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Author Topic: Swedish ASIC miner company kncminer.com  (Read 3011556 times)
Phoenix1969
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September 11, 2013, 10:38:36 PM
 #9141


Thought I'd have some fun...


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LetItRide
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erk
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September 11, 2013, 10:45:19 PM
 #9142

Looks like there are several 100THs+ farms going online not far apart, killing each others ROI. Just look how much of the net hash ASICminers have now, it's dropped right off. Each of their business plans doesn't know what new farms are doing online as competitors. I still feel the future of mining will be thousands of small backyard setups that need no aircon, datacenter rental, or staff wages. Bitcoin is designed to eat the margin of big players.
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September 11, 2013, 10:58:08 PM
 #9143

friendly reminder to join the KNCMiner team at 50btc.com if you havent already.

https://50btc.com/teams/join-token/8535027ea62c743e28985fb67df6d0a311549e69

On the KnCMiner team under ShadowBladeX :-)
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September 11, 2013, 11:00:27 PM
 #9144

friendly reminder to join the KNCMiner team at 50btc.com if you havent already.

https://50btc.com/teams/join-token/8535027ea62c743e28985fb67df6d0a311549e69

Joined up just waiting for my miners to arrive!
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September 11, 2013, 11:03:28 PM
 #9145

Looks like there are several 100THs+ farms going online not far apart, killing each others ROI. Just look how much of the net hash ASICminers have now, it's dropped right off. Each of their business plans doesn't know what new farms are doing online as competitors. I still feel the future of mining will be thousands of small backyard setups that need no aircon, datacenter rental, or staff wages. Bitcoin is designed to eat the margin of big players.

Will be very interesting to see who still stands once the smoke clears up. I think it will be a long and hard fought battle before equilibrium sets in and pinnacle of ASIC capability is achieved.

creativex
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September 11, 2013, 11:04:14 PM
 #9146

Looks like there are several 100THs+ farms going online not far apart, killing each others ROI. Just look how much of the net hash ASICminers have now, it's dropped right off. Each of their business plans doesn't know what new farms are doing online as competitors. I still feel the future of mining will be thousands of small backyard setups that need no aircon, datacenter rental, or staff wages. Bitcoin is designed to eat the margin of big players.

I agree and find it rather comical when I hear suggestions that only huge mining operations will survive in the near future. It may well be exactly the opposite.

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September 11, 2013, 11:07:44 PM
 #9147


My theory is this: They won't announce anything. They'll simply start providing tracking numbers to customers. Let the customers spread the word like fire to a pinetree farm. That'll be the best announcement which could ever be made.

Paul Revere's ride would hold nothing compared to KNC customers screaming they have tracking numbers.

You had me at hello....this would be an awesome way to let the news drop.


We'll actually see our units hashing on our pool accounts before they send them.

I don't think so.

Remember they stated that they ship on the day of production.
Put in a tracking-number for a day1 order, then you'll see  'Shipping on day 1 of production'
for ex. http://i43.tinypic.com/29e6p8p.jpg (found via google)
 
They will tell us some days before they start shipping, to ensure everyone can take a day off in order to be at home when the postman rings the bell.

So you expect them to ship untested units?

1) They are going to test the units
2) They are going to use people's pool IDs to do their testing.

So there is no way for someone to get a unit without seeing their unit hash on their pool first.

EDIT: I suppose it's possible they might send tracking numbers before they test. But presumably they are going to want to test for a while.  I don't think customers are going to mind a "delay" where the machines are actually online and hashing with power they don't need to pay for.

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September 11, 2013, 11:14:47 PM
 #9148

Looks like there are several 100THs+ farms going online not far apart, killing each others ROI. Just look how much of the net hash ASICminers have now, it's dropped right off. Each of their business plans doesn't know what new farms are doing online as competitors. I still feel the future of mining will be thousands of small backyard setups that need no aircon, datacenter rental, or staff wages. Bitcoin is designed to eat the margin of big players.

I agree and find it rather comical when I hear suggestions that only huge mining operations will survive in the near future. It may well be exactly the opposite.

Why would they need air conditioning? You just pump in a lot of air from the outside. Most likely mining will gravitate to low-cost power sites like WA/Vancouver/Ukraine/Kuwait.

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September 11, 2013, 11:26:37 PM
 #9149

Looks like there are several 100THs+ farms going online not far apart, killing each others ROI. Just look how much of the net hash ASICminers have now, it's dropped right off. Each of their business plans doesn't know what new farms are doing online as competitors. I still feel the future of mining will be thousands of small backyard setups that need no aircon, datacenter rental, or staff wages. Bitcoin is designed to eat the margin of big players.

I agree and find it rather comical when I hear suggestions that only huge mining operations will survive in the near future. It may well be exactly the opposite.

And maybe some of us smaller miners will get good deals on used hardware. Grin
btc_uzr
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September 11, 2013, 11:52:02 PM
 #9150


My theory is this: They won't announce anything. They'll simply start providing tracking numbers to customers. Let the customers spread the word like fire to a pinetree farm. That'll be the best announcement which could ever be made.

Paul Revere's ride would hold nothing compared to KNC customers screaming they have tracking numbers.

You had me at hello....this would be an awesome way to let the news drop.


We'll actually see our units hashing on our pool accounts before they send them.

I don't think so.

Remember they stated that they ship on the day of production.
Put in a tracking-number for a day1 order, then you'll see  'Shipping on day 1 of production'
for ex. http://i43.tinypic.com/29e6p8p.jpg (found via google)
 
They will tell us some days before they start shipping, to ensure everyone can take a day off in order to be at home when the postman rings the bell.

So you expect them to ship untested units?

1) They are going to test the units
2) They are going to use people's pool IDs to do their testing.

So there is no way for someone to get a unit without seeing their unit hash on their pool first.

EDIT: I suppose it's possible they might send tracking numbers before they test. But presumably they are going to want to test for a while.  I don't think customers are going to mind a "delay" where the machines are actually online and hashing with power they don't need to pay for.

No, I expect they test boxes before sending them, as well as that info about the day of shipping will be announced before there's activity on the test pool account. Not a tracking number, but info about the exact day.

!! File Complaints Against KnCMiner NOW !!
..and Thou shalt spread the coin in the name of cryptography for eternity
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September 11, 2013, 11:59:48 PM
 #9151

These huge farms will kill our chances of a profit to some extent, they will put people off the game because of the estimates from calculators looking bleak, then they will eat each other.

All in a pretty short time frame.

I think the system was designed with this possibility in mind and this scenario is a kind of defence mechanism to try and make sure too large a commercial concern won't prosper over a large network of smaller miners...which is the whole idea really isn't it?

Not great for us now, but when the dust settles it may improve. After all consider the fact that you can stop mining for 6 months and then see it become easier and restart...unlike a farm, they will long since have gone out of business, they can't afford to be idle as long as you. A drop in difficulty would probably be too late to help them, but you'd be a click away from mining again Smiley
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September 12, 2013, 12:03:43 AM
 #9152

regarding farms like

 https://www.cloudhashing.com/frequently-asked-questions
  "A1: (...) We are currently mining and by September 2013, will be operating at over 115 terahashes. This number will climb steeply to 300 terahashes by November 2013. "
  "A2: We expect mining for September contracts to start by 26th September 2013 (...)"
 
beside that..the date might be a hint for us regarding day1..?

edit:
actually it's not a farm I guess, since they offer their hashrate to customers..mining as a service

!! File Complaints Against KnCMiner NOW !!
..and Thou shalt spread the coin in the name of cryptography for eternity
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September 12, 2013, 01:02:53 AM
 #9153

regarding farms like

 https://www.cloudhashing.com/frequently-asked-questions
  "A1: (...) We are currently mining and by September 2013, will be operating at over 115 terahashes. This number will climb steeply to 300 terahashes by November 2013. "
  "A2: We expect mining for September contracts to start by 26th September 2013 (...)"
 
beside that..the date might be a hint for us regarding day1..?

edit:
actually it's not a farm I guess, since they offer their hashrate to customers..mining as a service

So how much is 300TH/s going to cost them to buy and run? I punched the figures into http://mining.thegenesisblock.com/ and it reckons the 300TH/s might make ROI in a couple of months, but it's a gamble because you don't know who else is coming online, the estimates are only at the known current growth rate. If it were me I would simply put the $millions into buying bitcoins, I don't see economies of scale.

I think it's quite funny that KNCminer talk about the ethics of ROI and taking a break until March for the net hash etc. Yet they are happy to support mega farms that totally fly in the face of the distributed hash concept of Bitcoin.

When the Hashfast, Cointerra, Avalon gen2, ASICminer gen2 all dump onto the market, 300TH/s will be a small player. BFL probably  still have 300TH/s of back orders to fill as well on their current 65nm products. The ASIC vendors are releasing too many TH/s per day, that's going to kill their own market, as the net hash is growing way faster than moores law, meaning they will rapidly run out of efficiency gains from technological advances, and the farms will collapse under their running costs. ASIC hardware is a classic pump and dump, it's didn't need to be that way, the hardware vendors have made it so, they could have sustained a sensible rollout for years.







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September 12, 2013, 01:04:56 AM
 #9154


Thought I'd have some fun...

that looks nice bro!

~~BTC~~GAMBIT~~BTC~~Play Boardgames for Bitcoins!!~~BTC~~GAMBIT~~BTC~~ Something I say help? Donate BTC! 1KN1K1xStzsgfYxdArSX4PEjFfcLEuYhid
ImI
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September 12, 2013, 01:05:25 AM
 #9155

Yet they are happy to support mega farms

Source?
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September 12, 2013, 01:09:26 AM
 #9156

These huge farms will kill our chances of a profit to some extent, they will put people off the game because of the estimates from calculators looking bleak, then they will eat each other.

All in a pretty short time frame.

I think the system was designed with this possibility in mind and this scenario is a kind of defence mechanism to try and make sure too large a commercial concern won't prosper over a large network of smaller miners...which is the whole idea really isn't it?

Not great for us now, but when the dust settles it may improve. After all consider the fact that you can stop mining for 6 months and then see it become easier and restart...unlike a farm, they will long since have gone out of business, they can't afford to be idle as long as you. A drop in difficulty would probably be too late to help them, but you'd be a click away from mining again Smiley

It's odd.. everyone assumes there are these 'others' that will take the diff to the moon even without ROI... 

So is mining just for non-ROI types?   Ones who don't mind paying more to make fresh coins instead of just buying them or perhaps folks that are 'too dumb to know better'?

OR..  will difficulty slow down since there really aren't that many of those in the non-ROI camp?


~~BTC~~GAMBIT~~BTC~~Play Boardgames for Bitcoins!!~~BTC~~GAMBIT~~BTC~~ Something I say help? Donate BTC! 1KN1K1xStzsgfYxdArSX4PEjFfcLEuYhid
erk
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September 12, 2013, 01:12:31 AM
 #9157

Yet they are happy to support mega farms

Source?
Um, the post I will commenting on above. Also I guess you haven't heard of things like ASICminer and 100TH

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September 12, 2013, 01:24:54 AM
 #9158

What do either of those have to do with KNC?
erk
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September 12, 2013, 02:06:28 AM
 #9159

What do either of those have to do with KNC?
Like KNC they are ASIC manufactures that supply big farms, and contributed to an oversupply of BTC hashing power that's killing most miners ROI.



AussieHash
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September 12, 2013, 03:08:56 AM
 #9160

Yet they are happy to support mega farms

Well they might not be happy with mega mines, but they wouldn't necessarily stop any individual from buying 110TH of product.
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