welcome.

Yes this issue had occurred to me also. I guess the incentive would have to be limited in some way to control for this possible exploit. Perhaps some way of analysing the transfers to determine if they are genuine or not? Ie, not to the same address and back again in similar amounts. Or as part of the merchant reward program, merchants might have to become "registered" and then only when coins are sent to registered merchants can coins be earned? Or perhaps in a similar way that staking only works with mature coins, that only mature coins can earn a chance at generating new coins?

I'm sure that someone with much greater technical knowledge than myself could devise a remards system which is fairly resistant to exploitation.

Well, I guess there's no place for a "registered" account in a pure P2P environment. I could easily set up a registered account and receive coins in this account and then transfer them to another one and back to the registered one. There's no escape from this when the cost is lower than the incentive. So, the key is to statistically ensure that the combined cost for forging transactions is smaller than the possible incentive. This would work just fine.

[Monkeys]

Check out VRCRadio.com, I've taken over and I am taking questions!!

Loooooool!! At the song currently playing =P

How do I chat on the radio channel?

[ScottAllyn]

OK, so the argument against forking the blockchain in the future because of theft are from a technical perspective ?

Imagine a world where VeriCoin is a big as Bitcoin currently is. A rollback in such a world would directly affect tens of thousands of people (if not more). Hundreds of stores/online shops/travel agencies/etc would suddenly lose the currency that they received for merchandise delivered/services rendered. It'd be a disaster.

[Monkeys]

To be a merchant partner perhaps we would need some sort of verification / legal framework to set up. This is a thing most cryptos would cringe upon. But, in the world of business, its something that is required for them. So what do we do if we want to go mainstream? We have to cater to business and the framework that surrounds them. If a business needs x amount of security, we need to have it. If a business needs incentives to get them to use it, we need to figure out a way to give them the incentives they require.

I like where this convo is headed. Debate and constructive criticism is very welcome.

Yes this issue had occurred to me also. I guess the incentive would have to be limited in some way to control for this possible exploit. Perhaps some way of analysing the transfers to determine if they are genuine or not? Ie, not to the same address and back again in similar amounts. Or as part of the merchant reward program, merchants might have to become "registered" and then only when coins are sent to registered merchants can coins be earned? Or perhaps in a similar way that staking only works with mature coins, that only mature coins can earn a chance at generating new coins?

I'm sure that someone with much greater technical knowledge than myself could devise a rewards system which is fairly resistant to exploitation.

Well, I guess there's no place for a "registered" account in a pure P2P environment. I could easily set up a registered account and receive coins in this account and then transfer them to another one and back to the registered one. There's no escape from this when the cost is lower than the incentive. So, the key is to statistically ensure that the combined cost for forging transactions is smaller than the possible incentive. This would work just fine.

I'm sure there is a better solution than that. It would be nice if the incentives outweighed the transaction fees in the long term, such that there is a real incentive for people to use the coin. The potential for exploitation could be alleviated by adding some restrictions on when coin would have a chance at earning new coin, ie mature coins only, only to registered merchants, only once transaction per day per coin etc. Enough restrictions like this would make it not worth it for people looking to exploit the system, but would still encourage regular users to choose Vericoin for the hope of earning a reward.

[buy4crypto]

Can any business owners around the community weigh in? What would a currency/payment system have to do to make you, and your customers chose vericoin over the other forms of payment you might accept?

Also, what would be great is if our Dev team, and maybe community decide what we want to call ourself.

Are we any other crypto? Are we a payment processor? Are we a currency? It would be great to get the community behind a common goal so we can better organize to go after our target audience. We lack direction right now. Once we get direction we can stand up for what we believe in, and be united again. Like we where in the days after the hack. We need to find our common goal again, and stand out from the crowd.

[lootz]

OK, so the argument against forking the blockchain in the future because of theft are from a technical perspective ?

Imagine a world where VeriCoin is a big as Bitcoin currently is. A rollback in such a world would directly affect tens of thousands of people (if not more). Hundreds of stores/online shops/travel agencies/etc would suddenly lose the currency that they received for merchandise delivered/services rendered. It'd be a disaster.

It is the wrong thing to do BUT it was the rite thing to do. Vericoin is in its early stages so the effect was virtually nill. Bitcoin did it also in its early stages so if you feel it will affect the coin just look at where BTC is today. I am happy it was still possible to do it because it will not be once VRC gets bigger and in more hands

[BitcoinPorn]

Never invest what you can't afford to lose. 

dont be arrogant- be part of the community. dont throw people off.

Arrogant?     It's a real truth and a rule people who not only day trade, but even long term investors, should apply.    If people are putting in money to ANY coin that they should be paying their bills with, I gladly hope they are thrown off and come back into digital currencies when they are able to accept loss. 

[ofp]

To be a merchant partner perhaps we would need some sort of verification / legal framework to set up. This is a thing most cryptos would cringe upon. But, in the world of business, its something that is required for them. So what do we do if we want to go mainstream? We have to cater to business and the framework that surrounds them. If a business needs x amount of security, we need to have it. If a business needs incentives to get them to use it, we need to figure out a way to give them the incentives they require.

I like where this convo is headed. Debate and constructive criticism is very welcome.

Yes this issue had occurred to me also. I guess the incentive would have to be limited in some way to control for this possible exploit. Perhaps some way of analysing the transfers to determine if they are genuine or not? Ie, not to the same address and back again in similar amounts. Or as part of the merchant reward program, merchants might have to become "registered" and then only when coins are sent to registered merchants can coins be earned? Or perhaps in a similar way that staking only works with mature coins, that only mature coins can earn a chance at generating new coins?

I'm sure that someone with much greater technical knowledge than myself could devise a rewards system which is fairly resistant to exploitation.

Well, I guess there's no place for a "registered" account in a pure P2P environment. I could easily set up a registered account and receive coins in this account and then transfer them to another one and back to the registered one. There's no escape from this when the cost is lower than the incentive. So, the key is to statistically ensure that the combined cost for forging transactions is smaller than the possible incentive. This would work just fine.

I'm sure there is a better solution than that. It would be nice if the incentives outweighed the transaction fees in the long term, such that there is a real incentive for people to use the coin. The potential for exploitation could be alleviated by adding some restrictions on when coin would have a chance at earning new coin, ie mature coins only, only to registered merchants, only once transaction per day per coin etc. Enough restrictions like this would make it not worth it for people looking to exploit the system, but would still encourage regular users to choose Vericoin for the hope of earning a reward.

Incentives could be concentrated, like a lottery. For example: every 100,000 transaction would participate in a draw that would pay 50% of the collected fees (many scattered prizes that collectively sum up 50% of the transaction fees).

[Monkeys]

Can any business owners around the community weigh in? What would a currency/payment system have to do to make you, and your customers chose vericoin over the other forms of payment you might accept?

Also, what would be great is if our Dev team, and maybe community decide what we want to call ourself.

Are we any other crypto? Are we a payment processor? Are we a currency? It would be great to get the community behind a common goal so we can better organize to go after our target audience. We lack direction right now. Once we get direction we can go after proper marketing.

I'd like to see it become all of those things, except for JUST ANOTHER CRYPTO =P

Imo, all other crypto's bar Bitcoin and maybe one of the social currencies (probably Doge, but Reddcoin is showing some promise) will fade to nothing eventually.

Vericoin should be aiming to distance itself from other crypto's and to become something in it's own right.

[Monkeys]

To be a merchant partner perhaps we would need some sort of verification / legal framework to set up. This is a thing most cryptos would cringe upon. But, in the world of business, its something that is required for them. So what do we do if we want to go mainstream? We have to cater to business and the framework that surrounds them. If a business needs x amount of security, we need to have it. If a business needs incentives to get them to use it, we need to figure out a way to give them the incentives they require.

I like where this convo is headed. Debate and constructive criticism is very welcome.

Yes this issue had occurred to me also. I guess the incentive would have to be limited in some way to control for this possible exploit. Perhaps some way of analysing the transfers to determine if they are genuine or not? Ie, not to the same address and back again in similar amounts. Or as part of the merchant reward program, merchants might have to become "registered" and then only when coins are sent to registered merchants can coins be earned? Or perhaps in a similar way that staking only works with mature coins, that only mature coins can earn a chance at generating new coins?

I'm sure that someone with much greater technical knowledge than myself could devise a rewards system which is fairly resistant to exploitation.

Well, I guess there's no place for a "registered" account in a pure P2P environment. I could easily set up a registered account and receive coins in this account and then transfer them to another one and back to the registered one. There's no escape from this when the cost is lower than the incentive. So, the key is to statistically ensure that the combined cost for forging transactions is smaller than the possible incentive. This would work just fine.

I'm sure there is a better solution than that. It would be nice if the incentives outweighed the transaction fees in the long term, such that there is a real incentive for people to use the coin. The potential for exploitation could be alleviated by adding some restrictions on when coin would have a chance at earning new coin, ie mature coins only, only to registered merchants, only once transaction per day per coin etc. Enough restrictions like this would make it not worth it for people looking to exploit the system, but would still encourage regular users to choose Vericoin for the hope of earning a reward.

Incentives could be concentrated, like a lottery. For example: every 100,000 transaction would participate in a draw that would pay 50% of the collected fees (many scattered prizes that collectively sum up 50% of the transaction fees).

A lottery would be nice, but still is open to being exploited without other restrictions like some of those I mentioned or something better =)

[Monkeys]

What about a referral program for encouraging people to get their friends to sign up and use AND BUY Vericoin?

Thoughts?