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Author Topic: Obyte: Totally new consensus algorithm + private untraceable payments  (Read 1165139 times)
cryptohunter
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November 05, 2017, 02:43:28 AM
Last edit: November 05, 2017, 03:08:17 AM by cryptohunter
 #14801

It would have been very dumb to null top 2% of balances, because then people who have their balances spread over multiple addresses would continue to receive GB (and ones who cared would simply distribute over multiple addresses). If you had done retroactive snapshot, you could have effectively distributed all at once and airdrops would be meaningless, defeating the purpose of getting more users to link. Also, those who held BTC on an exchange, would not be able to withdraw and participate.

Also, the idea of not distributing to bytes that have been moved is ludicrous. The whole point of byteball is using the currency and platform. Most bytes that have moved were not sold on exchanges.

I think a new solution is needed, e.g. continue cashback program, keep 50,000+ GB for development and bring on a bigger core team, including some marketing people, and "ICO" some for the foundation to have BTC and $/ruble or sell on market at a higher price. Or some new method which tonych is implying he came up with.

I think a good sketch of an overall plan would be:

  • halt further distribution to btc holders OR cut it by ~90%, outline maximum GB/GBB to be distributed this way, and add a proportional distribution to ETH holders, and halt distribution when out of allocated GB/GBB
  • outline exactly how many of the remaining GB/GBB will be sent to GB holders, and distribute it in a special distribution or a definite airdrop schedule
  • hold back roughly 50,000-100,000 GB and use it for a foundation to support development and marketing (but mostly development)
  • hold back roughly 10,000-50,000 GB for continuing cashback program
  • use 0-100,000 GB for whatever other mechanisms you have in mind

This way the knowledge of future inflation will be precise and the price/project can have some confidence boost.



Please go back and re read my posts near the start of this thread so i need not explain it again.

The first distribution was the crushing one and far more important than all of the rest.

The retroactive snap shot would have prevented people splitting their wallet for the sole purpose of linking to byteball.
Or just put a cap on how many bb a single could be given to one address without announcing such limitations ahead of time. Tony has no issue changing a few small details here and there anyway as we go.

I never said fully distribute in one hit please do not create new statements or ideas that you can refute that didnt exist before you invented them.

Sorry mr eth holder I don't feel we should introduce more confusing and convoluted schemes here. Tony flat out refused to consider any other alts at the start.

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November 05, 2017, 02:47:39 AM
Last edit: November 05, 2017, 03:04:08 AM by cryptohunter
 #14802

However this great work of his is getting killed by his not so great idealistic distributional model.

Disagree completely. If it wasn't for the airdrop, I would likely never have heard of the project.

What are you disagreeing with exactly?
There still would have been an airdrop right? just not the whales shares auto going to competing projects, exchanges and the already super rich.

2011 of course you disagree I would too if i was sitting on a bunch of sub 1 dollar btc.


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November 05, 2017, 02:52:24 AM
 #14803

Question: Can the contract language in byteball handle crosschain atomic swaps?

Bitcoin's lightning network Atomic Swaps are working now on Bitcoin Cash, Litecoin, Decred, possibly Vertcoin, Particl, and there are different types of atomic swaps (not requiring Lightning) for other networks: Komodo, ETH, ETC, maybe Waves, Steem / Bitshares and others I would expect?





Atomic swaps can be done on Byteball. It is one of the many features.

Yes, but can the contracts be configured for cross chain swaps (seems this would be obvious)? Maybe, has anyone ever done it?
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November 05, 2017, 02:52:50 AM
Last edit: November 05, 2017, 03:09:21 AM by cryptohunter
 #14804

However this great work of his is getting killed by his not so great idealistic distributional model.

Disagree completely. If it wasn't for the airdrop, I would likely never have heard of the project.

The distribution method has worked well, coins are 60% distributed, no ICO smell, and price is still low enough to attract new investors. Every distribution method has pros & cons - PoW is incredibly energy intensive, ICO's have legal risk and are scammy, and airdrops favour early adopters and some whales. Nothing is perfect, but velocity of circulation ensures that eventually the coins end up in the hands of people who value them, and support the project.

Stop whining guys, BB distribution is going well, and if tonych decides to tweek some aspects no worries, it's his project, and he didn't earn a cent from any ICO.

Going great guys.

The super rich were enriched super style with no risk to their btc
The competing projects were given more byteball than our own dev and we are now taking away the promised coins from byteball investors to pay for development
The rest got some crumbs
These first 2 groups control and will make the markets now for possibly months or years.
Tony's earnings are unknown and not relevant to the point that the distributional model was actually horrible.

The velocity of circulation sounds nice but eventually can be 1 small step before infinity so that is small comfort to those that are 90% in the red for investing under the impression of accumulating more byteball per full moon and are now getting told that probably was just a typo and actually they will get nothing other than a 90% hair cut on their btc.


Great is non exciting word. Tell me how this could have gone Amazing/phenomenal I want to hear all of the terrifying details.

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November 05, 2017, 03:40:25 AM
 #14805

"You are expected to receive 0.111883569 GB and 0.236197403 giga-blackbytes (GBB)."
...
"Payment: 0.034343383 GB 1:13 AM"
...
Distribution of Bytes is now finished.
That moment when you're wondering where the rest of your Bytes are... Huh And then you realise the Transition Bot is probably just having a cup of tea and a lie down while the distribution is in full swing... and actually go and look at the "History" tab... and your current balance and do the math properly...

"RECEIVED +0.07754 GB 12 hours ago"  Wink Grin  Cool
"RECEIVED +0.03434 GB 15 hours ago"

In other news, it is good to see the Dev actively working on the project and putting some proper serious thought into the Distribution model and not just cruising on autopilot. Will also be interesting to see how the TitanICO plays out Smiley

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November 05, 2017, 04:52:37 AM
 #14806

I believe you will continue with such spirit and will make this platform most successful.
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November 05, 2017, 05:34:45 AM
 #14807

However this great work of his is getting killed by his not so great idealistic distributional model.

Disagree completely. If it wasn't for the airdrop, I would likely never have heard of the project.

What are you disagreeing with exactly?
There still would have been an airdrop right? just not the whales shares auto going to competing projects, exchanges and the already super rich.

2011 of course you disagree I would too if i was sitting on a bunch of sub 1 dollar btc.

Yeah, well, I'm still sitting on my airdrop byteball. There is no way to control what people do with their coins. You seem to have a chip on your shoulder about bailing whales, but do you have any data to show for it? My point is that without the distribution model chosen, it is very unlikely that this coin would have broken through the noise. Even though it has several innovative aspects.

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November 05, 2017, 05:36:42 AM
 #14808

where I can find a good calculator to see how much I can earn with each airdrop from byte ball?
I never used this system Sad unfortunately I have lost a lot Sad without claiming
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November 05, 2017, 05:40:31 AM
 #14809

byteball airdrops really are terrible, I don't know whose idea it was to constantly give away to people who don't even hold the coin so people only interested in holding BTC and dumping byteball immediately get rewarded on a regular basis, it's a terrible setup. Bitcore is a good example because it's a % based on your bitcore holdings so it encourages people to hold and accumulate. It makes no sense at all to keep rewarding people who just dump right away. I'm very disappointed with the way it's all turned out.

And yet, you still registered for it.  LOL

hEy guys so how long is this airdrop going to go on for? is it infinite or is there a set date and time for this to end?

Thanks

The the first post, or even the white paper, or even the information on byteball.org

anyone still mining byte?

You've never been able to mine it.  So, and I am now just guess, exactly ZERO people still are.

We've finally got our last airdrop and price dump is not a surprice at all. This project made us understand that airdrops are not good for coins, and especially when it is more than once. Byteball is a good example for the future.

You could decide not to participate in it instead of complain about it.  Or, better yet, come up with a better method on your own alt.
It's almost tiring to read everyone bitch about free money.


yet it still gives to just btc holders, even if it's smaller than it was it's still rewarding people who hold zero byteballs, it's a terrible system when they could simply airdrop based on a % of current byteball holdings. It makes no sense to keep rewarding people over and over who hold zero byteball.

And, I have to laugh at you again.
BTC holders get .000625 per BTC owned.    That means, a BTC holder needs 160BTC to get just 1GB.

Yes, this means a BTC holder must have nearly $1.2Million just to get $200 worth of byteball.   You're complaining that bitcoin holders get byteball.  Gotta laugh as I am sure someone with $1.2 MILLION dollars has better things to do that worry about $200.   You know, just to be clear.



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November 05, 2017, 05:40:44 AM
 #14810

cryptohunter, a retroactive snapshot would have blacklisted exchange coins for example, and also caused numerous other problems. Furthermore many holders have their BTC split between addresses already. Giving large BTC holders bytes was a good idea, not perfect, because they may also buy bytes on the open market or support it in other ways. Many of the *largest* BTC linkers haven't sold a GB. Anyway all has been said and done.

The suggestion to distribute to ETH holders is not to make ETH holders richer, but to market and distribute the coin to a larger audience. It is just a suggestion and I believe tonych has not taken it up because it is logistically difficult.

If you look at the market history on bittrex, it shows that around 500,000 GB has changed hands there. Many GB have been distributed from people who don't want them to people who do. You may have taken a 80% haircut to your BTC (counting distributions) which only is a 50% haircut to your USD, but that is not actually that horrible for a crypto investment which is very risky. It is a good thing in the long run that the price has been low so people who want to buy it can.

You were never promised airdrops for the entirety of the supply. It would actually be foolish to do that at this point price and value-wise, because that would inflate the supply more without guaranteeing the future of the project. It would be better to receive 25% on top of existing balances with remaining supply used for more useful things to help the project, than 50% on top of balances making the price 33% less and have the project fade away.
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November 05, 2017, 06:20:25 AM
 #14811

Anyone having issues with the byte ball wallet?

Keeps saying "syncing"

I'm guessing you are one of those people that picked a full node, because...  Well, I bet you don't know why.  Had you picked lite wallet, it would take a second or two.

In which country this will be working? This will be for limited countries?

Byteball isn't limited by country or world.  Even Aliens can partake... you know, if they're connected to Earth's internet.


Interesting to see that the price has dipped as usual following the airdrop even though it didn't rise much this time.
Byteball needs better community more investors to go it big.


It was expected.  It's done the same thing the last 6 distributions or so.  This time is was also expected since ALL alts are dropping.

However this great work of his is getting killed by his not so great idealistic distributional model.

Disagree completely. If it wasn't for the airdrop, I would likely never have heard of the project.

I agree.  I still didn't find it myself.  Someone told me about how I could get free tokens and sell to get free bitcoin.  So, I linked, and received byteball.  But, I read the whitepaper and decided I liked the concept and never sold a single one.  If I was in it for the money alone, I would have made a poor decision by not selling.  So, either I am not in it for the money, or I like the idea.

....., but if you look a little closer very few of the really big holders have made any kind of move. it's all still sitting there.

I completely agree.  I haven't moved any from primary wallet(s), but I have played with others for testing.   Never sold any.


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November 05, 2017, 07:07:32 AM
 #14812

I got the bytes from the airdrop but didn't the the blackbytes,were they already distributed?

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November 05, 2017, 07:11:57 AM
 #14813

I got the bytes from the airdrop but didn't the the blackbytes,were they already distributed?


The distribution of Blackbytes is still ongoing, can take a few days.

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November 05, 2017, 08:36:48 AM
Last edit: November 05, 2017, 09:09:48 AM by Marc De Mesel
 #14814


...
I'll decide and announce the plans for future distribution around mid-November.  But it is already certain that we skip the December full moon.  The purpose of the free distribution is in acquiring new users, and we should use the remaining undistributed coins most efficiently.  That's why we are slowing down the distribution and gradually phasing out the method based on balances, which is not expected to produce much positive impact any more.  Cashback has already proved more efficient in terms of cost of user acquisition, albeit it is still slow.  Other product updates linked to the distribution are still in the making but not certain enough to speak about them now, I expect more certainty in the middle of November.
Agreed, the efficiency of the airdrop decreases. It takes more people to fill the coin with value through their work.
...but they need a reward


Great news Tonych  Cool


I was worried the distribution would continue as is.

Agree with you and kola that remaining bytes/blackbytes are much better used for distribution schemes that attract more users per spend byte, as well as pay devs that develop things.

I liked very much your idea of some free bytes for everyone that installs the wallet.


What concerns me most though is the lack of sustainable business model.

How will devs and other needed development and marketing expenses be payed once the limited stash is gone?

I don't believe dependency on donations works well. Only a few donate and pay for the bills for all coinholders.

After a while conflicts arise and the model in the end is changed, as is happening to Bitcoin, Nxt, Bitshares and so many others.


Think Dash, Decred, ZCash have solved this problem well by having an unlimited inflation where a piece of it continues to go to the dev/marketing.

However with a limited supply like Byteball I see only 2 solutions, break that agreement like Bitshares did and issue more coins, or abandon the project and build a new one with new tokes like Nxt did with Ardor, or much better and not tried yet to my knowledge, have a piece of the transaction fees go to a fund that pays for these things.

A hard problem to solve. Curious in your opinion on this.


In any case, thank you so much for everything. Love what you have build!!!  Cool

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November 05, 2017, 08:47:03 AM
 #14815

I got the bytes from the airdrop but didn't the the blackbytes,were they already distributed?


The distribution of Blackbytes is still ongoing, can take a few days.

Thanks a lot for clarifying. It’s my first Airdrop so I didn’t really know how it works

Vechain!
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November 05, 2017, 09:05:05 AM
 #14816

Distribution of Bytes is now finished.
61,299.720840161 GB distributed
645,222.052937914 GB is available supply after the distribution.

Distribution of blackbytes will start in a few hours and will take a few days, be patient.  I'll post here when it is complete.

I'll decide and announce the plans for future distribution around mid-November.  But it is already certain that we skip the December full moon.  The purpose of the free distribution is in acquiring new users, and we should use the remaining undistributed coins most efficiently.  That's why we are slowing down the distribution and gradually phasing out the method based on balances, which is not expected to produce much positive impact any more.  Cashback has already proved more efficient in terms of cost of user acquisition, albeit it is still slow.  Other product updates linked to the distribution are still in the making but not certain enough to speak about them now, I expect more certainty in the middle of November.

Monthly distribution successfully acquired tens of thousands of new holders, but at the same time bytes always oversold badly. Short-term sellers enjoy their free lunch, while hodlers have suffered most. That's not healthy thing for the community...
Not sure the cashback program is the best way, but i agree that we should use precious resource for more productive way.
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November 05, 2017, 09:47:49 AM
Last edit: November 05, 2017, 10:12:41 AM by superresistant
 #14817

What concerns me most though is the lack of sustainable business model.
How will devs and other needed development and marketing expenses be payed once the limited stash is gone?
I don't believe dependency on donations works well. Only a few donate and pay for the bills for all coinholders.
After a while conflicts arise and the model in the end is changed, as is happening to Bitcoin, Nxt, Bitshares and so many others.
Think Dash, Decred, ZCash have solved this problem well by having an unlimited inflation where a piece of it continues to go to the dev/marketing.

I don't understand why you say that you don't believe dependency on donations works well and name Bitcoin as an example. It is the proof that a project can be successful without business model even though I do not recommend Byteball or any project to be like Bitcoin.
Conflicts are a consequence of success and high valuation, there are no conflict when a project has no value. See Tezos for example, one of the highest ICO ever and already a conflict before it's release. I think it will turn well for them because the class action is very likely to fail but in the meantime, Tezos enjoyed one of the highest buzz in all the ecosystem and became the most anticipated project.

However with a limited supply like Byteball I see only 2 solutions, break that agreement like Bitshares did and issue more coins, or abandon the project and build a new one with new tokes like Nxt did with Ardor, or much better and not tried yet to my knowledge, have a piece of the transaction fees go to a fund that pays for these things. A hard problem to solve. Curious in your opinion on this.

Interesting but I don't think it's a problem of busines model or funding at this point. In fact there is a business model to fund development since the start : 1% of all supply + 1% (forgot what was it for) + control over the undistributed supply which represent 35.5%. That is more than enough to fund almost anything.

From outside, the greatest Byteball innovation was, and I'm sorry for all the dev work, the airdrop distribution. It is still the biggest trend in crypto but it was too easy to copy for thousands of shitcoins that took all of Byteball network effect.

What about growing the team and partnerships ? Iota is spamming non-stop those weird new team members and partnerships between downtime, fatal flaws and emergency bug-fixes. They are so good at narrative that people keep cheering non-stop. It's all about the narrative, telling stories, sharing a vision.
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November 05, 2017, 09:58:22 AM
 #14818

Anyone having issues with the byte ball wallet?

Keeps saying "syncing"
It takes long time to sync the data.

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November 05, 2017, 10:12:14 AM
 #14819

I would say do this

his game. his rules. if it isn't working how he wants then he should change it.

i agree that the distribution method so far has been kinda silly, but if you look a little closer very few of the really big holders have made any kind of move. it's all still sitting there.

Well if that is the case my later suggestions will work great.

Reward the loyal but not the super rich loyal who have been rewarded quite enough already.

The rest of the short term traders and churners can eat cake.

The rest goes for development.

I realise his game his rules but you keep changing the rules people start to wonder if they are the game.

If it isnt working already then perhaps his own council is not his best.

I think tonych is great and I am quite a fan. However this great work of his is getting killed by his not so great idealistic distributional model.

I would love him to explain to me why he never just nulled the top 2% of btc claiming wallets or even top 5% and done a retrospective snapshot from there?
I mean answer me this so that i can follow it and understand and i will double my efforts to support byteball.

There must be a good reason but I can not find it without his help. I find it impossible to believe someone so smart would do something like that at face value. There must be a deeper reason i can not fathom with my limited mind.
I think,Tonych is smart enough.For him the result is more important as the game.

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November 05, 2017, 10:29:31 AM
 #14820

 
People crying about distribution are so hypocrite, it's mind-blowing. They're all greedy like all others but don't bring anything to the table except noise and uninteresting discussions. Why do you guys even reply to them ?

There is no free lunch. If you're still poor after years in crypto there is no reason it'll ever change and that's not a distribution problem : you are the problem.

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