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Author Topic: Health and Religion  (Read 192934 times)
BADecker
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May 29, 2017, 02:59:44 PM
 #1281

@ BADecker

I hope I'm not off topic, but here are my two cents :

Over the ages, Gods of all sorts always been an excuse for things humans didn't understood (yet) Ra was rising the sun, Thor the lighting , etc.. etc..
Since then, everytime we learned more about our physical world, those went from gods to mythology. I takes time for sure to people abandon their faith, but History is nothing but proof that a lot of religions had their particular era. Major modern religions are not different , they are just living mythologies, followed by people who rectracted in the last and tiny bubble of unknown about our reality.

When our late descendants will study our era they will mock us and find us primitive.

And another option is possible, that our descendants will be able to prove the existence of the gods and will laugh at us for the fact that we could not do this.

Of course, we already proved the existence of God:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=737322.msg10718395#msg10718395
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1355109.msg14047133#msg14047133
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1662153.40
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1054513.msg16803380#msg16803380.

Why would our descendants be any more honest by admitting it when we don't seem to want to?

Cool

I take a bit of time away and BADecker is still quoting himself.

Oh well, it's another reason to have a drink!

Out of curiosity.... has anyone else quoted your links yet, or does everyone else know your links are full of shit.

I see you haven't become any smarter while you were away. You still can't refute or rebut the science that God exists, and that everything exists because of God.

Turn to God, now, while you still have time, and save yourself from your own demise.

Cool

Your links have been rebutted and refuted many times.

The only person who doesn't believe that is you.

Wake up before it's too late!

There you go again. All the time, all the time. Mere talk about rebuttal, without following through by showing any rebuttal that stands.

Find a point in my links, and rebut it directly and scientifically with scientific rebuttal, if you can. I kinda think that you have barely looked at what the links say.

Cool

Don't be afraid to donate Bitcoin >>> 1JDJotyxZLFF8akGCxHeqMkD4YrrTmEAwz !
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May 29, 2017, 05:37:17 PM
 #1282

@ BADecker

I hope I'm not off topic, but here are my two cents :

Over the ages, Gods of all sorts always been an excuse for things humans didn't understood (yet) Ra was rising the sun, Thor the lighting , etc.. etc..
Since then, everytime we learned more about our physical world, those went from gods to mythology. I takes time for sure to people abandon their faith, but History is nothing but proof that a lot of religions had their particular era. Major modern religions are not different , they are just living mythologies, followed by people who rectracted in the last and tiny bubble of unknown about our reality.

When our late descendants will study our era they will mock us and find us primitive.

And another option is possible, that our descendants will be able to prove the existence of the gods and will laugh at us for the fact that we could not do this.

Of course, we already proved the existence of God:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=737322.msg10718395#msg10718395
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1355109.msg14047133#msg14047133
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1662153.40
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1054513.msg16803380#msg16803380.

Why would our descendants be any more honest by admitting it when we don't seem to want to?

Cool

I take a bit of time away and BADecker is still quoting himself.

Oh well, it's another reason to have a drink!

Out of curiosity.... has anyone else quoted your links yet, or does everyone else know your links are full of shit.

I see you haven't become any smarter while you were away. You still can't refute or rebut the science that God exists, and that everything exists because of God.

Turn to God, now, while you still have time, and save yourself from your own demise.

Cool

Your links have been rebutted and refuted many times.

The only person who doesn't believe that is you.

Wake up before it's too late!

There you go again. All the time, all the time. Mere talk about rebuttal, without following through by showing any rebuttal that stands.

Find a point in my links, and rebut it directly and scientifically with scientific rebuttal, if you can. I kinda think that you have barely looked at what the links say.

Cool
I think that every person is convinced of something and will arrange his point of view to the last. Though there are times when someone will convince someone, but I think that it's just pointless to do it here. I have repeatedly tried to prove something to someone but I see that people still stand on their own and their opinion is, in their opinion, the most important and most truthful of all.

BADecker
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May 29, 2017, 10:22:02 PM
 #1283

@ BADecker

I hope I'm not off topic, but here are my two cents :

Over the ages, Gods of all sorts always been an excuse for things humans didn't understood (yet) Ra was rising the sun, Thor the lighting , etc.. etc..
Since then, everytime we learned more about our physical world, those went from gods to mythology. I takes time for sure to people abandon their faith, but History is nothing but proof that a lot of religions had their particular era. Major modern religions are not different , they are just living mythologies, followed by people who rectracted in the last and tiny bubble of unknown about our reality.

When our late descendants will study our era they will mock us and find us primitive.

And another option is possible, that our descendants will be able to prove the existence of the gods and will laugh at us for the fact that we could not do this.

Of course, we already proved the existence of God:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=737322.msg10718395#msg10718395
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1355109.msg14047133#msg14047133
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1662153.40
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1054513.msg16803380#msg16803380.

Why would our descendants be any more honest by admitting it when we don't seem to want to?

Cool

I take a bit of time away and BADecker is still quoting himself.

Oh well, it's another reason to have a drink!

Out of curiosity.... has anyone else quoted your links yet, or does everyone else know your links are full of shit.

I see you haven't become any smarter while you were away. You still can't refute or rebut the science that God exists, and that everything exists because of God.

Turn to God, now, while you still have time, and save yourself from your own demise.

Cool

Your links have been rebutted and refuted many times.

The only person who doesn't believe that is you.

Wake up before it's too late!

There you go again. All the time, all the time. Mere talk about rebuttal, without following through by showing any rebuttal that stands.

Find a point in my links, and rebut it directly and scientifically with scientific rebuttal, if you can. I kinda think that you have barely looked at what the links say.

Cool
I think that every person is convinced of something and will arrange his point of view to the last. Though there are times when someone will convince someone, but I think that it's just pointless to do it here. I have repeatedly tried to prove something to someone but I see that people still stand on their own and their opinion is, in their opinion, the most important and most truthful of all.

Right! It is only in the midst of great joy, or great pain, that a person will compare his opinions with reality to see what the truth is. Of course, there are a few people who try to be truthful all the time.

Cool

Don't be afraid to donate Bitcoin >>> 1JDJotyxZLFF8akGCxHeqMkD4YrrTmEAwz !
jonnybravo0411
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May 30, 2017, 05:12:45 AM
 #1284

@ BADecker

I hope I'm not off topic, but here are my two cents :

Over the ages, Gods of all sorts always been an excuse for things humans didn't understood (yet) Ra was rising the sun, Thor the lighting , etc.. etc..
Since then, everytime we learned more about our physical world, those went from gods to mythology. I takes time for sure to people abandon their faith, but History is nothing but proof that a lot of religions had their particular era. Major modern religions are not different , they are just living mythologies, followed by people who rectracted in the last and tiny bubble of unknown about our reality.

When our late descendants will study our era they will mock us and find us primitive.

And another option is possible, that our descendants will be able to prove the existence of the gods and will laugh at us for the fact that we could not do this.

Of course, we already proved the existence of God:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=737322.msg10718395#msg10718395
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1355109.msg14047133#msg14047133
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1662153.40
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1054513.msg16803380#msg16803380.

Why would our descendants be any more honest by admitting it when we don't seem to want to?

Cool

I take a bit of time away and BADecker is still quoting himself.

Oh well, it's another reason to have a drink!

Out of curiosity.... has anyone else quoted your links yet, or does everyone else know your links are full of shit.

I see you haven't become any smarter while you were away. You still can't refute or rebut the science that God exists, and that everything exists because of God.

Turn to God, now, while you still have time, and save yourself from your own demise.

Cool

Your links have been rebutted and refuted many times.

The only person who doesn't believe that is you.

Wake up before it's too late!

There you go again. All the time, all the time. Mere talk about rebuttal, without following through by showing any rebuttal that stands.

Find a point in my links, and rebut it directly and scientifically with scientific rebuttal, if you can. I kinda think that you have barely looked at what the links say.

Cool
I think that every person is convinced of something and will arrange his point of view to the last. Though there are times when someone will convince someone, but I think that it's just pointless to do it here. I have repeatedly tried to prove something to someone but I see that people still stand on their own and their opinion is, in their opinion, the most important and most truthful of all.

Right! It is only in the midst of great joy, or great pain, that a person will compare his opinions with reality to see what the truth is. Of course, there are a few people who try to be truthful all the time.

Cool
When a person is really in great pain, then there may even be a clouding of reason and sanity in such moments is very difficult. Therefore What is the truth to know will be even harder.

.
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BADecker
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May 30, 2017, 06:24:33 AM
 #1285

@ BADecker

I hope I'm not off topic, but here are my two cents :

Over the ages, Gods of all sorts always been an excuse for things humans didn't understood (yet) Ra was rising the sun, Thor the lighting , etc.. etc..
Since then, everytime we learned more about our physical world, those went from gods to mythology. I takes time for sure to people abandon their faith, but History is nothing but proof that a lot of religions had their particular era. Major modern religions are not different , they are just living mythologies, followed by people who rectracted in the last and tiny bubble of unknown about our reality.

When our late descendants will study our era they will mock us and find us primitive.

And another option is possible, that our descendants will be able to prove the existence of the gods and will laugh at us for the fact that we could not do this.

Of course, we already proved the existence of God:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=737322.msg10718395#msg10718395
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1355109.msg14047133#msg14047133
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1662153.40
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1054513.msg16803380#msg16803380.

Why would our descendants be any more honest by admitting it when we don't seem to want to?

Cool

I take a bit of time away and BADecker is still quoting himself.

Oh well, it's another reason to have a drink!

Out of curiosity.... has anyone else quoted your links yet, or does everyone else know your links are full of shit.

I see you haven't become any smarter while you were away. You still can't refute or rebut the science that God exists, and that everything exists because of God.

Turn to God, now, while you still have time, and save yourself from your own demise.

Cool

Your links have been rebutted and refuted many times.

The only person who doesn't believe that is you.

Wake up before it's too late!

There you go again. All the time, all the time. Mere talk about rebuttal, without following through by showing any rebuttal that stands.

Find a point in my links, and rebut it directly and scientifically with scientific rebuttal, if you can. I kinda think that you have barely looked at what the links say.

Cool
I think that every person is convinced of something and will arrange his point of view to the last. Though there are times when someone will convince someone, but I think that it's just pointless to do it here. I have repeatedly tried to prove something to someone but I see that people still stand on their own and their opinion is, in their opinion, the most important and most truthful of all.

Right! It is only in the midst of great joy, or great pain, that a person will compare his opinions with reality to see what the truth is. Of course, there are a few people who try to be truthful all the time.

Cool
When a person is really in great pain, then there may even be a clouding of reason and sanity in such moments is very difficult. Therefore What is the truth to know will be even harder.

Does a person ever, ever, ever have a completely correct opinion? Great pain or great joy can humble a person enough that he re-thinks his opinions. The result may not be correct. But it CAN bring him to level-headed thinking, because of his need.

Cool

Don't be afraid to donate Bitcoin >>> 1JDJotyxZLFF8akGCxHeqMkD4YrrTmEAwz !
seo11
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May 30, 2017, 06:43:03 AM
 #1286

Religion as any system protects their be committed. They need this system to recharge its energy. Therefore, I believe that the system maintains a good level of health of their people, so they served it longer.
stats
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May 30, 2017, 09:18:34 AM
 #1287



There you go again. All the time, all the time. Mere talk about rebuttal, without following through by showing any rebuttal that stands.

Find a point in my links, and rebut it directly and scientifically with scientific rebuttal, if you can. I kinda think that you have barely looked at what the links say.

Cool

For a point to be rebutted, it must first be proven.

Try that to begin with.
BADecker
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May 30, 2017, 01:45:28 PM
 #1288



There you go again. All the time, all the time. Mere talk about rebuttal, without following through by showing any rebuttal that stands.

Find a point in my links, and rebut it directly and scientifically with scientific rebuttal, if you can. I kinda think that you have barely looked at what the links say.

Cool

For a point to be rebutted, it must first be proven.

Try that to begin with.

That is a false idea. For a point to be rebutted, it must first be suggested. Something that is proven means that all accurate rebuttal has ceased.

Cause and effect - proven.
Entropy - proven.
Complex universe - proven.
Existence of God - proven.

You would be healthier to accept the proof for God, and then believe what He says. Fighting that which is real actually tears down the health.

Cool

Don't be afraid to donate Bitcoin >>> 1JDJotyxZLFF8akGCxHeqMkD4YrrTmEAwz !
af_newbie
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May 30, 2017, 02:13:04 PM
 #1289



There you go again. All the time, all the time. Mere talk about rebuttal, without following through by showing any rebuttal that stands.

Find a point in my links, and rebut it directly and scientifically with scientific rebuttal, if you can. I kinda think that you have barely looked at what the links say.

Cool

For a point to be rebutted, it must first be proven.

Try that to begin with.

That is a false idea. For a point to be rebutted, it must first be suggested. Something that is proven means that all accurate rebuttal has ceased.

Cause and effect - proven.
Entropy - proven.
Complex universe - proven.
Existence of God - proven.

You would be healthier to accept the proof for God, and then believe what He says. Fighting that which is real actually tears down the health.

Cool


Cause and effect - observed in temporal space, not applicable to non-temporal space
Entropy - another name for randomness or disorder in the system
Complex universe - well, chaotic is a better term, with all the explosions and collisions going on all the time.
Existence of God - Huh?  First of all, what is God?  Where is it? 

How can you proof something that is unknown and undefined?  You don't even know what it is never mind if it exist.

Another argument that nothing could have caused the Big Bang is that the time was not existent before the Big Bang, so cause and effect cannot be even applied to 'time' before Big Bang.  There was no time to begin with.




BADecker
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May 30, 2017, 02:28:01 PM
 #1290



There you go again. All the time, all the time. Mere talk about rebuttal, without following through by showing any rebuttal that stands.

Find a point in my links, and rebut it directly and scientifically with scientific rebuttal, if you can. I kinda think that you have barely looked at what the links say.

Cool

For a point to be rebutted, it must first be proven.

Try that to begin with.

That is a false idea. For a point to be rebutted, it must first be suggested. Something that is proven means that all accurate rebuttal has ceased.

Cause and effect - proven.
Entropy - proven.
Complex universe - proven.
Existence of God - proven.

You would be healthier to accept the proof for God, and then believe what He says. Fighting that which is real actually tears down the health.

Cool


Cause and effect - observed in temporal space, not applicable to non-temporal space
Entropy - another name for randomness or disorder in the system
Complex universe - well, chaotic is a better term, with all the explosions and collisions going on all the time.
Existence of God - Huh?  First of all, what is God?  Where is it?  

How can you proof something that is unknown and undefined?  You don't even know what it is never mind if it exist.

Another argument that nothing could have caused the Big Bang is that the time was not existent before the Big Bang, so cause and effect cannot be even applied to 'time' before Big Bang.  There was no time to begin with.


The fact that things exist, with a beginning somewhere in the distant past, and operates by cause and effect, show that something must have started this whole thing. The complexity involved in cause and effect activity show that the "something" was very knowledgeable and powerful. We don't have to "see" the "something" directly to determine a few things about it, by looking at the things it caused to happen.

Cool

EDIT: Why haven't the proponents of big bang suggested that BB is alive? They know about cause and effect programming in the universe.

Don't be afraid to donate Bitcoin >>> 1JDJotyxZLFF8akGCxHeqMkD4YrrTmEAwz !
af_newbie
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May 30, 2017, 03:11:52 PM
 #1291



There you go again. All the time, all the time. Mere talk about rebuttal, without following through by showing any rebuttal that stands.

Find a point in my links, and rebut it directly and scientifically with scientific rebuttal, if you can. I kinda think that you have barely looked at what the links say.

Cool

For a point to be rebutted, it must first be proven.

Try that to begin with.

That is a false idea. For a point to be rebutted, it must first be suggested. Something that is proven means that all accurate rebuttal has ceased.

Cause and effect - proven.
Entropy - proven.
Complex universe - proven.
Existence of God - proven.

You would be healthier to accept the proof for God, and then believe what He says. Fighting that which is real actually tears down the health.

Cool


Cause and effect - observed in temporal space, not applicable to non-temporal space
Entropy - another name for randomness or disorder in the system
Complex universe - well, chaotic is a better term, with all the explosions and collisions going on all the time.
Existence of God - Huh?  First of all, what is God?  Where is it?  

How can you proof something that is unknown and undefined?  You don't even know what it is never mind if it exist.

Another argument that nothing could have caused the Big Bang is that the time was not existent before the Big Bang, so cause and effect cannot be even applied to 'time' before Big Bang.  There was no time to begin with.


The fact that things exist, with a beginning somewhere in the distant past, and operates by cause and effect, show that something must have started this whole thing. The complexity involved in cause and effect activity show that the "something" was very knowledgeable and powerful. We don't have to "see" the "something" directly to determine a few things about it, by looking at the things it caused to happen.

Cool

EDIT: Why haven't the proponents of big bang suggested that BB is alive? They know about cause and effect programming in the universe.

Cause and effect could be just our mind playing tricks on us.  Like a black cat crossing the road is the 'cause' of the car accidents.
Or not going to church or praying is the 'cause' of cancer.  Or the other way around, going to church and praying is the cause of cancer remission.

Like I said, talking about cause of Big Bang is nonsense, there was no time for the cause to exist in.

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May 30, 2017, 03:17:45 PM
 #1292



There you go again. All the time, all the time. Mere talk about rebuttal, without following through by showing any rebuttal that stands.

Find a point in my links, and rebut it directly and scientifically with scientific rebuttal, if you can. I kinda think that you have barely looked at what the links say.

Cool

For a point to be rebutted, it must first be proven.

Try that to begin with.

That is a false idea. For a point to be rebutted, it must first be suggested. Something that is proven means that all accurate rebuttal has ceased.

Cause and effect - proven.
Entropy - proven.
Complex universe - proven.
Existence of God - proven.

You would be healthier to accept the proof for God, and then believe what He says. Fighting that which is real actually tears down the health.

Cool


Cause and effect - observed in temporal space, not applicable to non-temporal space
Entropy - another name for randomness or disorder in the system
Complex universe - well, chaotic is a better term, with all the explosions and collisions going on all the time.
Existence of God - Huh?  First of all, what is God?  Where is it?  

How can you proof something that is unknown and undefined?  You don't even know what it is never mind if it exist.

Another argument that nothing could have caused the Big Bang is that the time was not existent before the Big Bang, so cause and effect cannot be even applied to 'time' before Big Bang.  There was no time to begin with.


The fact that things exist, with a beginning somewhere in the distant past, and operates by cause and effect, show that something must have started this whole thing. The complexity involved in cause and effect activity show that the "something" was very knowledgeable and powerful. We don't have to "see" the "something" directly to determine a few things about it, by looking at the things it caused to happen.

Cool

EDIT: Why haven't the proponents of big bang suggested that BB is alive? They know about cause and effect programming in the universe.

Cause and effect could be just our mind playing tricks on us.  Like a black cat crossing the road is the 'cause' of the car accidents.
Or not going to church or praying is the 'cause' of cancer.  Or the other way around, going to church and praying is the cause of cancer remission.

Like I said, talking about cause of Big Bang is nonsense, there was no time for the cause to exist in.


The greatest reason why it's nonsensical talking about BB is, so far that we know of, BB is science fiction. Don't get me wrong. I enjoy good science fiction. But there are so many gaps in the plot of BB that, let's do something else.

Cool

Don't be afraid to donate Bitcoin >>> 1JDJotyxZLFF8akGCxHeqMkD4YrrTmEAwz !
CoinCube
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May 31, 2017, 05:06:42 AM
 #1293


The More Rational Model
http://www.scifiwright.com/2017/05/the-more-rational-model/#more-18419
Quote from: John C. Wright
A comment on my publisher’s website asks:

“Do you have any suggestions for finding faith? I see the necessity of religion, and Christianity in particular, but aside from history and cultural affinity I don’t have actual belief.”

My suggestion: Pray.

Also, consider that the Christian worldview is more coherent, robust, and rational than any secular worldview.
Our model explains things such as why stars look fair and beautiful to our eyes when it serves no credible Darwinian purpose to do so.

Our model explains the naturalistic fallacy, that is, the gap between ‘is’ and ‘ought’ which secular philosophy cannot explain, and some cannot even address.

Our model explains how free will can exist inside a deterministic universe. A materialist cannot even formulate the question in a rational way.

Our model explains why humans seek beauty. Social-evolutionary explanations for this are less convincing than astrology.

Our model explains how creatures with free will capable of grasping intellectual abstractions can arise in a universe which contains no such thing as intellectual abstractions.

Our model allows investigation of final causes in nature, without which nature cannot properly be understood.

Our model explains the prevalence of so many theists throughout history. The theory that over nine tenths of mankind, including some of the most brilliant thinkers in their age, were raving lunatics who hallucinate about imaginary sky beings is not credible and not supported by evidence.

Our model explains the various miracles and supernatural wonders that are in the older history books, and which, for no scientific reason, were excised from being reported.

Our model explains both why there is a plurality of religions and why there are striking similarities between them.

Our model explains the origin of the universe. By definition, if the universe were all that existed, exists and ever will exist, than a material cause for it is impossible.

Our modern explains the current hegemony of the West and makes clear the meaning and purpose of what otherwise seems like insane and suicidal attempts by the apparently sober and sane men on Left to undermine and destroy it.

Our model explains why you should not let your daughter whore around. She is immortal, and will outlast any nation, and language, any institution and human work on Earth.

Our model explains why you should not, once you have truly and deeply contemplated the vastness of the universe and the oppressive span of time to follow the death of everything you know, fall into despair, and end your meaningless life.

Our model gives something to live for nobler than one’s own pleasure seeking.

Our model avoids the logical paradox of asserting man can create meaning in life out of a vacuum. That would require an ability to create meaning out of meaninglessness, which is absurd.

Our model explains why men and women are different, and how we must arrange the dangerous mystery of the mating dance between the sexes to improve our chances to achieve joy rather than misery.

Our model gives rational hope of seeking the departed dead again.

Our model explains human psychology better than perverted old Freud dressing up old Greek myths in make believe, and far better than cranky old Thomas Hobbes and his cynicism.

Our model makes sense. Others are either incorrect, incomplete, or paradoxical, or lead ultimately to wrath or despair. Our model is the sole one which sees life as not futile and death as not bitter.

And, on an intellectual level, our model is the one to which to turn once your mind has become wearied with the reductionist, absurdist and postmodern models, which are in fact no models at all, but rather, are excuses why one should not make a model of the universe, nor seek any answers to deep questions.

It is the model to which to turn once you are heartily sick of hearing “It Just Happened” as the explanation for the origin of man, the universe, and all things.

Naturally, I do not expect any reader to take any of these conclusions as if they were persuasive arguments. Each would require a separate and in depth conversation. This is just a list, and a partial list at that, of the intellectually satisfying fullness of Christian thought. It is the scent and savor of the feast of Christian philosophy, not the meat and potatoes.

This list is not meant to argue the point. It is meant to whet the appetite of intellects starved and desiccated after vain attempt to feast on the shadows, dust and ashes of modern thought, and show the contrast.

There are additional reasons beyond this. All human reason can do is clear away false objections to faith. Faith itself is a supernatural gift bestowed by God to protect his own from the sudden, irrational loss of confidence in the self evident to which our foolish race is prone.

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May 31, 2017, 11:48:41 AM
 #1294

Religion is poison. They are reasoned by books that have no evidence or witness. and i don't know if there are any cure

That is your point of view but you cannot also blame the bond that a certain religion can provide to  its people . true religion In my opinion we can consider our soul as healthy but of course it does not apply to everyone

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May 31, 2017, 12:31:32 PM
 #1295

Religion is poison. They are reasoned by books that have no evidence or witness. and i don't know if there are any cure

That is your point of view but you cannot also blame the bond that a certain religion can provide to  its people . true religion In my opinion we can consider our soul as healthy but of course it does not apply to everyone
True religion cannot be. Any religion based on lies. How a lie can promote good? A lie is always aimed at achieving the goal. Many religious leaders have a good education and may not be aware of the fact that there is no God. They do, however, cheating people of their profession. Religion is a poison.
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May 31, 2017, 06:57:50 PM
 #1296

Religion is poison. They are reasoned by books that have no evidence or witness. and i don't know if there are any cure

That is your point of view but you cannot also blame the bond that a certain religion can provide to  its people . true religion In my opinion we can consider our soul as healthy but of course it does not apply to everyone
True religion cannot be. Any religion based on lies. How a lie can promote good? A lie is always aimed at achieving the goal. Many religious leaders have a good education and may not be aware of the fact that there is no God. They do, however, cheating people of their profession. Religion is a poison.

Medicine is poison. The pills your doctor prescribes for you to take are poison. Literally.

Go talk to your pharmacist when you get your pills at the drug store. He'll tell you that most of the time your pills contain a bunch of filler, and that there is a kernel of poison in them that does the work. You take the poison, but you get better.

Similar with religion. You sit around in church or at the bar (depending on your religion), and you get a bunch of filler, and a kernel of poison. Then you get healthier.

I mean, go ask your doctor what chemicals are in chemotherapy. They are poison. Religion tells you that you have to die to go to Heaven. And the stuff you imbibe at the bar helps you to die, but you can get awful happy for a while before you do.

Cool

Don't be afraid to donate Bitcoin >>> 1JDJotyxZLFF8akGCxHeqMkD4YrrTmEAwz !
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May 31, 2017, 07:20:17 PM
Last edit: May 31, 2017, 07:38:17 PM by CoinCube
 #1297

When you are schizophrenic or delusional you might never be able to cure yourself.  You will remain delusional until you die. (True)

It does not matter that people are delusional when they do not cause harm to others or themselves.  But unfortunately, that is not the case when it comes to religious delusion.  These people are dangerous, borderline insane. (False)

When people think they have the right to kill others because of their delusion, that is a problem. (True)

In the future, religions will be treated as a medical issue.  We need to find the "religion" gene and eradicate it from the gene pool. (False)


Truth followed by falsehood. You af_newbie simply do not seem to understand religion.
Since we are on a bitcoin forum let me frame this in the language of bitcoin maybe that will help you understand.

What is bitcoin?
Bitcoin is an overarching consensus system organized around the concept of sound money. Those voluntarily participating in this consensus are required to behave transparently and do work with the ultimate aim of ensuring all network participants abide by the greater consensus. Nodes who choose not to follow the protocol, miners who submit invalid proof of work, and users who try to spend bitcoins without verified private keys, are simply ignored by the greater consensus.

Bitcoin is a form of group selection and group selection entails that group behavior be referenced to something outside the group. This something outside is the concept groups cohere and organize around. It is what they cooperate to promote. In the case of bitcoin the referenced object is the conceptual idea of a sound and ideal money.

What is religion (specifically ethical monotheism)?
Religion is also a form of group selection. It is the far more ambitious consensus that involves organizing humanity around the external concept of God. Once you understand this you understand the transformative nature of religion in both historic and modern human societies.

In any network some actors behave badly. They seek to impose their vision through force rather then consensus. In bitcoin we see this with the threat of a miner instigated contentious hardfork and also in the threat of nodes forcing change with a UASF. In religion we see it with certain sects seeking converts by the sword. In all cases this behavior is unhelpful and it will cease and fade out gradually over time as it becomes clear to all that voluntary consensus and cooperation not force is the ultimate path forward.

Religion is the proximate method of Group Selection in humans. Below is a nice article on this by Bruce Charlton if you are interested in reading more.
http://iqpersonalitygenius.blogspot.com/2015/11/religion-as-proximate-method-of-group.html?m=1

As an aside this may also be why you will notice that the very religious on this forum often seem to be the most optimistic about bitcoin and confident in it's long term success. The religious have an innate affinity for consensus networks as they are already active members of one.  

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May 31, 2017, 08:02:02 PM
Last edit: May 31, 2017, 08:13:51 PM by af_newbie
 #1298

When you are schizophrenic or delusional you might never be able to cure yourself.  You will remain delusional until you die. (True)

It does not matter that people are delusional when they do not cause harm to others or themselves.  But unfortunately, that is not the case when it comes to religious delusion.  These people are dangerous, borderline insane. (False)

When people think they have the right to kill others because of their delusion, that is a problem. (True)

In the future, religions will be treated as a medical issue.  We need to find the "religion" gene and eradicate it from the gene pool. (False)


Truth followed by falsehood. You af_newbie simply do not seem to understand religion.
Since we are on a bitcoin forum let me frame this in the language of bitcoin maybe that will help you understand.

What is bitcoin?
Bitcoin is an overarching consensus system organized around the concept of sound money. Those voluntarily participating in this consensus are required to behave transparently and do work with the ultimate aim of ensuring all network participants abide by the greater consensus. Nodes who choose not to follow the protocol, miners who submit invalid proof of work, and users who try to spend bitcoins without verified private keys, are simply ignored by the greater consensus.

Bitcoin is a form of group selection and group selection entails that group behavior be referenced to something outside the group. This something outside is the concept groups cohere and organize around. It is what they cooperate to promote. In the case of bitcoin the referenced object is the conceptual idea of a sound and ideal money.

What is religion (specifically ethical monotheism)?
Religion is also a form of group selection. It is the far more ambitious consensus that involves organizing humanity around the external concept of God. Once you understand this you understand the transformative nature of religion in both historic and modern human societies.

In any network some actors behave badly. They seek to impose their vision through force rather then consensus. In bitcoin we see this with the threat of a miner instigated contentious hardfork and also in the threat of nodes forcing change with a UASF. In religion we see it with certain sects seeking converts by the sword. In all cases this behavior is unhelpful and it will cease and fade out gradually over time as it becomes clear to all that voluntary consensus and cooperation not force is the ultimate path forward.

Religion is the proximate method of Group Selection in humans. Below is a nice article on this by Bruce Charlton if you are interested in reading more.
http://iqpersonalitygenius.blogspot.com/2015/11/religion-as-proximate-method-of-group.html?m=1

As an aside this may also be why you will notice that the very religious on this forum often seem to be the most optimistic about bitcoin and confident in it's long term success. The religious have an innate affinity for consensus networks as they are already active members of one.  

You think I don't understand why the religions were invented?  Or what positive benefits they brought?

Primitive people needed common myths to co-operate with strangers.  Our ancestors would never be able to wipe out Neanderthals if it was not for the common myths.  We would be wiped out by the Neanderthals as they were stronger individuals, but their bands rarely exceeded 50 members.  

Religions allowed for larger groups of strangers to co-operate and this helped them survive.  50 Neanderthals did not stand a chance against 5000 horde of small, smart apes.  Sapiens exterminated them.

When agricultural revolution started,small cities formed, then larger cities etc.  You needed a rule of law to manage larger groups of people.
That is where religion was used.  This invention helped us thrive to the days of scientific revolution.  Now, religions are slowing down our progress.  Science and secular legal and moral frameworks essentially replace religion.  Religion is seen as a relic of the past.

Today, there are many other reasons why strangers might want to co-operate peacefully.  Religion is not one of them.
Religions are what divides us as humans.  Next step in human evolution, which will bring AI, cyborgs, colonization of other planets etc, will be done despite religions.

Religions hold us back.  The benefits it once had, are already achieved by other means.


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May 31, 2017, 08:39:56 PM
Last edit: May 31, 2017, 11:26:38 PM by CoinCube
 #1299

...
Now, religions are slowing down our progress.  Science and secular legal and moral frameworks essentially replace religion.  Religion is seen as a relic of the past.

Today, there are many other reasons why strangers might want to co-operate peacefully.  Religion is not one of them.
Religions are what divides us as humans.  Next step in human evolution, which will bring AI, cyborgs, colonization of other planets etc, will be done despite religions.

Religions hold us back.  The benefits it once had, are already achieved by other means.

Yes this is the part of your argument I believe to be false. Human nature is what divides us. Ethical monotheism is a consensus protocol that allows us to slowly overcome these divisions. A universal strategy is an essential foundation that enables freedom.
  
AI, cyborgs, etcetera are indeed coming. I take the position that ethical monotheism forms the foundation of a consensus protocol that will keep these things from destroying us.

I posted my reasoning for this upthread.

See: Faith and Future

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May 31, 2017, 11:22:42 PM
 #1300


Religions never helped us understand the truth.  Religions always provide the 'truths'.  And science has to work overtime to undo them.

Faith and science are not enemies. In fact, the opposite is true. One is absolutely necessary for the other to exist. All reasoning ultimately traces back to faith in something that you cannot prove.

For a convincing mathematical discussion of this point I would refer you to this excellent write up by Perry Marshall.
See: The Limits of Science

Humans have always sought power and control over their fellows using whatever tools are available. The most commonly used tool is violence but we will happily abuse religion too if we can twist it to that purpose. Secular history is similarly full of humans seeking power and control by any means possible. This constant and violent competition for power says much more about humanity then it does about religion.

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