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Author Topic: [1500 TH] p2pool: Decentralized, DoS-resistant, Hop-Proof pool  (Read 2029007 times)
IYFTech
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March 31, 2015, 07:37:55 PM
 #12381

I'm so full, I couldn't eat another block........

Well, maybe one more......nom nom  Grin

-- Smiley  Thank you for smoking  Smiley --  If you paid VAT to dogie for items you should read this thread:  https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1018906.0
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Meuh6879
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March 31, 2015, 08:23:12 PM
 #12382

It's rain on P2Pool ... 3 blocks in 1 day with 1,5Ph/s  Grin
Luck is the force ! ( http://minefast.coincadence.com/p2pool-stats.php look, the luke column... )


French ... but not so much   ---===---   P2P ... it's people at the end   ---===---   P2Pool (10,9 GH/s).
Comment miner des bitcoins ? Un tutoriel est là : https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1114415.0
Bitcoin change everything ... an explain of this fact : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=joITmEr4SjY
lightfoot
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March 31, 2015, 08:50:46 PM
 #12383

Showers of Gold my friends, yes P2pool is the home of golden showers.

(no gif)
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March 31, 2015, 10:09:47 PM
 #12384

Anybody know what's going on with p2pools.org? Been down for like 2 days now..

Make some real dough on http://j.mp/CloudScryptMining | Rent rigs and mine whatever you want on http://j.mp/RentMiningRigs | Mine without registration on http://p2pools.com
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March 31, 2015, 10:41:57 PM
 #12385

... official adress is : http://p2pool.in
and real and strong pool stats is : http://minefast.coincadence.com/p2pool-stats.php

French ... but not so much   ---===---   P2P ... it's people at the end   ---===---   P2Pool (10,9 GH/s).
Comment miner des bitcoins ? Un tutoriel est là : https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1114415.0
Bitcoin change everything ... an explain of this fact : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=joITmEr4SjY
devlin85
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March 31, 2015, 11:22:51 PM
 #12386

don't care about the official.. They don't have a list of all altcoin pools, and http://p2pool-nodes.info is just bitcoin.. wah wahh..

Make some real dough on http://j.mp/CloudScryptMining | Rent rigs and mine whatever you want on http://j.mp/RentMiningRigs | Mine without registration on http://p2pools.com
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April 03, 2015, 02:08:06 AM
 #12387

I wish there could be some more blocks in p2pool. I have invested everything back to pool and so far so good - ive been gaining more and more with rented power.
One time i did it with only the btc address and didnt get a single share with a one btc, so after that im doing it with /something.
So im gambling i guess, without blocks sofar.

I just wish everything is allright with my configs, because ive spend just over 10 btc now. Maybe next time then with a shiny new btc Wink

Some say its better to have more at once, like its better to have 1 ph for one hour than 100 th for 10 hours.  Is it?
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April 03, 2015, 09:30:15 AM
 #12388

Some say its better to have more at once, like its better to have 1 ph for one hour than 100 th for 10 hours.  Is it?

That depends on the phase of the moon.

lightfoot
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April 04, 2015, 12:31:04 PM
 #12389

Yes, luck is luck, but really: Lady luck and her friends are having a good time on P2Pool this week. Another 3 blocks in a 24 hour period....



Enjoy while it is here.
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April 04, 2015, 04:48:22 PM
 #12390

Notice a pattern?   My measly 6.9TH/s (6xS5) is now a small miner.  Top is shares, and bottom is pool hashrate, over a 14 hour period.  I'm sure people can pick this apart, debate luck and statistics, etc... I just thought a good screenshot, somewhat makes a point.






IYFTech
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April 04, 2015, 05:26:02 PM
 #12391

This is exactly what I've been saying for months now - p2pool just can't scale properly with the increased hash rate, the more the hash rate - the worse the problem. I only point a few old S3's at p2pool now, & then only when the hash is below 2PH - any more than that & it's wasted.

It's such a shame, really  Cry

-- Smiley  Thank you for smoking  Smiley --  If you paid VAT to dogie for items you should read this thread:  https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1018906.0
jonnybravo0311
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April 04, 2015, 06:51:41 PM
 #12392

Notice a pattern?   My measly 6.9TH/s (6xS5) is now a small miner.  Top is shares, and bottom is pool hashrate, over a 14 hour period.  I'm sure people can pick this apart, debate luck and statistics, etc... I just thought a good screenshot, somewhat makes a point.

http://s25.postimg.org/iikptg4i7/SNAG_1426.png
I guess I'm confused by what point you're trying to make.  If you're trying to compare shares found to hash rate, the only noticeable spike in your hash rate graph happens for a couple hour period.  There is plenty of other time where the hash rate is relatively constant that you're not finding shares.

We all recognize that as the pool's hash rate goes up, so to does the difficulty of getting a share onto the chain, which statistically means you find fewer.  However, it also statistically means the pool itself finds blocks more often.  Let's say you've got your 6.9TH/s and the share difficulty is 6.5M.  Statistically you expect to find a share about every 1.1 hours or so.  Assuming each red spike represents one share, you found 9 shares in 12 hours, so you're a bit lower than expectations.  Also, you can clearly see the distribution of found shares is nowhere near the "one an hour" expectations, but rather is clumped together.

This is exactly what I've been saying for months now - p2pool just can't scale properly with the increased hash rate, the more the hash rate - the worse the problem. I only point a few old S3's at p2pool now, & then only when the hash is below 2PH - any more than that & it's wasted.

It's such a shame, really  Cry
Remember last year (August) when share difficulty topped 10M for the first time?  Remember when it topped 20M a few times shortly thereafter?  That's what squeezes the smaller miners out.  Seeing a statistic that says it'll take you a day or more to find a share... and then hoping your share actually gets accepted and not orphaned.  Basically, as long as your expected time to share is less than the pool's expected time to block you're OK.  When it starts taking you longer to find a share than it does for the pool to find a block you perceive your mining to be "wasted" because blocks will be found for which you receive no payment.

Jonny's Pool - Mine with us and help us grow!  Support a pool that supports Bitcoin, not a hardware manufacturer's pockets!  No SPV cheats.  No empty blocks.
lightfoot
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April 04, 2015, 10:05:42 PM
 #12393

True but if you can just hold your gut in you realize it's variance. Sure he could miss a good run, but it's exactly as likely that he will have triple the number of shares when the next single block is found (thus evening it out).

p2pool's problem is that there are two dimensions of luck (shares and finding a block) but really over the long term it is exactly the same luck as say Eclipse or whatever. Now the perception is your's screwed if you are a small miner, but that's only looking at the short term.

A feel-good fix would be cool and might reduce small miner variance, but isn't that what operators like nastyguy do? Provide a place to mine and get more steady payouts while still on the p2pool concept?

Also in order to do p2pool right you have to run the stupid blockchain and a p2pool python thing. That's another problem: The dumb-ass blockchain node needs to be kept up to date and fast otherwise you will lose out with a high stale count. Blah.

Meuh6879
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April 05, 2015, 12:20:53 PM
 #12394

solid 2,5PH/s ... new farm launch for monday tested on sunday ?  Grin

French ... but not so much   ---===---   P2P ... it's people at the end   ---===---   P2Pool (10,9 GH/s).
Comment miner des bitcoins ? Un tutoriel est là : https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1114415.0
Bitcoin change everything ... an explain of this fact : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=joITmEr4SjY
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April 05, 2015, 07:29:18 PM
 #12395

Somehow http://p2pools.com wasn't registered?? It is now  Grin Grin Grin Got a very basic setup going testing out the p2pools. Adding a new coin everyday or so, the ones running have already been tested for days and haven't had any issues.

Make some real dough on http://j.mp/CloudScryptMining | Rent rigs and mine whatever you want on http://j.mp/RentMiningRigs | Mine without registration on http://p2pools.com
roy7
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April 05, 2015, 07:49:04 PM
 #12396

When it starts taking you longer to find a share than it does for the pool to find a block you perceive your mining to be "wasted" because blocks will be found for which you receive no payment.

I've not been active in the bitcoin community for a long time now, just randomly popped in the thread to see what's up, and I see this is still a topic of conversation. It's important to note (as you did) it is simply perception/variance, and people don't actually lose any income. If you can only find 1 share every 2 blocks, that share will pay enough that the income per block is still the correct average. This was a common point of confusion and misinformation a year ago. I suspect it will persist forever.

RoyalMiningCo: Pools retired. Was fun!
roy7
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April 05, 2015, 08:02:32 PM
 #12397

Notice a pattern?   My measly 6.9TH/s (6xS5) is now a small miner.  Top is shares, and bottom is pool hashrate, over a 14 hour period.  I'm sure people can pick this apart, debate luck and statistics, etc... I just thought a good screenshot, somewhat makes a point.

I don't know if you are running your own node or what, and this is my first time in ~8 months looking in the forum, but have you tried /DIFF if you want more frequent (but smaller value) shares? It won't do anything if you are already submitting at the network minimum diff level. But if you are on a public p2pool node that isn't running my old patches, your share difficulty might be higher than it needs to be. (I have no idea if any of my work ever made it into p2pool itself or not.)

Some info:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=18313.msg6556442#msg6556442

I'd suggest running your own p2pool node is the best choice, secondly running off a public node running my patches unless someone else or forrest did something better which made them obsolete, or thirdly manually adjusting /DIFF.

RoyalMiningCo: Pools retired. Was fun!
kano
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April 05, 2015, 10:22:14 PM
 #12398

Notice a pattern?   My measly 6.9TH/s (6xS5) is now a small miner.  Top is shares, and bottom is pool hashrate, over a 14 hour period.  I'm sure people can pick this apart, debate luck and statistics, etc... I just thought a good screenshot, somewhat makes a point.

I don't know if you are running your own node or what, and this is my first time in ~8 months looking in the forum, but have you tried /DIFF if you want more frequent (but smaller value) shares? It won't do anything if you are already submitting at the network minimum diff level. But if you are on a public p2pool node that isn't running my old patches, your share difficulty might be higher than it needs to be. (I have no idea if any of my work ever made it into p2pool itself or not.)

Some info:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=18313.msg6556442#msg6556442

I'd suggest running your own p2pool node is the best choice, secondly running off a public node running my patches unless someone else or forrest did something better which made them obsolete, or thirdly manually adjusting /DIFF.
Unfortunately that wont help him in any way (unless he was a big time miner)
/diff is relevant for fake (pseudo) shares when used by small miners
The p2pool share-chain diff is what you must meet before you get a share that will be paid.

Pool: https://kano.is BTC: 1KanoiBupPiZfkwqB7rfLXAzPnoTshAVmb
CKPool and CGMiner developer, IRC FreeNode #ckpool and #cgminer kanoi
Help keep Bitcoin secure by mining on pools with Stratum, the best protocol to mine Bitcoins with ASIC hardware
roy7
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April 06, 2015, 01:13:07 AM
 #12399

Unfortunately that wont help him in any way (unless he was a big time miner)
/diff is relevant for fake (pseudo) shares when used by small miners
The p2pool share-chain diff is what you must meet before you get a share that will be paid.

The fake pseudo shares are controlled by +DIFF. The actual difficulty of shares you are trying to submit for credit (not just graphs/hashrate purposes) is /DIFF. Agreed that he's possibly too small for it to matter. (I have no idea what p2pool's share difficulty or bitcoin's difficulty are these days.) /DIFF is usually used by huge miners to reduce their shares/block by voluntarily targeting a very high difficulty target. Small miners running their own node don't need to worry about it, the vardiff logic won't push their target too high.

It's only a problem if you are a small fish in a large public node. In raw p2pool a year ago (no idea if the code has changed), the share-chain diff target for miners on a node was based on the node's hash rate (not the miner). Thus small miners on a public node also being used by other much larger miners would have diff targets higher than the share-chain minimum difficulty. By using /DIFF you can override that. If you want to make sure you always mine at the minimum possible share-chain difficulty, you could just use /1 since it'll make the share-chain difficulty the floor.

Relevant code includes my attempt to fold this into official tree:

https://github.com/forrestv/p2pool/pull/174

And iongchun's branch where he provides some config options to give you more manual control over how it works, but with the same intent/basic result. However, this only effects psuedo-shares.

https://github.com/iongchun/p2pool/tree/auto-worker-diff

Here is me trying to get iongchun's stuff merged in as well:

https://github.com/forrestv/p2pool/pull/187

TLDR: Public node operators should use both 174 and 187 to help small miners be served appropriate difficulty target automatically.

RoyalMiningCo: Pools retired. Was fun!
kano
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April 06, 2015, 02:07:40 AM
 #12400

Yeah that was a typo by me Smiley
Should have read:
/diff is irrelevant for fake (pseudo) shares when used by small miners
(but that should be an obvious typo from what else I said)

---

The issue is small miners, so the changes don't help.

Pool: https://kano.is BTC: 1KanoiBupPiZfkwqB7rfLXAzPnoTshAVmb
CKPool and CGMiner developer, IRC FreeNode #ckpool and #cgminer kanoi
Help keep Bitcoin secure by mining on pools with Stratum, the best protocol to mine Bitcoins with ASIC hardware
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