Gold collapsing. Bitcoin UP.

[cypherdoc]

...so it annoys me when you folks try to fuck it up ...

Define, please.

when tvbcof gets mad, he just gets mad at everyone.

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[N12]

Sidechains irrelevant, Bitcoin UP.

[cypherdoc]

Sidechains irrelevant, Bitcoin UP.

this could very well be true.

in that case, why change anything?

[Dusty]

Sidechains irrelevant, Bitcoin UP.

this could very well be true.

in that case, why change anything?

And what if the rally is being fueled by the understanding of sidechains, thanks to the debate of this thread? ;-)

[cypherdoc]

Sidechains irrelevant, Bitcoin UP.

this could very well be true.

in that case, why change anything?

And what if the rally is being fueled by the understanding of sidechains, thanks to the debate of this thread? ;-)

or maybe fuelled by the understanding that SC's won't be enacted, thanks to the debate of this thread?

[justusranvier]

And what if the rally is being fueled by the understanding of sidechains, thanks to the debate of this thread? ;-)

Maybe the rally is being fueled by this:

http://tech.slashdot.org/story/14/11/12/0532223/after-silk-road-20-shutdown-rival-dark-net-markets-grow-quickly

[NewLiberty]

The rising price hasn't lifted my spirits much at all.
Still reeling from this bad news.  (Bad for gold, bad for Bitcoin)
http://news.goldseek.com/GATA/1415649749.php
...
http://www.gata.org/files/VonNotHausOrder-Nov-10-2014.pdf

In which Judge Voorhees writes about my friend Bernard von NotHaus, one of the inspirations for Satoshi...
A quote from the previous horrible case Gellman v US:

"The United States has the sole power to coin money under the Constitution, and if anyone, individual or
State, assumes to supplant the medium of exchange adopted by our Government,
or assumes to compete with the United States Government in this regard, a
violation of these statutes would follow. Undoubtedly, no one can interfere with
the monopoly which this Government has obtained by reason of the
Constitutional provisions without running afoul of these statutes"
...
Whether the rationale
set forth in Gellman is adopted or not, the Court finds that under the construction of Section 486
applied here, contemplating that if a coin is intended for use as current money then there is
necessarily a deceptive quality about its design, Defendant’s conviction on Count Three must be
upheld.
For the reasons set forth herein, the undersigned is of the opinion, and this Court so finds
as a matter of law, that Congress indeed possesses the power to criminalize an individual’s
minting of coinage, whether in resemblance of U.S. coins or of original design, that is intended
for use as current money.

This... in contrast to several state's "lawful money" decisions (Calif), and even precious metal as Legal Tender laws (Utah)

[Adrian-x]

Yeppers, and those of us that saw that in the theaters when it first came out have been here lining up this shot all along.
Someday, Justus, when we are alone, and I'm feeling good... I will tell you some stories about this and the cypherpunk connection that will absolutely blow your mind.
Just be sure to remind me to do so when the time comes, so I don't get senile and start talking about sleds named rosebud or something.  

I don't think I'm ever remiss in acknowledging the work people in preceding generation did to set this up. At this point, however, anyone in those generations either helped get us to this point, or they didn't.

If they didn't, it's too late for them now.

Easy now, I read a brochure about this " 21 century New World" and was looking for an immigration office to process my visa, it sounds like a great place to start a new business, still lots of opportunity in the land of the new free I hope.

[Adrian-x]

And what if the rally is being fueled by the understanding of sidechains, thanks to the debate of this thread? ;-)

Maybe the rally is being fueled by this:

http://tech.slashdot.org/story/14/11/12/0532223/after-silk-road-20-shutdown-rival-dark-net-markets-grow-quickly

i loled at teh comments,
i loved this one:

They should really start naming the black markets after big companies and celebrities. Then, when the news of a shutdown occurs, people will be confused. "What? They shut down the Microsoft drug marketplace?"

[justusranvier]

i loled at teh comments,
i loved this one:

They should really start naming the black markets after big companies and celebrities. Then, when the news of a shutdown occurs, people will be confused. "What? They shut down the Microsoft drug marketplace?"

"Hey dude! You're doing lots of business! Want to bulk buy some illegal drugs from me? Let's chat on skype a bit more! Sincerely, Definitely Not An FBI Informant."

[Melbustus]

The rising price hasn't lifted my spirits much at all.
Still reeling from this bad news.  (Bad for gold, bad for Bitcoin)
http://news.goldseek.com/GATA/1415649749.php
...
http://www.gata.org/files/VonNotHausOrder-Nov-10-2014.pdf

In which Judge Voorhees writes about my friend Bernard von NotHaus, one of the inspirations for Satoshi...
A quote from the previous horrible case Gellman v US:

"The United States has the sole power to coin money under the Constitution, and if anyone, individual or
State, assumes to supplant the medium of exchange adopted by our Government,
or assumes to compete with the United States Government in this regard, a
violation of these statutes would follow. Undoubtedly, no one can interfere with
the monopoly which this Government has obtained by reason of the
Constitutional provisions without running afoul of these statutes"
...
Whether the rationale
set forth in Gellman is adopted or not, the Court finds that under the construction of Section 486
applied here, contemplating that if a coin is intended for use as current money then there is
necessarily a deceptive quality about its design, Defendant’s conviction on Count Three must be
upheld.
For the reasons set forth herein, the undersigned is of the opinion, and this Court so finds
as a matter of law, that Congress indeed possesses the power to criminalize an individual’s
minting of coinage, whether in resemblance of U.S. coins or of original design, that is intended
for use as current money.

This... in contrast to several state's "lawful money" decisions (Calif), and even precious metal as Legal Tender laws (Utah)

That's a ridiculous interpretation of Article I (am I missing some other constitutional commentary on currency issuance?). Seems a very unlikely attack vector against bitcoin unless additional explicit legislation is passed (and it would have to somehow deal only with bitcoin et al, lest they set precedent that any Chuck E Cheese franchise owner is running an illegal currency scheme).

[Melbustus]

How much did David Chaum have solved at Digicash/eCash?

Some of the notes on the relevant wikipedia pages suggest he had double-spending solved:

...
Depending on the payment transactions, one distinguishes between on-line and off-line electronic cash: If the payee has to contact a third party (e.g., the bank or the credit-card company acting as an acquirer) before accepting a payment, the system is called an on-line system.[2] In 1990, Chaum together with Naor proposed the first off-line e-cash system, which was also based on blind signatures.[3]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ecash

In 1988, he extended this idea (with Amos Fiat and Moni Naor) to prevent double-spending.[13]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Chaum

Anyone have any more info on this? Was eCash's remaining problem merely initial-coin distribution, or was BGP actually not (practically) 'solved' despite the above?

[adam3us]

How much did David Chaum have solved at Digicash/eCash?

Some of the notes on the relevant wikipedia pages suggest he had double-spending solved:

...
Depending on the payment transactions, one distinguishes between on-line and off-line electronic cash: If the payee has to contact a third party (e.g., the bank or the credit-card company acting as an acquirer) before accepting a payment, the system is called an on-line system.[2] In 1990, Chaum together with Naor proposed the first off-line e-cash system, which was also based on blind signatures.[3]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ecash

In 1988, he extended this idea (with Amos Fiat and Moni Naor) to prevent double-spending.[13]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Chaum

Anyone have any more info on this? Was eCash's remaining problem merely initial-coin distribution, or was BGP actually not (practically) 'solved' despite the above?

I moved the question and my comments on it into another thread in dev/tech section https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=856069.msg9526439#msg9526439 as its not really to do with speculation nor gold, though an interesting question!

Adam

[brg444]

How much did David Chaum have solved at Digicash/eCash?

Some of the notes on the relevant wikipedia pages suggest he had double-spending solved:

...
Depending on the payment transactions, one distinguishes between on-line and off-line electronic cash: If the payee has to contact a third party (e.g., the bank or the credit-card company acting as an acquirer) before accepting a payment, the system is called an on-line system.[2] In 1990, Chaum together with Naor proposed the first off-line e-cash system, which was also based on blind signatures.[3]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ecash

In 1988, he extended this idea (with Amos Fiat and Moni Naor) to prevent double-spending.[13]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Chaum

Anyone have any more info on this? Was eCash's remaining problem merely initial-coin distribution, or was BGP actually not (practically) 'solved' despite the above?

I moved the question and my comments on it into another thread in dev/tech section https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=856069.msg9526439#msg9526439 as its not really to do with speculation nor gold, though an interesting question!

Adam

so you've been snooping on our sidechains debate all along heh 

[BlindMayorBitcorn]

Ha! I was wondering when we'd get back to gold collapsing

[justusranvier]

so you've been snooping on our sidechains debate all along heh 

Based on the occasional snide comments I see posted in other parts of the 'net, lots of people are watching this thread without commenting.

[brg444]

so you've been snooping on our sidechains debate all along heh 

Based on the occasional snide comments I see posted in other parts of the 'net, lots of people are watching this thread without commenting.

so I'm famous now 


 

[cypherdoc]

so you've been snooping on our sidechains debate all along heh 

Based on the occasional snide comments I see posted in other parts of the 'net, lots of people are watching this thread without commenting.

so I'm famous now 


 

like i said, you should apply for a job.

[brg444]

http://www.bloomberg.com/video/bloomberg-panel-discussion-on-outlook-for-bitcoin-NTorPlQGQzurnbQgYEz9~g.html

just started watching, impressive lineup. thought I'd share

[Melbustus]

http://www.bloomberg.com/video/bloomberg-panel-discussion-on-outlook-for-bitcoin-NTorPlQGQzurnbQgYEz9~g.html

just started watching, impressive lineup. thought I'd share

Ugh - looks interesting... I really don't have time for this tonight.

I *almost* (not really) miss the days when I could read/watch the past week's worth of mainstream bitcoin coverage in 10 minutes.