Bitcoin Forum
October 01, 2016, 04:56:00 AM *
News: Due to DDoS attacks, there may be periodic downtime.
 
   Home   Help Search Donate Login Register  
Poll
Question: What type of pool payouts do you prefer?
Bitcoins - 3152 (80.4%)
Bank transfer / USD - 407 (10.4%)
Gold/silver coins and bars - 359 (9.2%)
Total Voters: 3916

Pages: « 1 ... 479 480 481 482 483 484 485 486 487 488 489 490 491 492 493 494 495 496 497 498 499 500 501 502 503 504 505 506 507 508 509 510 511 512 513 514 515 516 517 518 519 520 521 522 523 524 525 526 527 528 [529] 530 531 532 533 534 535 536 537 538 539 540 541 542 543 544 545 546 547 548 549 550 551 552 553 554 555 556 557 558 559 560 561 562 563 564 565 566 567 568 569 570 571 572 573 574 575 576 577 578 579 ... 1104 »
  Print  
Author Topic: [40+ PH] SlushPool (slushpool.com); World's First Mining Pool  (Read 3859371 times)
nottm28
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 574



View Profile
June 24, 2013, 05:56:54 PM
 #10561

Which pool do you suggest as a backup? As I have only about 500 MHash/s I want pool with small minimum payout.

bitparking needs your spare hashes - admirable pool - only 2-4TH/s normally but they offer NMC, DVC and IXC when you mine BTC.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1976.msg2565283#msg2565283

donations not accepted
1475297760
Hero Member
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1475297760

View Profile Personal Message (Offline)

Ignore
1475297760
Reply with quote  #2

1475297760
Report to moderator
Advertised sites are not endorsed by the Bitcoin Forum. They may be unsafe, untrustworthy, or illegal in your jurisdiction. Advertise here.
gourmet
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 311


View Profile
June 24, 2013, 06:19:00 PM
 #10562


cruel funny too! especially with the new "RULES" it is basically impossible to get to 55.
I am beginning to think 42 is on my back

Yeah - what's up with that?  I see all these old timers running around with activity = 42.  Did I miss some announcement?

My activity count is almost identical to what my post count was before the change.

Call me crazy, but I'm one of the rare posters who actually tries to stick to meaningful and helpfull topics when I post...

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=86580.0

Activity & new membergroup limits in the Meta section is now a more appropriate link.

The magical number of 42 is not only the Answer to the Ultimate Question of Life, the Universe, and Everything, but also 3*14. That means that these "oldtimers" have been posting through three fortnights at best.
Trongersoll
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 448


Retired Software Engineer


View Profile
June 24, 2013, 07:05:07 PM
 #10563

I'm confused, people are complaining about the increase in the pool's hash rate because their return per block has gone down? If our hashrate goes down, doesn't some other pool's hashrate go up and they get more blocks while we get fewer blocks?

Personally, since the entire Bitcoin hash rate is rising, i think that i'd prefer a smaller piece of more blocks. the only way to increase or maintain your earning rate is to increase your own hash rate.

*insert appropriate begging line here* 
BTC: 1CS6AV7VnjcPLxaTFoUhTjXK4mQCTzfSxE
Doge: DB22tiynvXKg7SyPpnH9jyfitKLTZb6ejc
trasla
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 639



View Profile
June 24, 2013, 07:30:32 PM
 #10564

Pools hashrate does not matter, really.
The higher it is, the smoother your earnings will be, but its either bigger parts of fewer blocks or smaller parts of more blocks, average the same, as long as the difficulty stays the same.
nottm28
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 574



View Profile
June 24, 2013, 07:41:47 PM
 #10565

Pools hashrate does not matter, really.
The higher it is, the smoother your earnings will be, but its either bigger parts of fewer blocks or smaller parts of more blocks, average the same, as long as the difficulty stays the same.

Exactly Smiley

Your hash rate should be stable - it will fluctuate slightly depending on individual worker luck - but if you had about 2 GH/s last week, then you should still have 2 GH/s this week. This is regardless of difficulty increases, increases in the pool hash rate or increases in the network hash rate.

That is the easy bit - your own hash rate is a relative constant.

Now, assuming your own hash rate remains constant (and you are not adding in lots of usb miners - so you stay at 2 GH/s):

1) If the pool hash rate increases but the total network hash rate stays the same (so in other words, other existing miners move their rigs over to slush's pool)?

Then you should expect to find blocks more frequently - but your share of the payouts will go down slightly. Net effect is you earn the same over a week.

2) If slush's pool hash rate remains the same but the overall network hash rate increases?

Then you should expect to find blocks less frequently - but your share of the payouts will remain the same. Net effect is you earn less per week.

3) More typically, if slush's pool hash rate increases and the total network hash rate increases proportionally?

Then you should expect to find blocks relatively consistently - but your share of the payouts will go down. Net effect is you earn less per week.

donations not accepted
trasla
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 639



View Profile
June 24, 2013, 07:44:45 PM
 #10566

2) and 3) is not true until difficulty adjusts - so you earn less in the long run, but until the next retarget everybody just earns more, because due to increased network hashrate, blocks will be found more frequently than every ten minutes.
nottm28
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 574



View Profile
June 24, 2013, 08:00:14 PM
 #10567

2) and 3) is not true until difficulty adjusts - so you earn less in the long run, but until the next retarget everybody just earns more, because due to increased network hashrate, blocks will be found more frequently than every ten minutes.

Sorry I beg to differ. Difficulty is simply a reflection of hash rate - not the other way around. Hash rate is the master - difficulty comes into play in an attempt to make 1 block be found every 10 mins. If someone plugged in a 100 TH miner into the network then it would take a while for difficulty to adjust - but your reward would go down straight away.

donations not accepted
trasla
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 639



View Profile
June 24, 2013, 08:06:16 PM
 #10568

Why should my reward go down?
The frequency in which i find blocks with a given difficulty does not depend on the network hashrate in any way.
Trongersoll
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 448


Retired Software Engineer


View Profile
June 24, 2013, 08:09:48 PM
 #10569

Why should my reward go down?
The frequency in which i find blocks with a given difficulty does not depend on the network hashrate in any way.

Actually, it does because the higher the hashrate relative to yours, the better the odds that someone will fing the next block before you do and you'll have to start all over.

*insert appropriate begging line here* 
BTC: 1CS6AV7VnjcPLxaTFoUhTjXK4mQCTzfSxE
Doge: DB22tiynvXKg7SyPpnH9jyfitKLTZb6ejc
eleuthria
Legendary
*
Online Online

Activity: 1750


BTC Guild Owner


View Profile WWW
June 24, 2013, 08:10:57 PM
 #10570

2) and 3) is not true until difficulty adjusts - so you earn less in the long run, but until the next retarget everybody just earns more, because due to increased network hashrate, blocks will be found more frequently than every ten minutes.

Sorry I beg to differ. Difficulty is simply a reflection of hash rate - not the other way around. Hash rate is the master - difficulty comes into play in an attempt to make 1 block be found every 10 mins. If someone plugged in a 100 TH miner into the network then it would take a while for difficulty to adjust - but your reward would go down straight away.

Incorrect regarding rewards, at least directly.  You would still see the same rewards until difficulty adjusted.  You may be mixing up reduces rewards per round (which would happen if pool speed increases), but that's the same net reward for the difficulty since more rounds would complete.

The only immediate reduction in rewards would be the result of orphaned blocks and stale shares.  When the network is producing blocks faster than it should, the rate of orphans and stale shares is higher.  This is a marginal decrease though (fractions of a % decrease in rewards for the remainder of the difficulty).

R.I.P. BTC Guild, 2011 - 2015.
BTC Guild Forum Thread
Trongersoll
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 448


Retired Software Engineer


View Profile
June 24, 2013, 08:14:03 PM
 #10571

2) and 3) is not true until difficulty adjusts - so you earn less in the long run, but until the next retarget everybody just earns more, because due to increased network hashrate, blocks will be found more frequently than every ten minutes.

Sorry I beg to differ. Difficulty is simply a reflection of hash rate - not the other way around. Hash rate is the master - difficulty comes into play in an attempt to make 1 block be found every 10 mins. If someone plugged in a 100 TH miner into the network then it would take a while for difficulty to adjust - but your reward would go down straight away.

Incorrect regarding rewards, at least directly.  You would still see the same rewards until difficulty adjusted.  You may be mixing up reduces rewards per round (which would happen if pool speed increases), but that's the same net reward for the difficulty since more rounds would complete.

The only immediate reduction in rewards would be the result of orphaned blocks and stale shares.  When the network is producing blocks faster than it should, the rate of orphans and stale shares is higher.


Oh sure, just what we need, someone who actually knows what he's talking about. Who left the gates between the pools unlocked? heheheheheh

*insert appropriate begging line here* 
BTC: 1CS6AV7VnjcPLxaTFoUhTjXK4mQCTzfSxE
Doge: DB22tiynvXKg7SyPpnH9jyfitKLTZb6ejc
trasla
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 639



View Profile
June 24, 2013, 08:15:00 PM
 #10572

There is no "starting all over".
Its not like you calculate the block share by share, and after some time its done.
Each of the 336.000 Hashes your USB Block Erupter calculates per second could be a complete valid block.
Of all those hashes, 5 per minute are relayed to the pool, because they satisfy difficulty one.
Any of those could by chance start with many more zeros, and thats a valid block at current difficulty.

But chance does not care how many valid blocks have been found since the old shares you submitted or something like that.
You always work on the current block, and its always a very small chance per share to be the valid block hash.
And it doesnt matter whether you have worked on the same block before or not.
And it does not matter how fast any other miner does find new blocks, as long as you get notified about it fast enough.
The low number of orphaned blocks say we do get notified fast enough, and thus network hashrate does not matter at all for our income, until difficulty rises.
nottm28
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 574



View Profile
June 24, 2013, 08:16:49 PM
 #10573

Why should my reward go down?
The frequency in which i find blocks with a given difficulty does not depend on the network hashrate in any way.

If that 'someone' suddenly plugged in their 100 TH/s miner into slush's pool, you would see a smaller share of the pot - result - reward goes down. If they plugged it into another pool then slush's pool would find blocks less frequently (more competition) - result - reward goes down.

[EDIT] bottom line is hash rate rules, difficulty follows in order to try and keep 1 block found every 10 mins.

donations not accepted
trasla
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 639



View Profile
June 24, 2013, 08:18:48 PM
 #10574

Why should my reward go down?
The frequency in which i find blocks with a given difficulty does not depend on the network hashrate in any way.

If that 'someone' suddenly plugged in their 100 TH/s miner into slush's pool, you would see a smaller share of the pot - result - reward goes down. If they plugged it into another pool then slush's pool would find blocks less frequently (more competition) - result - reward goes down.


1) Reward per block found by the pool goes down, but number of blocks found goes up -> reward stays the same.
2) No, how many blocks slush' pool finds does not decrease when some other pool gets more hashing power, see the post i just wrote before yours.

If there was some mechanism to make our pool find less blocks if some other finds more, we would never need a difficulty adjustment.

There is nothing like "more competition".
You are rolling dice in a casino. You get a dollar on every 5 or 6.
If a thousand other people start doing it too, you still earn the same money.
Only when the casino decides to only pay out on 6 and no more on 5 (difficulty adjust), you suddenly earn less.
Trongersoll
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 448


Retired Software Engineer


View Profile
June 24, 2013, 08:23:39 PM
 #10575

Hey nottm, we might as well give up, he just doesn't get it. and we won't convince him that there is more to it than just probability,

*insert appropriate begging line here* 
BTC: 1CS6AV7VnjcPLxaTFoUhTjXK4mQCTzfSxE
Doge: DB22tiynvXKg7SyPpnH9jyfitKLTZb6ejc
nottm28
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 574



View Profile
June 24, 2013, 08:24:34 PM
 #10576

Why should my reward go down?
The frequency in which i find blocks with a given difficulty does not depend on the network hashrate in any way.

If that 'someone' suddenly plugged in their 100 TH/s miner into slush's pool, you would see a smaller share of the pot - result - reward goes down. If they plugged it into another pool then slush's pool would find blocks less frequently (more competition) - result - reward goes down.


1) Reward per block found by the pool goes down, but number of blocks found goes up -> reward stays the same.
2) No, how many blocks slush' pool finds does not decrease when some other pool gets more hashing power, see the post i just wrote before yours.

There is nothing like "more competition".
You are rolling dice in a casino. You get a dollar on every 5 or 6.
If a thousand other people start doing it too, you still earn the same money.
Only when the casino decides to only pay out on 6 and no more on 5 (difficulty adjust), you suddenly earn less.

1) Only if the 100TH/s miner was an existing miner somewhere else (i.e. moved his processing power from somewhere else to slush). If he was a 'new addition' then your share decreases.
2) I don't see that - other pools gaining hash power and slush's pool remaining the same = less blocks found (by chance).

donations not accepted
trasla
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 639



View Profile
June 24, 2013, 08:27:00 PM
 #10577

Hey nottm, we might as well give up, he just doesn't get it. and we won't convince him that there is more to it than just probability,

This time, you are partly correct, at least.
You would not convince me.
Smiley

Really, guys, you did not completely grasp how it works.
If you want to, reread the explanations, or ask, or just try to explain to me just why you think it does matter.
If you feel like i am just a dumb guy, that okay, i can live with it.
My girlfriend has objections anyway: http://xkcd.com/386/
nottm28
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 574



View Profile
June 24, 2013, 08:27:20 PM
 #10578

Hey nottm, we might as well give up, he just doesn't get it. and we won't convince him that there is more to it than just probability,

Gave it one more go Smiley - look for organofcorti's posts - he really explains things well

donations not accepted
nottm28
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 574



View Profile
June 24, 2013, 08:28:33 PM
 #10579

Hey nottm, we might as well give up, he just doesn't get it. and we won't convince him that there is more to it than just probability,

This time, you are partly correct, at least.
You would not convince me.
Smiley

Really, guys, you did not completely grasp how it works.
If you want to, reread the explanations, or ask, or just try to explain to me just why you think it does matter.
If you feel like i am just a dumb guy, that okay, i can live with it.
My girlfriend has objections anyway: http://xkcd.com/386/


No worries my friend Smiley believe what you will - I like a strong mind.

donations not accepted
trasla
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 639



View Profile
June 24, 2013, 08:30:18 PM
 #10580

1) Only if the 100TH/s miner was an existing miner somewhere else (i.e. moved his processing power from somewhere else to slush). If he was a 'new addition' then you share decreases.
2) I don't see that - other pools gaining hash power and slush's pool remaining the same = less blocks found (by chance).

Okay, lets do this step by step.
I dont get why you think the hashrate of some other pool should influence how often we find blocks.

Finding a block means calculating a hash of some data containing the past block header and new transactions since the last block, plus a random number (nonce), and the hash has to meet certain conditions, like starting with 19 million (difficulty) zeros. Do we agree?

EDIT: I have to correct myself, it has to start with a certain number of zeros, so its value is less than the target, but that number isnt 19 million (the hash is "only" a 256 bit number, and only has that many digits).
Pages: « 1 ... 479 480 481 482 483 484 485 486 487 488 489 490 491 492 493 494 495 496 497 498 499 500 501 502 503 504 505 506 507 508 509 510 511 512 513 514 515 516 517 518 519 520 521 522 523 524 525 526 527 528 [529] 530 531 532 533 534 535 536 537 538 539 540 541 542 543 544 545 546 547 548 549 550 551 552 553 554 555 556 557 558 559 560 561 562 563 564 565 566 567 568 569 570 571 572 573 574 575 576 577 578 579 ... 1104 »
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Sponsored by , a Bitcoin-accepting VPN.
Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.19 | SMF © 2006-2009, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!