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Author Topic: [ANN] [ETC] Ethereum Classic: Immutable Smart Contracts  (Read 820547 times)
This is a self-moderated topic. If you do not want to be moderated by the person who started this topic, create a new topic. (1 post by 1+ user deleted.)
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October 19, 2016, 07:08:29 AM
Last edit: October 19, 2016, 07:20:38 AM by greenuser
 #4821


What affect this hard fork?
ETH, ETC, REP... Huh

Hard fork for EIP150 gas cost changes successfully activated

3  ethereum ETH  $ 12.7477742 +6.52%

5  ethereumclassic ETC $ 1.0264320 -4.03%


 Roll Eyes

Pathetic performance from ETH.  They fixed their attack issue (for now) and they still can't maintain a price of 20 mbtc.  I sold all mine 6 days before the Dao attack at 24mbtc.  We will never see those days again. Or those difficultiy values.

Moreover, ETC should be losing miners with these low prices. ETC mining revenue is not increasing with the price fall as it is picking up the smaller miners from ETH as they struggle to make money.  Lets hope Bitcoin stays low for the momment so I get more bitcoin on my daily cashouts.
And I can't even get a node to solo, All i have is a centralised pool and a centralised client side wallet to use. So I am constantly at the mercy of third parties. Until that changes I will never hold this coin longer than 24hours after minting. This was not what crypto promised.

Boy we need a new PoW GPU coin to mine while PoC HHD is gaining momentum.

Monero is not was it was for mining on GPU although I still have some CPU on it,
feathercoin has too small market cap and no upward price movement.
The Groestle family are no better in the market cap dept.

I have all this hardware and no decent coins to mine.

Crypto is like TV. It's the 21st Century, we have wide screen HD 5.1 surround sound, the very best in hardware and no good programs to watch.  Just fake news, rigged elections and a ringside seat to military slaughter of world citizens.
At least the old RF analog TV had good programs and shows.

Lets hope the chinese can come up with an ethash ASIC at a good low price.

Barr humbug....

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October 19, 2016, 07:24:18 AM
 #4822

Some read:
Statement On The Hardfork To Address Spam Attacks

https://www.reddit.com/r/EthereumClassic/comments/57ipia/statement_on_the_hardfork_to_address_spam_attacks/?st=iugldwg2&sh=ad442f17

Hi everyone,
Very busy day for statements it seems but the silver lining I suppose is that lots of activity is much much better than no activity. My feed has been filled with some misconceptions by outside a parties about this protocol improvement so I wanted to state the following:
This is a protocol improvement.
This protocol improvement is very much aligned with our principles of immutability.
It has been stated by many since day 1 that protocol improvement is 100% acceptable.
The discussions taking place are about the pro's vs con's of doing it sooner as opposed to later.
General strategy and dev advice leans towards later. (Block 2,500,000 about 1 week 10-25-16)
A simple course of action recommended for ETC geth users by /u/bit_novosti
Use classic geth release (http://github.com/ethereumproject/go-ethereum/releases)
Upgrade to the latest classic geth release available at the above link shortly before planned hard fork date (2016-10-25)
For ETC parity users: continue to run parity, update to latest parity version prior to 2016-10-25.
For light wallet users (Jaxx, classicetherwallet): no change needed.
Update #1
Discussions with ETH on gitter have taken place. They are updating their release to warn users not to use their geth if users want to stay ETC.
Please voice your opinions about this matter, discussion leads to better decision making. Looking forward to hearing your thoughts.
Cheers
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October 19, 2016, 07:52:02 AM
 #4823

Some read:
Statement On The Hardfork To Address Spam Attacks

https://www.reddit.com/r/EthereumClassic/comments/57ipia/statement_on_the_hardfork_to_address_spam_attacks/?st=iugldwg2&sh=ad442f17

Hi everyone,
Very busy day for statements it seems but the silver lining I suppose is that lots of activity is much much better than no activity. My feed has been filled with some misconceptions by outside a parties about this protocol improvement so I wanted to state the following:
This is a protocol improvement.
This protocol improvement is very much aligned with our principles of immutability.
It has been stated by many since day 1 that protocol improvement is 100% acceptable.
The discussions taking place are about the pro's vs con's of doing it sooner as opposed to later.
General strategy and dev advice leans towards later. (Block 2,500,000 about 1 week 10-25-16)
A simple course of action recommended for ETC geth users by /u/bit_novosti
Use classic geth release (http://github.com/ethereumproject/go-ethereum/releases)
Upgrade to the latest classic geth release available at the above link shortly before planned hard fork date (2016-10-25)
For ETC parity users: continue to run parity, update to latest parity version prior to 2016-10-25.
For light wallet users (Jaxx, classicetherwallet): no change needed.
Update #1
Discussions with ETH on gitter have taken place. They are updating their release to warn users not to use their geth if users want to stay ETC.
Please voice your opinions about this matter, discussion leads to better decision making. Looking forward to hearing your thoughts.
Cheers

I have no issue with a protocol fork, lets get on with it, hay?

I have installed classic geth release (http://github.com/ethereumproject/go-ethereum/releases)
2.0 and 3.0 will not sync.

With Jaxx, you cannot see a transmited transaction before it gets a conformation. Moreover, you cannot reuse addresses so no good for pointing mining equipment to it.
classicetherwallet has poor security.  Do you want me to post some random private text keys alongwith their coresponding ETC addresses and a "how-to" to prove it?  How many do you want? I'm not gonna post mine (even though i empty it daily) but i will pull some at random if you wish.  How about a bounty?

Try using this stuff daily!

If you want to get ETC off your geth wallet,
use https://www.myetherwallet.com/#send-transaction

as it allows you to upload your geth UTC keystore file. Just remember to select ETC only.
It will also prompt you for the "password" you used when you set up your geth account.
By far the safest way to get ETC off your frozen geth. Just send it straight to a pre arranged shapeshift address to cash out in BTC or LTC, (no BURST option yet.)  Wink


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October 19, 2016, 08:51:49 AM
 #4824

Pathetic ethf celebrating hard forks like it's an accomplishment, it's disgusting

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October 19, 2016, 11:28:26 AM
 #4825

Ethereum Classic Price Technical Analysis – 100 SMA Holding ETC

Ethereum Classic price as forecasted yesterday moved down versus the Bitcoin, and almost tested the 0.00150BTC support area. There was a new low of 0.00153BTC where somehow the ETC buyers managed to defend the downside move. There were two important support areas, which prevented a downside move. First, a minor new bullish trend line formed on the hourly chart of ETC/BTC (data feed via Simplefx) acted as a buy zone...

Link
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October 19, 2016, 12:02:00 PM
 #4826

You remember ETH at somehow early stages? price was $1ish as ETC right now but now look at ETH price around $12 to $15.

Now just wait a few months to see how ETC will rise to the same ranges, people just need time to trust and adapt.

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October 19, 2016, 01:00:36 PM
 #4827


What affect this hard fork?
ETH, ETC, REP... Huh

Hard fork for EIP150 gas cost changes successfully activated

3  ethereum ETH  $ 12.7477742 +6.52%

5  ethereumclassic ETC $ 1.0264320 -4.03%


 Roll Eyes

Pathetic performance from ETH.  They fixed their attack issue (for now) and they still can't maintain a price of 20 mbtc.  I sold all mine 6 days before the Dao attack at 24mbtc.  We will never see those days again. Or those difficultiy values.

Moreover, ETC should be losing miners with these low prices. ETC mining revenue is not increasing with the price fall as it is picking up the smaller miners from ETH as they struggle to make money.  Lets hope Bitcoin stays low for the momment so I get more bitcoin on my daily cashouts.
And I can't even get a node to solo, All i have is a centralised pool and a centralised client side wallet to use. So I am constantly at the mercy of third parties. Until that changes I will never hold this coin longer than 24hours after minting. This was not what crypto promised.

Boy we need a new PoW GPU coin to mine while PoC HHD is gaining momentum.

Monero is not was it was for mining on GPU although I still have some CPU on it,
feathercoin has too small market cap and no upward price movement.
The Groestle family are no better in the market cap dept.

I have all this hardware and no decent coins to mine.

Crypto is like TV. It's the 21st Century, we have wide screen HD 5.1 surround sound, the very best in hardware and no good programs to watch.  Just fake news, rigged elections and a ringside seat to military slaughter of world citizens.
At least the old RF analog TV had good programs and shows.

Lets hope the chinese can come up with an ethash ASIC at a good low price.

Barr humbug....

Everything you wrote here is exactly how I feel, especially "have all this mining gear and nothing to mine".  The only difference is, I'm still using an old analog tube tv!

There are many that feel this way.
 
Does anyone want to speculate who's behind the attacks?
It would have to be someone or organisation familiar with this new programming language (Solidaty), have substantial financial resource in the way of Ethereum tokens and, feel threatened buy the existence of a new currency and world programming platform.

They would have to get hold of ethereum tokens to pay the gas for the attacks so they either have lots of mining equipment, move a lot of currency through exchanges or were on the inside the foundation and had pre-mined tokens.

It must be someone or organisation that sees ETC and ETH as a threat, although ETH have had the worse of the attacks. Or... was it a Vitalik ploy right from the start to put up the gas price.

Are miners providing a live testnet for the banking sector?  

https://www.reddit.com/r/ethereum/comments/589uqu/blocks_with_transactions_are_still_taking_a_huge/SophisticatedBob:%20xkrajnan,%20OMNI?

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October 19, 2016, 01:20:00 PM
 #4828


https://www.reddit.com/r/ethereum/comments/589l6b/lol_i_think_its_another_attack_contract_burns/

I'm mining Monero with my CPU.  If this attack come to ETC no way will i mine solo to my node. Set your Affinity now to be on the safe side.

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October 19, 2016, 01:47:45 PM
 #4829

Looks like http://91pool.com/#/ lost their US server. All miners inside the great firewall are still mining by the look of things.  

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October 19, 2016, 01:55:50 PM
 #4830

so are these attacks affecting miners, or only it makes payouts take longer...??
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October 19, 2016, 02:26:45 PM
 #4831

Looks like http://91pool.com/#/ lost their US server. All miners inside the great firewall are still mining by the look of things.  

Its seems like 91pool is down , the miners need to set up failover pools on their miners , thei can use coin miners or epool as a back up , the payouts are disabled for the moment on https://ethc.coin-miners.info/#/ until the network get more stable and i will set up the pool fee from 1% to 0.5%

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October 19, 2016, 02:30:09 PM
 #4832

so are these attacks affecting miners, or only it makes payouts take longer...??

The attacks on network affects both blocks as well as transactions become delayed.
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October 19, 2016, 03:02:41 PM
 #4833

Looks like http://91pool.com/#/ lost their US server. All miners inside the great firewall are still mining by the look of things.  

Its seems like 91pool is down , the miners need to set up failover pools on their miners , thei can use coin miners or epool as a back up , the payouts are disabled for the moment on https://ethc.coin-miners.info/#/ until the network get more stable and i will set up the pool fee from 1% to 0.5%

91pool back online

Ethereum currently have blocktimes of up to 50 seconds and a very high uncle rate, when is it our turn? https://ethstats.net/

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October 19, 2016, 05:20:28 PM
 #4834

Ξpool - Updates

Due to heavy network DDOS payouts are delayed. We hope to have fully operational soon.

We are operating in full capacity other than payouts. if you encounter issues please feel free to use alternative stratum servers.

us1.epool.io
us2.epool.io
us3.epool.io
us4.epool.io
uk1.epool.io
uk2.epool.io
uk3.epool.io
uk4.epool.io
hd.epool.io

Thanks,

epool.io
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October 20, 2016, 02:11:04 AM
 #4835

Pathetic ethf celebrating hard forks like it's an accomplishment, it's disgusting

Code is law  Grin

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October 20, 2016, 07:08:03 AM
 #4836

so are these attacks affecting miners, or only it makes payouts take longer...??

The attacks on network affects both blocks as well as transactions become delayed.

https://www.cryptocoinsnews.com/ethereum-classic-divided-proposed-hardfork/

Ethereum is to hardfork within 85 hours with little if any apparent controversy as the community moves quickly to address dos vulnerabilities. Ethereum Classic however seems divided regarding a proposed hardfork to solve an underlying fault that has lead to numerous dos attacks.

The argument concerns null accounts that contain no balances or code and are fully empty. Ethereum developers have proposed the removal of this “state-bloat” as apparently the attacker could create as many null accounts as he wishes at effectively no cost to himself, but at a cost to the network in storage and perhaps memory usage.

Technically, this is a “violation of immutability”, says one active member of ETC’s community opening a debate that has apparently led to the formation of a small community arguing that the hardfork would breach ETC’s main reason for existing, immutability. Therefore, they are to continue ETC’s current chain as ETC Uncensored, splitting ETC’s currency and tiny community.

Ethereum DAO

In comparable arguments made during the DAO debate, practicality and functionality is raised on one hand, with one commenter suggesting that immutability is “worthless in a dead chain” and idealistic principles on the other with some arguing that the attacker exploited the rules of the code, same as with the DAO, therefore over imposing new rules is a slippery slope.

The question regarding these empty accounts, for ETC’s community, is not without merit. From a practical point of view, we clearly want to remove the bloat, but from a hard ideological, perhaps even fundamentalist, immutability or bust view, which is the whole point of ETC, it is not very clear why these accounts should be removed since that would technically violate immutability which brings up an interesting philosophical question.

What is Immutability?
According to Wikipedia’s definition: “an immutable object is an object whose state cannot be modified after it is created.” We know this does not apply to blockchains, whether Ethereum or Bitcoin. They both can be modified from a technical perspective. Therefore, we need to add to the definition “cannot or should not.”

Should is a subjective term and a matter of opinion, concerning more philosophical or political questions than code, but it assists to establish three different categories for network upgrades as far as immutability is concerned.

There are purely technical upgrades, such as the current proposed fork, with decisions mainly based on technical aspects. These are not at all controversial, with little if any real arguments against it.

There are defensive upgrades where the decision is fairly obvious and beneficial to almost everyone – such as the slock.it dao upgrade where a theft was prevented with the agreement of an overwhelming majority, but a small minority disagrees for a variety of reasons from purely selfish (such as say thief sockpuppets) to more thoughtful considerations of how such upgrades could be abused.

Ideas regulation chain

Generally, upgrading the network in these cases has overwhelming and obvious benefits. Equally, failure to do so has tremendous costs for network participants and potentially the network itself on a social and reputational level. The network incentives, therefore, would probably demand an upgrade in most cases with the upgraded chain having far more value than the immutable at a cost of tens of millions chain as we have seen with the dao fork.

Then there are offensive, as in pro-active, rather than defensive, hardforks which almost everyone takes issue with and where the principle of immutability truly, and perhaps solely, applies. An example would be seizing satoshi’s bitcoins – a clear abuse of power, but, considering that bitcoin mining is so centralized and may well be a cartel, it might be tempting for miners to covertly seize such coins.

Here, immutability is necessary, but the question of should is irrelevant, giving prominence to the question of can which depends on the level of decentralization of not just mining, but developers, clients, and all other aspects. The dogmatic application or misapplication of this principle can therefore be dangerous if applied where it is of little benefit yet high cost to the network and its participants as, in increasing centralization, it places the network at risk of mutability where it actually matters.

What we may now see with ETC is the absurdity of the dogmatic application of this principle by a very small number of individuals even where the principle is of no benefit and in fact likely to be quite harmful.

From a dogmatic point of view, ETC should not fork, because the attacker simply knows the code better than any ETC dev and has not violated any rule of the protocol. Instead, the attacker is using the rules far more proficiently than any ETC developer. Therefore, ETC’s community has no right to impose its will upon the attacker by changing the rules afterwards as this leads to a slippery slope where the one or two ETC devs make all sort of decisions and might all the sudden censor ordinary transactions and demand that everyone provides ID to use the network (or they suddenly randomly start seizing assets).

Nonsense arguments, of course, but, since the whole point of ETC’s existence is a dogmatic application of immutability, by their own arguments, they should not fork. Practically, however, they have no choice, thus invalidating the dogmatic application of the immutability principle even where it is of high cost while providing as good as no benefit.
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October 21, 2016, 12:00:25 AM
 #4837

I had about 180 eth on coinbase  the day of the fork now they have "opened" the ETC withdraw but i can  only withdraw 109 ETC.

So this is true : https://bitflikz.myshopify.com/blogs/news/critical-security-update-from-bitflikz-gdax-coinbase-may-be-insolvent




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October 21, 2016, 01:52:13 AM
 #4838

I had about 180 eth on coinbase  the day of the fork now they have "opened" the ETC withdraw but i can  only withdraw 109 ETC.

So this is true : https://bitflikz.myshopify.com/blogs/news/critical-security-update-from-bitflikz-gdax-coinbase-may-be-insolvent





i had 50 eth on bittrex and i received 0 etc Cheesy
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October 21, 2016, 09:13:11 AM
 #4839

How to add ETC to Ethereum Wallet/Mist?
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October 21, 2016, 10:00:52 AM
Last edit: October 21, 2016, 10:59:04 AM by greenuser
 #4840

Is the etc network still up? Is it under attack?  Anyone out there with a working node that can tell me if the blockchain has stoped?

I send and receive etc daily but this morning....

I sent 1.335644399 ect from 0x0377c0fCA3C22e3F3cd12531F650c74BAcF5fBBD to 0x9bde13625043c9a0aa38a037543dd22fdfcd736d

Transaction submitted. TX ID: 0x21be26a7ee5c22b8fefc4d86e391bd21be46ef985b9dca0c1da24ae6012331ad

Raw Transaction
Code:
{"nonce":"0x06","gasPrice":"0x04e3b29200","gasLimit":"0x5208","to":"0x9bde13625043c9a0aa38a037543dd22fdfcd736d","value":"0x128929811ca29600","data":""}
Signed Transaction
Code:
0xf86c068504e3b29200825208949bde13625043c9a0aa38a037543dd22fdfcd736d88128929811ca29600801ba0226ed735f76b986106df2d4edaaed78414e50827dc8b72b5692126826640e293a003f901cda0db661880854636493350cdec0157c1b360fb9f0bf90e7f775212aa

No etc arrived, all fields are zero apart from, Confirmations = 2477036

https://etcchain.com/tx/0x21be26a7ee5c22b8fefc4d86e391bd21be46ef985b9dca0c1da24ae6012331ad

It is typical of the transactions i send every day. I haven't sent any more from my other wallets today until i know what is happening.

Looks like game over?

EDIT: I have ceased mining this shitcoin.  Anyone know of any other GPU shitcoin to mine where the payments are still working as they should?

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