Health and Religion

[joebrook]

Health and religions are two different things. Health depends on your food habits and how you are living your life on daily basis. Whereas religion is something which got associated with you from birth. Depending on the religion some food habits are being defined - Veg or Non Veg.

Though entirely different between the two, Their are some religions who are able to cure so many ailments in the human body, I have seen crippled people walk, the blind see, cancer being cured and a whole lot of diseases being cured by the name of Jesus.

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[halych]

Health and religions are two different things. Health depends on your food habits and how you are living your life on daily basis. Whereas religion is something which got associated with you from birth. Depending on the religion some food habits are being defined - Veg or Non Veg.

Though entirely different between the two, Their are some religions who are able to cure so many ailments in the human body, I have seen crippled people walk, the blind see, cancer being cured and a whole lot of diseases being cured by the name of Jesus.

Have you seen it personally? Or have you heard these stories from other people? I do not believe that Jesus cured these people. It most likely looks like a self-suggestion. I do not believe that human health depends on his religious beliefs

[Aleister Crowley]

Health and religions are two different things. Health depends on your food habits and how you are living your life on daily basis. Whereas religion is something which got associated with you from birth. Depending on the religion some food habits are being defined - Veg or Non Veg.

Though entirely different between the two, Their are some religions who are able to cure so many ailments in the human body, I have seen crippled people walk, the blind see, cancer being cured and a whole lot of diseases being cured by the name of Jesus.

If in Islam worship is the same as maintaining health because in every movement that prayer can be called with sports,,. If we know how the movement of prayer is the same as the movement of airobik / gymnastics ..
And it can burn fat calories in the body, plus we are required to do that in 5 times in the same day., and each one of 5 there are 2 to 4 repetitive movements

[CoinCube]

The More Rational Model

It most likely looks like a self-suggestion. I do not believe that human health depends on his religious beliefs

Here are two different arguments from two of my favorite writers Bruce Charlton and John C. Wright that will challenge your view. I recommend reading them if only to understand the logical basis of the opposing view.

Is it true that Man is a primarily religious being?
http://charltonteaching.blogspot.com/2017/06/is-it-true-that-man-is-primarily.html

The literal insanity of mainstream public discourse, and the lack of insight of this fact, suggests that Man without religion is non-viable.

To put matters another way - religion is the most important thing in the human world.  

Of course, a few individuals, in the short term, can survive atheism mentally intact; but there is no evidence at all that this is a possibility for human societies over more than a few decades - then the signs of insanity (incoherence, exitinction) become more-and-more obvious... or they would do so if loss of insight was not itself a prime sign of insanity.

So insanity shields us from knowledge of our own insanity, because insanity destroys insight as much as it destroys judgement - it affects the whole mode of thinking.

How, then, do we know we, as a society, are insane?

1. By applying older judgements, from the time before Men became insane - reading old books, talking to non-modern people...

2. By looking at the basic biological viability of atheist societies in terms of reproduction, demographics, response to direct and immediate threats, scale of priorities ... Compare societies and groups that are biologically viable, with the modern atheist societies that are not...

3. By reflecting on how we feel about Life. Insane people are almost always miserable - dysphoric, despairing, desperate... almost all of the time. Even the euphoric frenzy of mania is brittle, and crashes into suicidal self-destruction with a high frequency. Is there hope?

In conclusion - religion is the most important thing.

Religion is necessary for long term motivation, for social coherence, for purpose, and to enable the individual to be a part of the whole.

Since religion is necessary, if or when humans either dispense with religion or else place it anything lower than first in priority; then they as individuals and their societies will begin to fall apart and spiral towards alienation, purposelessness, inability to perceive or reason what is important, cowardice (i.e. short-term selfishness), desperation and all the rest of it.

Modernity is the experiment of Man living without Religion. The experiment has been running for several generations.

But the experiment of modernity has deprived modern people of the motivation, honesty and ability to evaluate the results of the experiment - by the always changing criteria of modernity, modernity sees no alternative to itself...

Conclusion: Religion is objectively necessary; and, by one kind of reasoning, therefore true. If you are not religious you are living in error. If you are not religious then you need to become religious. The question you must settle is not whether you should be religious, but which religion you will adopt.

The More Rational Model
http://www.scifiwright.com/2017/05/the-more-rational-model/#more-18419

A comment on my publisher’s website asks:

“Do you have any suggestions for finding faith? I see the necessity of religion, and Christianity in particular, but aside from history and cultural affinity I don’t have actual belief.”

My suggestion: Pray.

Also, consider that the Christian worldview is more coherent, robust, and rational than any secular worldview.
Our model explains things such as why stars look fair and beautiful to our eyes when it serves no credible Darwinian purpose to do so.

Our model explains the naturalistic fallacy, that is, the gap between ‘is’ and ‘ought’ which secular philosophy cannot explain, and some cannot even address.

Our model explains how free will can exist inside a deterministic universe. A materialist cannot even formulate the question in a rational way.

Our model explains why humans seek beauty. Social-evolutionary explanations for this are less convincing than astrology.

Our model explains how creatures with free will capable of grasping intellectual abstractions can arise in a universe which contains no such thing as intellectual abstractions.

Our model allows investigation of final causes in nature, without which nature cannot properly be understood.

Our model explains the prevalence of so many theists throughout history. The theory that over nine tenths of mankind, including some of the most brilliant thinkers in their age, were raving lunatics who hallucinate about imaginary sky beings is not credible and not supported by evidence.

Our model explains the various miracles and supernatural wonders that are in the older history books, and which, for no scientific reason, were excised from being reported.

Our model explains both why there is a plurality of religions and why there are striking similarities between them.

Our model explains the origin of the universe. By definition, if the universe were all that existed, exists and ever will exist, than a material cause for it is impossible.

Our model explains the current hegemony of the West and makes clear the meaning and purpose of what otherwise seems like insane and suicidal attempts by the apparently sober and sane men on Left to undermine and destroy it.

Our model explains why you should not let your daughter whore around. She is immortal, and will outlast any nation, and language, any institution and human work on Earth.

Our model explains why you should not, once you have truly and deeply contemplated the vastness of the universe and the oppressive span of time to follow the death of everything you know, fall into despair, and end your meaningless life.

Our model gives something to live for nobler than one’s own pleasure seeking.

Our model avoids the logical paradox of asserting man can create meaning in life out of a vacuum. That would require an ability to create meaning out of meaninglessness, which is absurd.

Our model explains why men and women are different, and how we must arrange the dangerous mystery of the mating dance between the sexes to improve our chances to achieve joy rather than misery.

Our model gives rational hope of seeking the departed dead again.

Our model explains human psychology better than perverted old Freud dressing up old Greek myths in make believe, and far better than cranky old Thomas Hobbes and his cynicism.

Our model makes sense. Others are either incorrect, incomplete, or paradoxical, or lead ultimately to wrath or despair. Our model is the sole one which sees life as not futile and death as not bitter.

And, on an intellectual level, our model is the one to which to turn once your mind has become wearied with the reductionist, absurdist and postmodern models, which are in fact no models at all, but rather, are excuses why one should not make a model of the universe, nor seek any answers to deep questions.

It is the model to which to turn once you are heartily sick of hearing “It Just Happened” as the explanation for the origin of man, the universe, and all things.

Naturally, I do not expect any reader to take any of these conclusions as if they were persuasive arguments. Each would require a separate and in depth conversation. This is just a list, and a partial list at that, of the intellectually satisfying fullness of Christian thought. It is the scent and savor of the feast of Christian philosophy, not the meat and potatoes.

This list is not meant to argue the point. It is meant to whet the appetite of intellects starved and desiccated after vain attempt to feast on the shadows, dust and ashes of modern thought, and show the contrast.

There are additional reasons beyond this. All human reason can do is clear away false objections to faith. Faith itself is a supernatural gift bestowed by God to protect his own from the sudden, irrational loss of confidence in the self evident to which our foolish race is prone.

See: Superrationality and the Infinite for more.

[BADecker]

Have you seen it personally? Or have you heard these stories from other people? I do not believe that Jesus cured these people. It most likely looks like a self-suggestion. I do not believe that human health depends on his religious beliefs

Here are two different arguments from two of my favorite writers that will challenge your view halych. I recommend reading them if only to understand that logical basis of the opposing view.

Is it true that Man is a primarily religious being?
http://charltonteaching.blogspot.com/2017/06/is-it-true-that-man-is-primarily.html

The More Rational Model
http://www.scifiwright.com/2017/05/the-more-rational-model/#more-18419

Bravo, CoinCube. You have well exceeded my little hit-and-miss explanations. You have found the answers that I would give if I took the time to think these things out. This stuff should be in the evolution hoax thread to show how evolution utterly fails in its whole theme.

[PramLooker4]

I don't believe these studies at all, times have changed and the problem is always extremist people. Judging by religions is a mistake at this time. Or are we still living in caverns?

[BADecker]

I don't believe these studies at all, times have changed and the problem is always extremist people. Judging by religions is a mistake at this time. Or are we still living in caverns?

It's kinda the other way around. Look at the fossil record. Way back when earth was healthy, there lived 2 or 3 times the species that are around today. These species didn't get there, or die off, because of anything that mankind did. They are simply dying off because of entropy. Everything is falling apart, even if it is taking thousands of years for it to happen.

The point is that there is devolution, not evolution. The whole evolution hoax is simply some people trying to use positive thinking to make themselves feel better. They all know that evolution in the face of entropy is really non existent. Rather, it is entirely devolution we see.

And now, a bunch of jokers for whatever reason, are tossing out the better wisdom of the past, for the foolishness that gets them nowhere. And you have succumbed to their folly.

[Astargath]

I don't believe these studies at all, times have changed and the problem is always extremist people. Judging by religions is a mistake at this time. Or are we still living in caverns?

It's kinda the other way around. Look at the fossil record. Way back when earth was healthy, there lived 2 or 3 times the species that are around today. These species didn't get there, or die off, because of anything that mankind did. They are simply dying off because of entropy. Everything is falling apart, even if it is taking thousands of years for it to happen.

The point is that there is devolution, not evolution. The whole evolution hoax is simply some people trying to use positive thinking to make themselves feel better. They all know that evolution in the face of entropy is really non existent. Rather, it is entirely devolution we see.

And now, a bunch of jokers for whatever reason, are tossing out the better wisdom of the past, for the foolishness that gets them nowhere. And you have succumbed to their folly.

Science works, religion does not. When has prayer or god healed an amputee or a blind person lately? Do religious people go to the hospital when they are sick or do they just pray to god? Where are all the advancements or inventions based on the bible? How come the bible is totally useless and hasn't helped in any advancements. Medicine on the other hand actually works and so does all the other sciences. Your opinion is that evolution is a hoax but thankfully your opinion is meaningless on whether something works or not and evolution works, the bible does not.

[BADecker]

I don't believe these studies at all, times have changed and the problem is always extremist people. Judging by religions is a mistake at this time. Or are we still living in caverns?

It's kinda the other way around. Look at the fossil record. Way back when earth was healthy, there lived 2 or 3 times the species that are around today. These species didn't get there, or die off, because of anything that mankind did. They are simply dying off because of entropy. Everything is falling apart, even if it is taking thousands of years for it to happen.

The point is that there is devolution, not evolution. The whole evolution hoax is simply some people trying to use positive thinking to make themselves feel better. They all know that evolution in the face of entropy is really non existent. Rather, it is entirely devolution we see.

And now, a bunch of jokers for whatever reason, are tossing out the better wisdom of the past, for the foolishness that gets them nowhere. And you have succumbed to their folly.

Science works, religion does not. When has prayer or god healed an amputee or a blind person lately? Do religious people go to the hospital when they are sick or do they just pray to god? Where are all the advancements or inventions based on the bible? How come the bible is totally useless and hasn't helped in any advancements. Medicine on the other hand actually works and so does all the other sciences. Your opinion is that evolution is a hoax but thankfully your opinion is meaningless on whether something works or not and evolution works, the bible does not.

Since science is the religion of so many scientists, by your own statement, religion works.

[pingu39]

Religion was invented by capitalists in order to keep the working class in subjection. Whatever the name is called 'capitalist': slaves, feudalists, kings, politicians ... it's my opinion

[BADecker]

Religion was invented by capitalists in order to keep the working class in subjection. Whatever the name is called 'capitalist': slaves, feudalists, kings, politicians ... it's my opinion

Capitalism is the top religion of all people, when they get hungry enough.

[Astargath]

I don't believe these studies at all, times have changed and the problem is always extremist people. Judging by religions is a mistake at this time. Or are we still living in caverns?

It's kinda the other way around. Look at the fossil record. Way back when earth was healthy, there lived 2 or 3 times the species that are around today. These species didn't get there, or die off, because of anything that mankind did. They are simply dying off because of entropy. Everything is falling apart, even if it is taking thousands of years for it to happen.

The point is that there is devolution, not evolution. The whole evolution hoax is simply some people trying to use positive thinking to make themselves feel better. They all know that evolution in the face of entropy is really non existent. Rather, it is entirely devolution we see.

And now, a bunch of jokers for whatever reason, are tossing out the better wisdom of the past, for the foolishness that gets them nowhere. And you have succumbed to their folly.

Science works, religion does not. When has prayer or god healed an amputee or a blind person lately? Do religious people go to the hospital when they are sick or do they just pray to god? Where are all the advancements or inventions based on the bible? How come the bible is totally useless and hasn't helped in any advancements. Medicine on the other hand actually works and so does all the other sciences. Your opinion is that evolution is a hoax but thankfully your opinion is meaningless on whether something works or not and evolution works, the bible does not.

Since science is the religion of so many scientists, by your own statement, religion works.

?? That's like saying, so many scientists believe in ghosts therefore ghosts work or are real. Scientists do not base science on religion or the bible. The bible which is supposed to be the word of God contains literally no useful information that can be applied to anything. Even evolution that you refute has been applied to things, even if it's only the concept, it's still useful. As I said, the bible hasn't.

[justin86]

They are fully different things if you are not from amazon or africa got it?

[BADecker]

I don't believe these studies at all, times have changed and the problem is always extremist people. Judging by religions is a mistake at this time. Or are we still living in caverns?

It's kinda the other way around. Look at the fossil record. Way back when earth was healthy, there lived 2 or 3 times the species that are around today. These species didn't get there, or die off, because of anything that mankind did. They are simply dying off because of entropy. Everything is falling apart, even if it is taking thousands of years for it to happen.

The point is that there is devolution, not evolution. The whole evolution hoax is simply some people trying to use positive thinking to make themselves feel better. They all know that evolution in the face of entropy is really non existent. Rather, it is entirely devolution we see.

And now, a bunch of jokers for whatever reason, are tossing out the better wisdom of the past, for the foolishness that gets them nowhere. And you have succumbed to their folly.

Science works, religion does not. When has prayer or god healed an amputee or a blind person lately? Do religious people go to the hospital when they are sick or do they just pray to god? Where are all the advancements or inventions based on the bible? How come the bible is totally useless and hasn't helped in any advancements. Medicine on the other hand actually works and so does all the other sciences. Your opinion is that evolution is a hoax but thankfully your opinion is meaningless on whether something works or not and evolution works, the bible does not.

Since science is the religion of so many scientists, by your own statement, religion works.

?? That's like saying, so many scientists believe in ghosts therefore ghosts work or are real. Scientists do not base science on religion or the bible. The bible which is supposed to be the word of God contains literally no useful information that can be applied to anything. Even evolution that you refute has been applied to things, even if it's only the concept, it's still useful. As I said, the bible hasn't.

Not at all. It's saying that if scientists believe in false religion, it doesn't work. But if they believe in true religion, it does work.

Scientists who have scientifically traced the truths of the Bible and believe in it, have found that it works better than any other science religion.

[Astargath]

I don't believe these studies at all, times have changed and the problem is always extremist people. Judging by religions is a mistake at this time. Or are we still living in caverns?

It's kinda the other way around. Look at the fossil record. Way back when earth was healthy, there lived 2 or 3 times the species that are around today. These species didn't get there, or die off, because of anything that mankind did. They are simply dying off because of entropy. Everything is falling apart, even if it is taking thousands of years for it to happen.

The point is that there is devolution, not evolution. The whole evolution hoax is simply some people trying to use positive thinking to make themselves feel better. They all know that evolution in the face of entropy is really non existent. Rather, it is entirely devolution we see.

And now, a bunch of jokers for whatever reason, are tossing out the better wisdom of the past, for the foolishness that gets them nowhere. And you have succumbed to their folly.

Science works, religion does not. When has prayer or god healed an amputee or a blind person lately? Do religious people go to the hospital when they are sick or do they just pray to god? Where are all the advancements or inventions based on the bible? How come the bible is totally useless and hasn't helped in any advancements. Medicine on the other hand actually works and so does all the other sciences. Your opinion is that evolution is a hoax but thankfully your opinion is meaningless on whether something works or not and evolution works, the bible does not.

Since science is the religion of so many scientists, by your own statement, religion works.

?? That's like saying, so many scientists believe in ghosts therefore ghosts work or are real. Scientists do not base science on religion or the bible. The bible which is supposed to be the word of God contains literally no useful information that can be applied to anything. Even evolution that you refute has been applied to things, even if it's only the concept, it's still useful. As I said, the bible hasn't.

Not at all. It's saying that if scientists believe in false religion, it doesn't work. But if they believe in true religion, it does work.

Scientists who have scientifically traced the truths of the Bible and believe in it, have found that it works better than any other science religion.

I don't know what you are talking about. You are just trying to deflect. Science works, religion does not. How does the bible work better than science? Don't you think  cars, planes, medicine, internet...etc are amazing advancements? Well they are all based on science not on the bible. The bible is not useful for anything. Extremely bad for morals as well. So much killing, slaves and rape in the bible is disgusting. Even god himself commanded people to kill and enslave. How does anyone think that is good.

How does anyone think that even if you are a good person throughout your whole life but you don't believe in god you should be tortured forever and someone who actually killed people but repented and believes in god goes to heaven. If that's not the most twisted shit ever I don't know what is.

[BADecker]

I don't believe these studies at all, times have changed and the problem is always extremist people. Judging by religions is a mistake at this time. Or are we still living in caverns?

It's kinda the other way around. Look at the fossil record. Way back when earth was healthy, there lived 2 or 3 times the species that are around today. These species didn't get there, or die off, because of anything that mankind did. They are simply dying off because of entropy. Everything is falling apart, even if it is taking thousands of years for it to happen.

The point is that there is devolution, not evolution. The whole evolution hoax is simply some people trying to use positive thinking to make themselves feel better. They all know that evolution in the face of entropy is really non existent. Rather, it is entirely devolution we see.

And now, a bunch of jokers for whatever reason, are tossing out the better wisdom of the past, for the foolishness that gets them nowhere. And you have succumbed to their folly.

Science works, religion does not. When has prayer or god healed an amputee or a blind person lately? Do religious people go to the hospital when they are sick or do they just pray to god? Where are all the advancements or inventions based on the bible? How come the bible is totally useless and hasn't helped in any advancements. Medicine on the other hand actually works and so does all the other sciences. Your opinion is that evolution is a hoax but thankfully your opinion is meaningless on whether something works or not and evolution works, the bible does not.

Since science is the religion of so many scientists, by your own statement, religion works.

?? That's like saying, so many scientists believe in ghosts therefore ghosts work or are real. Scientists do not base science on religion or the bible. The bible which is supposed to be the word of God contains literally no useful information that can be applied to anything. Even evolution that you refute has been applied to things, even if it's only the concept, it's still useful. As I said, the bible hasn't.

Not at all. It's saying that if scientists believe in false religion, it doesn't work. But if they believe in true religion, it does work.

Scientists who have scientifically traced the truths of the Bible and believe in it, have found that it works better than any other science religion.

I don't know what you are talking about. You are just trying to deflect. Science works, religion does not. How does the bible work better than science? Don't you think  cars, planes, medicine, internet...etc are amazing advancements? Well they are all based on science not on the bible. The bible is not useful for anything. Extremely bad for morals as well. So much killing, slaves and rape in the bible is disgusting. Even god himself commanded people to kill and enslave. How does anyone think that is good.

How does anyone think that even if you are a good person throughout your whole life but you don't believe in god you should be tortured forever and someone who actually killed people but repented and believes in god goes to heaven. If that's not the most twisted shit ever I don't know what is.

How many times are you going to ignore the definition of "religion" in the dictionary ( http://www.dictionary.com/browse/religion?s=t )? Anything a person believes in and follows devotedly is a religion for him. Scientists are devoted to their science projects more than almost anyone else is devoted to anything else. Scientists are religious people.

You are similar to scientists. You are devoted to your propaganda that is trying to denounce religion, and in being so devoted, you have it as your religion. It's in the dictionary definition.

If God did not create the universe, there wouldn't be any scientific advancements. Therefore, God is the source of it all.

[Astargath]

I don't believe these studies at all, times have changed and the problem is always extremist people. Judging by religions is a mistake at this time. Or are we still living in caverns?

It's kinda the other way around. Look at the fossil record. Way back when earth was healthy, there lived 2 or 3 times the species that are around today. These species didn't get there, or die off, because of anything that mankind did. They are simply dying off because of entropy. Everything is falling apart, even if it is taking thousands of years for it to happen.

The point is that there is devolution, not evolution. The whole evolution hoax is simply some people trying to use positive thinking to make themselves feel better. They all know that evolution in the face of entropy is really non existent. Rather, it is entirely devolution we see.

And now, a bunch of jokers for whatever reason, are tossing out the better wisdom of the past, for the foolishness that gets them nowhere. And you have succumbed to their folly.

Science works, religion does not. When has prayer or god healed an amputee or a blind person lately? Do religious people go to the hospital when they are sick or do they just pray to god? Where are all the advancements or inventions based on the bible? How come the bible is totally useless and hasn't helped in any advancements. Medicine on the other hand actually works and so does all the other sciences. Your opinion is that evolution is a hoax but thankfully your opinion is meaningless on whether something works or not and evolution works, the bible does not.

Since science is the religion of so many scientists, by your own statement, religion works.

?? That's like saying, so many scientists believe in ghosts therefore ghosts work or are real. Scientists do not base science on religion or the bible. The bible which is supposed to be the word of God contains literally no useful information that can be applied to anything. Even evolution that you refute has been applied to things, even if it's only the concept, it's still useful. As I said, the bible hasn't.

Not at all. It's saying that if scientists believe in false religion, it doesn't work. But if they believe in true religion, it does work.

Scientists who have scientifically traced the truths of the Bible and believe in it, have found that it works better than any other science religion.

I don't know what you are talking about. You are just trying to deflect. Science works, religion does not. How does the bible work better than science? Don't you think  cars, planes, medicine, internet...etc are amazing advancements? Well they are all based on science not on the bible. The bible is not useful for anything. Extremely bad for morals as well. So much killing, slaves and rape in the bible is disgusting. Even god himself commanded people to kill and enslave. How does anyone think that is good.

How does anyone think that even if you are a good person throughout your whole life but you don't believe in god you should be tortured forever and someone who actually killed people but repented and believes in god goes to heaven. If that's not the most twisted shit ever I don't know what is.

How many times are you going to ignore the definition of "religion" in the dictionary ( http://www.dictionary.com/browse/religion?s=t )? Anything a person believes in and follows devotedly is a religion for him. Scientists are devoted to their science projects more than almost anyone else is devoted to anything else. Scientists are religious people.

You are similar to scientists. You are devoted to your propaganda that is trying to denounce religion, and in being so devoted, you have it as your religion. It's in the dictionary definition.

If God did not create the universe, there wouldn't be any scientific advancements. Therefore, God is the source of it all.

Ok? It doesn't matter whether you want to call it a religion or not, science still works and you haven't shown a single example of the bible being applied to something that actually works.

[BADecker]

I don't believe these studies at all, times have changed and the problem is always extremist people. Judging by religions is a mistake at this time. Or are we still living in caverns?

It's kinda the other way around. Look at the fossil record. Way back when earth was healthy, there lived 2 or 3 times the species that are around today. These species didn't get there, or die off, because of anything that mankind did. They are simply dying off because of entropy. Everything is falling apart, even if it is taking thousands of years for it to happen.

The point is that there is devolution, not evolution. The whole evolution hoax is simply some people trying to use positive thinking to make themselves feel better. They all know that evolution in the face of entropy is really non existent. Rather, it is entirely devolution we see.

And now, a bunch of jokers for whatever reason, are tossing out the better wisdom of the past, for the foolishness that gets them nowhere. And you have succumbed to their folly.

Science works, religion does not. When has prayer or god healed an amputee or a blind person lately? Do religious people go to the hospital when they are sick or do they just pray to god? Where are all the advancements or inventions based on the bible? How come the bible is totally useless and hasn't helped in any advancements. Medicine on the other hand actually works and so does all the other sciences. Your opinion is that evolution is a hoax but thankfully your opinion is meaningless on whether something works or not and evolution works, the bible does not.

Since science is the religion of so many scientists, by your own statement, religion works.

?? That's like saying, so many scientists believe in ghosts therefore ghosts work or are real. Scientists do not base science on religion or the bible. The bible which is supposed to be the word of God contains literally no useful information that can be applied to anything. Even evolution that you refute has been applied to things, even if it's only the concept, it's still useful. As I said, the bible hasn't.

Not at all. It's saying that if scientists believe in false religion, it doesn't work. But if they believe in true religion, it does work.

Scientists who have scientifically traced the truths of the Bible and believe in it, have found that it works better than any other science religion.

I don't know what you are talking about. You are just trying to deflect. Science works, religion does not. How does the bible work better than science? Don't you think  cars, planes, medicine, internet...etc are amazing advancements? Well they are all based on science not on the bible. The bible is not useful for anything. Extremely bad for morals as well. So much killing, slaves and rape in the bible is disgusting. Even god himself commanded people to kill and enslave. How does anyone think that is good.

How does anyone think that even if you are a good person throughout your whole life but you don't believe in god you should be tortured forever and someone who actually killed people but repented and believes in god goes to heaven. If that's not the most twisted shit ever I don't know what is.

How many times are you going to ignore the definition of "religion" in the dictionary ( http://www.dictionary.com/browse/religion?s=t )? Anything a person believes in and follows devotedly is a religion for him. Scientists are devoted to their science projects more than almost anyone else is devoted to anything else. Scientists are religious people.

You are similar to scientists. You are devoted to your propaganda that is trying to denounce religion, and in being so devoted, you have it as your religion. It's in the dictionary definition.

If God did not create the universe, there wouldn't be any scientific advancements. Therefore, God is the source of it all.

Ok? It doesn't matter whether you want to call it a religion or not, science still works and you haven't shown a single example of the bible being applied to something that actually works.

Check the yellow highlighting, directly above.

Some people can't see the forest for the trees.

Jesus said, John 9:41:

If you were blind, you would not be guilty of sin; but now that you claim you can see, your guilt remains.

[CoinCube]

Ok? It doesn't matter whether you want to call it a religion or not, science still works and you haven't shown a single example of the bible being applied to something that actually works.

Astargath this is a complex topic but I would suggest that you are applying a frame of reference that is too small.

One way the Bible "works" is by creating the conditions that allow science to "work".

Christianity and Science: Friends or Foes?
https://www.exploregod.com/christianity-and-science-friends-or-foes

There are certain philosophical presuppositions that must be assumed in order for science to be considered an effective, worthy endeavor:

✧ The external world is real and knowable.
✧ Nature itself is not divine. It is an object worthy of study, not worship.
✧ The universe is orderly. There is uniformity in nature that allows us to observe past phenomena and to understand and predict future occurrences.
✧ Our minds and senses are capable of accurately observing and understanding the world.
✧ Language and mathematics can accurately describe the external world that we observe.

So where did these metaphysical assumptions come from?

Science, Romance and the Scientific Romance of Christendom
http://www.scifiwright.com/2012/04/science-romance-and-the-scientific-romance-of-christendom/

The most famous philosopher of the Hellenic culture, Socrates, was condemned to death for his investigations, while Aristotle fled into exile. The Hellenes were a people soaked in magic and mysticism, to which the clean intellectualism of Christianity was a shocking and refreshing change. Julian the Apostate, eager to reintroduce the Old Religion, in order to foretell the outcome of his war in Persia, had a slave girl disemboweled and her entrails examined by haruspices, official readers of entrails.

The reason why we think of the Greek as logical and philosophical culture is that the monks of the Dark Ages carefully preserved the ancient writings concerning grammar, rhetoric, logic, arithmetic, geometry, music and astronomy.

The monks did not preserve the mystery religions, the mysticism, no more than did the Romans after the conversion of the Empire preserve the barbaric customs and traditions of their pagan fathers, such as slavery, gladiatorial combat, exposing unwanted infants, the right of the father to kill disobedient sons, temple prostitution, temple sodomy prostitution, and no fault divorce.
...
Science arose in Christendom because it could arise nowhere else.

To summarize briefly, the Latins believed that:

• The universe was rationally ordered because a single rational God had willed it into being
• This order was knowable by autonomous human reason by ‘measuring, numbering, and weighing’ (and reason could be trusted in this regard)
• Matter could act directly on matter in “the common course of nature;” and because God was true to his promises, these actions were dependable and repeatable; and
• The discovery of such relations was a worthwhile pursuit for adults.

They also embedded this pursuit in their culture through broad-based cultural institutions:

• Creating independent, self-governing corporations in the social space between Church and State.
• Accepting with enthusiasm the work of pagan philosophers and Muslim commentators and reconciling them with their religious beliefs.
• Teaching logic, reason, and natural philosophy systematically across the whole of Europe in self-governing universities, in consequence of which: Nearly every medieval theologian was first trained in natural philosophy, which created enthusiasm for rather than resistance to the study of nature.
• Encouraged freedom of inquiry and a culture of “poking into things” by means of the Questions genre and the disputatio.

The reason it could arise nowhere else is that, while scientific breakthroughs are made by particular geniuses, and which refinements of technique are possible in any civilization, scientific progress itself is a orderly group effort, and must be sustained by the consensus of the general society. You cannot have a generally literate society, as Europe had in the Late Middle Ages, without a university system that enjoyed academic freedom.

Science or natural philosophy cannot be maintained by the consensus of society unless that same consensus accept the metaphysical and theological axioms on which natural science is based.

So what happens to science in a world that starts to reject the basic foundation that allowed for science in the first place. Like so many other things it starts to die. This slow death is well documented by Charlton.

Not even trying: the corruption of real science
http://corruption-of-science.blogspot.com/

Real Science noun Science that operates on the basis of a belief in the reality of truth: that truth is real.

The argument of this book in a single paragraph

Briefly, the argument of this book is that real science is dead, and the main reason is that professional researchers are not even trying to seek the truth and speak the truth; and the reason for this is that professional ‘scientists’ no longer believe in the truth - no longer believe that there is an eternal unchanging reality beyond human wishes and organization which they have a duty to seek and proclaim to the best of their (naturally limited) abilities. Hence the vast structures of personnel and resources that constitute modern ‘science’ are not real science but instead merely a professional research bureaucracy, thus fake or pseudo-science; regulated by peer review (that is, committee opinion) rather than the search-for and service-to reality. Among the consequences are that modern publications in the research literature must be assumed to be worthless or misleading and should always be ignored. In practice, this means that nearly all ‘science’ needs to be demolished (or allowed to collapse) and real science carefully rebuilt outside the professional research structure, from the ground up, by real scientists who regard truth-seeking as an imperative and truthfulness as an iron law.

[Astargath]

Ok? It doesn't matter whether you want to call it a religion or not, science still works and you haven't shown a single example of the bible being applied to something that actually works.

Astargath this is a complex topic but I would suggest that you are applying a frame of reference that is too small.

One way the Bible "works" is by creating the conditions that allow science to "work".

Christianity and Science: Friends or Foes?
https://www.exploregod.com/christianity-and-science-friends-or-foes

There are certain philosophical presuppositions that must be assumed in order for science to be considered an effective, worthy endeavor:

✧ The external world is real and knowable.
✧ Nature itself is not divine. It is an object worthy of study, not worship.
✧ The universe is orderly. There is uniformity in nature that allows us to observe past phenomena and to understand and predict future occurrences.
✧ Our minds and senses are capable of accurately observing and understanding the world.
✧ Language and mathematics can accurately describe the external world that we observe.

So where did these metaphysical assumptions come from?

Science, Romance and the Scientific Romance of Christendom
http://www.scifiwright.com/2012/04/science-romance-and-the-scientific-romance-of-christendom/

The most famous philosopher of the Hellenic culture, Socrates, was condemned to death for his investigations, while Aristotle fled into exile. The Hellenes were a people soaked in magic and mysticism, to which the clean intellectualism of Christianity was a shocking and refreshing change. Julian the Apostate, eager to reintroduce the Old Religion, in order to foretell the outcome of his war in Persia, had a slave girl disemboweled and her entrails examined by haruspices, official readers of entrails.

The reason why we think of the Greek as logical and philosophical culture is that the monks of the Dark Ages carefully preserved the ancient writings concerning grammar, rhetoric, logic, arithmetic, geometry, music and astronomy.

The monks did not preserve the mystery religions, the mysticism, no more than did the Romans after the conversion of the Empire preserve the barbaric customs and traditions of their pagan fathers, such as slavery, gladiatorial combat, exposing unwanted infants, the right of the father to kill disobedient sons, temple prostitution, temple sodomy prostitution, and no fault divorce.
...
Science arose in Christendom because it could arise nowhere else.

To summarize briefly, the Latins believed that:

• The universe was rationally ordered because a single rational God had willed it into being
• This order was knowable by autonomous human reason by ‘measuring, numbering, and weighing’ (and reason could be trusted in this regard)
• Matter could act directly on matter in “the common course of nature;” and because God was true to his promises, these actions were dependable and repeatable; and
• The discovery of such relations was a worthwhile pursuit for adults.

They also embedded this pursuit in their culture through broad-based cultural institutions:

• Creating independent, self-governing corporations in the social space between Church and State.
• Accepting with enthusiasm the work of pagan philosophers and Muslim commentators and reconciling them with their religious beliefs.
• Teaching logic, reason, and natural philosophy systematically across the whole of Europe in self-governing universities, in consequence of which: Nearly every medieval theologian was first trained in natural philosophy, which created enthusiasm for rather than resistance to the study of nature.
• Encouraged freedom of inquiry and a culture of “poking into things” by means of the Questions genre and the disputatio.

The reason it could arise nowhere else is that, while scientific breakthroughs are made by particular geniuses, and which refinements of technique are possible in any civilization, scientific progress itself is a orderly group effort, and must be sustained by the consensus of the general society. You cannot have a generally literate society, as Europe had in the Late Middle Ages, without a university system that enjoyed academic freedom.

Science or natural philosophy cannot be maintained by the consensus of society unless that same consensus accept the metaphysical and theological axioms on which natural science is based.

So what happens to science in a world that starts to reject the basic foundation that allowed for science in the first place. Like so many other things it starts to die. This slow death is well documented by Charlton.

Not even trying: the corruption of real science
http://corruption-of-science.blogspot.com/

Real Science noun Science that operates on the basis of a belief in the reality of truth: that truth is real.

The argument of this book in a single paragraph

Briefly, the argument of this book is that real science is dead, and the main reason is that professional researchers are not even trying to seek the truth and speak the truth; and the reason for this is that professional ‘scientists’ no longer believe in the truth - no longer believe that there is an eternal unchanging reality beyond human wishes and organization which they have a duty to seek and proclaim to the best of their (naturally limited) abilities. Hence the vast structures of personnel and resources that constitute modern ‘science’ are not real science but instead merely a professional research bureaucracy, thus fake or pseudo-science; regulated by peer review (that is, committee opinion) rather than the search-for and service-to reality. Among the consequences are that modern publications in the research literature must be assumed to be worthless or misleading and should always be ignored. In practice, this means that nearly all ‘science’ needs to be demolished (or allowed to collapse) and real science carefully rebuilt outside the professional research structure, from the ground up, by real scientists who regard truth-seeking as an imperative and truthfulness as an iron law.

You could argue that with any other religious book or just philosophy in general. A lot of philosophers already presented arguments for the creation of the universe, life and many other problems. That doesn't mean anything. And badecker says that god allows all science to happen. The god from the bible? Or the one from islam? Or maybe is the one from the other thousands of religions, which one is it?