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Author Topic: Swedish ASIC miner company kncminer.com  (Read 3039472 times)
The Avenger
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October 26, 2014, 09:21:32 PM
 #38861

What the fuck is this meaning?

Quote
Due to the relatively young nature of the scrypt mining market we are not currently offering refunds on our scrypt mining products.

What has the scrypt mining market have to do with getting a legal refund? Such morons...

It has everything to do with why they did not offer refunds right from the start - they knew that ASIC mining would kill off scrypt coins and anyone who bought an scrypt ASIC would regret it. Legal or not is a different issue....

They are not as fast as you, just 1 year slower than you to discover that fact Cheesy

ckolivas pointed this all out for people in this thread months ago:

They know the score, and that's why they offer no refunds for the scrypt miner. Titan will kill all scrypt mining since its only alleged advantage is that it is not mined by ASICs. Once ASICs are mining it in vast quantities, the only people who will have any interest in LTC and friends are those who already own a lot of it. If there is no real advantage or purpose to LTC and the profit margins for mining disappear and turn into absolute losses, those who preordered with a no-refund policy will get royally shafted.

Yeah, that was March. He was correct.

People who are a surprised knc are devious cunts with no regards for their customers and ltc is tanking just didn't read the zillion warning signs posted all over this thread by myself and many many other people.

I could quote a million of my posts, but here's just one:

As I've said many times before, knc have nothing but contempt for their customers. They just see them as annoying idiots/imbeciles with wallets to take advantage of. We'll see this play out again for sure.

It did. What did we have to do to get you guys not to order from these fuckers? It was like watching lemming line up at the edge of a cliff when all you guys were putting cash down on Titans.

I got burned by these guys with faulty hardware almost a year to the day and I saw then they didn't give a damn or feel any obligation to provide customers with fully functional hardware. They've only got worse and more greed/more disrespectful of customers since then.

You guys who are getting involved in a law suit - organise yourselves! Maybe set up a forum where you can discuss your plans, don't just each individually hand over cash to some lawyer. Good luck with it

"I am not The Avenger"
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October 26, 2014, 10:02:43 PM
 #38862

I won't argue with Avenger's basic premise that KNC seem to be cunts but the rest of his self-congratulatory I told-you-so rant can't go without comment.

LTC's current depressed valuation is not a result of the existence of scrypt ASICs. It began quite a long time ago and has tracked BTC closely. It isn't just LTC that is in the dumps. It has lots of good company in the crypto-coin world, BTC being the most well known.

If you want to argue that ASIC's have killed BTC and that LTC valuation has tracked BTC, then that is different argument.

In general alt-coins have a lot of advantages over BTC. For example, they provide an area where experimentation can take place without the risks associated with BTC changes. Many of them are more suitable for use in payment systems due to their fast block time. Many are more profitable to mine than BTC for the average guy with a rig at home. The list goes on. I respect Con's experience and contributions to the cryptocoin world but his comment sounds a bit like an alt-coin hater and Avenger's comments sound a bit like he's still coming to terms with his own mistakes.


By all means organize a group action against KNC but get smart and come up with a workable plan.
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October 26, 2014, 10:10:29 PM
 #38863

Are there any known batch 3 neptune customers that still haven't received their equipment?

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October 26, 2014, 10:48:01 PM
 #38864

Everyone best take a look at this, we need to reach out to these guys and get ball rolling. Sign up if you haven't yet. http://insidebitcoins.com/news/kncminer-denies-abandoning-customers-though-admits-it-will-mine-for-its-own-benefit-possible-lawsuits-loom/25700
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October 27, 2014, 04:11:21 AM
 #38865

Everyone best take a look at this, we need to reach out to these guys and get ball rolling. Sign up if you haven't yet. http://insidebitcoins.com/news/kncminer-denies-abandoning-customers-though-admits-it-will-mine-for-its-own-benefit-possible-lawsuits-loom/25700

The above article was corrected to say the KNC still plans to sell equipment in the future...fat fricking chance of anyone ordering a pre-order in large amounts from them again

just lying and covering their butts looks better to say after the article is written that you will make equipment .....PR lie and correction by KNC imho

Try out www.synchro.net An 'Old School' BBS (Bulletin Board System) works on Win /10/8/7 and Linux!
Three-minute install. The last upgrade was Jan 1st, 2019. I think you will be impressed by this project!
AussieHash
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October 27, 2014, 08:55:17 AM
Last edit: October 27, 2014, 12:55:42 PM by AussieHash
 #38866

The only thing Knc will sell direct to consumers from here is their cloud hashing contracts. And people will still buy them.
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October 27, 2014, 11:15:14 AM
 #38867

Quote from: ckolivas
It has everything to do with why they did not offer refunds right from the start - they knew that ASIC mining would kill off scrypt coins and anyone who bought an scrypt ASIC would regret it. Legal or not is a different issue....
[...]
In general alt-coins have a lot of advantages over BTC. For example, they provide an area where experimentation can take place without the risks associated with BTC changes. Many of them are more suitable for use in payment systems due to their fast block time.

That is true of both SHA256 and scrypt alt-coins.
The advantage that scrypt alt-coins had were that they were not mineable by ASICs.
When scrypt ASICs come along, that advantage goes away.
Alt-coins have simply moved to different algorithms, and as each one gets overwhelmed by hardware, will continue to find new ones to move to.
The simple act of producing and selling scrypt ASICs renders them almost worthless.

BTC: 16TgAGdiTSsTWSsBDphebNJCFr1NT78xFW
SRC: scefi1XMhq91n3oF5FrE3HqddVvvCZP9KB
s1gs3gv
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October 27, 2014, 12:11:25 PM
 #38868

The advantage that scrypt alt-coins had were that they were not mineable by ASICs.

I know that this is a popular view and it is encouraged by those communities built around alt-coins which are still GPU based, but ...

There is no advantage to being unable to mine a coin with ASICs. ASIC mining strengthens alt-coins in the same way it strengthens BTC, by increasing the security of the network. Nor do ASICs cause decentralization of the network.

The reason many alt-coins adopt non-scrypt based algorithms is because they are trying to protect the self interests of their members, who are typically GPU users, not for the good of network security. There were GPU haters, there are ASIC haters and there will always be a community of luddites who perceive their self interest avoiding change.

Scrypt ASICs will be as common and inexpensive as GPUs are in the near future. There is no logical reason to fear them and every reason to adopt them.
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October 27, 2014, 01:02:41 PM
 #38869

The advantage that scrypt alt-coins had were that they were not mineable by ASICs.

I know that this is a popular view and it is encouraged by those communities built around alt-coins which are still GPU based, but ...

There is no advantage to being unable to mine a coin with ASICs.

Don't tell me, tell them.
If people believe that not being ASIC mineable is a good thing, they will shift to non-ASIC mineable coins, and the value of the ASIC-mineable coins will fall.
It doesn't matter whether their view of the cause is right or not, if the effect is the same.

BTC: 16TgAGdiTSsTWSsBDphebNJCFr1NT78xFW
SRC: scefi1XMhq91n3oF5FrE3HqddVvvCZP9KB
vesperwillow
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October 27, 2014, 02:18:17 PM
 #38870

The advantage that scrypt alt-coins had were that they were not mineable by ASICs.

I know that this is a popular view and it is encouraged by those communities built around alt-coins which are still GPU based, but ...

There is no advantage to being unable to mine a coin with ASICs. ASIC mining strengthens alt-coins in the same way it strengthens BTC, by increasing the security of the network. Nor do ASICs cause decentralization of the network.

The reason many alt-coins adopt non-scrypt based algorithms is because they are trying to protect the self interests of their members, who are typically GPU users, not for the good of network security. There were GPU haters, there are ASIC haters and there will always be a community of luddites who perceive their self interest avoiding change.

Scrypt ASICs will be as common and inexpensive as GPUs are in the near future. There is no logical reason to fear them and every reason to adopt them.


^- On the mark. I've had this discussion numerous times with people. They don't get it, and a month down the road, aren't sure why they lost their investment in XYZ new altcoin. Some people just will never get it.

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October 27, 2014, 02:27:25 PM
 #38871

The advantage that scrypt alt-coins had were that they were not mineable by ASICs.

I know that this is a popular view and it is encouraged by those communities built around alt-coins which are still GPU based, but ...

There is no advantage to being unable to mine a coin with ASICs.

Don't tell me, tell them.
If people believe that not being ASIC mineable is a good thing, they will shift to non-ASIC mineable coins, and the value of the ASIC-mineable coins will fall.
It doesn't matter whether their view of the cause is right or not, if the effect is the same.

I know we are going off-topic a bit here, though these arguments are relevant to KNC and the Titan in many ways, so I'll just close by saying:

You've got the cart before the horse here. The value of coins doesn't fall because miners stop mining them. Miners are incentivized by profit. They stop mining coins which aren't profitable. Sure, some GPU miners will quit mining coins that you can mine with an ASIC, because there is no profit in it for them, just like a lot of CPU miners stopped mining BTC when GPU mining became possible. BTC survived the transition from CPU to GPU to ASIC and so will scrypt coins.

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October 27, 2014, 02:51:28 PM
 #38872

I think this is maybe one of the funniest bitcoin videos i have ever witnessed - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D1GSKnJLcDg

$450 a day reward with one Titan? in there dreams maybe --> www.coinwarz.com

BTW video outside looks like Netherlands but it could also be Hamburg the guys talk German sometimes.  Grin

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October 27, 2014, 03:10:35 PM
 #38873

http://kncnews.org/roi
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October 27, 2014, 03:16:11 PM
 #38874


In November/December 2013 there were the glory days where you are able to mine $500 a day with BTC. but these times are long over.  

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customminer
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October 27, 2014, 04:56:13 PM
 #38875

"Natalie (kncminer)
Oct 27 14:58

Hi,

Our terms and conditions are in accordance with Swedish law.
As mentioned before the Titan miner is a nonrefundable product.

We will continue to produce and ship the miners as quickly as possible according to the payment dates of the orders.

Best regards 
Med vänlig hälsning

Natalie

Kncminer
www.kncminer.com
Office: +46 8559 253
20"
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October 27, 2014, 05:26:06 PM
 #38876

Magnus Daar from Nova responded to my e-mail. I think it is the best option for all EU based clients. There is already a number of people willing to join the group action (not a class action actually). I am 80% convinced to do it with Nova. I will keep you posted.

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October 27, 2014, 06:37:50 PM
 #38877

Magnus Daar from Nova responded to my e-mail. I think it is the best option for all EU based clients. There is already a number of people willing to join the group action (not a class action actually). I am 80% convinced to do it with Nova. I will keep you posted.

That's encouraging to hear. Is there an issue with North American or other non-EU resident clients participating ?
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October 27, 2014, 08:48:17 PM
 #38878

This is why I think you are guys are barking up the wrong tree when you set out to try and sue KNC Miner, you have to realize they are only responsible for complying with the Swedish Law and not any international laws. KNC is a pretty big company that they likely have confirmed everything with their own lawyers.





"Natalie (kncminer)
Oct 27 14:58

Hi,

Our terms and conditions are in accordance with Swedish law.
As mentioned before the Titan miner is a nonrefundable product.

We will continue to produce and ship the miners as quickly as possible according to the payment dates of the orders.

Best regards 
Med vänlig hälsning

Natalie

Kncminer
www.kncminer.com
Office: +46 8559 253
20"
Urgh
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October 27, 2014, 09:36:20 PM
 #38879

This is why I think you are guys are barking up the wrong tree when you set out to try and sue KNC Miner, you have to realize they are only responsible for complying with the Swedish Law and not any international laws. KNC is a pretty big company that they likely have confirmed everything with their own lawyers.

...

dude  Roll Eyes

I can sell you miners all you want for the best price available, but as B2H (Business-2-Horse) only.
"The Products are sold to horses only and Purchaser hereby accepts that it has purchased the Products as a horse."
Since you are a horse, you cannot make business and therefore I neither need to deliver anything nor refund you.

Just because one puts something written in the internet and call it TandC, it doesn't change the laws.
Let alone this B2B crap and deceptive marketing, refusal of refunds, keeping money of accepted refunds for several months, etc..
Even if most of their TandC would be ok for some B2B cases in the wild, it would not mean that it fits to KnC's reality and covers their fraudulent scammy actions.

..and Thou shalt spread the coin in the name of cryptography for eternity
mattie
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October 27, 2014, 11:31:33 PM
 #38880

Any tips on how to get disabled dies/cores enabled again on neptunes.
Got one neptune which is very stubborn even after upgrades / downgrades reboots the die's still won't come up.



Haven't had the chance yet to power down the full cubes yet as they are on a remote site.
Know previously we had a script to enable all cores again with a reboot by using a script on jupiters.
Not sure if there is any for neptunes?
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