Phoenix1969
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LIR DEV
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December 29, 2013, 07:18:39 PM |
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Because it's in U.S. Dollars, and includes transmitting to wallets in the USA
I see, like some hosting services will pay out in dollars not btc. or transmitting to a wallet in USA... whatever... I'm not the gov't here... lol... The point speaks for itself... and I totally agree with you, and am on your side... but the rules are the rules.... and they just let them be known... it is what it is.
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soy
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Activity: 1428
Merit: 1013
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December 29, 2013, 07:24:23 PM |
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FINCEN was created not to hamstring Bitcoin miners but to impeded illegal drug imports that addict and kill Americans. That the banks have another agenda and can exert influence to use FINCEN regulations to make Bitcoin use difficult is another story. Just my opinion.
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noodle73
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December 29, 2013, 07:45:57 PM |
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There's another way of reading that FINCEN stuff which is essentially "if you own the machine and mine from it for yourself, you don't need to register". So it doesn't matter if it is co-located in a hosting farm or in your home, it's your miner with the income going to you. Mining contracts are a distribution from the company that owns the miner (i.e. not you) to a customer who has paid to receive a share of the earnings over a period of time. In that case you don't own the miner so the bitcoins are being transmitted to you. KnC always went to lengths to say that if hosted it was your specific miner and would be shipped to you at the end of the contract, so I don't see how they would be caught by FINCEN as well as the fact that they're outside US jurisdiction.
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RickJamesBTC
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December 29, 2013, 07:48:13 PM |
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There's another way of reading that FINCEN stuff which is essentially "if you own the machine and mine from it for yourself, you don't need to register". So it doesn't matter if it is co-located in a hosting farm or in your home, it's your miner with the income going to you. Mining contracts are a distribution from the company that owns the miner (i.e. not you) to a customer who has paid to receive a share of the earnings over a period of time. In that case you don't own the miner so the bitcoins are being transmitted to you. KnC always went to lengths to say that if hosted it was your specific miner and would be shipped to you at the end of the contract, so I don't see how they would be caught by FINCEN as well as the fact that they're outside US jurisdiction.
Thankfully, with most regulations here, things take so long to sort out that you can just wait and see. Only major players need to worry at first, as they are the ones that will be approached for compliance first, and have the lawyers ready for it.
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soy
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December 29, 2013, 09:30:33 PM |
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I agree. Selling timeshares on Ebay is out tho.
I was thinking of the German Ebay offering of 12 hours output from a Jupiter for some hundreds of Euros but now I'm thinking about the group buys with hosting one sees here on bitcointalk.org in Bitcoin Forum > Bitcoin > Mining > Hardware > Group buys.
So, if twenty guys go in on a Neptune purchase they own 1/20th of the miner, one of the owners does the operation and pays out to the other owners. When it gets down to the billing of power, rental on the space to run the miner, and some hourly wage for checking in on it, I'd guess it would be tougher to argue that it's privately owned.
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RickJamesBTC
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December 29, 2013, 09:49:15 PM |
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I agree. Selling timeshares on Ebay is out tho.
I was thinking of the German Ebay offering of 12 hours output from a Jupiter for some hundreds of Euros but now I'm thinking about the group buys with hosting one sees here on bitcointalk.org in Bitcoin Forum > Bitcoin > Mining > Hardware > Group buys.
So, if twenty guys go in on a Neptune purchase they own 1/20th of the miner, one of the owners does the operation and pays out to the other owners. When it gets down to the billing of power, rental on the space to run the miner, and some hourly wage for checking in on it, I'd guess it would be tougher to argue that it's privately owned.
This discussion needs its own thread. Has nothing to do with knc. Nothing is certain yet, so there is no point in clouding up the knc discussion further. Yes I know I'm the one who mentioned it first, I was just happy to see it. lol
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Grix
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December 29, 2013, 11:09:55 PM |
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When I bought my saturn I picked it up in stockholm. They don't allow this apparently for the neptune. Can't say I'm looking forward to pay $3000 in import fees on top of the $10k price..
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noodle73
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December 29, 2013, 11:12:58 PM |
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I agree. Selling timeshares on Ebay is out tho.
I was thinking of the German Ebay offering of 12 hours output from a Jupiter for some hundreds of Euros but now I'm thinking about the group buys with hosting one sees here on bitcointalk.org in Bitcoin Forum > Bitcoin > Mining > Hardware > Group buys.
So, if twenty guys go in on a Neptune purchase they own 1/20th of the miner, one of the owners does the operation and pays out to the other owners. When it gets down to the billing of power, rental on the space to run the miner, and some hourly wage for checking in on it, I'd guess it would be tougher to argue that it's privately owned.
This discussion needs its own thread. Has nothing to do with knc. Nothing is certain yet, so there is no point in clouding up the knc discussion further. Yes I know I'm the one who mentioned it first, I was just happy to see it. lol Oh yea - it's your fault! Well, we've got to pass the time until the next big piece of KnC news talking about something...
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soy
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December 29, 2013, 11:49:50 PM |
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I agree. Selling timeshares on Ebay is out tho.
I was thinking of the German Ebay offering of 12 hours output from a Jupiter for some hundreds of Euros but now I'm thinking about the group buys with hosting one sees here on bitcointalk.org in Bitcoin Forum > Bitcoin > Mining > Hardware > Group buys.
So, if twenty guys go in on a Neptune purchase they own 1/20th of the miner, one of the owners does the operation and pays out to the other owners. When it gets down to the billing of power, rental on the space to run the miner, and some hourly wage for checking in on it, I'd guess it would be tougher to argue that it's privately owned.
lol Oh yea - it's your fault! Well, we've got to pass the time until the next big piece of KnC news talking about something... Yes. If January Jupiters, wonder if the 3rd or sometime between the 7th and 10th. The 3rd is 5 days away and these last few have been slow post days here.
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merv77
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December 30, 2013, 04:17:45 AM |
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hot off the press... current price $6300.00 for a sierra miner at 1.2TH/s lets say you want 2.4TH/s that's $12,600.00 soon increase dramatically would make the price over $12,600.00 for 2 sierra's at only 2.4TH/s (The Avenger is not gonna be a happy chap after hearing this) this makes a KNC Neptune look like a real bargain... grab one while they last. quick click link below ↓ ↓ ↓ ↓ Neptune's wont last long after this news gets around.
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RickJamesBTC
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December 30, 2013, 04:21:44 AM |
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Shit yeah! Can't wait to order something for at least may from a company that hasn't shipped a thing! Sweet deal!
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r1senfa17h
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December 30, 2013, 04:28:05 AM |
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hot off the press...
[IMG]
current price $6300.00 for a sierra miner at 1.2TH/s lets say you want 2.4TH/s that's $12,600.00
soon increase dramatically would make the price over $12,600.00 for 2 sierra's at only 2.4TH/s (The Avenger is not gonna be a happy chap after hearing this)
this makes a KNC Neptune look like a real bargain... grab one while they last.
quick click link below ↓ ↓ ↓ ↓ Neptune's wont last long after this news gets around.
Looks like the HF gear is about as energy efficient as the Jupiters too. Having 400gh/s on a single chip suddenly seems irrelevant.
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1N3o5Kyvb4iECiJ3WKScKY8xTVXxf1hMvA
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vesperwillow
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December 30, 2013, 04:31:40 AM |
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soon increase dramatically would make the price over $12,600.00 for 2 sierra's at only 2.4TH/s (The Avenger is not gonna be a happy chap after hearing this)
this makes a KNC Neptune look like a real bargain... grab one while they last.
quick click link below ↓ ↓ ↓ ↓ Neptune's wont last long after this news gets around.
Actually, that makes a Neptune look like not a bargain. 2.4TH within 30 days for the same price you paid for 3-4TH 3-5 months from now. Think about that for a moment. Part of the reason KNC is moving to newer wafer technology is that they knew the competitors would match/exceed their first gen stuff on their first try. Here is soon to be an example.
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r1senfa17h
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December 30, 2013, 04:36:34 AM |
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soon increase dramatically would make the price over $12,600.00 for 2 sierra's at only 2.4TH/s (The Avenger is not gonna be a happy chap after hearing this)
this makes a KNC Neptune look like a real bargain... grab one while they last.
quick click link below ↓ ↓ ↓ ↓ Neptune's wont last long after this news gets around.
Actually, that makes a Neptune look like not a bargain. 2.4TH within 30 days for the same price you paid for 3-4TH 3-5 months from now. Think about that for a moment. Part of the reason KNC is moving to newer wafer technology is that they knew the competitors would match/exceed their first gen stuff on their first try. Here is soon to be an example. Are you suggesting that one could purchase 2.4th/s from HF now and receive it by Jan 30th? If not (because that's ridiculous), when would I have had to purchase by to get it in 30 days?
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1N3o5Kyvb4iECiJ3WKScKY8xTVXxf1hMvA
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1l1l11ll1l
Legendary
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Activity: 1274
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December 30, 2013, 04:38:42 AM |
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soon increase dramatically would make the price over $12,600.00 for 2 sierra's at only 2.4TH/s (The Avenger is not gonna be a happy chap after hearing this)
this makes a KNC Neptune look like a real bargain... grab one while they last.
quick click link below ↓ ↓ ↓ ↓ Neptune's wont last long after this news gets around.
Actually, that makes a Neptune look like not a bargain. 2.4TH within 30 days for the same price you paid for 3-4TH 3-5 months from now. Think about that for a moment. Part of the reason KNC is moving to newer wafer technology is that they knew the competitors would match/exceed their first gen stuff on their first try. Here is soon to be an example. 30 days? Where are you getting that from? If you try to order now for BATCH 4 it says "Orders placed today are guaranteed to ship by March 31, 2014." or about the time the Neptune ships.
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painge
Newbie
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December 30, 2013, 04:45:54 AM |
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There's another way of reading that FINCEN stuff which is essentially "if you own the machine and mine from it for yourself, you don't need to register". So it doesn't matter if it is co-located in a hosting farm or in your home, it's your miner with the income going to you. Mining contracts are a distribution from the company that owns the miner (i.e. not you) to a customer who has paid to receive a share of the earnings over a period of time. In that case you don't own the miner so the bitcoins are being transmitted to you. KnC always went to lengths to say that if hosted it was your specific miner and would be shipped to you at the end of the contract, so I don't see how they would be caught by FINCEN as well as the fact that they're outside US jurisdiction.
This makes sense to me. If my miner is in a hosting facility and I am paying for power and network for the hardware. It is still my hardware and if I am dictating where the BTC go then I am mining for myself. US out of my BTC!
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faetos
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December 30, 2013, 05:04:17 AM |
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Go look at Hashfast's threads here to see how thrilled their customers are. It's BFLish to say the least. Think hard before ordering from an outfit like that.
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dhenson
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December 30, 2013, 05:06:25 AM |
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As a Batch 1 customer from both KNC and Hashfast, I cannot recommend KNC enough.
KNC = honest, capable, prompt and actually delivers. Hashfast = dishonest, incapable, delayed and doesn't deliver.
Of course, the decision is ultimately up to you.
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vesperwillow
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December 30, 2013, 05:11:38 AM |
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I'm talking about for the folks who are batch 1, obviously. Yes they're delayed--KNC did a fabulous job with delivery, I love them for that.
I'm just examining the price/hash/kw comparison.
Once HF (or XYZ Brand) has equipment flowing through the pipeline, it will continue to flow. Some folks here don't stop to realize that I suppose. KNC decided to shut off the orders and halt the pipeline, so I suppose some folks are used to the 'batch' mentality. HashFest, and other brands, aren't interested in stopping the pipeline. They're going to keep taking orders, and keep shipping, non-stop, once they have worked their bugs out.
If their batch 1 ships within 30 days--which is reasonable--there's no reason their successive batches won't follow roughly on original schedule, provided they have parts on hand.
I have no skin in the game either way, this is basic analysis. KNC wouldn't be ramping up to take orders if they didn't take the competition seriously.
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faetos
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December 30, 2013, 06:18:07 AM |
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I think KnC's main competition right now is going to be Cointerra. When they first came on the scene they looked really vaporware-ish, but it looks like they are for real. If they pull together a solid device without major issues then that will be good for our industry and ultimately us as consumers.
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