Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion

[realr0ach]

As Reuters reported on Aug. 28, the gold industry is currently facing a forgery crisis — with fake kilogram bars found in the vaults of major banks such as JPMorgan Chase.

I guess gold isn't as stable or trustworthy as it's made out to be, or at least the gatekeepers in charge of it aren't.

Total nonsense.  Even small coin shops and pawn shops have the electronics needed to test gold and silver 1/20th oz to kilo bars, let alone MEGA BANKS with billions of dollars at their disposal.  You can even test smaller bars and coins with a resonance ping test and android app on your cell phone.  If places like JP Morgan have fake metals - unless all of their employees are running around drunk and high on cocaine - it's not because they accidentally received them, it's because they're attempting to create fake tungsten bars to scam other people.

[Bossian]

Just curious, why silver and not gold?

Gold has been a better investment most of the time.

1)  The gold to silver ratio chart highly favors silver

2)  Silver is the most artificially downward rigged commodity on the entire planet in the futures market and the goal is to buy low sell high
 
3)  There's something like 1/4th the amount of above ground silver now as during the 1980's metals bull run while there's twice as much above ground gold since then.  Hard to quantify the exact supply numbers, but they favor a massive silver spike moreso than gold in any type of 'free market'.

4)  To prevent silver from being depleted and disappearing like it's current trajectory, the price will eventually have to go to several hundred dollars an ounce to warrant recycling in things like electronics

5)  In any type of monetary metals revaluation, the west has a huge shortfall in gold with probably somewhere between 0 to 2000 tons only, so would likely attempt to buffer the gold shortfall with silver valued at a high ratio like 10-20:1 instead.

6)  All other things being equal, silver has better fundamentals than gold due to having more use cases.  Commodity money works under the context that if you hoard the entire supply, people somewhere actually need the commodity resource for something and you can ask whatever the market can bear.  Conversely, since Bitcoin is not a real commodity or resource, if you hoard all 21 million the entire planet can just laugh at you and you have no power over anyone or anything.

Thanks for the constructive reply. That's what this forum is all about.

[fabiorem]

https://cointelegraph.com/news/bitcoin-fixes-this-thousands-of-fake-gold-bars-dilute-market-supply

As Reuters reported on Aug. 28, the gold industry is currently facing a forgery crisis — with fake kilogram bars found in the vaults of major banks such as JPMorgan Chase.

Why am I not surprised?

[gembitz]

https://cointelegraph.com/news/bitcoin-fixes-this-thousands-of-fake-gold-bars-dilute-market-supply

As Reuters reported on Aug. 28, the gold industry is currently facing a forgery crisis — with fake kilogram bars found in the vaults of major banks such as JPMorgan Chase.

...fake tether bars found    oooooohhLLol

[realr0ach]

(((Tether)))

[Phil_S]

There are more countries at the counter online...>  https://www.usdebtclock.org/world-debt-clock.html

18% is the lowest, interesting...

[Hueristic]

A little, yet very important for bitcoin, history lesson:

https://wtfhappenedin1971.com/

My last merit well spent.


I have been saying for years our economic disparity has all stemmed from Nixon and been yelled down for it.

[lightfoot]

Every once in awhile I like to look at old bitcoin purchases.....

In March 2014 I bought a Wii U for 1btc.

I'm looking at it now. See how stupid I was?

HODL

[LFC_Bitcoin]

Every once in awhile I like to look at old bitcoin purchases.....

In March 2014 I bought a Wii U for 1btc.

I'm looking at it now. See how stupid I was?

HODL

At least you’re still in the game, bro. If you look around this forum sometimes you see old posts telling how people sold their entire stash for pittance.

I was saying to micg in Amsterdam that I sold some years ago which looks stupid now but I had to experiment & figure out how to sell. We’d be utter morons if we didn’t know how to sell when the time comes.

[Febo]

Thing is that when recession happens and GDP start falling down and government start spend more to revive economy then debt makes a huge leg up. So if you have now 100% you will have then 130% or 150% almost instantly. So all countries should decrease it drastically in last 5 years, but 3/4 of them totally failed.

[Icygreen]

There are more countries at the counter online...>  https://www.usdebtclock.org/world-debt-clock.html

18% is the lowest, interesting...

Interestingly that's Russia. They've been trying to participate in this grand game and print more debt for awhile now but sanctions slowing growth.
Mortgages, student loans and personal debt are a fairly new concept for them of which they seem to be piling into as quickly as possible. Sigh.....

[lightfoot]

https://cointelegraph.com/news/bitcoin-fixes-this-thousands-of-fake-gold-bars-dilute-market-supply

As Reuters reported on Aug. 28, the gold industry is currently facing a forgery crisis — with fake kilogram bars found in the vaults of major banks such as JPMorgan Chase.

Hope they are good at acting surprised

Note: The "fake" bars are real gold, however they have fake stamps for provenance.

So the gold people have the equal of monero. :-)

[Millionero]

They oughtta register them ingots on a blockchain.

[Hueristic]

https://cointelegraph.com/news/bitcoin-fixes-this-thousands-of-fake-gold-bars-dilute-market-supply

As Reuters reported on Aug. 28, the gold industry is currently facing a forgery crisis — with fake kilogram bars found in the vaults of major banks such as JPMorgan Chase.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-gold-swiss-fakes-exclusive/exclusive-fake-branded-bars-slip-dirty-gold-into-world-markets-idUSKCN1VI0DD

The gold is real, and very high purity, with only the markings faked. Fake-branded bars are a relatively new way to flout global measures to block conflict minerals and prevent money-laundering.

https://cointelegraph.com/news/bitcoin-fixes-this-thousands-of-fake-gold-bars-dilute-market-supply

As Reuters reported on Aug. 28, the gold industry is currently facing a forgery crisis — with fake kilogram bars found in the vaults of major banks such as JPMorgan Chase.

Hope they are good at acting surprised

Note: The "fake" bars are real gold, however they have fake stamps for provenance.

So the gold people have the equal of monero. :-)

Woops, you beat me to it.

[realr0ach]

If you want a horrifying glimpse of the SJW future and non-fungible, digital shitcoin future, here it is:

https://www.forbes.com/sites/jonathanberr/2019/06/17/neo-nazi-website-daily-stormer-ordered-to-pay-41-million-to-dean-obeidallah/#79c229535494

You make fun of some random muslim guy on the internet and they can sue you for $4 million and win.  If your money is in a bank, it will just be instantly seized by Jewish Marxists at the bank and transferred to someone else via power of the Jewish occupied court.  But how is Bitcoin really any different?  If your money is in any type of non-fungible, digital tracking and slavery blockchain system, your identification is already going to be linked to whatever coins you have and monitored in real-time in giant corporate and govt databases.  

Since a handful of (((corporations))) whose shares were acquired through (((financial manipulation))) own everything, they will all circulate shared blacklists to make your tokens toxic waste and unusable, and mixing will be prosecuted as a laundering crime.  Any real world point of sale use is also going to trigger your whereabouts and movement patterns, then the same Jewish occupied banks and courts will swoop in to try and steal your entire life savings for your $4 million fine for making fun of muslims on the internet when they become unhappy with simply blacklisting your non-fungible tokens.  Even if you don't make fun of muslims, you will accidentally call someone a tranny (which is hate speech) and get the same $4 million fine and lose everything.  TLDR:  Anything non-fungible is worthless garbage.

[SuperTA]

If you want a horrifying glimpse of the SJW future and non-fungible, digital shitcoin future, here it is:

https://www.forbes.com/sites/jonathanberr/2019/06/17/neo-nazi-website-daily-stormer-ordered-to-pay-41-million-to-dean-obeidallah/#79c229535494

You make fun of some random muslim guy on the internet and they can sue you for $4 million and win.  If your money is in a bank, it will just be instantly seized by Jewish Marxists at the bank and transferred to someone else via power of the Jewish occupied court.  But how is Bitcoin really any different?  If your money is in any type of non-fungible, digital tracking and slavery blockchain system, your identification is already going to be linked to whatever coins you have and monitored in real-time in giant corporate and govt databases.  

Since a handful of (((corporations))) whose shares were acquired through (((financial manipulation))) own everything, they will all circulate shared blacklists to make your tokens toxic waste and unusable, and mixing will be prosecuted as a laundering crime.  Any real world point of sale use is also going to trigger your whereabouts and movement patterns, then the same Jewish occupied banks and courts will swoop in to try and steal your entire life savings for your $4 million fine for making fun of muslims on the internet when they become unhappy with simply blacklisting your non-fungible tokens.  Even if you don't make fun of muslims, you will accidentally call someone a tranny (which is hate speech) and get the same $4 million fine and lose everything.  TLDR:  Anything non-fungible is worthless garbage.

You don't have any those problems if you're not insulting anybody. If you want to make fun, cashout at 100k or 1 mln and have fun.

[realr0ach]

Hey, bro.  If they make it illegal to be white, just don't be white.

[Millionero]

 throughout history fiat paper has typically been a derivative (receipt) of physical metals.

I'm not sure that paper money started as PM receipts.
This is Marco Polo describing Kublai Khan's paper money in the thirteenth century:

He makes his money after this fashion. He makes them take of the bark of a certain tree, in fact of the mulberry tree, the leaves of which are the food of the silkworms, these trees being so numerous that whole districts are full of them. What they take is a certain fine white bast or skin which lies between the wood of the tree and the thick outer bark, and this they make into something resembling sheets of paper, but black. When these sheets have been prepared they are cut up into pieces of different sizes. All these pieces of paper are issued with as much solemnity and authority as if they were of pure gold or silver; and on every piece a variety of officials, whose duty it is, have to write their names, and to put their seals. And when all is prepared duly, the chief officer deputed by the Khan smears the seal entrusted to him with vermilion, and impresses it on the paper, so that the form of the seal remains imprinted upon it in red; the money is then authentic. Anyone forging it would be punished with death.

https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2019/08/05/the-invention-of-money

[realr0ach]

Yea, paper money has been everything from free floating to a derivative of rice, to a derivative of physical metals and various other things.  But the point is that paper money that doesn't instantly implode usuallly doesn't implode due to being a receipt for an actual commodity resource.  When paper money tries to free float it's far more likely to just be a temporary blip on the radar and insta-die.  You can kind of see how this correlates into being a very negative thing for Bitcoin not being a real commodity or resource and all.  

If technology existed to facilitate Bitcoin's creation in the year 0 AD, it would not exist today.  Not because of dark ages or anything like that, simply because it's not a real commodity or resource and thus there is no reason for anyone to consistently place value in it on a long enough timeline beyond speculation (pump and dump scams).  Bitcoin would and will fall to the wayside like any standard fiat.  Fiats don't die solely due to printing too much.  They can die from people simply not giving a fuck about them because they aren't resources.  Which is why Aristotle says money is required to be a physical commodity resource and why Plato is an idiot.

[bkbirge]

So the gold people have the equal of monero. :-)

Haha! Classic!