Swedish ASIC miner company kncminer.com

[Searing]

if not, the retainer money is lost, and KNC will have fucked us even more

THIS is the reason, why I'm scared to join. I lost because of those swedish retards thousands of dollars and I'm somehow living with it but...if court will be unsuccessful for any reason I will lost even more..Is there any assumption about success court from somebody, who is familiar with law?

good luck with those fuckers anyway.

yeah my issue as well......i can't see KNC not appealing this up the courts in Sweden for 10 years.. i mean we are talking millions of dollars here much better to just pay
the knc law firm for a few years (and hope btc goes up in price i guess)..drag it out forever

and then IF YOU LOSE you have to pay KNC's legal costs which would by that time be CONSIDERABLE imho

my situation is different due to circumstances with bank error and now a biz and file taxes etc
 ..i can by being a legal biz in usa and such with equip depreciation the 10,131.80 miner down to around 7598.85 usd loss when it all wraps up
(have yet to pay any taxes on what i've mined vs equip i've got..so golden there)

thus with what I've mined ...i kinda am at a loss if this makes sense due to the above concerns

as to those who do pursue this good luck .....just my circumstances that retainer and what i've mined in coin ..the risk would be considerable in comparison when it is all
shaken out vs what I can maybe probably be close to ROI just riding this beast out..and i assume any settlement I would be taxed on anyway....so it would all come out
the same in the wash?

also unsure of status....when I ordered the miner (for like 6 months) was NOT a legal business....after april 10th 2013 WAS a legal business everyone knows knc's view on that

and I've sent previously 2 emails to the knc class action in the usa version with NO reply..that also is not encouraging

not a slam and better info then i have is appreciated....just from where i'm sitting on the fence what i'm pondering following this thread of thought on the class action

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[notlist3d]

if not, the retainer money is lost, and KNC will have fucked us even more

THIS is the reason, why I'm scared to join. I lost because of those swedish retards thousands of dollars and I'm somehow living with it but...if court will be unsuccessful for any reason I will lost even more..Is there any assumption about success court from somebody, who is familiar with law?

good luck with those fuckers anyway.

yeah my issue as well......i can't see KNC not appealing this up the courts in Sweden for 10 years.. i mean we are talking millions of dollars here much better to just pay
the knc law firm for a few years (and hope btc goes up in price i guess)..drag it out forever

and then IF YOU LOSE you have to pay KNC's legal costs which would by that time be CONSIDERABLE imho

my situation is different due to circumstances with bank error and now a biz and file taxes etc
 ..i can by being a legal biz in usa and such with equip depreciation the 10,131.80 miner down to around 7598.85 usd loss when it all wraps up
(have yet to pay any taxes on what i've mined vs equip i've got..so golden there)

thus with what I've mined ...i kinda am at a loss if this makes sense due to the above concerns

as to those who do pursue this good luck .....just my circumstances that retainer and what i've mined in coin ..the risk would be considerable in comparison when it is all
shaken out vs what I can maybe probably be close to ROI just riding this beast out..and i assume any settlement I would be taxed on anyway....so it would all come out
the same in the wash?

also unsure of status....when I ordered the miner (for like 6 months) was NOT a legal business....after april 10th 2013 WAS a legal business everyone knows knc's view on that

and I've sent previously 2 emails to the knc class action in the usa version with NO reply..that also is not encouraging

not a slam and better info then i have is appreciated....just from where i'm sitting on the fence what i'm pondering following this thread of thought on the class action

I wish I could find the quote I think it said the minimun number they would do class action was 20 people (I could be wrong), but I think it was around that number.  If that is true they want 30k to go ahead with KNC lawsuit.  Please correct me if I'm wrong on this.

I have only dealt with lawyers in two occasions. So I'm not a legal expert.  The one that really was a big deal he knew he could do it and he set a percent as he believed in the case.

These lawyers might be great... but I think they should have went with a percentage vs the retainer on class action if they believed in it.

[varChar]

What would be a fair amount to claim from KnC regarding the bonus Titan, either if they accept it without trial or if it will go to trial?
What was the price on the Titan? Around $5500?

"Dear Sir/Madam.

We can see from our records that you have selected to receive a bonus Titan miner as part of the 2 for 1 offer we ran last year. Due technical issues in the selection process the Titan miner was not correctly registered as a choice and not accounted for. In this case we would like to offer you the following options instead of receiving the bonus Titan miner.

Option 1: Swap the bonus Titan miner for a free Neptune miner expected to ship within the next few weeks.

Or

Option 2: Receive a BTC payment of 3 Bitcoins per bonus Titan miner you were entitled to. (If you select this option please provide a BTC wallet address with your confirmation)

Please reply to this email to confirm your choice before the end of business 17:00 CET on Friday 3rd of April.

Thank you.
KnCMiner Team. "

[Searing]

the knc class action link FAQ page

http://kncclassaction.com/faq/


er went to the above site..here is a quote....kinda sums up my concerns on what happens if KNC wins this case




We require a retainer of 15% of any invoices paid to KNC. (For example, if you paid KNC $10,131.80 USD for a Titan, your retainer will be $1,519.77).

Note:

* If Swedish court demands a security bond for your individual case, you are also liable for a bond, which is refunded upon favorable verdict. We make no guarantee that we can waive your bond requirement.



so as you see my main concern of the above...what is to stop knc from simply appealing on up (till the heat death of the universe)...and or we having to pay more and more fees to the law firm? What is the limit if KNC won the class action and they had say a million bucks in legal fees....if 50 folk were liable under the above  senario that is 20k each
and/or again they also if they won could counter sue for damages to their rep with the same group i would imagine

just looks kinda limitless on what burden you are partaking in this class action SHOULD YOU LOSE THE CASE or even if it just drags on and the class action folk run out of $$$ to proceed....

heck that would be my straegy if I was KNC

anyway the above stood out....

i suppose i should send a THIRD email to these people and get the facts (would help if i could find my previous frigging emails and no do a re-do)


heh managed to sign up for the site in the above FAQ link..it states submit an online form to be considered....seems the link for the online form is not coming
up in IE or Firefox....this is hardly encouraging....name and password work...go to this page and fill out form and nada

[notthematrix]

the knc class action link FAQ page

http://kncclassaction.com/faq/


er went to the above site..here is a quote....kinda sums up my concerns on what happens if KNC wins this case




We require a retainer of 15% of any invoices paid to KNC. (For example, if you paid KNC $10,131.80 USD for a Titan, your retainer will be $1,519.77).

Note:

* If Swedish court demands a security bond for your individual case, you are also liable for a bond, which is refunded upon favorable verdict. We make no guarantee that we can waive your bond requirement.



so as you see my main concern of the above...what is to stop knc from simply appealing on up (till the heat death of the universe)...and or we having to pay more and more fees to the law firm? What is the limit if KNC won the class action and they had say a million bucks in legal fees....if 50 folk were liable under the above  senario that is 20k each
and/or again they also if they won could counter sue for damages to their rep with the same group i would imagine

just looks kinda limitless on what burden you are partaking in this class action SHOULD YOU LOSE THE CASE or even if it just drags on and the class action folk run out of $$$ to proceed....

heck that would be my straegy if I was KNC

anyway the above stood out....

i suppose i should send a THIRD email to these people and get the facts (would help if i could find my previous frigging emails and no do a re-do)


heh managed to sign up for the site in the above FAQ link..it states submit an online form to be considered....seems the link for the online form is not coming
up in IE or Firefox....this is hardly encouraging....name and password work...go to this page and fill out form and nada

Yep thats why I dont like going to courd myself as a lawyer family member
I would go for  3 BTC ,, as yoiu paid BTC for the miner.....
KNC can apply for at least 7 years and you have to pay up front.

[retro72]

...what is to stop knc from simply appealing on up (till the heat death of the universe)...and or we having to pay more and more fees to the law firm?

Searing. I've seen you post this same statement a few times now. This is just FUD and not how the law works.

KNC can appeal the decision ONCE in the Appeals court (Appellate Court) THAT IS IT. In extreme circumstances where a legal precedent needs to be set a party can appeal to the Supreme Court. That is absolutely not the case with KNC.

They have only 3 weeks to appeal the decision from the date they receive judgement. Leave to appeal can also be denied, making the Judges ruling final.

So KNC cannot drag this out ad-infinitum draining the plaintiffs of their finances. It's just not possible. I wish people would do the most basic research before posting statements or making decisions that may cost them or other people thousands of dollars.

Read this if you would like more info on appeals or the Swedish courts system in general http://www.domstol.se/Funktioner/English/Legal-proceedings/Contentious-cases/Appeal/

@notlist3d I know someone posted Joakim was doing a no up front cost deal/percentage, but that is probably a spoof email/scam. As far as I'm aware Swedish law prohibits "No win, No fee" deals so the idea that the lawyers don't have confidence in the case because they won't work on a percentage does not apply here. But I would email them and ask.

Look, if you don't feel you have a strong case and its not worth the risk, sit this one out. Personally I think KNCs case is extremely weak on so many fronts, morally and legally and I'm prepared to put my money where my mouth is. I'm certainly not going to roll over and let KNC shaft me. I've never let anyone do it the past. I see no reason to start now.

As for notthematrix. I sure people here have enough sense to dismiss whatever that fool has to say regarding this or anything else quite frankly.

Do you're own research and come to your own conclusions.

[Searing]

the knc class action link FAQ page

http://kncclassaction.com/faq/


er went to the above site..here is a quote....kinda sums up my concerns on what happens if KNC wins this case




We require a retainer of 15% of any invoices paid to KNC. (For example, if you paid KNC $10,131.80 USD for a Titan, your retainer will be $1,519.77).

Note:

* If Swedish court demands a security bond for your individual case, you are also liable for a bond, which is refunded upon favorable verdict. We make no guarantee that we can waive your bond requirement.



so as you see my main concern of the above...what is to stop knc from simply appealing on up (till the heat death of the universe)...and or we having to pay more and more fees to the law firm? What is the limit if KNC won the class action and they had say a million bucks in legal fees....if 50 folk were liable under the above  senario that is 20k each
and/or again they also if they won could counter sue for damages to their rep with the same group i would imagine

just looks kinda limitless on what burden you are partaking in this class action SHOULD YOU LOSE THE CASE or even if it just drags on and the class action folk run out of $$$ to proceed....

heck that would be my straegy if I was KNC

anyway the above stood out....

i suppose i should send a THIRD email to these people and get the facts (would help if i could find my previous frigging emails and no do a re-do)


heh managed to sign up for the site in the above FAQ link..it states submit an online form to be considered....seems the link for the online form is not coming
up in IE or Firefox....this is hardly encouraging....name and password work...go to this page and fill out form and nada

Yep thats why I dont like going to courd myself as a lawyer family member
I would go for  3 BTC ,, as yoiu paid BTC for the miner.....
KNC can apply for at least 7 years and you have to pay up front.

yeah would suck thou NOT to be one of say the 50 folk on the class action and they WON...in that the class action WILL ONLY APPLY to those involved I guess...but then again
at that point I'd guess with a KNC loss we would be 'motivated' to start another from scratch huh?

but yeah if i could get say a ball park figure of what a worst case loss would cost say cost each of the 50 say as much as 2k plus the 1.5k retainer..i am pissed off enough I might do it...but unless they could narrow it down and such..and it not being such an open ended number...and if you have to keep chucking money out from knc appealing losing appealing etc ....well too open ended for me....visions of usa corps just dragging it out in court till people bugging them run out of money..and a settlement of 10k each or so to 50 people is 500,000 usd..so i can't see knc saying you win either...

will see what kinda info folk can find out..but the fact that the FAQ says that the Swedish court may require a 'bond' to be made by each person in the class action group does not inspire courage on my part....and you pay them from what i can tell the 1.5k then they tell you the particulars of the case you just bought into....

my further exception is that KNC is gonna go with the Swedish law claim that 'mining is a business' so i guess it may boil down to how much the Swedish courts feel like protecting the precedent as a hedge to EU law.......for all I know KNC may think they have the case run just on that one Swedish rule of law ..ie you are a business..so screw you... EU consumer protection and law etc does not apply argument..that may be a BIG deal for Swedish courts to keep for all I know.....sovereignty and all that

all lawyers and court cases of a monetary value ie $$$$ should be replaced with a vigorous round round of 2 out of 3 'rock/paper/scissors for such cases of law...would sure as hell cost a lot less to society......we'd probably have 3/4 less lawyers.........and probably no worse then the court system we have on such monetary law with 'expert witnesses' and all the rest of the rigging of such cases in big moneys favor imho...and we'd have the added benefit of the new trend of martial art rock/paper/scissor dojo's ....whoo hoo...


ah if only btc was still 1k i'd so do this ...knc really really pisses me off.....(never saw anything like their change in attitude from nun to porn star in an ethical point of view)

grrrrrr

 

[Searing]

...what is to stop knc from simply appealing on up (till the heat death of the universe)...and or we having to pay more and more fees to the law firm?

Searing. I've seen you post this same statement a few times now. This is just FUD and not how the law works.

KNC can appeal the decision ONCE in the Appeals court (Appellate Court) THAT IS IT. In extreme circumstances where a legal precedent needs to be set a party can appeal to the Supreme Court. That is absolutely not the case with KNC.

They have only 3 weeks to appeal the decision from the date they receive judgement. Leave to appeal can also be denied, making the Judges ruling final.

So KNC cannot drag this out ad-infinitum draining the plaintiffs of their finances. It's just not possible. I wish people would do the most basic research before posting statements or making decisions that may cost them or other people thousands of dollars.

Read this if you would like more info on appeals or the Swedish courts system in general http://www.domstol.se/Funktioner/English/Legal-proceedings/Contentious-cases/Appeal/

@notlist3d I know someone posted Joakim was doing a no up front cost deal/percentage, but that is probably a spoof email/scam. As far as I'm aware Swedish law prohibits "No win, No fee" deals so the idea that the lawyers don't have confidence in the case because they won't work on a percentage does not apply here. But I would email them and ask.

Look, if you don't feel you have a strong case and its not worth the risk, sit this one out. Personally I think KNCs case is extremely weak on so many fronts, morally and legally and I'm prepared to put my money where my mouth is. I'm certainly not going to roll over and let KNC shaft me. I've never let anyone do it the past. I see no reason to start now.

As for notthematrix. I sure people here have enough sense to dismiss whatever that fool has to say regarding this or anything else quite frankly.

Do you're own research and come to your own conclusions.

ok I stand corrected..on this case did they ever put a limit on what the amount you can LOSE if KNC wins the case...say on the 'us miners were a business' argument...and what is this security bond....? I can't find anything even in ball park terms...so if knc for example (this is just my paranoia here) was to blow crap loads of money on lawyers for this ie high priced law firms i'd guess (50 people 10k a pop that is 500,000 bucks) and they WIN.....I'd just be kinda annoyed shucking out another 10k to them and the loss of the 1.5k retainer

as to the appeals process I will take you on your word for this

I also had no luck finding the page for the online request to join the class action tonite when i tried so unsure what is up with that ..it just let me register to the site sent me
to a page with a supposed link to this supposed request to join...and nothing

perhaps they expect me to call them with such questions..but the site was not clear enough on risk reward etc with the whole process imho at least on this type of pay up front class action 

[retro72]

ok I stand corrected..on this case did they ever put a limit on what the amount you can LOSE if KNC wins the case...say on the 'us miners were a business' argument...and what is this security bond....? I can't find anything even in ball park terms...so if knc for example (this is just my paranoia here) was to blow crap loads of money on lawyers for this ie high priced law firms i'd guess (50 people 10k a pop that is 500,000 bucks) and they WIN.....I'd just be kinda annoyed shucking out another 10k to them and the loss of the 1.5k retainer

as to the appeals process I will take you on your word for this

I also had no luck finding the page for the online request to join the class action tonite when i tried so unsure what is up with that ..it just let me register to the site sent me
to a page with a supposed link to this supposed request to join...and nothing

perhaps they expect me to call them with such questions..but the site was not clear enough on risk reward etc with the whole process imho at least on this type of pay up front class action  

Please don't take my word for it. It's there in black and white on the Swedish Courts website.

Regarding costs. They are awarded by the court and represent "reasonable costs of counsel" So no, KNC can't employ an army 10k an hour Lawyers and expect the plaintiffs to pay for them. They will be liable for any extra costs over and above what is deemed reasonable by the court. Also as far as I'm aware they have one guy working on this, Per Widman so there is not a herd of Armani suits running the show.

Coincidently Joakim just emailed me about joining the class action and said the forms would be up in a few days. I guess that's why you can't get them. I still need to figure whether to join or continue with my individual case. I feel I have a strong case so spreading of the costs in the event of loss isn't really an issue for me and seems to be the only benefit of joining the class action in my case. But discretion is the better part of valour so I'll have to give it some thought.

[s1gs3gv]

Isn't Brock Pierce a big investor in KNC ? Does KNC now own the Bitcoin Foundation ? Is this the final nail in the coffin of the foundation ?

https://www.coindesk.com/brock-pierce-bitcoin-foundation-board-chairman/

[Prelude]

Did anyone ever figure out how to overclock a neptune over 500MHz?

Or a Titan over 325MHz?

[unitedminers]

If a Titan cube (B1) doesn't mine any longer, is there any chance/idea to get him back mining?

[notthematrix]

Did anyone ever figure out how to overclock a neptune over 500MHz?

Or a Titan over 325MHz?

500 MHZ for a neptune is hardcoded in the asic firmware.
its simply the max allowed setting.
0=off 1=50 etc...

[Searing]

Isn't Brock Pierce a big investor in KNC ? Does KNC now own the Bitcoin Foundation ? Is this the final nail in the coffin of the foundation ?

https://www.coindesk.com/brock-pierce-bitcoin-foundation-board-chairman/

my view is that when he got involved in KNC that is when customer service  went to sh*t and they went the IPO data hall route soon after
the canceling of promised module add ons with their jupiter/saturn lines beyond nov 2013 etc etc


so yeah....fricking BTC is looking like "The empire" from star wars on the Bitcoin foundation side and the the rebels from star wars on the MIT Media Lab and new cryptocurrency
dept that hired the main bitcoin developers on the other hand...(ie academia was instrumental in going open source in turning the Arpanet military net into the framework for
the modern Internet with UNIX between universities etc.....looks like they want lightning to strike twice...if bitcoin protocol is a future big sucess it would be a big deal
to long term future enhancement of MIT .....imho ...i think  a place like MIT is looking for kudos decades ahead....or i hope

we will see.....weird frigging day reading bitcion foundation head is brock pierce and that MIT is gonna house/fund the current main bitcoin core devs via academia model the
same day yesterday ...litterally had to sit back and do a 'double take' to make sure i read both titles right on the daily 'bitcoin' google search 24hrs ..(hey i have no life)

'strange times"

links

http://www.coindesk.com/bitcoin-foundation-director-no-plans-to-fund-core-development/if i

well just saw this above...guess it is all up to MIT project with current core devs now


the corresponding MIT news confirming such


http://cointelegraph.com/news/114046/mit-to-take-over-funding-of-three-bitcoin-core-developers

if I had to choose between the two options above ..I'd rather go the MIT route anyway......hopefully more public and open...and MIT is 'probably' gonna use
this to enhance its reputation rather then "just" a  money making endeavor (hey a person can hope?)

but yeah Brock Pierce involvement in KNC fiasco does not make me warm and fuzzy about him involved in the bitcoin foundation  for me also (hope I'm proven very wrong)

If a Titan cube (B1) doesn't mine any longer, is there any chance/idea to get him back mining?

if you can't get it to run at all you 'supposedly' as far as I know send it back to get it replaced from KNC as an RMA....
not sure what they charge for shipping/handling so would check that out ..likely you may pay both ways

and of course turn around is out of your hands...but see if you can get a reply..if it is completely toast and you did not mess with the innards of it
'eventually' you would get it back hopefully working at some point in time..being a completely dead cube as you state above seems like there is little risk
in that it is already 'a brick'

let us know here how the email works for an RMA etc some of us will probably also be in your boat someday ..would be good to know how/what/if/when it
all works out for future reference if needed

Did anyone ever figure out how to overclock a neptune over 500MHz?

Or a Titan over 325MHz?

very good question I would like to know this as well ...probably they are pretty much maxed out ...but someone confirming such would be great

2 further related questions below

I would like to know if there is anyway in the future ..when or if it becomes needed ..if you CAN upgrade the BFGMINER to whatever next
enhancement or upgrade may come down the way in the future....or even if that would even could be done w/o knc firmware enhancements
etc

my view is (due to the sudden urge to make a full .img file of 2.00 in knc's last update to titan) that this is the LAST Firmware upgrades and/or bfgminer upgrade that will
ever be made..for neptunes or titans ..ie they have pulled up the circus tent and moved on to the giant data hall IPO farm with 16nm etc

so again

1) is it possible in the future or common if you think so to upgrade to future versions of bfgminer versions for the titan?

2) with the source for the firmware out there on github...has anyone looked at further improvements for titan or neptune source as a possible project?

again probably does not matter to do either at this point in time ..but the last thing i programmed was an apple II gs ...so kinda felt the need to ask

[pdx99]

Well In the US you can sue for notting , in sweden this is diffrent , but KNC is going to refunt as I read so I guess they are not so bad at all.
oh btw if you dont accept the refund well then you are on your own.
as long KNC miners are not FCC or CE , certified you have NO CASE if it explodes in your face!

Does being this stupid come naturally or do you have to work at it?

@s1gs3gv
I'm waiting for the prelim hearings where we go before the judge and outline our case. Should be May/June. I'm not in the class action, I have my own case but the class action has slowed everything down. The Judge wants to hear all the KNC cases together to speed up the process. So unfortunately the head start I had has been nullified.

@notlist3d
Give Joakim or Magnus a bell. Someone posted a few pages back they were offering to work on a percentage with no up front costs on the class action. I've already paid so I haven't got the details but it might be worth dropping them a line.

Based on the consistency in his postings, I think it's a natural ability.

[muhrohmat]

well its a generic site you may need to put the asic to sell no? lol itsa  great site i do trust nordish tech soo it will be all good and those miners will sell.

[teslaman]

Do you guys think these would be good replacement fans for Neptunes?

http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835200110&cm_re=140mm_fan-_-35-200-110-_-Product

No, the worst Neptune stock fan is 120CFM minimum, so you need one better than that at the very least.

On the class action, I would love to join and could really use a win on that having paid $13.2K for my Neptune, but I can't afford another $2K gamble on the retainer. I really think they will win, but I just can't afford the risk of being stuck with that bill on top of the Neptune. Just my luck, lol.

[varChar]

Do you guys think these would be good replacement fans for Neptunes?

http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835200110&cm_re=140mm_fan-_-35-200-110-_-Product

No, the worst Neptune stock fan is 120CFM minimum, so you need one better than that at the very least.

On the class action, I would love to join and could really use a win on that having paid $13.2K for my Neptune, but I can't afford another $2K gamble on the retainer. I really think they will win, but I just can't afford the risk of being stuck with that bill on top of the Neptune. Just my luck, lol.

Sorry to hear that!
Think that everyone got some thought like that. What I understand there will be a group speak, but everyone in the group will have their own claim. Perhaps you can claim a small amount of $2000 in different damages that KnC caused. If we/you loose, you will only need to pay $300. But at least you did something against the company. And if we/you win, you will at least get some of it. And you don't need to feel later on in life that you didn't do it when you had the chance. Justice is important!
Even if you paid $13.2K for your Neptune you don't need to take that amount as a 'claim amount' in the court.

Probably it isn't the same thing in this group speak. Please help me with this word, but in Sweden we got this 'base amount' (in swedish: basbelopp). It's 44 500 SEK (~$5600). You don't need to pay any costs at all if the amount in the court is half a 'base amount' (22 250 SEK), perhaps there is some fee of $100-$200 to begin the process. But if you loose, you don't need to pay anything.
But then you probably need to be out of the group speak :/

However at least send an email to one of the loywers. Perhaps it will be cheaper, say 10% of the amount you claim if we get enough peoples in this group speak.

[defcon23]

looking for some pcie power conectors for severals cubes. anyone know where could i find some at good prices ?  
thanx in advance  

[xhomerx10]

looking for some pcie power conectors for severals cubes. anyone know where could i find some at good prices ?  
thanx in advance  

 Try this guy:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=54059