[ANN][CLAM] CLAMs, Proof-Of-Chain, Proof-Of-Working-Stake, a.k.a. "Clamcoin"

[dooglus]

yeah your right, bit of a stupid question by me, you would empty addresses.

I guess that a bit of a hassle for cold storage.

Indeed. I've heard from some people who have hundreds of paper wallets with 1 BTC in each. They're wondering whether it is worth the hassle of making hundreds of new paper wallets and moving their coins over just to claim 4.6 CLAM per address. If each address has 1 BTC and 4.6 CLAM, then you gain 0.0055 * 4.6 = 0.0253 BTC per address you claim. That results in a one-off 2.53% increase in your BTC worth, assuming you trade the CLAM for BTC at 0.0055 BTC/CLAM.

Your distribution model is interesting, however does it favor people or encourage people who have lots of addresses with small amounts.

or did you chose some min amount of BTC on an address before you sent.

If you're talking to me, it's not "my" distribution model, and I didn't choose anything. I found out about CLAM a while after it launched.

The model does favour people who had a lot of funded addresses. There have been a few examples of people taking advantage of that, too. Someone had a litecoin wallet with thousands of funded addresses in it, and so they were able to claim thousands of CLAM. They were probably running an exchange or some similar service, but we never found out who it was.

In another case some guy made himself thousands of DOGE addresses shortly before the initial CLAM distribution, and funded them all with small amounts of DOGE. He was also able to claim large amounts of CLAM. We don't know whether he created all those DOGE addresses because he had found out that CLAM was going to launch, or whether he did it for some other reason, and just got lucky.

It's also worth pointing out that only a small percentage of the initially distributed CLAM have ever moved so far:

09:28:44 INFO: 68,622 of 3,208,032 sets of 4.60545574 CLAM were dug up so far from the initial distribution

That's only a little over 2% of them. It's quite possible that one day an old MtGox hot wallet will be used to dig up a whole lot of CLAMs. Or the hot wallet from any other BTC/LTC/DOGE service that was popular in May 2014.

[1713454367]

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[bobboooiie]

I see a lot of selling pressure on polo, anyone who would like to sell a big bulk please PM me .

[gaba]

How about reducing CLAM reward to 0.46 after first year. That will be good for price.

[flyingplows]

Where is the best place to buy some CLAM at the moment? I think I'll put a few in a just-dice bankroll

[J. J. Phillips]

Where is the best place to buy some CLAM at the moment? I think I'll put a few in a just-dice bankroll

It depends. I think shapeshift.io is the easiest, but probably not the cheapest. poloniex.com has pretty good volume if you have/are willing to create an account there. If you're looking to buy a significant amount, I think dooglus (of just-dice.com) has said he's open to buying/selling privately. He obviously has enough clams to sell. 

[Joecker]

Any info on the current network situation ? Khashier showing old data. Transactions not getting through.

[chilly2k]

Any info on the current network situation ? Khashier showing old data. Transactions not getting through.

    According to my 2 clients last block was a few seconds ago.  454149 at 10:34.   And still running strong.  Not sure if it the explorer that's stuck. 

[cloverme]

Any info on the current network situation ? Khashier showing old data. Transactions not getting through.

I'm curious as well, I have a transaction that's not showing up on the network and a deposit address at poloniex that's not receiving this morning. None of my transaction is showing up at Khashier either.  My own clam client is showing 0 network connections... Seems like something is not working somewhere in the clam universe.

[akeetlebeetle]

Any info on the current network situation ? Khashier showing old data. Transactions not getting through.

I'm curious as well, I have a transaction that's not showing up on the network and a deposit address at poloniex that's not receiving this morning. None of my transaction is showing up at Khashier either.  My own clam client is showing 0 network connections... Seems like something is not working somewhere in the clam universe.

I'm having problems as well. Tried to send from Poloniex to JD and 8 hours later I'm still waiting.

Edit: Apparently, the node went down and has been brought back up. I got my coins and everything's fixed.

Can you imagine what the reaction would've been if bitcoin was out of service for 8 hours

[Bitco¡n]

Edit: Apparently, the node went down and has been brought back up. I got my coins and everything's fixed.

Clam is running off just one node?

[dooglus]

Any info on the current network situation ? Khashier showing old data. Transactions not getting through.

I'm curious as well, I have a transaction that's not showing up on the network and a deposit address at poloniex that's not receiving this morning. None of my transaction is showing up at Khashier either.  My own clam client is showing 0 network connections... Seems like something is not working somewhere in the clam universe.

I'm having problems as well. Tried to send from Poloniex to JD and 8 hours later I'm still waiting.

Edit: Apparently, the node went down and has been brought back up. I got my coins and everything's fixed.

Can you imagine what the reaction would've been if bitcoin was out of service for 8 hours

From what I understand, both khashier (the block explorer) and poloniex's CLAM wallet (the biggest CLAM exchange) were down for hours overnight. I haven't yet been able to get in touch with the poloniex wallet manager to find out whether the two events were related. I can't imagine why poloniex would have a dependency on khashier. I guess it's possible that some weird transaction triggered a bug that affected both khashier and poloniex and brought them both down.

Just-Dice and the CLAM network as a whole both stayed up and working fully throughout. But with the only block explorer and the only significant exchange both out of action for hours, it would have looked to an outsider as if "CLAM is down". That wasn't the case.

Edit: I spoke with polo's wallet manager. He was unaware that there had been a problem, but when he checked his their CLAM wallet it was showing that it was only connected to a single peer. It's likely that the single peer went down for a while, leaving polo's wallet disconnected from the network.

We really need more people to run their own CLAM wallet, and open a port (31174/TCP is the default p2p port for CLAM) on their firewall to allow incoming connections. Of course, if poloniex themselves didn't have a "no open ports" policy, they wouldn't have this problem...

Edit2:

18:43 <tf2honeybadger> Does clam support addnode in the conf?
18:46 <dooglus> yes
18:46 <tf2honeybadger> cool
18:46 <tf2honeybadger> i'm adding them now
18:50 <tf2honeybadger> ok, it's restarting with lots of nodes
18:54 <tf2honeybadger>     "connections": 11,

[dooglus]

Where is the best place to buy some CLAM at the moment? I think I'll put a few in a just-dice bankroll

It depends. I think shapeshift.io is the easiest, but probably not the cheapest. poloniex.com has pretty good volume if you have/are willing to create an account there. If you're looking to buy a significant amount, I think dooglus (of just-dice.com) has said he's open to buying/selling privately. He obviously has enough clams to sell. 

I concur.

* shapeshift is fast and easy, but somewhat expensive

* poloniex is slower, but still pretty fast, only charges 0.2% commission, but has limited market depth. People don't tend to leave large amounts of CLAM for sale in the polo market because polo don't stake the CLAM they hold. So if you want to buy a lot of CLAM at polo your best strategy is to put a large buy order in the marketplace and wait for it to fill. People are more willing to deposit their CLAM to sell if they sell that there is a buyer waiting.

* private deals are cheapest. People will often deal at the mid-market price, without any fee. You can also get a decent volume that way. Deals are often arranged in the Just-Dice chat tab. Be sure to use a trusted escrow so you don't get ripped off. Discord (user 13) is often available and willing to help out with that, if I'm (user 1) not around. I'd also advise against trying to buy or sell for PayPal or similar. It's too easy to reverse PayPal payments leaving the seller out of pocket.

[chilly2k]

Any info on the current network situation ? Khashier showing old data. Transactions not getting through.

I'm curious as well, I have a transaction that's not showing up on the network and a deposit address at poloniex that's not receiving this morning. None of my transaction is showing up at Khashier either.  My own clam client is showing 0 network connections... Seems like something is not working somewhere in the clam universe.

I'm having problems as well. Tried to send from Poloniex to JD and 8 hours later I'm still waiting.

Edit: Apparently, the node went down and has been brought back up. I got my coins and everything's fixed.

Can you imagine what the reaction would've been if bitcoin was out of service for 8 hours

From what I understand, both khashier (the block explorer) and poloniex's CLAM wallet (the biggest CLAM exchange) were down for hours overnight. I haven't yet been able to get in touch with the poloniex wallet manager to find out whether the two events were related. I can't imagine why poloniex would have a dependency on khashier. I guess it's possible that some weird transaction triggered a bug that affected both khashier and poloniex and brought them both down.

Just-Dice and the CLAM network as a whole both stayed up and working fully throughout. But with the only block explorer and the only significant exchange both out of action for hours, it would have looked to an outsider as if "CLAM is down". That wasn't the case.

Edit: I spoke with polo's wallet manager. He was unaware that there had been a problem, but when he checked his their CLAM wallet it was showing that it was only connected to a single peer. It's likely that the single peer went down for a while, leaving polo's wallet disconnected from the network.

We really need more people to run their own CLAM wallet, and open a port (31174/TCP is the default p2p port for CLAM) on their firewall to allow incoming connections. Of course, if poloniex themselves didn't have a "no open ports" policy, they wouldn't have this problem...

Edit2:

18:43 <tf2honeybadger> Does clam support addnode in the conf?
18:46 <dooglus> yes
18:46 <tf2honeybadger> cool
18:46 <tf2honeybadger> i'm adding them now
18:50 <tf2honeybadger> ok, it's restarting with lots of nodes
18:54 <tf2honeybadger>     "connections": 11,

I'm running the client on 2 boxes.  Linux and windows.  Windows has 16 connections and linux has 74.    Both have been running fine for weeks.  Strange problem, someone else above mentioned not having peers.   

[tspacepilot]

I see in the thread topic "proof-of-chain", "proof-of-pearl".  These are cute names (actually I don't understand how a "chain" is clammy), but I ask myself, are these simply renamed "proof-of-work", "proof-of-stake", or is there something more that I should understand?

[db2]

These are cute names (actually I don't understand how a "chain" is clammy)

www.youtube.com/watch?v=giVMOdMTUNM

lol don't kill me

[tspacepilot]

These are cute names (actually I don't understand how a "chain" is clammy)

www.youtube.com/watch?v=giVMOdMTUNM

lol don't kill me

I guess I appreciate the effort, but I'm in a library with no headphones so videos aren't going to cut it   Let me know if there's a succinct-textual answer somewhere.  FWIW, I can try to watch videos later on at home.

Here's a slightly off-topic rant: do you guys ever get annoyed when you're looking for some simple answer to a question and the only thing you can find are videos that you know are going to have a rambly introduction and no way to search on the page for exactly what you're looking for (because it isn't a page!) etc?  Ok, end of my rant!

[xploited]

These are cute names (actually I don't understand how a "chain" is clammy)

www.youtube.com/watch?v=giVMOdMTUNM

lol don't kill me

I guess I appreciate the effort, but I'm in a library with no headphones so videos aren't going to cut it   Let me know if there's a succinct-textual answer somewhere.  FWIW, I can try to watch videos later on at home.

Here's a slightly off-topic rant: do you guys ever get annoyed when you're looking for some simple answer to a question and the only thing you can find are videos that you know are going to have a rambly introduction and no way to search on the page for exactly what you're looking for (because it isn't a page!) etc?  Ok, end of my rant!

Proof-of-Pearl was a cute name for our lottery which was removed long ago. It was basically just random block rewards aka superblocks or whatever you'd like to call it but it didn't work out well.   

Proof-of-Chain is in reference to how clams were originally distributed, sending out to all the btc / ltc and doge addresses that had a balance last may.

Hope that helps

[tspacepilot]

These are cute names (actually I don't understand how a "chain" is clammy)

www.youtube.com/watch?v=giVMOdMTUNM

lol don't kill me

I guess I appreciate the effort, but I'm in a library with no headphones so videos aren't going to cut it   Let me know if there's a succinct-textual answer somewhere.  FWIW, I can try to watch videos later on at home.

Here's a slightly off-topic rant: do you guys ever get annoyed when you're looking for some simple answer to a question and the only thing you can find are videos that you know are going to have a rambly introduction and no way to search on the page for exactly what you're looking for (because it isn't a page!) etc?  Ok, end of my rant!

Proof-of-Pearl was a cute name for our lottery which was removed long ago. It was basically just random block rewards aka superblocks or whatever you'd like to call it but it didn't work out well.   

Proof-of-Chain is in reference to how clams were originally distributed, sending out to all the btc / ltc and doge addresses that had a balance last may.

Hope that helps

Yup, that answers it, thanks!

[dooglus]

Proof-of-Pearl was a cute name for our lottery which was removed long ago. It was basically just random block rewards aka superblocks or whatever you'd like to call it but it didn't work out well.   

It didn't work out well because each time you got a chance to stake a block, you could see what the lottery prize was going to be, and decide whether to submit the block to the network or not. You could calculate the threshold below which it was +EV to withhold the block. Submitting a block would destroy all the "age" on the staking output, making it very unlikely to stake again for a while, and so it was in your interest to withhold it and save the "age" for a better lotto prize.

Now, however, age is irrelevant. All that matters is the size of the output (other than the 510 block maturation period). So now I suspect that it would never be +EV to withhold a block, and so the lottery wouldn't be game-able.

Not that I'm saying you should reinstate the lottery, just that the reason for removing it is no longer valid, and so if you wanted to start the lottery up again, I think this time it could work better. I'm not sure most people would be in favour of it. Have a steady return from staking is probably more attractive to most than a lower regular return with occasional jackpots - this is why people join mining pools rather than solo mining.

[dooglus]

* private deals are cheapest. People will often deal at the mid-market price, without any fee. You can also get a decent volume that way. Deals are often arranged in the Just-Dice chat tab. Be sure to use a trusted escrow so you don't get ripped off. Discord (user 13) is often available and willing to help out with that, if I'm (user 1) not around. I'd also advise against trying to buy or sell for PayPal or similar. It's too easy to reverse PayPal payments leaving the seller out of pocket.

I'm hearing that I may have caused offence by mentioning Discord and nobody else in this paragraph. I certainly didn't mean to offend anyone. That's not an exclusive list of "good mods" or any such thing. I just saw him escrowing recently.

We have lots of mods on Just-Dice who I'm guessing would be happy to act as escrows. Use whoever you trust. My omission of individuals from my list of escrows is more an indication that I had just woken up to a bunch of complaints about late deposits and withdrawals and had other stuff on my mind than anything else.