Liquid Synergy Designs Inc. -ASIC mining hardware

[ibminer]

Many of us were forced to adhere to the June 30th deadline... (which I did, I made payment on time, as requested... because I was told the money was needed to secure the parts for those batches!!)  If I had known I was securing parts for other chip purchases, you would have seen a completely different tune from me.

After all of that, the deadline ended up getting 'lifted' on july 1st, the day AFTER the deadline.

The website wasn't even open to other chip purchases until July 13th...
http://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=192916.msg2722887#msg2722887

It is not making any sense to me why the coins I sent to secure 'parts' for batches 1-4 was somehow batches 1-4 of every chip purchase that exists.

[ibminer]

Assembly is open to those who purchased from other group buys, however; miners assembled from chips arriving through other group purchases will experience significant delays due to increased shipping and processing times, and will not be processed until all units from this group buy have been completed. Additionally, these chips will be processed in a FIFO queue, which will begin once the minimum board run quota has been reached.  

I was looking for this, I believe I had seen roughly the same comment... was this in an email?  What's the source?


EDIT: Found it..

That is correct. Assembly is processed per batch. In the event all the batches arrive at once, assembly will process each batch before continuing to the next.

Payment for assembly is due as soon as possible. We are willing to work with you due to extenuating circumstances, which are reviewed on a case by case basis.

Queue placement ability is very low on the priority of items which need to be finished for unit delivery in time. The longer it takes to make the payment, the more strain you put on our finances to cover the cost until you do.

[quiksilver911]

I'm not sure why everyone is getting ruffled.

I take steamboat's statement to mean that if you have not paid for components/assembly through his website, its not his fault if he runs out of components. This is especially pertinent for early batches. For example, if you are in batch 1, and you have not paid for components/assembly, and steamboat runs out of components because other chips arrive (his own batches and/or other group buys) that have paid for components/assembly, then you will face delays until steamboat orders another few pallets of components.

Assuming the above is true, I also think this is fair. He can't sit on his thumbs hoping that early batchers that are late to pay for components/assembly will do so eventually, while holding back customers that have paid for components/assembly, and their chips have arrived.

So, if you have already paid for components/assembly before the 30th June deadline (or perhaps even a couple of days after that) I don't think you have anything to worry about.

[nightengale]

I would just like to know that the components I've already paid for will be held until the chips that I purchased via this group buy arrive, even if they are in batches 3 & 4.

Hopefully this is still the case and how Steamboat's statements can be interpreted.

[eroxors]

I'm not sure why everyone is getting ruffled.

Ambiguity and mission-creep. Not that it isn't warranted or fair, but that's why.

[logicbomb666]

I'm concerned about the possible delay in my order just like everyone else.  I purchased my chips in batch 5, and paid for my assembly within the first deadline.

My calculations on delivery for my units from steamboat are late September at the earliest.  Now with a possible delay due to parts being used up, this could push delivery for who knows how long.  Any delays could push my orders so far back I might as well purchased paper-weights somewhere else. 

[cp1]

I'm not sure why everyone is getting ruffled.

I take steamboat's statement to mean that if you have not paid for components/assembly through his website, its not his fault if he runs out of components. This is especially pertinent for early batches. For example, if you are in batch 1, and you have not paid for components/assembly, and steamboat runs out of components because other chips arrive (his own batches and/or other group buys) that have paid for components/assembly, then you will face delays until steamboat orders another few pallets of components.

Assuming the above is true, I also think this is fair. He can't sit on his thumbs hoping that early batchers that are late to pay for components/assembly will do so eventually, while holding back customers that have paid for components/assembly, and their chips have arrived.

So, if you have already paid for components/assembly before the 30th June deadline (or perhaps even a couple of days after that) I don't think you have anything to worry about.

People signed onto this chip group buy because it was being bundled with an assembly service.  Everyone thought that steamboat chip purchasers would get priority use of steamboat's assembly services.  But now it seems that there's only enough components for 4.8 batches at this time and someone in steamboat batch 2 or 3 could be waiting for a significant parts delay if another chip group buy sends a significant amount of chips to him first.  We were not anticipating to have to fight with other chip group buys; we thought our batch # in steamboat's group buy would be the main factor.

[Galli]

I'm not sure why everyone is getting ruffled.

I take steamboat's statement to mean that if you have not paid for components/assembly through his website, its not his fault if he runs out of components. This is especially pertinent for early batches. For example, if you are in batch 1, and you have not paid for components/assembly, and steamboat runs out of components because other chips arrive (his own batches and/or other group buys) that have paid for components/assembly, then you will face delays until steamboat orders another few pallets of components.

Assuming the above is true, I also think this is fair. He can't sit on his thumbs hoping that early batchers that are late to pay for components/assembly will do so eventually, while holding back customers that have paid for components/assembly, and their chips have arrived.

So, if you have already paid for components/assembly before the 30th June deadline (or perhaps even a couple of days after that) I don't think you have anything to worry about.

People signed onto this chip group buy because it was being bundled with an assembly service.  Everyone thought that steamboat chip purchasers would get priority use of steamboat's assembly services.  But now it seems that there's only enough components for 4.8 batches at this time and someone in steamboat batch 2 or 3 could be waiting for a significant parts delay if another chip group buy sends a significant amount of chips to him first.  We were not anticipating to have to fight with other chip group buys; we thought our batch # in steamboat's group buy would be the main factor.

I agree and additionally we pre-paid for the components before June 30th essentially footing the bill for Steamboat to order parts with no upfront risk to them...  Now other users get to benefit from our financial risk? Not cool

[dentldir]

I'm not sure why everyone is getting ruffled.

Ambiguity and mission-creep. Not that it isn't warranted or fair, but that's why.

Agreed.  The ambiguity presents a counter party risk and a change in terms that are inconsistent with the rest of the written agreement.

It seems unlikely that we paid to have a bunch of strangers get their boards assembled.  So lets wait to see what the man has to say.

[ik2013]

More parts would be sourced fairly quickly as compared to the time frame in which chip batches 4+ and up come in weeks from now, I would think. Probably even earlier than batch4, more parts will be sourced. Steamboat is kicking ass in every corner around the street to keep everyone satisfied.   

Steamboat's choice of words: "considerable delays", concerns me. I paid for assembly services and components in good faith, and on time. My timely payment helped fund all of the components that are sitting in his warehouse. And now that I've paid up front, it is revealed that individuals with chips from other group buys will be given precedence over my order, with "significant delays" anticipated.

This is not right.

The delays likely stem from component shortages. Factory lead times for these components range from 2-10 weeks or longer. Bkk discusses it briefly here: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=190731.msg2795290#msg2795290

I am with you about having paid up front and on time though. Not feeling good about the last update, now is not the time for ambiguity.

[ionstorm]

I *hope* steamboat gives priority for those of us whom ordered chips and assembly the soonest, since he said that those of us who got in early the profits are funding the bulk of the components.  Other than this, what time frame are we looking at recieving batch 1 & 2 chips and having them assembled and shipped?

[eroxors]

At least we know that Steamboat is an honorable manager adept at overseeing the project progress and has been (so far) more than gracious to his customers.

That being said, he is in a very tough situation. If Avalon ships based on order time instead of in lump batches (which I'm grateful for, and it appears that way), then Steamboat is stuck with with potentially 8? weeks between batch 1 and 6 and he can't just sit on Zefir/Ragin/other chips from paying assembly customers while waiting for his own group buy chips to arrive.

Personally, I thought that we would have priority, but I can't expect him to turn down business to wait. I also thought that the order of chip purchase had priority for assembly and then I was leapfrogged by those who ordered assembly in B1 before me on the site (my mistake, I'm just bitter about it).

Anyway, thank you Steamboat for your hard work, we're all very confident in your abilities. How are you recovering from bronchitis?

[miner_btc]

Ok so I am in batch 4 likely right around the cutoff with currently ordered supplies. I paid up front for assembly by the june 30 deadline so I could secure my place in line. BTC at that time had just crashed and had I been able to wait, could have paid less. IF I now have to wait 2-10 weeks for parts to arrive because others who did not pay with crashing BTC values swoop in and buy the parts that I *ALREADY PAID FOR*, that's just dirty. Please Steamboat, say it ain't so!

Now, that being said, nothing about the way Steamboat has acted thus far in this process leads me to believe he would pull such a thing. He has been nothing but honorable and fair up to this point and I appreciate all of his work putting this all together. I am hoping for a clarification on all of this that alleviates these doubts that have emerged with the most recent update. Steamboat please clarify.

[alfabitcoin]

At least we know that Steamboat is an honorable manager adept at overseeing the project progress and has been (so far) more than gracious to his customers.

That being said, he is in a very tough situation. If Avalon ships based on order time instead of in lump batches (which I'm grateful for, and it appears that way), then Steamboat is stuck with with potentially 8? weeks between batch 1 and 6 and he can't just sit on Zefir/Ragin/other chips from paying assembly customers while waiting for his own group buy chips to arrive.

Personally, I thought that we would have priority, but I can't expect him to turn down business to wait. I also thought that the order of chip purchase had priority for assembly and then I was leapfrogged by those who ordered assembly in B1 before me on the site (my mistake, I'm just bitter about it).

Anyway, thank you Steamboat for your hard work, we're all very confident in your abilities. How are you recovering from bronchitis?

But those who already paid in full need to be served when chips arrive and all components secured. It does not matter when chips arrive. Its done deal and we secured units from those 3000 availiable.
If he have excess of components then by all means offer it to those who has chips.

However, I am sure that steamboat do it right and fair and need to clearify it and state precisly.

[kostagr33k]

I think https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=192916.msg2801613#msg2801613  was well put.

instead of all of us jumping the gun, lets wait for Steamboat to make a follow up post. I feel that those who pre-ordered are safe, but the people who did not pay for the assembly service Yet, or after the deadline may have to wait until more parts are ordered.

I would suggest, depending on what Steamboat says, is for *all* people who have chips to decide what they want to do. *IF* you want to secure your assembly, you should order ASAP because if *all* chips that need assembly pay for that service ASAP, then ordering for those extra parts can be done.

Since he is buying in bulk (as noticed in the pictures) he can't just order 10 fans here, 10 cables here, etc. These need to be in large quantity batches, or pricing will be  A LOT more then he is securing them for, and that would cause problems.

Maybe we can work something out to ensure the remaining chips get mated to boards, or finalize those people who just want their chips shipped without assembly.


kosta

[cardcomm]

I'm sure this will all be made clear by Steamboat. He's shown repeatedly that he will do the right thing. I'm confident he will do the right thing and reserve the parts for those of us in the group buy that have already paid for assembly.

Steamboat - I know you are quite busy, but could you please explicitly address this issue ASAP? I think we are all looking for explicit insight into just how many of the existing batches will be covered by the current parts shipment.

Will there be enough parts to complete ALL current group buy orders (or at least those that have already ordered assembly)?

[dmcdad]

I'll just add my +1 for this entire discussion: I'm in chip batch 5 and was one of the first to pay for complete assembly+testing for all my chips on the assumption that the money would go to securing the parts for my order, not someone else's order. If my chips come in I am expecting the parts to be there and not to have been sold to someone that paid for their assembly later (while I get stuck waiting for a parts shortage to clear up, which can take a very signficant amount of time). Please confirm this is the case steamboat. Thanks.

[dmcdad]

There are 625 complete K16 to a batch of 10k chips...so we are good up through batch four correct? This assumes no one wants their chips only or are sending them elsewhere of course.

That would be the case if we were not accepting orders from other sources. We are not reserving any parts for those that have purchased chips from us.

Note I'm not expecting you to reserve parts for chip customers, but I am indeed expecting you to reserve parts for chip customers (regardless of batch) that have purchased (and prepaid) assembly services through you. Please confirm this is the case.

[cp1]

We have ordered enough parts for 3,000 units. Once these are gone, there will likely be considerable delays for the next batch to arrive. We are receiving orders from chip purchasers other than our own 6 batches, and will not be holding any components in reserve for those that have purchased chips from us.

Rereading this I'm optimistic that he's just trying to warn us to purchase assembly sooner rather than later, assuming we'll get special treatment.  I'm fine as long as parts are allocated in the order of those who paid for them.

[Stringchains]

Many of us were forced to adhere to the June 30th deadline... (which I did, I made payment on time, as requested... because I was told the money was needed to secure the parts for those batches!!)  If I had known I was securing parts for other chip purchases, you would have seen a completely different tune from me.

After all of that, the deadline ended up getting 'lifted' on july 1st, the day AFTER the deadline.

The website wasn't even open to other chip purchases until July 13th...
http://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=192916.msg2722887#msg2722887

It is not making any sense to me why the coins I sent to secure 'parts' for batches 1-4 was somehow batches 1-4 of every chip purchase that exists.

I'm not sure why everyone is getting ruffled.

So, if you have already paid for components/assembly before the 30th June deadline (or perhaps even a couple of days after that) I don't think you have anything to worry about.

Everyone who has purchased from Steamboat and dealt with him directly with chips and assembly and who have put all faith in him from the start up until now and his unexpected latest post which has so truly ruffled this community MUST be served. There are plenty of us including I, who can find many reasons for why even if there was a reservation for us based on the dates of those of us who payed before june 30th, july 1st (uplifted date), or even july 13th (when website became open for other chip purchases), it still would not be fair. I would have gladly payed before june26-july1 for my Batch3&Batch4 chip assembly orders if it wasn't for the matter of MtGox changing the wire transfer SWIFT code the day of my transfer resulting in 5-10 more days to resolve the issue.