[1500 TH] p2pool: Decentralized, DoS-resistant, Hop-Proof pool

[bhanu545]

P2pool is seeing the worst luck in last 3 months.

[Geremia]

Why isn't http://p2pool.info/ up-to-date?

[Geremia]

P2pool is seeing the worst luck in last 3 months.

That shouldn't matter so much in the long. Most p2pool users are in it for the long haul, no?

[jonnybravo0311]

Why isn't http://p2pool.info/ up-to-date?

Because nobody maintains it.

[Geremia]

Why isn't http://p2pool.info/ up-to-date?

Because nobody maintains it.

What sort of maintenence does it take? And is the source for it on GitHub?

[lightfoot]

P2pool is seeing the worst luck in last 3 months.

This after blocks appeared upon us like showers of gold.

[jonnybravo0311]

Why isn't http://p2pool.info/ up-to-date?

Because nobody maintains it.

What sort of maintenence does it take? And is the source for it on GitHub?

Apparently too much for the current owner to bother keeping it up to date.  You want good stats?  Check out windpath's site: minefast.coincidence.com

[Geremia]

You want good stats?  Check out windpath's site: minefast.coincidence.com

thanks
Here's what appears to be the correct URL: http://minefast.coincadence.com/p2pool-stats.php
That is a good page.

[Geremia]

Fresh-mined coins for payouts were innovated by pools in the following order: puddinpop, Eligius, BitPenny, p2pool.

This would seem to make all these pools equally immune to potential pool manager fraud, then, no?
Does P2Pool have any advantage, security-wise, over the others mentioned here?

[jonnybravo0311]

Fresh-mined coins for payouts were innovated by pools in the following order: puddinpop, Eligius, BitPenny, p2pool.

This would seem to make all these pools equally immune to potential pool manager fraud, then, no?
Does P2Pool have any advantage, security-wise, over the others mentioned here?

P2Pool has the best chance of avoiding fraud because of its decentralized nature.  Sure a node operator could charge ridiculous fees on his own node, but nobody would mine there.

Centralized pools could easily skim off the top.  Generate a percentage of coins to your own address.  Would the average miner know if he's missing a small portion of a payout?  He'd probably explain it away as bad pool luck.

[kano]

Fresh-mined coins for payouts were innovated by pools in the following order: puddinpop, Eligius, BitPenny, p2pool.

This would seem to make all these pools equally immune to potential pool manager fraud, then, no?
Does P2Pool have any advantage, security-wise, over the others mentioned here?

P2Pool is the only one that has any immunity coz the breakdown of the payout is distributed to all nodes and all nodes must mine to a correct breakdown or their shares will not be included in the share chain.
The others can do whatever they like to the coinbase payout just as any other pool can with their payout scheme.

[Geremia]

Fresh-mined coins for payouts were innovated by pools in the following order: puddinpop, Eligius, BitPenny, p2pool.

This would seem to make all these pools equally immune to potential pool manager fraud, then, no?
Does P2Pool have any advantage, security-wise, over the others mentioned here?

P2Pool has the best chance of avoiding fraud because of its decentralized nature.  Sure a node operator could charge ridiculous fees on his own node, but nobody would mine there.

Centralized pools could easily skim off the top.  Generate a percentage of coins to your own address.  Would the average miner know if he's missing a small portion of a payout?  He'd probably explain it away as bad pool luck.

indeed
thus P2Pool passes my inspection.

[kano]

Fresh-mined coins for payouts were innovated by pools in the following order: puddinpop, Eligius, BitPenny, p2pool.

This would seem to make all these pools equally immune to potential pool manager fraud, then, no?
Does P2Pool have any advantage, security-wise, over the others mentioned here?

P2Pool has the best chance of avoiding fraud because of its decentralized nature.  Sure a node operator could charge ridiculous fees on his own node, but nobody would mine there.

Centralized pools could easily skim off the top.  Generate a percentage of coins to your own address.  Would the average miner know if he's missing a small portion of a payout?  He'd probably explain it away as bad pool luck.

indeed
thus P2Pool passes my inspection.

As long as you are OK with the inherent issues with how p2pool works

[Geremia]

As long as you are OK with the inherent issues with how p2pool works

What issue?…

[jonnybravo0311]

As long as you are OK with the inherent issues with how p2pool works

What issue?…

In a nutshell p2pool doesn't scale.  Unlike the centralized pool model where the higher the hash rate of the pool the lower the variance for the miner, here because of the share chain concept the higher the hash rate the greater the variance experienced by miners.

[nonnakip]

In a nutshell p2pool doesn't scale.  Unlike the centralized pool model where the higher the hash rate of the pool the lower the variance for the miner, here because of the share chain concept the higher the hash rate the greater the variance experienced by miners.

However it is a double edge sword. If P2Pool hashrate is too low then blocks are solved too slow and miner shares drop off the share chain. In my opinion this is much worse than higher variance because it means wasted energy and money. And in my opinion unfair.

P2Pool should have as high hashrate as we can give it. If your miner is too weak to generate shares regularly then you should either join a trusted P2Pool subpool or start your own P2Pool subpool.

[windpath]

However it is a double edge sword. If P2Pool hashrate is too low then blocks are solved too slow and miner shares drop off the share chain. In my opinion this is much worse than higher variance because it means wasted energy and money. And in my opinion unfair.

P2Pool should have as high hashrate as we can give it. If your miner is too weak to generate shares regularly then you should either join a trusted P2Pool subpool or start your own P2Pool subpool.

Well said.

[bhanu545]

In a nutshell p2pool doesn't scale.  Unlike the centralized pool model where the higher the hash rate of the pool the lower the variance for the miner, here because of the share chain concept the higher the hash rate the greater the variance experienced by miners.

However it is a double edge sword. If P2Pool hashrate is too low then blocks are solved too slow and miner shares drop off the share chain. In my opinion this is much worse than higher variance because it means wasted energy and money. And in my opinion unfair.

P2Pool should have as high hashrate as we can give it. If your miner is too weak to generate shares regularly then you should either join a trusted P2Pool subpool or start your own P2Pool subpool.

Exactly bro, without high hashrate in p2pool, people loose earned shares due to blocks being solved too slow. Atleast a 4-5PH minimum hashrate would make p2pool better i guess. Ya ofcourse finding a share will become a little more harder but payouts will be stable atleast. With a average 1PH now, its nothing compared to other pools.

[jonnybravo0311]

In a nutshell p2pool doesn't scale.  Unlike the centralized pool model where the higher the hash rate of the pool the lower the variance for the miner, here because of the share chain concept the higher the hash rate the greater the variance experienced by miners.

However it is a double edge sword. If P2Pool hashrate is too low then blocks are solved too slow and miner shares drop off the share chain. In my opinion this is much worse than higher variance because it means wasted energy and money. And in my opinion unfair.

P2Pool should have as high hashrate as we can give it. If your miner is too weak to generate shares regularly then you should either join a trusted P2Pool subpool or start your own P2Pool subpool.

I fully agree.  I gave only one of the sword's edges in explaining the higher variance.  You provided the other edge.  Miners feel it both ways... hash rate too low and you've got shares dropping off the chain before they're paid.  Hash rate too high and you've got blocks found where you've got no shares to be paid.

Your solution mitigates this by creating the sub-pool.  Yes, a miner sacrifices some of the decentralized freedom using this model;  however, it gives miners a less variant payout.  To date it's the best solution that's been provided to the problem.

[Geremia]

shares dropping off the chain before they're paid

What do you mean?