Gold collapsing. Bitcoin UP.

[cypherdoc]

Gold spiking higher

Has anyone been following the german repatriation (or lack thereof) news? Which probably had a lot to do with the initial spike last thursday. The Fed is beginning to look a lot like Mt Gox. First some shitty excuses and misdirection, and then...

Nobody wants to be the one to trigger the collapse of the $USD / Global financial construct

Their is a Western -> Eastern power shift that looks to be coming to a head in the Saudi / Qatari vs Russia / Iran  energy war. The U.S is caught in the middle holding a very shitty hand of cards. The EU needs to decide what they're going to do. Would be wise to take advantage of this opportunity and drive up the price of gold / balance their balance sheets(gold is a floating asset) so the Euro can get in on some petro action before they get trumped by an eastern currency.

Gold as the central bedrock(glue) of the financial system and bitcoin as the efficient payment mechanism to transmit value and have easily movable / verifiable wealth.

The two aren't in competition as this thread would make people believe. They'll create a fairer and more efficient global financial system together.

i still disagree with this.  Bitcoin has too many advantages.  and it's more than just a payment mechanism; it's functioning as an increasing store of value.

You can, and that's fine. You probably made the trade of the century..if I recall right you sold gold for bitcoin near the peak? So you took the stance at the appropriate time. I don't ignore vested interest. It doesn't really matter what should be. The Eurozone, among others, can clear their balance sheets by eating up gold on the open market and placing a high bid. I don't think the Euro will collapse and the way to un-fuck the eurozone is by making an effort to increase their asset column. It's pretty simple..drown in debt or set the market price for gold at a much higher level. No point in suffering when you have the option to clear debt.

Crypto central bank holdings may be the future but for now I see them making a concerted effort, once the $ is known to be fucked..ala no support from Saudi Oil..to wipe clean their debts via an increased price in gold. Will it outpace bitcoin? probably not. But timing is a factor. Gold to $45-60k an ounce, bitcoin +$100k per in today's $'s.

Hold both for insurance in case of time delays or a miscalculation.

I'm tempted to drop my silver holdings but it's a back-up to my back-up insurance policy. I don't believe it will witness the astronomical rise of the 2 previously mentioned but I've been wrong before.

yeah i did do that trade.  yes, i do have a vested interest.

but sincerely my views haven't changed b/c no new information has arisen; just affirmation of my thought processes.  in fact, every day since that trade i learn something new about Bitcoin that only reinforces those thoughts.

you might want to read some of the ideas i have made here about using a Bitcoin revaluation to back the USD much like you wish to happen with gold:  https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=646186.msg7410222#msg7410222

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[cypherdoc]

back in...

[FNG]

Gold spiking higher

Has anyone been following the german repatriation (or lack thereof) news? Which probably had a lot to do with the initial spike last thursday. The Fed is beginning to look a lot like Mt Gox. First some shitty excuses and misdirection, and then...

Nobody wants to be the one to trigger the collapse of the $USD / Global financial construct

Their is a Western -> Eastern power shift that looks to be coming to a head in the Saudi / Qatari vs Russia / Iran  energy war. The U.S is caught in the middle holding a very shitty hand of cards. The EU needs to decide what they're going to do. Would be wise to take advantage of this opportunity and drive up the price of gold / balance their balance sheets(gold is a floating asset) so the Euro can get in on some petro action before they get trumped by an eastern currency.

Gold as the central bedrock(glue) of the financial system and bitcoin as the efficient payment mechanism to transmit value and have easily movable / verifiable wealth.

The two aren't in competition as this thread would make people believe. They'll create a fairer and more efficient global financial system together.

i still disagree with this.  Bitcoin has too many advantages.  and it's more than just a payment mechanism; it's functioning as an increasing store of value.

You can, and that's fine. You probably made the trade of the century..if I recall right you sold gold for bitcoin near the peak? So you took the stance at the appropriate time. I don't ignore vested interest. It doesn't really matter what should be. The Eurozone, among others, can clear their balance sheets by eating up gold on the open market and placing a high bid. I don't think the Euro will collapse and the way to un-fuck the eurozone is by making an effort to increase their asset column. It's pretty simple..drown in debt or set the market price for gold at a much higher level. No point in suffering when you have the option to clear debt.

Crypto central bank holdings may be the future but for now I see them making a concerted effort, once the $ is known to be fucked..ala no support from Saudi Oil..to wipe clean their debts via an increased price in gold. Will it outpace bitcoin? probably not. But timing is a factor. Gold to $45-60k an ounce, bitcoin +$100k per in today's $'s.

Hold both for insurance in case of time delays or a miscalculation.

I'm tempted to drop my silver holdings but it's a back-up to my back-up insurance policy. I don't believe it will witness the astronomical rise of the 2 previously mentioned but I've been wrong before.

yeah i did do that trade.  yes, i do have a vested interest.

but sincerely my views haven't changed b/c no new information has arisen; just affirmation of my thought processes.  in fact, every day since that trade i learn something new about Bitcoin that only reinforces those thoughts.

you might want to read some of the ideas i have made here about using a Bitcoin revaluation to back the USD much like you wish to happen with gold:  https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=646186.msg7410222#msg7410222

It's not what I wish to happen, it what I think will happen. We appear to be looking at the same broad picture so any geo-politics that I bring up will not help sway you. I'm of the mind that the rest of the world will do what is in their best interest (when I say the rest I'm referring to the key players who hold a substantial amount of gold)  and let / help gold reach a level that balances their books. I don't see why they wouldn't even if the USD goes bitcoin off of the back of their un-sold SR holdings (if they control them)

There's a lot of dirty balance sheets and if the U.S can no longer support them by suppressing oil, supporting them in their decisions militarily, they they must cleanse their sheets and welcome gas from Russia. Petro dollar will be dead to Europe as it should have been a decade ago.

Off to sleep. Will engage in convo tomorrow if you're up for it. I look forward to hearing your response.

[tvbcof]

yeah i did do that trade.  yes, i do have a vested interest.

but sincerely my views haven't changed b/c no new information has arisen; just affirmation of my thought processes.  in fact, every day since that trade i learn something new about Bitcoin that only reinforces those thoughts.
...

A good devout fundamentalist attitude.  It certainly shows since you forcibly reject any suggestion that there might be any risks whatsoever to the object of your zealotry.  In true form, you can look at literally anything and be so convinced that it demonstrates and reinforces your belief that you'll present it as such to the world.  Reminds me of how everything, no matter how awful, is proof of "God's will" to a certain large fraction of Christians.  To another faction of fruit-loops it is the work of the devil, and to a lot of people it is both simultaneously.

[cypherdoc]

yeah i did do that trade.  yes, i do have a vested interest.

but sincerely my views haven't changed b/c no new information has arisen; just affirmation of my thought processes.  in fact, every day since that trade i learn something new about Bitcoin that only reinforces those thoughts.
...

A good devout fundamentalist attitude.  It certainly shows since you forcibly reject any suggestion that there might be any risks whatsoever to the object of your zealotry.  In true form, you can look at literally anything and be so convinced that it demonstrates and reinforces your belief that you'll present it as such to the world.  Reminds me of how everything, no matter how awful, is proof of "God's will" to a certain large fraction of Christians.  To another faction of fruit-loops it is the work of the devil, and to a lot of people it is both simultaneously.

oh stop.

i could easily just label you a "pessimist".  these processes take time and there are plenty of skeptics like yourself that sway the crowd in the other direction.  if these forums were filled with optimists or zealots, as you like to say, i might buy that we're in a bubble.  no such thing exists.  this is Bitcoin's Tension, as i like to call it.  hoards of ppl will be dragged, kicking and screaming as we go higher.  the fundamentals of the situation haven't changed for the worse; if anything they've gotten better.

[cypherdoc]

ZipZap finds a more willing partner.  too bad for PayPoint:

http://www.coindesk.com/zipzap-resumes-cash-bitcoin-services-uk-shoppers/

[molecular]

Gold spiking higher

Has anyone been following the german repatriation (or lack thereof) news? Which probably had a lot to do with the initial spike last thursday. The Fed is beginning to look a lot like Mt Gox. First some shitty excuses and misdirection, and then...

Don't forget the most prominent feature of gox/fed: the incredible LAG in withdraw operations!

[conspirosphere.tk]

The Fed is beginning to look a lot like Mt Gox. First some shitty excuses and misdirection, and then...

Don't forget the most prominent feature of gox/fed: the incredible LAG in withdraw operations!

lol. the Fed goxxed ze germans   
how much funnier can it get?

[nwfella]

Correct me if I'm wrong here but hasn't Germany collected less than 10 tonnes worth of the gold they requested back?  If I had to lay satoshi's my bet would be that recent increase in Gold prices at least partly linked.

[cypherdoc]

The Fed is beginning to look a lot like Mt Gox. First some shitty excuses and misdirection, and then...

Don't forget the most prominent feature of gox/fed: the incredible LAG in withdraw operations!

lol. the Fed goxxed ze germans   
how much funnier can it get?

note how none of this would've had to happen if they'd been dealing in Bitcoin.

[molecular]

The Fed is beginning to look a lot like Mt Gox. First some shitty excuses and misdirection, and then...

Don't forget the most prominent feature of gox/fed: the incredible LAG in withdraw operations!

lol. the Fed goxxed ze germans   
how much funnier can it get?

note how none of this would've had to happen if they'd been dealing in Bitcoin.

also with bitcoin auditing is much easier and more reliable if done right

[cypherdoc]

Ripple dying a slow death:

[cypherdoc]

MIT is off and running:

http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/28zzh1/125_students_and_45_teams_submitted_pitches_for/

[FNG]

Gold collapsing, pipeline going up

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-06-24/putin-scores-another-historic-victory-austria-signs-south-stream-pipeline-deal-defia

[cypherdoc]

Gold collapsing, pipeline going up

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-06-24/putin-scores-another-historic-victory-austria-signs-south-stream-pipeline-deal-defia

as a previous enthusiast energy trader, these sorts of strategic issues have been going on for years if not decades.  i highly doubt the last few months of shenanigans represent some sort of seminal moment. 

[zeetubes]

Gold collapsing, pipeline going up

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-06-24/putin-scores-another-historic-victory-austria-signs-south-stream-pipeline-deal-defia

as a previous enthusiast energy trader, these sorts of strategic issues have been going on for years if not decades.  i highly doubt the last few months of shenanigans represent some sort of seminal moment. 

That is a logical comment that would work in a logical world ... but the world is currently run by crusty old men (think: cheney) who are no longer (or never were) attractive to young women, and who only get female attention (read: pussy) by spending money. These sociopathic, otherwise irrelevant old men should be put out to pasture so they can spend time with their grandkids, but because they believe they still have some relevance, they persist in trying to run/ruin the world. They should be euthanized. Ask a 20 year old male if he would instantly add 40 years to his life in exchange for $10M and he would tell you to go fuck yourself. No one wants to be old.

Thus, even though it makes absolutely no sense for china and russia to willingly fuck the USD because it would also fuck them, they will still do it. Like the scorpion story in a prevous post, that's just how they are. I'm guessing one year maximum before something really bad happens. if they can string it out longer I'll be happy but I also wouldn't be surprised to see it happen tomorrow.

[cypherdoc]

the wonderful US economy at work.





but at least the stock market is up!!! (hint: give it time)

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-06-25/gdp-disaster-final-q1-gdp-crashes-29-worst-2009-far-below-worst-expectations

[bitcoinsrus]

Gold collapsing, pipeline going up

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-06-24/putin-scores-another-historic-victory-austria-signs-south-stream-pipeline-deal-defia

as a previous enthusiast energy trader, these sorts of strategic issues have been going on for years if not decades.  i highly doubt the last few months of shenanigans represent some sort of seminal moment. 

That is a logical comment that would work in a logical world ... but the world is currently run by crusty old men (think: cheney) who are no longer (or never were) attractive to young women, and who only get female attention (read: pussy) by spending money. These sociopathic, otherwise irrelevant old men should be put out to pasture so they can spend time with their grandkids, but because they believe they still have some relevance, they persist in trying to run/ruin the world. They should be euthanized. Ask a 20 year old male if he would instantly add 40 years to his life in exchange for $10M and he would tell you to go fuck yourself. No one wants to be old.

Thus, even though it makes absolutely no sense for china and russia to willingly fuck the USD because it would also fuck them, they will still do it. Like the scorpion story in a prevous post, that's just how they are. I'm guessing one year maximum before something really bad happens. if they can string it out longer I'll be happy but I also wouldn't be surprised to see it happen tomorrow.

I had a question about the whole china and russia news about the USD. Can someone explain this to me. No matter how many articles I read on it (I think they are not using it anymore) I am not understanding it and what it means for the USD. Thanks

[cypherdoc]

Gold collapsing, pipeline going up

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-06-24/putin-scores-another-historic-victory-austria-signs-south-stream-pipeline-deal-defia

as a previous enthusiast energy trader, these sorts of strategic issues have been going on for years if not decades.  i highly doubt the last few months of shenanigans represent some sort of seminal moment.  

That is a logical comment that would work in a logical world ... but the world is currently run by crusty old men (think: cheney) who are no longer (or never were) attractive to young women, and who only get female attention (read: pussy) by spending money. These sociopathic, otherwise irrelevant old men should be put out to pasture so they can spend time with their grandkids, but because they believe they still have some relevance, they persist in trying to run/ruin the world. They should be euthanized. Ask a 20 year old male if he would instantly add 40 years to his life in exchange for $10M and he would tell you to go fuck yourself. No one wants to be old.

Thus, even though it makes absolutely no sense for china and russia to willingly fuck the USD because it would also fuck them, they will still do it. Like the scorpion story in a prevous post, that's just how they are. I'm guessing one year maximum before something really bad happens. if they can string it out longer I'll be happy but I also wouldn't be surprised to see it happen tomorrow.

I had a question about the whole china and russia news about the USD. Can someone explain this to me. No matter how many articles I read on it (I think they are not using it anymore) I am not understanding it and what it means for the USD. Thanks

just like any other good, the USD relative value depends on supply and demand.  we want it to be used.  having been dubbed the world's reserve currency, it's important for it to maintain value, at least for appearances sake in the eyes of the rest of the world.  a strong dollar maintains confidence and is an image TPTB love to project; think Hank Paulson and Tim Geithner.  this is what allows us to have originally negotiated the notion of a petrodollar; the Saudi's depend on us to keep it strong.

otoh, no nation wants it's currency to be too strong since it makes it's goods more expensive to the ROW.  therefore, they continually inflate their currencies to weaken it's relative value so that foreigners will be attracted to buy their goods.  the US has had the exorbitant privilege to be able to inflate the USD abusively, yet maintain confidence thru various means such as our military, economy, stock market, bond market, etc.  however over the last few decades there has been something called USD hegemony where our military and political apparatus has gone out into the world and used intimidation (think war) to extend the power of the USD (the ultimate goal).  while it has worked well it is an unsustainable situation according to some.

we've also used money printing to suppress interest rates and probably suppress the price of gold via the principles of Gibson's Paradox ala Larry Summers.  problem is that we are at the zero bound.  no real room left as the national debt has ballooned, the money supply has quintupled, and derivatives are estimated to be in the quadrillions.  all this works to erode the USD relative value which is why you hear ppl say that its value has dropped 98% over the last 100 yrs.

[bitcoinsrus]

Thanks cypher, I appreciate the detailed answer to my question (and after I posted my question), I saw the chart above my comment with the zerohedge link. (Right now I am curious to see what happens the end of this week going into next month sub 570 now)

also to add to what you said, yes I saw a chart where 1 dollar was worth 1 dollar in purchasing power in 1970 or something. And now its like 3 cents (inflation).  I used to wonder why my older friend (like 80 now) said with 1 dollar he could have went to the movies all day back in the 50's (but now 1 dollar cannot buy you anything)

edit to FNG (below this comment): Wow, sounds scary. I read somewhere that US lost a few high profile contracts for something as well. Lets see what ends up happening.