Swedish ASIC miner company kncminer.com

[CYPER]

KNC setting up the datacentre:

That's Sam right there on the left:




Sam again:

[1715143310]

1715143310

[Mota]

looking at thegenesisblock i did some math and things are looking grim..wanted to know what you guys think about it.

Given facts:
- With an initial mining date of October
- Difficulty ~140 mil (now 110 + 30% over the next week)
- 1 Jupiter @ 400 MH/s
- BTC@140$

Results. This scenario with an increase of 77% until march next year will not break even!
Considering that in October we will most likely see 40-50%/11day increase since KNC is shipping, November and December mark the months of newcomers such as (CoinTerra and HashFEst)
The likelihood that the difficulty will taper off until march 2014 is next to 0.

Maybe i`m not seeing all the sides of the cube, but it is not looking good.
With BTC @ 180$ will have profited ~400$

again with this bs...
http://mining.thegenesisblock.com/a/9b3c1f63cb  
use this as a reference if you really want to calculate your earnings in dollar for the next 3 months. after that it won't work with this calculation anymore, but this is pretty much the worst case imo...
(notice the increased power cost for germany, another 1k for VAT, 250 psu and 150 shipping cost extra AND only 400 gh/s AND $ per btc at 100 AND a pretty much unlikely doubling of the hashrate from now to october)
NOW:
let's do the same with 500 gh/s and 850W (850 should be max. with OC (which would, again, be more gh/s)):
http://mining.thegenesisblock.com/a/9dd2b831fc

I am actually more than willing to put my money where my mouth is if that stops this fucking stupid posts about roi shit. anyone interested can pm me for a nice little bet on roi of knc's jupiter delivered until mid october.

[-Redacted-]

They ought to give out one of those cooler master bags with each order....

[rizzman]

looking at thegenesisblock i did some math and things are looking grim..wanted to know what you guys think about it.

Given facts:
- With an initial mining date of October
- Difficulty ~140 mil (now 110 + 30% over the next week)
- 1 Jupiter @ 400 MH/s
- BTC@140$

Results. This scenario with an increase of 77% until march next year will not break even!
Considering that in October we will most likely see 40-50%/11day increase since KNC is shipping, November and December mark the months of newcomers such as (CoinTerra and HashFEst)
The likelihood that the difficulty will taper off until march 2014 is next to 0.

Maybe i`m not seeing all the sides of the cube, but it is not looking good.
With BTC @ 180$ will have profited ~400$

I'm actually counting on difficulty to start tapering off for a while at around 2.201 Billion by February, and here is why.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=283820.0

The thread creator did a pretty good job of estimating the total worst case scenario based on all announced vendors which are suppose to come online and at what time and based off of this information, the genesis block looks to be accurate up until around mid February. I think this is an pretty accurate assessment but even with this bleak of an outlook, any KNC's delivered before Oct 15 should still make ROI (Albeit a low profit) or at-least get close to it.

The only possibilities it does not take into account is
1. Shadow corps which could theoretically exist that start dumping massive amounts of computing power into the network between now and December.
2. Failures by any of the other ASIC vendors to deliver on time.

Both of these would have a significant impact on ROI, however we just down know... I am betting at least one of KNC's competitors is going to be delayed.  

But as someone else also mentioned earlier on in the forum, by November they're will still be people willing to buy the hardware used. I personally depending on the outlook intend on selling my Jupiter's around the end of November and using those funds as my ROI/profit, which will then go into the next gen hardware around march.

[blastbob]

Simple racks, but does the trick Great news.

Seem legit!

[ASIC-K]

Simple racks, but does the trick Great news.

Seem legit!

+1

[Ytterbium]

KNC setting up the datacentre:

That's Sam right there on the left:




Sam again:

BOXES OF FANS!!!!!!

[plasmoske]

God damn those pics. More people will be betting YES now. lol.

I want to win big here

[ASIC-K]

i wonder what psu model those are?

http://www.canadacomputers.com/product_info.php?cPath=33_443&item_id=061579

[NetTime]

God damn those pics. More people will be betting YES now. lol.

I want to win big here

    ROFL me too!

[vesperwillow]

But as someone else also mentioned earlier on in the forum, by November they're will still be people willing to buy the hardware used. I personally depending on the outlook intend on selling my Jupiter's around the end of November and using those funds as my ROI/profit, which will then go into the next gen hardware around march.

For how much?

[FeedbackLoop]

i wonder what psu model those are?

http://www.canadacomputers.com/product_info.php?cPath=33_443&item_id=061579

Lol, very much the same model I posted earlier. Very stable!

[Ytterbium]

No you clearly have no idea what you are talking about. It is illegal to mention the word 'investment', or promise a 'return on investment' and then make that part of your terms of sale via the use of a clickwrap when you are an unregulated financial service.

Bullshit.  In order for something to be illegal in the U.S, there needs to be a law that says it's illegal. What law says it's illegal to say "investment" or "return on investment"

Earlier you were saying it was fraudulent to buy something with a credit card with the intention of canceling the order, which is clearly bonkers.

"Please read this carefully, as with all things Bitcoin one should treat this as an investment and make the decision best for you based on the liquid-able funds available at the moment when placing an order.

I accept the terms and the potential risks involved with placing an order."

If you want to hold and transmit money in any way you will need to comply with money transmitter laws. Bitcoin has been recognised as a currency on a Federal level. Bitsyncom has claimed to offer an investment by which they hold your funds and offer a return over a given period and then made you click to agree to those terms.

To compound this, there is the shadiness of the fact they pre-mined and purposely delayed equipment with a premeditated knowledge of the effect on promised returns, this is known and provable and had a direct detrimental effect on their customers 'investment', along with the allegations by their own staff they were in possession of significant numbers of chips from the end of June, before dropping all contact for a couple of months until legal action was threatened.

There is a significant difference between the above and what they should have stuck to, i.e. they manufacture a machine that spits Bitcoins, that is all the machine does, and is not priced on a return on investment.

Again, what you are saying is totally insane.  FinCEN SPECIFICALLY EXCLUDED people who SOLD PRODUCTS WITH BITCOINS from needing to register as money transmitters or needing to comply with KYC.   It's not illegal to sell stuff with bitcoin in the U.S without registering as a money transmitter.

Secondly, bitcoin isn't even recognized as a currency at the federal level, a single judge in one case said it could be money regarding the PirateAt40 case.  That only applies to that single case, and if upheld on appeal at the circuit level would only apply to the circuit (a group of states).

Pirate would have to appeal the case all the way to the supreme court and lose in order for that ruling to be the official law of the land.

You don't live in the U.S. and you clearly do not understand how the US legal system works, or what the laws actually say.

Obviously if Yifu refused refunds and never delivered the products, he would be likely be sued and possibly lose.  However, giving the refunds it's unlikely a lawsuit would be successful, and if it was it could only be for the cost of the boards, etc that people purchased in anticipation of the chips.

Claiming that Avalon units were financial instruments simply because he used the word 'investment' or "ROI" is insane.  People use the word investment all the time when advertising products. Things like awnings or clearcoat for your car are advertised as "great investments"

If you think it's illegal in the us to use the word "investment" when advertising a product then show me the specific chapter and paragraph in the legal code that makes it illegal.  If you can't find it, then you can't make that claim, period.

Also, you seem to be getting more and more shrill lately. I have no idea why you're hammering on this bizarre legal theory about Avalon but it's definitely completely insane.

“Collectible cars have always been a great investment,” says Donnie Gould, president of Auctions America, which is expected to sell upwards of $75 million worth of cars in a half-dozen events in California, Florida, Indiana and Pennsylvania this year. “There’s a lot of people out there who love cars and feel more comfortable putting their money in automobiles than leaving it stagnate in a bank account.”

Oh shit, better lock that guy up!

"Comic-book investments are more predictable than stocks. The Dow Jones Industrial Average DJIA +0.45%   could go to 20,000 or 5,000, but Zurzolo predicts comic books will continue to captivate new buyers. “At the conventions, people see my comics in the case and they say how much is that? And I say $100,000 or $500,000 or $700,000 or $1 million. And they can’t believe I have a comic book worth more than their house.”

OMG THAT GUY IS SELLING COMICS AND CALLING THEM INVESTMENTS, AND EVEN USING NUMBERS!? HOW IS THIS MONSTER NOT IN JAIL!??!!?

Seriously dude you seem to have lost your mind.

If it was illegal, there would be a specific law that said it was illegal.  Of course, there isn't, because it's obviously not.

[timmmers]

Man, these guys are really putting some work into this "scam" eh? Pretending to build a datacentre and buy loads of shiny kit.

I await some hilarious trolling about that being something else than  what it obviously is...some guys making a home for some rigs to live in in the very near future.

Thanks for sharing.

[vesperwillow]

Man, these guys are really putting some work into this "scam" eh? Pretending to build a datacentre and buy loads of shiny kit.

I await some hilarious trolling about that being something else than  what it obviously is...some guys making a home for some rigs to live in in the very near future.

Thanks for sharing.

You know damn well that's photoshopped!

 

[blastbob]

Wonder if this is a photoshop..

[Mota]

No you clearly have no idea what you are talking about. It is illegal to mention the word 'investment', or promise a 'return on investment' and then make that part of your terms of sale via the use of a clickwrap when you are an unregulated financial service.

Bullshit.  In order for something to be illegal in the U.S, there needs to be a law that says it's illegal. What law says it's illegal to say "investment" or "return on investment"

Earlier you were saying it was fraudulent to buy something with a credit card with the intention of canceling the order, which is clearly bonkers.

"Please read this carefully, as with all things Bitcoin one should treat this as an investment and make the decision best for you based on the liquid-able funds available at the moment when placing an order.

I accept the terms and the potential risks involved with placing an order."

If you want to hold and transmit money in any way you will need to comply with money transmitter laws. Bitcoin has been recognised as a currency on a Federal level. Bitsyncom has claimed to offer an investment by which they hold your funds and offer a return over a given period and then made you click to agree to those terms.

To compound this, there is the shadiness of the fact they pre-mined and purposely delayed equipment with a premeditated knowledge of the effect on promised returns, this is known and provable and had a direct detrimental effect on their customers 'investment', along with the allegations by their own staff they were in possession of significant numbers of chips from the end of June, before dropping all contact for a couple of months until legal action was threatened.

There is a significant difference between the above and what they should have stuck to, i.e. they manufacture a machine that spits Bitcoins, that is all the machine does, and is not priced on a return on investment.

Again, what you are saying is totally insane.  FinCEN SPECIFICALLY EXCLUDED people who SOLD PRODUCTS WITH BITCOINS from needing to register as money transmitters or needing to comply with KYC.   It's not illegal to sell stuff with bitcoin in the U.S without registering as a money transmitter.

Secondly, bitcoin isn't even recognized as a currency at the federal level, a single judge in one case said it could be money regarding the PirateAt40 case.  That only applies to that single case, and if upheld on appeal at the circuit level would only apply to the circuit (a group of states).

Pirate would have to appeal the case all the way to the supreme court and lose in order for that ruling to be the official law of the land.

You don't live in the U.S. and you clearly do not understand how the US legal system works, or what the laws actually say.

Obviously if Yifu refused refunds and never delivered the products, he would be likely be sued and possibly lose.  However, giving the refunds it's unlikely a lawsuit would be successful, and if it was it could only be for the cost of the boards, etc that people purchased in anticipation of the chips.

Claiming that Avalon units were financial instruments simply because he used the word 'investment' or "ROI" is insane.  People use the word investment all the time when advertising products. Things like awnings or clearcoat for your car are advertised as "great investments"

If you think it's illegal in the us to use the word "investment" when advertising a product then show me the specific chapter and paragraph in the legal code that makes it illegal.  If you can't find it, then you can't make that claim, period.

Also, you seem to be getting more and more shrill lately. I have no idea why you're hammering on this bizarre legal theory about Avalon but it's definitely completely insane.

“Collectible cars have always been a great investment,” says Donnie Gould, president of Auctions America, which is expected to sell upwards of $75 million worth of cars in a half-dozen events in California, Florida, Indiana and Pennsylvania this year. “There’s a lot of people out there who love cars and feel more comfortable putting their money in automobiles than leaving it stagnate in a bank account.”

Oh shit, better lock that guy up!

"Comic-book investments are more predictable than stocks. The Dow Jones Industrial Average DJIA +0.45%   could go to 20,000 or 5,000, but Zurzolo predicts comic books will continue to captivate new buyers. “At the conventions, people see my comics in the case and they say how much is that? And I say $100,000 or $500,000 or $700,000 or $1 million. And they can’t believe I have a comic book worth more than their house.”

OMG THAT GUY IS SELLING COMICS AND CALLING THEM INVESTMENTS, AND EVEN USING NUMBERS!? HOW IS THIS MONSTER NOT IN JAIL!??!!?

Seriously dude you seem to have lost your mind.

If it was illegal, there would be a specific law that said it was illegal.  Of course, there isn't, because it's obviously not.

You Sir have to learn how to read correctly. You argument is invalid since both of these guys did not say those specific words in a terms of service context. IF you have those terms in your ToS, you need to have the appropriate licenses. That is not only so in the US, it's pretty much everywhere in the world.
And please note that he is not liable because he sold goods for bitcoins but because he "promised" returns of investments to his customers - which only a licensed/registered/regulateted (insert any kind of money playing thingy here) can.

[Rampion]

looking at thegenesisblock i did some math and things are looking grim..wanted to know what you guys think about it.

Given facts:
- With an initial mining date of October
- Difficulty ~140 mil (now 110 + 30% over the next week)
- 1 Jupiter @ 400 MH/s
- BTC@140$

Results. This scenario with an increase of 77% until march next year will not break even!
Considering that in October we will most likely see 40-50%/11day increase since KNC is shipping, November and December mark the months of newcomers such as (CoinTerra and HashFEst)
The likelihood that the difficulty will taper off until march 2014 is next to 0.

Maybe i`m not seeing all the sides of the cube, but it is not looking good.
With BTC @ 180$ will have profited ~400$

Yep. It would have been more profitable to just have bought BTC in June instead of buying Jupiters. Difficulty just went to the roof.

Hindsight is 20/20. It was a risk, we took it, it didn't pay off. That's life, at least the loss is not too big if they deliver on time.

[The Avenger]

KNC setting up the datacentre:

That's Sam right there on the left:

Speaking of photoshop, I like how they blurred out the labels on all the boxes, just in case they gave anything away  

P.S. The power supply looks like a Cooler Master V1000.

[CYPER]

For ideal efficiency you want no more than ~60% load on the PSU. So people are getting a 1,000 watt PSU to achieve that. 850w is adequate but not targeted towards efficiency, on a device that will be operating full bore, 24/7, it makes sense.

Also you could get two 500w PSUs and feed one to each side, but I wonder if you face an additional risk if one board is powered on before the others? Might that cause problems?

The efficiency part is rubbish.

In regards to the 2 PSUs: just plug them to the same power extension lead and flip the switch = they power exactly at the same time.