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Author Topic: HashFast announces specs for new ASIC: 400GH/s  (Read 875470 times)
Gleb Gamow
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September 14, 2014, 01:18:31 AM
 #10681

Ice,

I did my owm due diligence.  the 51 btc statement is not just a post on the forum. it comes from an email thread between me and HF with the subj refund policy.  I specifically asked that question and they gave me a specific answer BEFORE i ordered. 4 babyjets

The 51 BTC statement assumed the exchange rate would remain stable, not spike 5-10 times and set new records.

YODD involves more than getting an email (from a non-executive no less) telling you want you want to hear.

YODD requires you and your attorney critically evaluate the firm's ability to deliver on their statements and your possible recourse if they fail.

In this case, it was obvious that the start-up had absolutely no ability to give you back your BTC 'No Matter WhatTM.'

Any lawyer you asked would have informed you such a claim may not be interpreted to provide windfalls in the case of substantial BTC/USD appreciation.

We all knew the BTC were converted to fiat and spent to get the chips/boards/machines built.  We all knew the BTC weren't sitting in escrow.

It took a student still in law school about 45 seconds to disabuse me of the delusion that such windfalls were reasonable, much less actionable.   Cry

Granted, I have a strong background in legal studies, but the entire concept chain from common law to equity to 'No Windfalls Allowed' has been explained in detail ad nauseum.

Even the slow learners like cedivad should be able to understand that a tiny new firm is obviously not going to be able to pay out windfalls.

As for the hilarious MMQ about 'hurr-durr they should have bought futures and hedged.'  Those services, even if available somewhere at the the time, were not yet legal in the US.  The first one was just approved yesterday: http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/09/12/us-usa-bitcoin-cftc-idUSKBN0H71FU20140912?feedType=RSS&feedName=technologyNews

Sorry you were never offered a refund.  That sucks, but there is hope we may be compensated to some degree as a result of the HF IP auction in Oct.

How do you feel about those who got 105% refunds, but refused to take them because they felt so entitled to windfalls at impossible expense to HF?

How do you feel about the BTCT Internet Lawyers who created their impossible windfall expectations, and then advised others against taking their 105% refunds when they had the chance?

Ironically, it's actually good for us they refused their 105% refunds because that left more money to pay the 15 lawyers now feasting off HF's corpse, which in turn means we may gain an addition one percent or two on our claims.   Cool

I'm curious as to what capacity you're still playing at HashFast, for I've yet to determine your last name, R.... .





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September 14, 2014, 01:23:12 AM
 #10682

The 51 BTC statement assumed the exchange rate would remain stable, not spike 5-10 times and set new records.

Prove it. Show the statement from HF stating such a restriction. PROVE IT OR YOU ARE LYING.
sorry to put salt on old wounds but lying is rarely legally actionable.  If someone lies to you and it is obvious to a reasonable person then you can't rely on that lie and claim damages.  The very fact that the TOS was directly oposite of those BTC refund marketing statements should've been a big red flag.
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September 14, 2014, 01:36:26 AM
 #10683

The 51 BTC statement assumed the exchange rate would remain stable, not spike 5-10 times and set new records.

Prove it. Show the statement from HF stating such a restriction. PROVE IT OR YOU ARE LYING.

I can easily prove that such was the case with the following as proof:

Quote
eceived: by 10.194.138.199 with SMTP id qs7csp90853wjb;
        Fri, 16 Aug 2013 16:38:36 -0700 (PDT)
X-Received: by 10.236.45.102 with SMTP id o66mr196684yhb.13.1376696316262;
        Fri, 16 Aug 2013 16:38:36 -0700 (PDT)
Return-Path: <bitpaysupport@hashfast.com>

Hi Jim,
Thank you so much for your patience while I got the answer for you, I greatly appreciate it.

The answer is if you buy Baby Jet for 51 BitCoins today and it does not ship, you will be refunded the 51 BitCoins you paid.

I hope that helps and hope you have a good weekend!

Thanks,
Cara

Regardless what capacity Cara had over at HashFast at the time, the truth of the matter is that once such was published on this forum and elsewhere, NOBODY at HashFast disputed the claim(s) until it was convenient for them to do such, in spite of HashFast's main principals addressing every other issue under the sun at their earliest possible convenience to further ensure garnering more sales.

Fuck, a Shakespearean janitor could've pen the email prose, but HashFast was well aware of its existence, yet never commented on it till shit really started hitting the fan and the fictive janitor was let go, possibly seeking employment over at Bliss Devices.

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September 14, 2014, 01:49:39 AM
 #10684

Regardless what capacity Cara had over at HashFast at the time, the truth of the matter is that once such was published on this forum and elsewhere, NOBODY at HashFast disputed the claim(s) until it was convenient for them to do such, in spite of HashFast's main principals addressing every other issue under the sun at their earliest possible convenience to further ensure garnering more sales.

Fuck, janitor could've pen the email reply, but HashFast was well aware of its existence, yet never commented on it till shit really started hitting the fan and the fictive janitor was let go.

You may disregard relevant details, such as the capacity and authority of the respondent, all you like.  But a judge won't, as your due diligence lawyer should have advised you.

Make all the noise you want, it will never change the fact that your expectation for a windfall No Matter WhatTM was unreasonable (based on common sense and common law), impossible (based on financial reality), and harmful (because it led people to lose their chance at 105% refunds by gambling on legally unsound wishful thinking).

Many people tried their best to explain this before it was too late, but we were drowned out by the shrieking of trolls like yourself and the rest of your Free Stuff Army.   Roll Eyes


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Monero
"The difference between bad and well-developed digital cash will determine
whether we have a dictatorship or a real democracy." 
David Chaum 1996
"Fungibility provides privacy as a side effect."  Adam Back 2014
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September 14, 2014, 02:07:59 AM
 #10685

Many people tried their best to explain this before it was too late, but we were drowned out by the shrieking of trolls like yourself and the rest of your Free Stuff Army.   Roll Eyes

If HashFast doesn't ship anything this year, apart from Christmas cards, I get a full refund.  In BTC.

Given the coins have appreciated 300% vs fiat since I spent them, I'm fine with that.
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September 14, 2014, 02:15:55 AM
 #10686

Many people tried their best to explain this before it was too late, but we were drowned out by the shrieking of trolls like yourself and the rest of your Free Stuff Army.   Roll Eyes

If HashFast doesn't ship anything this year, apart from Christmas cards, I get a full refund.  In BTC.

Given the coins have appreciated 300% vs fiat since I spent them, I'm fine with that.

Yes, I was deluded by glittering visions of risk-free windfalls, which I should have realized were an economic impossibility.  Greed + confirmation bias is a PITA.   Embarrassed

Thanks for the quote from November 2013.  Here's one from today you seem to have accidentally overlooked on purpose:


It took a student still in law school about 45 seconds to disabuse me of the delusion that such windfalls were reasonable, much less actionable.   Cry


As I said w/r/t the actual scams BASIC and COGNITIVE, "live and learn."   Cool


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Monero
"The difference between bad and well-developed digital cash will determine
whether we have a dictatorship or a real democracy." 
David Chaum 1996
"Fungibility provides privacy as a side effect."  Adam Back 2014
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Gleb Gamow
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September 14, 2014, 02:17:10 AM
 #10687

Many people tried their best to explain this before it was too late, but we were drowned out by the shrieking of trolls like yourself and the rest of your Free Stuff Army.   Roll Eyes

If HashFast doesn't ship anything this year, apart from Christmas cards, I get a full refund.  In BTC.

Given the coins have appreciated 300% vs fiat since I spent them, I'm fine with that.


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September 14, 2014, 02:21:18 AM
 #10688

The 51 BTC statement assumed the exchange rate would remain stable, not spike 5-10 times and set new records.

Prove it. Show the statement from HF stating such a restriction. PROVE IT OR YOU ARE LYING.
sorry to put salt on old wounds but lying is rarely legally actionable.  If someone lies to you and it is obvious to a reasonable person then you can't rely on that lie and claim damages.  The very fact that the TOS was directly oposite of those BTC refund marketing statements should've been a big red flag.

Careful, don't piss off PG and his Free Stuff Army.  They don't take kindly to common sense, facts, and such fancy talk.  They know what they know and that means windfalls No Matter What.

Better keep your mouth shut before PG does his creepy little dox and stalk thing to you too (as if ad hominem trolling will change the facts of the matter).   Cheesy


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Monero
"The difference between bad and well-developed digital cash will determine
whether we have a dictatorship or a real democracy." 
David Chaum 1996
"Fungibility provides privacy as a side effect."  Adam Back 2014
Buy and sell XMR near you
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Gleb Gamow
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September 14, 2014, 02:25:14 AM
 #10689

Many people tried their best to explain this before it was too late, but we were drowned out by the shrieking of trolls like yourself and the rest of your Free Stuff Army.   Roll Eyes

If HashFast doesn't ship anything this year, apart from Christmas cards, I get a full refund.  In BTC.

Given the coins have appreciated 300% vs fiat since I spent them, I'm fine with that.

ICEBREAKER's very next post in that thread...

Hi all,

Here is a picture of Kenneth Slaughter, VMC CEO, receiving the wafers!




Cheers,

ACTIVE MINING Team


EDIT: Oops, that's actually the CEO of HashFast receiving their wafers. 

ALWAYS BET ON iCE...



Pick of the same dude after receiving more orders for HashFast miners.



Same dude after Christmas, 2013.


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September 14, 2014, 02:27:27 AM
 #10690

The 51 BTC statement assumed the exchange rate would remain stable, not spike 5-10 times and set new records.

Prove it. Show the statement from HF stating such a restriction. PROVE IT OR YOU ARE LYING.
sorry to put salt on old wounds but lying is rarely legally actionable.  If someone lies to you and it is obvious to a reasonable person then you can't rely on that lie and claim damages.  The very fact that the TOS was directly oposite of those BTC refund marketing statements should've been a big red flag.

Careful, don't piss off PG and his Free Stuff Army.  They don't take kindly to common sense, facts, and such fancy talk.  They know what they know and that means windfalls No Matter What.

Better keep your mouth shut before PG does his creepy little dox and stalk thing to you too (as if ad hominem trolling will change the facts of the matter).   Cheesy

Hints to what's Ralph's last name in my PM box in 5...4...3...  Shocked

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September 14, 2014, 02:31:43 AM
 #10691

Hints to what's Ralph's last name in my PM box in 5...4...3...  Shocked

You're slipping Gleb, we already know Ralph's last name is Crowder.  He was outed several pages back.

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September 14, 2014, 02:34:55 AM
 #10692

Many people tried their best to explain this before it was too late, but we were drowned out by the shrieking of trolls like yourself and the rest of your Free Stuff Army.   Roll Eyes

If HashFast doesn't ship anything this year, apart from Christmas cards, I get a full refund.  In BTC.

Given the coins have appreciated 300% vs fiat since I spent them, I'm fine with that.

Yes, I was deluded by glittering visions of risk-free windfalls, which I should have realized were an economic impossibility.  Greed + confirmation bias is a PITA.   Embarrassed

Seriously you/hashfast are full of shit.

You didn't have any sort of epiphany about your delusions, you simply changed your opinion to fit your agenda which has always been promoting hashfast as the best who can never do anything wrong.

There is nothing "economically impossible" about btc refunds. Any competent company with that policy would keep the btc payments in cold storage instead of converting them to USD and gambling on the exchange rate.
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September 14, 2014, 02:51:25 AM
 #10693

You may disregard relevant details, such as the capacity and authority of the respondent, all you like.

Fine, I'll quote Simon. He confirms the same about of BTC refunds:

Now since the only payment option is in BTC Will I get the same ammount of BTC back should you fail to deliver by December 31st?

Orders are taken in BTC, in the unlikely event we get to refunds they will be given in BTC.


Make all the noise you want, it will never change the fact that your expectation for a windfall No Matter WhatTM was unreasonable (based on common sense and common law), impossible (based on financial reality), and harmful (because it led people to lose their chance at 105% refunds by gambling on legally unsound wishful thinking).

Yes, I agree, HashFast was lying from the very beginning about BTC refunds in order to secure more pre-orders.

Buy & Hold
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September 14, 2014, 02:52:48 AM
 #10694

Hints to what's Ralph's last name in my PM box in 5...4...3...  Shocked

You're slipping Gleb, we already know Ralph's last name is Crowder.  He was outed several pages back.

I think I missed it and it ain't coming up via any searches. Need help!

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September 14, 2014, 03:06:37 AM
 #10695


Yes, I was deluded by glittering visions of risk-free windfalls, which I should have realized were an economic impossibility.  Greed + confirmation bias is a PITA.   Embarrassed

Seriously you/hashfast are full of shit.

You didn't have any sort of epiphany about your delusions, you simply changed your opinion to fit your agenda which has always been promoting hashfast as the best who can never do anything wrong.

There is nothing "economically impossible" about btc refunds. Any competent company with that policy would keep the btc payments in cold storage instead of converting them to USD and gambling on the exchange rate.

"Epiphany?"  Nope, I simply discussed the matter with a bright law school student for about 45 seconds.  She introduced me to the concept of a 'windfall' and that was that.  In retrospect it was obvious.   Embarrassed

How was HF supposed to both A) keep the BTC in cold storage, and B) pay for the chips/boards/machines to be produced?  That doesn't make sense!  Those are mutually exclusive actions. 

The kicking and screaming from those who refuse to acknowledge their mistakes is deafening.

As for PG and PM's dox and stalk sideshow, what is the point now that everyone but Simon and Eduardo have been laid off?

Are they just trying to distract everyone from their lulzy failure to secure windfalls at the cost of losing the opportunity for a full refund, or what?


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Monero
"The difference between bad and well-developed digital cash will determine
whether we have a dictatorship or a real democracy." 
David Chaum 1996
"Fungibility provides privacy as a side effect."  Adam Back 2014
Buy and sell XMR near you
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September 14, 2014, 03:18:01 AM
 #10696

Hints to what's Ralph's last name in my PM box in 5...4...3...  Shocked

You're slipping Gleb, we already know Ralph's last name is Crowder.  He was outed several pages back.

I think I missed it and it ain't coming up via any searches. Need help!

My bad, it wasn't in this forum, you can find his last name by searching for people making claims against Hashfast under the name "Ralph" on the Pacer website.  At any rate it's in the public record.

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September 14, 2014, 03:33:12 AM
 #10697

You may disregard relevant details, such as the capacity and authority of the respondent, all you like.

Fine, I'll quote Simon. He confirms the same about of BTC refunds:

Now since the only payment option is in BTC Will I get the same ammount of BTC back should you fail to deliver by December 31st?

Orders are taken in BTC, in the unlikely event we get to refunds they will be given in BTC.


Make all the noise you want, it will never change the fact that your expectation for a windfall No Matter WhatTM was unreasonable (based on common sense and common law), impossible (based on financial reality), and harmful (because it led people to lose their chance at 105% refunds by gambling on legally unsound wishful thinking).

Yes, I agree, HashFast was lying from the very beginning about BTC refunds in order to secure more pre-orders.

"Lying?"  How was Simon supposed to know on August 9, 2013 that BTC was about to set new records by rising 500-1200%?  No reasonable person would expect HF to be culpable for such an outcome, much less actually believe a tiny new start-up could meet impossible obligations.

You violate Occam's Razor by positing a nefarious conspiracy where simple naivete offers sufficient explanatory power.

Also, you should have known better than to believe any interpretation that results in a risk-free, too good to be true, free lunch type outcome.  That's on you. 

Own it, sucker.   Wink


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Monero
"The difference between bad and well-developed digital cash will determine
whether we have a dictatorship or a real democracy." 
David Chaum 1996
"Fungibility provides privacy as a side effect."  Adam Back 2014
Buy and sell XMR near you
P2P Exchange Network
Buy XMR with fiat
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September 14, 2014, 03:57:30 AM
 #10698

"Lying?"  How was Simon supposed to know on August 9, 2013 that BTC was about to set new records by rising 500-1200%?

Because that's what bitcoin does. It has always been highly volatile.

No reasonable person would expect HF to be culpable for such an outcome, much less actually believe a tiny new start-up could meet impossible obligations.

Then it was a lie to promise it. Simple. They lied to gain orders.

Buy & Hold
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September 14, 2014, 04:21:09 AM
 #10699

"Lying?"  How was Simon supposed to know on August 9, 2013 that BTC was about to set new records by rising 500-1200%?

Because that's what bitcoin does. It has always been highly volatile.

No reasonable person would expect HF to be culpable for such an outcome, much less actually believe a tiny new start-up could meet impossible obligations.

Then it was a lie to promise it. Simple. They lied to gain orders.

Lying requires intent.  There is no way Simon intended to lie, because on August 9, 2013 he did not know BTC would suddenly explode in value, making full BTC refunds impossible.  Are you saying Simon is psychic, or controls the price of BTC?  Do you know how crazy that sounds?

Furthermore, HF provided full refunds to the extent possible for them.  The rest are tied up in litigation, pending sale of assets.  That's how business works.  Grow up, son.

There are no charges pending against any HF people for fraud nor any other illegal action.  Your defamation is contrary to the facts, has no basis in reality, and makes you look like a gambling addict unable to accept responsibility for his share of the blame for a bad (but entirely self-imposed) outcome.


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Monero
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September 14, 2014, 04:28:14 AM
 #10700

Bruno, did you find any information about how much HF paid to Uniquify? I'm quite sure to have read it somewhere, probably in the examinations, but I don't remember where exactly. It's something that has been bothering me for a while.

http://www.plainsite.org/dockets/28mzy2tfp/california-northern-bankruptcy-court/hashfast-technologies-llc/

See if #41 is what you're looking for.

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