[ANN][CLAM] CLAMs, Proof-Of-Chain, Proof-Of-Working-Stake, a.k.a. "Clamcoin"

[SuperClam]

Also, I notice that your 98 CLAM output was created on 7th February - just 11 days ago. Maybe you had a similar amount before and were just moving things around, but note that each time you move an output it stops trying to stake for 4 hours.

Brain failure yet again; I have to stop replying to threads at the far end of my awake time. Yes, at that time I believe I gathered various inputs into one, which of course would have reset its weight. My run of luck was bad, but not super bad.
Good news is that I staked about 7 hours ago.
---
I still don't get clamspeech.
"Each time a CLAM is minted or moves on the blockchain, the transaction record is now accompanied by text of your choosing. The CLAMspeech feature allows you to pick from a list of religious and political statements, or to enter a custom expression."
        "tx-comment" : "Expression of Religious Freedom: Canaanite Mythology"
I take it my client grabbed this line randomly from clamspeech.txt. Fine if you want to participate, and set your own unique statements, but I don't understand why the client will (by default) bloat the blockchain with the same set of text lines that everyone else has?
If I understand correctly, around 20% of this transaction is taken up by the clamspeech comment: http://khashier.com/tx/4683254175f04dd5a10de1c1a11f1c24c7827d279b3380b51c94cd0319cac406
(Warning: this reply is also being written at the far end of my awake time, so may contain content that defies common sense and/or makes me seem like a babbling idiot. If so, please feel free to knock some sense into me.)

Not a bad question at all

You are correct that CLAMspeech places additional weight on the chain. 

The concept is deceptively simple: political and religious expression/speech is legally protected in many jurisdictions around the world.

There are two facets of the feature that mutually protect each other:
1.  The ability to guarantee freedom of speech by hosting it on the block chain;
2.  Possibly more importantly, protection of the block chain by having expressions of protected speech embedded in it.

We think that as some of the various proposals for regulating crypto-currency are challenged in court; this issue will become much more important in the community and public at large.

In reference to the "Bit License", you can read more about the legal arguments behind such a feature in the public comment submitted by the legal representation of Reddit/EFF.

Of most interest is the section starting at page 11, specifically the sub-section at page 14 and beyond.


As an aside, CLAMspeech also provides an interesting opportunity for additional functionality on top of the protocol.
Services such as Counterparty become much simpler to implement with a ready-made field in which could be placed data to be parsed and consensus approved.

[dooglus]

So many blocks were created for a few hours??

Lots of blocks were created, but lots of them were at the same "height" as each other. Only one block survived in the main chain at each height. The vast majority of the blocks that were created ended up as orphans, and so earned no staking reward.

It was quite an impressive demonstration on the network's ability to find consensus even with such chaos going on.

[dooglus]

The concept is deceptively simple: political and religious expression/speech is legally protected in many jurisdictions around the world.

There are two facets of the feature that mutually protect each other:
1.  The ability to guarantee freedom of speech by hosting it on the block chain;
2.  Possibly more importantly, protection of the block chain by having expressions of protected speech embedded in it.

What do you think of the idea of having JD take random lines from its on-site chat as its "CLAMspeech" for the blocks it stakes?

That way you get a much wider range of "expression" in the blockchain - though some of it may not be the kind of stuff you want preserved forever.

I've asked before and don't think I've seen an answer: are the "expression of * freedom: *" lines a work in progress? Are they templates to be filled in with real statements about each religion/whatever? Because it seems to me that currently the "expressions" aren't actually expressing anything - they're just a list of religions and suchlike.

[dooglus]

Good news is that I staked about 7 hours ago.

I'm glad to hear it.

I put 100 CLAMs into my local wallet a couple of days ago, just to see how long they would take to stake.

They took almost exactly 2 days:

    http://khashier.com/address/xQ1F485bxrsPudaWLUNmrTtpJ3UrXLhuzJ

So I was lucky. I'll leave them staking and see how long it takes for the next stake.

[Vortex20000]

Good news is that I staked about 7 hours ago.

I'm glad to hear it.

I put 100 CLAMs into my local wallet a couple of days ago, just to see how long they would take to stake.

They took almost exactly 2 days:

    http://khashier.com/address/xQ1F485bxrsPudaWLUNmrTtpJ3UrXLhuzJ

So I was lucky. I'll leave them staking and see how long it takes for the next stake.

Took me several weeks to stake, but that's because my wallet was only online ~12 hours a day and I only had 17 CLAM

[huryde]

As an aside, CLAMspeech also provides an interesting opportunity for additional functionality on top of the protocol.
Services such as Counterparty become much simpler to implement with a ready-made field in which could be placed data to be parsed and consensus approved.

This, this is what could make this coin.

[dooglus]

As an aside, CLAMspeech also provides an interesting opportunity for additional functionality on top of the protocol.
Services such as Counterparty become much simpler to implement with a ready-made field in which could be placed data to be parsed and consensus approved.

This, this is what could make this coin.

It's also useful for messing with the block explorer. Someone sent a transaction with the CLAMspeech '<img src="http://.../dancingbanana.gif">' and the image ended up rendered on the block explorer page.

I think they fixed that now though.

[dooglus]

I updated this post about the bootstrap.dat file that I maintain to help people get started with the blockchain more easily.

[Vortex20000]

As an aside, CLAMspeech also provides an interesting opportunity for additional functionality on top of the protocol.
Services such as Counterparty become much simpler to implement with a ready-made field in which could be placed data to be parsed and consensus approved.

This, this is what could make this coin.

It's also useful for messing with the block explorer. Someone sent a transaction with the CLAMspeech '<img src="http://.../dancingbanana.gif">' and the image ended up rendered on the block explorer page.

I think they fixed that now though.

Wow, that's cool... is it the dancing banana used mostly for logins? 

[SuperClam]

It's also useful for messing with the block explorer. Someone sent a transaction with the CLAMspeech '<img src="http://.../dancingbanana.gif">' and the image ended up rendered on the block explorer page.
I think they fixed that now though.

Wow, that's cool... is it the dancing banana used mostly for logins?  

The dancing banana was an interesting lesson; and just about the least malicious way to discover what could have been a serious issue.
Believe it or not, it was appreciated

As an aside, CLAMspeech also provides an interesting opportunity for additional functionality on top of the protocol.
Services such as Counterparty become much simpler to implement with a ready-made field in which could be placed data to be parsed and consensus approved.

This, this is what could make this coin.

Another interesting use-case that we will likely be seeing sooner, rather than later: in client proof-of-existence.
For those not familiar, it would basically provide an on the block chain notary service where messages and files could be hashed and inserted to prove their existence.  Not a new idea or feature in the crypto space but having it in client and searchable via UI or RPC would be interesting if nothing else.

[coric]

Reminds me of little Bobby Tables. Yes, a dancing banana is certainly harmless, though I think it is the block explorer's problem, not the client itself

[SuperClam]

The concept is deceptively simple: political and religious expression/speech is legally protected in many jurisdictions around the world.
There are two facets of the feature that mutually protect each other:
1.  The ability to guarantee freedom of speech by hosting it on the block chain;
2.  Possibly more importantly, protection of the block chain by having expressions of protected speech embedded in it.

What do you think of the idea of having JD take random lines from its on-site chat as its "CLAMspeech" for the blocks it stakes?

Absolutely.

That way you get a much wider range of "expression" in the blockchain - though some of it may not be the kind of stuff you want preserved forever.
I've asked before and don't think I've seen an answer: are the "expression of * freedom: *" lines a work in progress? Are they templates to be filled in with real statements about each religion/whatever? Because it seems to me that currently the "expressions" aren't actually expressing anything - they're just a list of religions and suchlike.

The initial/default CLAMspeech list should exist in code at the official git repository.
We welcome proposed additions or changes.


We could certainly use ideas and advice is this regard.

This is a much more complex issue than it appears at first glance.

Initially, the idea was to have a much smaller initial list, with the expectation that users would add additional expressions as they saw fit.

Such an activity becomes very difficult, very quickly.  
What exactly "deserves" to exist in the list?  
Maybe more importantly, who are we to say a given item doesn't?
Does having a larger (as opposed to empty or small) list provide the opportunity for users to have some degree of psuedo-anonymity and still be able to choose specific items to broadcast?

One option would be provide a sort of feed, similar to some social websites.  Users would see a list of previously sent "expressions" and could choose to either disregard them or add them with a simple click to their personal list.  A sort of "re-tweet" if you will.
Interesting? Maybe.

Ideas are welcome.

[dooglus]

I've asked before and don't think I've seen an answer: are the "expression of * freedom: *" lines a work in progress? Are they templates to be filled in with real statements about each religion/whatever? Because it seems to me that currently the "expressions" aren't actually expressing anything - they're just a list of religions and suchlike.

The initial/default CLAMspeech list should exist in code at the official git repository.
We welcome proposed additions or changes.

OK, but I think you miss my point. To pick a random example the first tx I looked at says:

    "clam-speech" : "Expression of Political Freedom: Nazism"

I'm saying that I don't think that is an expression of political freedom. It's just a word. Just as the string "one sausage" isn't a sausage, it's just some words. And so "Expression of Political Freedom: Nazism" looks to me like a template that needs to be filled in. If it said "White people are the best, especially blue-eyed blonde-haired ones" then that's an expression - it's saying something. I'm not sure a simple list of words *is*. I'm not a lawyer (nor an expert on Nazism, clearly), but it just kind of bugs me that the default speech list contains the *word* expression a lot, but never actually expresses anything.

[SuperClam]

The initial/default CLAMspeech list should exist in code at the official git repository.
We welcome proposed additions or changes.

OK, but I think you miss my point.

Didn't miss your point - just don't have a great answer for you.
I am no more a lawyer than you.

The supposition was that the block chain is a place in which words can be "etched", presumably forever.

In the United States (only one jurisdiction and example), it is not unusual during election time to see signs posted about reading "Democrat" or "Republican" (the two major parties in the U.S.).

I would expect a court of law in the U.S. would find it very difficult to uphold a law that prevented citizens from displaying such signs.

It seems to me that "etching" the name of a political party or group into the immutable block chain is very similar to displaying a sign of such in your front yard.


Does it in any way meet the standard of triggering the legal protection of being "expression", "association", "speech", etc.?
Even if it did in one given jurisdiction, would it in others?

No idea.

[SuperClam]

Pardon for the delay.

After speaking to a few people concerning BitDice.me, it appears to be a legitimate service integrating CLAM.

Adding the service to the OP post now.


Thanks BitDice.me!
Welcome to the CLAM family!
Good luck

[Hades.]

YAY! i just imported my addy and got 4 clams!! 

[dooglus]

It seems to me that "etching" the name of a political party or group into the immutable block chain is very similar to displaying a sign of such in your front yard.

OK, good point. I'll stop going on about it now.

I made some more pushes, re. CLAMspeech. Added RPC call "setspeech" which sets the speech string to be used for all staking and transactions until it's called again. Set it to the empty string to go back to random speech. Made createrawtransaction act the same as everything else - it defaults to a random string unless setspeech has been called. Previously it defaulted to no speech.

In doing so, I noticed that the 140 character limit is soft - >140 speech characters makes a transaction "non-standard" which stops it from being relayed around the network, but if you stake the block yourself it will be accepted as valid by peers. Is that the intended behaviour? I can fill my blocks with very long "speech" for free, since I don't pay fees on the staking transaction. It would take a soft-fork to fix this.

[Rashid Ahmed]

How its work?

1 wallet.dat = 4.6 clam

Or

1 address = 4/6 clam

 

I have 4 address with some bitcoin in May 12, 2014.If I import a wallet.dat with them address. How much will I get? 4.6 clam or 4.6*4 =18.4 clam

 

Thanks!

[shorena]

How its work?

1 wallet.dat = 4.6 clam

Or

1 address = 4/6 clam

 

I have 4 address with some bitcoin in May 12, 2014.If I import a wallet.dat with them address. How much will I get? 4.6 clam or 4.6*4 =18.4 clam

 

Thanks!

4.6 CLAM per address/private key.

[Pecunia non olet]

how long before an exchange goes through their old privatekeys and dumps a shit load?


Love this concept of distribution btw.