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Author Topic: [1500 TH] p2pool: Decentralized, DoS-resistant, Hop-Proof pool  (Read 2034903 times)
nreal
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June 25, 2014, 03:06:29 AM
 #9281

He does if he wants people to switch on donations again. Anyway, if we can't ensure that future mining hardware is usable with p2pool - it will die - simple as that. The hash rate drop since his spectacular fail of a "statement/moan/bribery attempt" shows which way p2pool is going, it will only get worse as everyone gradually switches off their S1's.......

Copy/Paste of my last received email from Bitmain:

"Hi,
Thanks for the info.
Please kindly provide us compared version of screenshot showing that the different speed when you use the p2pool and other pools. we need to provide more details to engineers to investigate it.
Thanks for your help in advance.

Best Regards

BITMAIN"

As my node is no longer online (stripped down) I am unable to provide these - can anyone chime in with these?

Peace.
Tell them to install one node and test themselves... It isnt too hard i think, for them..
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June 25, 2014, 03:36:54 AM
 #9282

A fork is good too

If forrestv doesn't show up - a fork will be a required necessity........
Forking it will only serve a purpose if you have a set of planned changes. If you have a set of planned changes then you're better off in the long run just pushing code to p2pool itself. Frustration with the current development process does not make the code/changes magically appear.

Primary developer/maintainer for cgminer and ckpool/ckproxy.
Pooled mine at kano.is, solo mine at solo.ckpool.org
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forrestv
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June 25, 2014, 04:44:37 AM
 #9283

I am currently in email conversation with Bitmain regarding the issues with the S2 (& soon to be released S3) & p2pool firmware/driver incompatibility issues. Bitmain have requested more info from me regarding the issues, however the type of info they require is a few levels above my paygrade/capability - so can someone either post here or PM me the exact problem & I will relay it to Bitmain.

This is an opportunity for the p2pool community to help increase the hardware availability for p2pool, something that so far has been severely lacking for the last year, and is especially important for the upcoming S3's - let's not miss out on this chance.

How can I help? I don't have any S1/S2 hardware to test with (if I did, P2Pool would probably work with it by now...) and haven't really gotten any concrete bug reports. I gather that they have high DoA rates, which I assume is due to high latency responding to pushed new work or high latency sending results.

The main things P2Pool needs in a miner are:
  • Don't have arbitrary limits on the coinbase transaction size or the placement of the Stratum nonce within the coinbase (late generation Avalon miners are guilty of this).
  • Send results/good nonces as soon as possible after they are discovered (ideally within 1 second).
  • Start working on pushed new work as quickly as possible (ideally within 1 second). Also, don't drop good nonces if new work comes in (equivalent to cgminer's --submit-stales option)

If I am correct in assuming that the problem is latency, no simple solution will help existing devices. The parallel sharechains idea (which is my top priority) would alleviate this issue by moving away from the linear sharechain/30 seconds per share paradigm to one where latency matters far less.

1J1zegkNSbwX4smvTdoHSanUfwvXFeuV23
norgan
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June 25, 2014, 05:43:59 AM
 #9284

this http://www.norgzpool.net.au/antminer.html essentially fixes the issues with the S1 but that's with Kano's fix. 

Miner, tech geek, operator of NorgzPool - Sydney Australia P2Pool Node creator of p2pool fancy front end

Tips: 1NorganBbymShTN2MMpfGzRYJF8mcPeXjv Exchange BTC locally in Australia or Donate to p2pool miners
jdot007
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June 25, 2014, 06:42:20 AM
 #9285

************URGENT**********
@forrestv - This is your chance to prove to p2pool users that you actually care - I & every user here would like to see some input from you regarding this - please provide any info you can.....

BIG +1, S2's and upcoming S3's are ciritical to our success.


I'd like to start a bounty for forrestv to complete this.

I will start it with a BTC0.50 bounty offered to forrestv for a working solution for p2pool/anitminer S2 & S3 compatibility with the Ants achieving expected hashrate and shares.

Anyone is welcome to contribute to the donation address, bounty is paid to forrestv (or his designee) upon a working, distributed solution or returned in full in 30 days, I will pay return tx fees for any donation over BTC0.001, if your donation is less, consider it donated.

Bounty Address: 1Ft1DZ4EcpH1jFttDoPwsFbe11a6diyZ1H

https://blockchain.info/address/1Ft1DZ4EcpH1jFttDoPwsFbe11a6diyZ1H

Signed message:

Code:
forrestv p2pool antminer s2 and s3 compatibility fix.

Message signature:

Code:
G7zuvJ7/LPv7LpZveAsQWet1gAR42bnwFRVPB7NsnGqPnWkN8bqSSN1UwR+NnfDs/8LkruqZcVsTTdfcy5pcNj4=

Please contribute.


Edit: Any additional donations (over BTC0.001) will be returned to donation address or paid to Forrest or his designee on or before July 25th, 2014.

My hope is to pay Forrest for work done, lets make the bounty worthwhile.

Donated

7f9e8ad8756685ef911f3cbb2a0c4ae74b3851dbfa0f1b312154fdf689ee6b11
norgan
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June 25, 2014, 07:01:29 AM
 #9286

hmm my node hasn't picked up a share in over 5 hours. hashing at 700gh/s+ and usually a share comes up every couple of hours. anyone else seeing this?

Miner, tech geek, operator of NorgzPool - Sydney Australia P2Pool Node creator of p2pool fancy front end

Tips: 1NorganBbymShTN2MMpfGzRYJF8mcPeXjv Exchange BTC locally in Australia or Donate to p2pool miners
jonnybravo0311
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June 25, 2014, 07:05:58 AM
 #9287

I am currently in email conversation with Bitmain regarding the issues with the S2 (& soon to be released S3) & p2pool firmware/driver incompatibility issues. Bitmain have requested more info from me regarding the issues, however the type of info they require is a few levels above my paygrade/capability - so can someone either post here or PM me the exact problem & I will relay it to Bitmain.

This is an opportunity for the p2pool community to help increase the hardware availability for p2pool, something that so far has been severely lacking for the last year, and is especially important for the upcoming S3's - let's not miss out on this chance.

How can I help? I don't have any S1/S2 hardware to test with (if I did, P2Pool would probably work with it by now...) and haven't really gotten any concrete bug reports. I gather that they have high DoA rates, which I assume is due to high latency responding to pushed new work or high latency sending results.

The main things P2Pool needs in a miner are:
  • Don't have arbitrary limits on the coinbase transaction size or the placement of the Stratum nonce within the coinbase (late generation Avalon miners are guilty of this).
  • Send results/good nonces as soon as possible after they are discovered (ideally within 1 second).
  • Start working on pushed new work as quickly as possible (ideally within 1 second). Also, don't drop good nonces if new work comes in (equivalent to cgminer's --submit-stales option)

If I am correct in assuming that the problem is latency, no simple solution will help existing devices. The parallel sharechains idea (which is my top priority) would alleviate this issue by moving away from the linear sharechain/30 seconds per share paradigm to one where latency matters far less.
Hey forrestv,

I wish I could give you details, but unfortunately I'm half a world away from my S2.  What I can tell you is that when I point my S2 at my p2pool node (or any p2pool node for that matter) it will max out at 850-900GH/s.  I point it to another pool and it hits 1TH/s without issue.

I'd ask that you contact mdude77 and kano.  They have more details regarding what's going on with the S2.

By the way, the S1 works just fine with p2pool.

Jonny's Pool - Mine with us and help us grow!  Support a pool that supports Bitcoin, not a hardware manufacturer's pockets!  No SPV cheats.  No empty blocks.
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June 25, 2014, 07:10:53 AM
 #9288

I did - but not as pissed as most of the p2pool users are with him. This is his chance to actually participate - let's see  Wink

But he has no reason to participate

So then I guess you're assuming that if he actually was active on the project, then it wouldn't affect donations?

in any case, I had my donations set to 0% but I'm fairly certain I sent at least 1% directly to that p2pool donation address, from people with invalid names submitting shares

on the next update, maybe he should make it possible to not input a default address, so then ppl with messed up names end up donating their bitcoins, and you can still have it set to 0% for everyone else

Dacentec, best deals for US dedicated servers. They regularly restock $20-$25 Opterons with 8-16GB RAM & 2x1-2TB HDD's (ofc, usually lots of other good stuff to choose from).  I did a Serverbear benchmark of one of my $20/mo Opteron (June last year), it's here.  Have had about a half dozen different servers with Dacentec, & none have failed to sustain at least 40MB/s (burst higher). My favorite is a 12-month rent-to-own ZT Systems 2XL5520 16GB 2x2TB SATA for $40/month (got lucky with the 'off-brand', haven't seen a RTO 2xL5520 for under $50/mo since -- at least for monthly contracts).  wholesaleinternet.com has some ancient 2-core intel CPUs @ $10/mo sometimes (I got an Intel Core 2 6300 @ 1.86GHz, with a 250GB HDD with 46000 hours on it, LOL. $20 @ Dacentec is much better, if you can grab one). joesdatacenter.com (same location as Wholesale Internet) also occasionally has specials (or if you don't want to wait, it has an AMD Opteron 170 @ $16/mo).
jonnybravo0311
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June 25, 2014, 07:17:32 AM
 #9289

hmm my node hasn't picked up a share in over 5 hours. hashing at 700gh/s+ and usually a share comes up every couple of hours. anyone else seeing this?
That's just variance for you... my SP10 has gone for over 6 hours without finding a share.  I've had my S1s go for 22 hours and more without finding shares.  It happens.

Jonny's Pool - Mine with us and help us grow!  Support a pool that supports Bitcoin, not a hardware manufacturer's pockets!  No SPV cheats.  No empty blocks.
norgan
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June 25, 2014, 07:23:17 AM
 #9290

hmm my node hasn't picked up a share in over 5 hours. hashing at 700gh/s+ and usually a share comes up every couple of hours. anyone else seeing this?
That's just variance for you... my SP10 has gone for over 6 hours without finding a share.  I've had my S1s go for 22 hours and more without finding shares.  It happens.
cool cheers, yeah I figured that was the case but it seems out of the ordinary with nearly 1th/s to have so much time between shares. All good, still learning the nuances of variation and p2pool.

Miner, tech geek, operator of NorgzPool - Sydney Australia P2Pool Node creator of p2pool fancy front end

Tips: 1NorganBbymShTN2MMpfGzRYJF8mcPeXjv Exchange BTC locally in Australia or Donate to p2pool miners
jonnybravo0311
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June 25, 2014, 07:33:05 AM
 #9291

hmm my node hasn't picked up a share in over 5 hours. hashing at 700gh/s+ and usually a share comes up every couple of hours. anyone else seeing this?
That's just variance for you... my SP10 has gone for over 6 hours without finding a share.  I've had my S1s go for 22 hours and more without finding shares.  It happens.
cool cheers, yeah I figured that was the case but it seems out of the ordinary with nearly 1th/s to have so much time between shares. All good, still learning the nuances of variation and p2pool.

I know what you mean... I'm always thinking something has gone wrong.  Unfortunately, I'm usually on the other side of the planet when these things happen.  Whenever I'm home they seem to behave properly for the most part.  I think they're afraid I'll unplug them Smiley

I've learned that those "Expected time to..." values are not worth looking at unless you want to get ulcers and stress headaches trying to tweak things into oblivion.  As long as your node's efficiency rating/range has 100% in it, you're pretty much right on target.

Jonny's Pool - Mine with us and help us grow!  Support a pool that supports Bitcoin, not a hardware manufacturer's pockets!  No SPV cheats.  No empty blocks.
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June 25, 2014, 07:42:12 AM
 #9292

You could always manually adjust the share difficulty to get lower variances afaik.

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norgan
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June 25, 2014, 07:44:42 AM
 #9293

You could always manually adjust the share difficulty to get lower variances afaik.
you mean lower the diff?

Miner, tech geek, operator of NorgzPool - Sydney Australia P2Pool Node creator of p2pool fancy front end

Tips: 1NorganBbymShTN2MMpfGzRYJF8mcPeXjv Exchange BTC locally in Australia or Donate to p2pool miners
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June 25, 2014, 07:48:16 AM
 #9294

You could always manually adjust the share difficulty to get lower variances afaik.
you mean lower the diff?
pseudo diff only makes graphs look pretty.  You still need to submit a share of X difficulty to land on the chain.  Yeah, you could do something like this:

MYBTCADDRESS/1+1

But all that will do is flood the node with difficulty 1 shares from your miner.

Jonny's Pool - Mine with us and help us grow!  Support a pool that supports Bitcoin, not a hardware manufacturer's pockets!  No SPV cheats.  No empty blocks.
norgan
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June 25, 2014, 08:53:42 AM
 #9295

You could always manually adjust the share difficulty to get lower variances afaik.
you mean lower the diff?
pseudo diff only makes graphs look pretty.  You still need to submit a share of X difficulty to land on the chain.  Yeah, you could do something like this:

MYBTCADDRESS/1+1

But all that will do is flood the node with difficulty 1 shares from your miner.

my understanding is it ensures your lower hash rate doesn't get lost in the higher hash rate of other miners on your node. If you are the only one on your node it shouldn't matter.

btw a bock! yay!

Miner, tech geek, operator of NorgzPool - Sydney Australia P2Pool Node creator of p2pool fancy front end

Tips: 1NorganBbymShTN2MMpfGzRYJF8mcPeXjv Exchange BTC locally in Australia or Donate to p2pool miners
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June 25, 2014, 09:51:51 AM
 #9296

fwiw, a while back I also emailed bitmain about p2pool.  I also asked that they work with Kano ... and give him the code to their S2 so he can figure things out.  I got the same response, about forwarding info to their engineers.

The symptoms are as others described: they max out around 920-930gh/s upon startup, and slowly decline over time from there.

I agree with what others have said: all bitmain has to do is setup their own node and point an S2 to it to see what's going on. 

M

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Buyer beware of Bitmain hardware and services.
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June 25, 2014, 09:52:38 AM
 #9297

You could always manually adjust the share difficulty to get lower variances afaik.
you mean lower the diff?
pseudo diff only makes graphs look pretty.  You still need to submit a share of X difficulty to land on the chain.  Yeah, you could do something like this:

MYBTCADDRESS/1+1

But all that will do is flood the node with difficulty 1 shares from your miner.

my understanding is it ensures your lower hash rate doesn't get lost in the higher hash rate of other miners on your node. If you are the only one on your node it shouldn't matter.

btw a bock! yay!
Yes... a block.  Let's knock a few more out today Smiley

As for the difficulty, I'm not really sure how setting it would have any effect on low hash rate miners.  Your miner must find a share that satisfies the difficulty requirements of the share chain, regardless of whether or not you have 1GH/s or 1TH/s.  Currently, that is about 1.2M.  Setting your pseudo difficulty (by using the +xxx after your BTC address) doesn't have any effect on the actual share difficulty.  All it does is make graphs look nicer.  The lower you set it, the smoother the graph is - at the price of flooding the node with shares that have no chance of ever being accepted.  By default, the node will dynamically adjust the pseudo-share difficulty to get 1 share per second:

Code:
target = min(target, bitcoin_data.average_attempts_to_target(local_hash_rate * 1))

I think setting the difficulty (using the /xxx after your BTC address) is really more for the miners with exceptionally high hash rates compared to others.  I'm not sure anyone actually uses this.  However, like with setting pseudo-difficulty, the node dynamically adjusts your difficulty to limit you to 1.67% of the pool's shares:

Code:
desired_share_target = min(desired_share_target, bitcoin_data.average_attempts_to_target(local_hash_rate * self.node.net.SHARE_PERIOD / 0.0167))

Jonny's Pool - Mine with us and help us grow!  Support a pool that supports Bitcoin, not a hardware manufacturer's pockets!  No SPV cheats.  No empty blocks.
norgan
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June 25, 2014, 11:09:46 AM
 #9298

Interesting, thanks for that. I've removed it from my S1 and it seems to hash a little bit higher now and can see the diff adjusting. will let that run for a it and see how it looks.
Just when you think you are starting to understand it all, something pops up and you re-evaluate your tactic lol

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June 25, 2014, 11:21:04 AM
 #9299

Hey guys,

Thanks to everyone for the info regarding the S2 (S3) p2pool issues. I have just rebuilt my node & am syncing the wallets now - as soon as it's ready I will take the screens requested by Bitmain & send everything off to them. Thanks & kudos to Kano for getting back to me also, his work on the S1 & S2's is massive.
There are still a couple of hours worth of syncing to be done, so if anyone has anything else to add that they think might help, just post or PM me.

Lets hope we can get it sorted  Wink

"When one person is deluded it is called insanity - when many people are deluded it is called religion" - Robert M. Pirsig.  I don't want your coins, I want change.
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June 25, 2014, 11:37:24 AM
 #9300

Hey guys,

Thanks to everyone for the info regarding the S2 (S3) p2pool issues. I have just rebuilt my node & am syncing the wallets now - as soon as it's ready I will take the screens requested by Bitmain & send everything off to them. Thanks & kudos to Kano for getting back to me also, his work on the S1 & S2's is massive.
There are still a couple of hours worth of syncing to be done, so if anyone has anything else to add that they think might help, just post or PM me.

Lets hope we can get it sorted  Wink

Nice one Patman.

I still find it ironic that we see pool rate drop and blocks fewer but we seem to be getting more traction on code development. I can't help but speculate what that means for p2pool.
Will petamine add their hashing to p2pool effectively pushing us all out due to diff rising or will a change come that no only avoids this but even perhaps takes advantage of it, as in more blocks for miners on p2pool. and the even stranger thing is the number of donations made to p2pool of late.

Funny times we are seeing right now.

Miner, tech geek, operator of NorgzPool - Sydney Australia P2Pool Node creator of p2pool fancy front end

Tips: 1NorganBbymShTN2MMpfGzRYJF8mcPeXjv Exchange BTC locally in Australia or Donate to p2pool miners
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