ODI cricket and general cricketing discussion [self - mod]

[Swordsoffreedom]

I am not going to watch any of the T20 World Cup clashes after the whole Quinton de Kock "take the knee" rubbish. What the f#%ck have happened to "freedom of choice" and "freedom of religion"?  I am totally against all forms of racism, but I am definitely not going to take the knee.. just because everyone else are forcing the issue.

They force the "race" issues... but they allow countries like Afghanistan and Pakistan with several human rights and women rights violations to participate it these tournaments. (Capturing and torturing of Afghan people, indulging in terrorism etc...)  

I was aware of the entire thing until I saw your post now and then did some research of what exactly happened. It is indeed shameful to force others to take the knee although I highly rate this movement but no one should be forced to do they don't want to.

I read at espn that De Kock has agreed to take the knee and even apologized. It's hard to understand what for he apologized. But looking from a different angle, I am not sure why he was so against taking a knee in first place because it's not like you are forced to do something that will cause any harm. Taking a knee to support a movement that is for the larger good shouldn't have been a problem for him to begin with.

Yes taking a knee is to support the movement that black lives matter. But in the case of India, Indian people are saying that there are a lot of problems going on right now in their own country and there has not been a single tweet about any of them and here we have the whole Indian team taking a knee to support a movement continents away. And the speculation about the Indian team being forced to do this is actually true, you and I was so surprised hearing this. And racism is something that ain't going to be solved if the people in power don't realize that it's a pretty big problem.

[1714702223]

1714702223

[blatchcorn]

Yes taking a knee is to support the movement that black lives matter. But in the case of India, Indian people are saying that there are a lot of problems going on right now in their own country and there has not been a single tweet about any of them and here we have the whole Indian team taking a knee to support a movement continents away. And the speculation about the Indian team being forced to do this is actually true, you and I was so surprised hearing this. And racism is something that ain't going to be solved if the people in power don't realize that it's a pretty big problem.

In RSA there is a clash going on for including Black players in the team. We know RSA used to be team of whites in 90s. Ntini was first ever black player who made it to national team. As far as bowing down for BLM is concerned, I think its decision of board that matters not the player. Since its the board that is sending players under the name of country.  Player individual opinion matters in leagues, in which player plays for some club.

[CDC AP]

Yes taking a knee is to support the movement that black lives matter. But in the case of India, Indian people are saying that there are a lot of problems going on right now in their own country and there has not been a single tweet about any of them and here we have the whole Indian team taking a knee to support a movement continents away. And the speculation about the Indian team being forced to do this is actually true, you and I was so surprised hearing this. And racism is something that ain't going to be solved if the people in power don't realize that it's a pretty big problem.

In RSA there is a clash going on for including Black players in the team. We know RSA used to be team of whites in 90s. Ntini was first ever black player who made it to national team. As far as bowing down for BLM is concerned, I think its decision of board that matters not the player. Since its the board that is sending players under the name of country.  Player individual opinion matters in leagues, in which player plays for some club.

Well i feel selection in team should be completely fair there should not be any reservation in this. As players like rabada do not need any kind of reservation so why is there any need of this kind of things, If you are good enough then you should be selected in the team, that should be the criteria for selection in the team.

[eaLiTy]

~
Yes taking a knee is to support the movement that black lives matter. But in the case of India, Indian people are saying that there are a lot of problems going on right now in their own country and there has not been a single tweet about any of them and here we have the whole Indian team taking a knee to support a movement continents away.

There is a lot of problem that is going on due the right wing extremist politics that is in power, if a country is ruled by identity politics then you are bound to have issues and that is what is happening right now and you cannot expect anyone having the freedom to voice against them because you will be silenced.

And the speculation about the Indian team being forced to do this is actually true, you and I was so surprised hearing this. And racism is something that ain't going to be solved if the people in power don't realize that it's a pretty big problem.

I am not sure about forcing anyone to follow the knee, but i am yet to understand what is the point of doing these as if all the racist watching Cricket would identify and change their opinion when they see someone taking a knee  . Racism is always subtle and i do not consider there is institutional racism.

[jostorres]

I was aware of the entire thing until I saw your post now and then did some research of what exactly happened. It is indeed shameful to force others to take the knee although I highly rate this movement but no one should be forced to do they don't want to.

I read at espn that De Kock has agreed to take the knee and even apologized. It's hard to understand what for he apologized. But looking from a different angle, I am not sure why he was so against taking a knee in first place because it's not like you are forced to do something that will cause any harm. Taking a knee to support a movement that is for the larger good shouldn't have been a problem for him to begin with.

Yes taking a knee is to support the movement that black lives matter. But in the case of India, Indian people are saying that there are a lot of problems going on right now in their own country and there has not been a single tweet about any of them and here we have the whole Indian team taking a knee to support a movement continents away. And the speculation about the Indian team being forced to do this is actually true, you and I was so surprised hearing this. And racism is something that ain't going to be solved if the people in power don't realize that it's a pretty big problem.

We can't stop these things in one month or year these can take very long time because these are part of life for millions for decades so if you want to solve these issues then first bring some better education and development of new generation with transparency because it's must for all these things we have the best example of Japan as they were really rude and stick, but they spend some very good time now all nation is completely different.

In case of India or South Africa it is not possible because too many languages cultures and values which are stopping them from many things which are required but not happening currently South Africa is also in situation of making or breaking let's watch what happen here in next few years because I am not positive about this all right now.

[Sithara007]

I am not sure about forcing anyone to follow the knee, but i am yet to understand what is the point of doing these as if all the racist watching Cricket would identify and change their opinion when they see someone taking a knee  . Racism is always subtle and i do not consider there is institutional racism.

It's just that ICC want to focus on activism rather than the development of the game. If they are serious, then they should look in to why cricket is not popular among the blacks of South Africa, Zimbabwe and Namibia. They should invest money there. Are they doing so? Having this BLM drama everytime before the start of the match is irritating. What is the point in doing the knee protest, before a match between India and Pakistan? What was the contribution of these two countries to the George Floyd killing?

[galambo]

It's just that ICC want to focus on activism rather than the development of the game. If they are serious, then they should look in to why cricket is not popular among the blacks of South Africa, Zimbabwe and Namibia. They should invest money there. Are they doing so? Having this BLM drama everytime before the start of the match is irritating. What is the point in doing the knee protest, before a match between India and Pakistan? What was the contribution of these two countries to the George Floyd killing?

May be its popular among blacks in South Africa, Zimbabwe and Namibia. Blacks dont have necessary facilities as compared to whites that's why they cant compete with them. South Africa has produced great black players like Makhaya Ntini, so we cant say that blacks dont like cricket in SA. I am surprised to see there is no black player in Namibia team and its strange that you have majority of Blacks in country while your team only has white players.


In Pak/India match, its Indians that were more interested in doing that KNEE Protest as Pakistanis only placed there hands on chest. With gestures of Babar Azam in the start of match, I can say he has no idea of that protest.

[ene1980]

~
May be its popular among blacks in South Africa, Zimbabwe and Namibia. Blacks dont have necessary facilities as compared to whites that's why they cant compete with them. South Africa has produced great black players like Makhaya Ntini, so we cant say that blacks dont like cricket in SA. I am surprised to see there is no black player in Namibia team and its strange that you have majority of Blacks in country while your team only has white players.

I have no idea what you are implying here that facilities are different for everyone in a country, you are talking in 2021 like we differentiate people with their caste and color and it is bullshit to see these issues raised here. I have no idea about Namibia as a country, if there are no native players then it is the ICC or their respective cricket that need to sort out because they need to attract the players to play the game.

[Sithara007]

May be its popular among blacks in South Africa, Zimbabwe and Namibia. Blacks dont have necessary facilities as compared to whites that's why they cant compete with them. South Africa has produced great black players like Makhaya Ntini, so we cant say that blacks dont like cricket in SA. I am surprised to see there is no black player in Namibia team and its strange that you have majority of Blacks in country while your team only has white players.

Namibian history is a bit complicated. The whites (Germans and Dutch) first arrived in the country during the 16th and 17th centuries, when Namibia was populated by the San (yellow-skinned people). The blacks (Bantu) arrived sometime later and completely exterminated the San by the end of 19th century. So whites of Namibia are as native as anyone else. The blacks, not the whites are the latter arrivals (although in the case of South Africa that is not true). And there are black players in the Namibian squad, such as Ben Shikongo and Pikky Ya France. On top of that, they have some other non-white players as well (Zane Green.etc).

[pakhitheboss]

It's just that ICC want to focus on activism rather than the development of the game. If they are serious, then they should look in to why cricket is not popular among the blacks of South Africa, Zimbabwe and Namibia. They should invest money there. Are they doing so? Having this BLM drama everytime before the start of the match is irritating. What is the point in doing the knee protest, before a match between India and Pakistan? What was the contribution of these two countries to the George Floyd killing?

May be its popular among blacks in South Africa, Zimbabwe and Namibia. Blacks dont have necessary facilities as compared to whites that's why they cant compete with them. South Africa has produced great black players like Makhaya Ntini, so we cant say that blacks dont like cricket in SA. I am surprised to see there is no black player in Namibia team and its strange that you have majority of Blacks in country while your team only has white players.


In Pak/India match, its Indians that were more interested in doing that KNEE Protest as Pakistanis only placed there hands on chest. With gestures of Babar Azam in the start of match, I can say he has no idea of that protest.

The Indian team acted like a fool. I was never aware at first why they were kneeling down but later on, realized that it was for BLM. Did the ICC ask for this or was it the BCCi? Cause if it's the BCCI then there are many other things happening within the country that needs attention.

[galambo]

Namibian history is a bit complicated. The whites (Germans and Dutch) first arrived in the country during the 16th and 17th centuries, when Namibia was populated by the San (yellow-skinned people). The blacks (Bantu) arrived sometime later and completely exterminated the San by the end of 19th century. So whites of Namibia are as native as anyone else. The blacks, not the whites are the latter arrivals (although in the case of South Africa that is not true). And there are black players in the Namibian squad, such as Ben Shikongo and Pikky Ya France. On top of that, they have some other non-white players as well (Zane Green.etc).

Since you have knowledge about Namibia history which I don't have so I can't argue on it unless I have same knowledge. This black white conflict in Namibia team may arise in future if there team gets to standard of SA or Zimbabwe. So far nobody is worried about this conflict in Namibia team.

Did the ICC ask for this or was it the BCCi? Cause if it's the BCCI then there are many other things happening within the country that needs attention.

If you see discussion of babar azam with Rohit at the start of match, it looks clear that babar azam has no idea of this BLM. I m sure it's done on directives of ICC otherwise Indian cricket team won't be doing that.

[jostorres]

I was never aware at first why they were kneeling down but later on, realized that it was for BLM. Did the ICC ask for this or was it the BCCi? Cause if it's the BCCI then there are many other things happening within the country that needs attention.

This is not mandatory by ICC it's every board own decision, so I am feeling this was from BCCI that every Indian cricketer will be kneeling down. About Pakistan, I read they already cleared about this they will never do this in any game but in respect they will put their hands on chest which is also like same thing. Your point is valid, BCCI need to do some other things as well because they are most powerful in ICC, and they can force them for anything related to humanity instead of this BLM.

India also facing some serious issues which are hurting very badly to them in last few decades, but sadly they never do any act for this on any forum which is very important for them to aware world about these things with their way in this ICC.

[ene1980]

This is not mandatory by ICC it's every board own decision, so I am feeling this was from BCCI that every Indian cricketer will be kneeling down. About Pakistan, I read they already cleared about this they will never do this in any game but in respect they will put their hands on chest which is also like same thing. Your point is valid, BCCI need to do some other things as well because they are most powerful in ICC, and they can force them for anything related to humanity instead of this BLM.

I am not sure whether these are mandatory or not, i understand the message they are trying to convey but my opinion is to avoid these political statement or any massage other than cricket. There are major problems in the world and it is not because of racism and if you start voicing one then you need to start mentioning other issues as well.

India also facing some serious issues which are hurting very badly to them in last few decades, but sadly they never do any act for this on any forum which is very important for them to aware world about these things with their way in this ICC.

I am not sure what you are talking about, can you be more specific about the things you are talking about. What are these issues related to cricket and what changes ICC can come up with to sort any issues  .

[Sithara007]

This is not mandatory by ICC it's every board own decision, so I am feeling this was from BCCI that every Indian cricketer will be kneeling down. About Pakistan, I read they already cleared about this they will never do this in any game but in respect they will put their hands on chest which is also like same thing. Your point is valid, BCCI need to do some other things as well because they are most powerful in ICC, and they can force them for anything related to humanity instead of this BLM.

It was not mandatory. In case of India, Virat Kohli asked the BCCI management for permission to knee for BLM, which was granted by the president Sourav Ganguly. It has nothing to do with the ICC directives. During yesterday's match between Namibia and Afghanistan, both the teams refused to knee. Namibian players held up their hands in support, while Afghanistan did the right thing by completely ignoring it. I still don't understand what Asian teams have to do with the BLM movement. Afghanistan and Pakistan are doing the right thing by standing against this drama.

[laurenB7742]

This is not mandatory by ICC it's every board own decision, so I am feeling this was from BCCI that every Indian cricketer will be kneeling down. About Pakistan, I read they already cleared about this they will never do this in any game but in respect they will put their hands on chest which is also like same thing. Your point is valid, BCCI need to do some other things as well because they are most powerful in ICC, and they can force them for anything related to humanity instead of this BLM.

It was not mandatory. In case of India, Virat Kohli asked the BCCI management for permission to knee for BLM, which was granted by the president Sourav Ganguly. It has nothing to do with the ICC directives. During yesterday's match between Namibia and Afghanistan, both the teams refused to knee. Namibian players held up their hands in support, while Afghanistan did the right thing by completely ignoring it. I still don't understand what Asian teams have to do with the BLM movement. Afghanistan and Pakistan are doing the right thing by standing against this drama.

Yes. And Asia is a kind of place where these things are not given much priority to be honest because I know they have a lot more serious matters to think about. It's more like the police are getting murder rape and much more serious cases and someone just what's in the police station and says that a guy called him black. So, as usual, the police actually might get angry and think that you are wasting their time. What I am trying to say is there are much more serious matters in Asian countries and some taking any in the support of black lives matters seems kind of irrelevant.

[galambo]

It was not mandatory. In case of India, Virat Kohli asked the BCCI management for permission to knee for BLM, which was granted by the president Sourav Ganguly. It has nothing to do with the ICC directives. During yesterday's match between Namibia and Afghanistan, both the teams refused to knee. Namibian players held up their hands in support, while Afghanistan did the right thing by completely ignoring it. I still don't understand what Asian teams have to do with the BLM movement. Afghanistan and Pakistan are doing the right thing by standing against this drama.

This issue was very much settled but it came to cricket in this WC. Just like sometimes cricket promoting awareness on breast cancer. Don't worry this moment won't pop up in other icc tournaments. Even if it pops up I don't see any harm in kneeling down for BLM.

[Sithara007]

This issue was very much settled but it came to cricket in this WC. Just like sometimes cricket promoting awareness on breast cancer. Don't worry this moment won't pop up in other icc tournaments. Even if it pops up I don't see any harm in kneeling down for BLM.

It should be left to the players, and no one should be forced in to doing it. Here we have Quinton de Kock being forced to apologize by the SACB, after he refused to kneel. Now this is not something that you would associate awareness with. And the idea of Indian team kneeling down for the BLM is the biggest joke. BLM is essentially a movement started by blacks in the US against police brutality and I don't understand what India has to do with all that. I am glad that the other Asian teams chose not to endorse this moonbattery.

[perfect999]

It was not mandatory. In case of India, Virat Kohli asked the BCCI management for permission to knee for BLM, which was granted by the president Sourav Ganguly. It has nothing to do with the ICC directives. During yesterday's match between Namibia and Afghanistan, both the teams refused to knee. Namibian players held up their hands in support, while Afghanistan did the right thing by completely ignoring it. I still don't understand what Asian teams have to do with the BLM movement. Afghanistan and Pakistan are doing the right thing by standing against this drama.

This issue was very much settled but it came to cricket in this WC. Just like sometimes cricket promoting awareness on breast cancer. Don't worry this moment won't pop up in other icc tournaments. Even if it pops up I don't see any harm in kneeling down for BLM.

Surely this is not going to have any serious impact in ICC events in future because it's all about your personal feelings. I really appreciate Afghanistan as they completely ignore this because they feel they have nothing with this all, and it's true. They are already facing some other troubles which are more important for them in future instead of going down on knee for BLM.

Few peoples talking about Aids and Cancer programs were also obliged by ICC, so this is also needed some intention, but I have been feeling these are completely different from this drama which is happening in name of BLM because it's all about just politics nothing else. So, hopefully this all will be settled by better understanding between all parties.

[JSRAW]

In a country where majority of folks obsessed with a fair skin and struggling with ridiculous amount of challenges. Some Brown coolies thought that bending the knee would be a excellent idea so that they can earn some brownie points but when its comes to their own country countless societal fuckups or neighboring countries genocidal acts, they start behaving like ostrich and become some sort of spineless professionals.

[Juggy777]

It was not mandatory. In case of India, Virat Kohli asked the BCCI management for permission to knee for BLM, which was granted by the president Sourav Ganguly. It has nothing to do with the ICC directives. During yesterday's match between Namibia and Afghanistan, both the teams refused to knee. Namibian players held up their hands in support, while Afghanistan did the right thing by completely ignoring it. I still don't understand what Asian teams have to do with the BLM movement. Afghanistan and Pakistan are doing the right thing by standing against this drama.

This issue was very much settled but it came to cricket in this WC. Just like sometimes cricket promoting awareness on breast cancer. Don't worry this moment won't pop up in other icc tournaments. Even if it pops up I don't see any harm in kneeling down for BLM.

Surely this is not going to have any serious impact in ICC events in future because it's all about your personal feelings. I really appreciate Afghanistan as they completely ignore this because they feel they have nothing with this all, and it's true. They are already facing some other troubles which are more important for them in future instead of going down on knee for BLM.

Few peoples talking about Aids and Cancer programs were also obliged by ICC, so this is also needed some intention, but I have been feeling these are completely different from this drama which is happening in name of BLM because it's all about just politics nothing else. So, hopefully this all will be settled by better understanding between all parties.

I believe taking the knee is causing more issues than solving the racism problem, because each time someone refuses the knee it’s taken in the wrong sense. Also ICC could organise some ad campaigns to spread awareness, and stop the knee bending because its dividing the cricket world and neither side is wrong (those taking the knee, and those refusing to take).