Swedish ASIC miner company kncminer.com

[raskul]

i've been saying for long enough, as soon as these farms start to sell coins, the price is going to slowly drop. nomatter how tactical or how much a spread they try to make on the sell orders, regular volume on exchanges will make exchanges devalue the commodity. KnC and others like them are only making a rod for their own backs (and kicking us in the teeth in the process) - but you can guarantee that once they have mined BTC to double digit$, they will try and sell off all those used blades.

[xstr8guy]

i've been saying for long enough, as soon as these farms start to sell coins, the price is going to slowly drop. nomatter how tactical or how much a spread they try to make on the sell orders, regular volume on exchanges will make exchanges devalue the commodity. KnC and others like them are only making a rod for their own backs (and kicking us in the teeth in the process) - but you can guarantee that once they have mined BTC to double digit$, they will try and sell off all those used blades.

New coins make up a tiny percentage of trades.  Besides, the total number of bitcoins minted doesn't increase just because someone has a lot of hashing power.  That's why there are difficulty adjustments.  

[dropt]

[...]
 Developers, instead of focusing on easing adoption, either doing endless patches or focus on some theoretically interesting, but esoteric stuff like contracts, colored coins, etc. If a contract can be described as a function of a single satoshi, how this can help the value of BTC? It wouldn't.

Are you just here for the money?  Bitcoin is more than just lining the pockets of speculators and miners.  There are many amazing useful layers that can be built on the Bitcoin protocol and it is, IMO, quite short-sighted to discredit them.

[raskul]

i've been saying for long enough, as soon as these farms start to sell coins, the price is going to slowly drop. nomatter how tactical or how much a spread they try to make on the sell orders, regular volume on exchanges will make exchanges devalue the commodity. KnC and others like them are only making a rod for their own backs (and kicking us in the teeth in the process) - but you can guarantee that once they have mined BTC to double digit$, they will try and sell off all those used blades.

New coins make up a tiny

regular

percentage of trades.  Besides, the number of bitcoins minted doesn't increase just because someone has a lot of hashing power. 

but sell orders do when organisations have more than the lions share

That's why there are difficulty adjustments. 

which has nothing to do with how an org sells it's stock.

[xstr8guy]

i've been saying for long enough, as soon as these farms start to sell coins, the price is going to slowly drop. nomatter how tactical or how much a spread they try to make on the sell orders, regular volume on exchanges will make exchanges devalue the commodity. KnC and others like them are only making a rod for their own backs (and kicking us in the teeth in the process) - but you can guarantee that once they have mined BTC to double digit$, they will try and sell off all those used blades.

New coins make up a tiny

regular

percentage of trades.  Besides, the number of bitcoins minted doesn't increase just because someone has a lot of hashing power. 

but sell orders do when organisations have more than the lions share

That's why there are difficulty adjustments. 

which has nothing to do with how an org sells it's stock.

.

Way to cherry-pick my quote.  You misrepresented or didn't understand my comment about difficulty changes.  I simply meant to point out that the number of bitcoins minted doesn't increase just because some organization has a lot if hashing power.

Each block still takes approximately 10 minutes.  A big organization will take more of the blocks.  But I don't see how this is going to significantly drive the price of BTC down.  There are many other things that can do that much more easily like the failure of the premier BTC exchange.  I actually think that a major decrease in people investing in new hardware bought with BTC is likely to have a significant effect on BTC demand therefore driving down the exchange rate.

I don't understand what your "regular" comment is supposed to mean.

[raskul]

Way to cherry-pick my quote.  You misrepresented or didn't understand my comment about difficulty changes.  I simply meant to point out that the number of bitcoins minted doesn't increase just because some organization has a lot if hashing power.

Each block still takes approximately 10 minutes.  A big organization will take more of the blocks.  But I don't see how this is going to significantly drive the price of BTC down.  There are many other things that can do that much more easily like the failure of the premier BTC exchange.  I actually think that a major decrease in people investing in new hardware bought with BTC is likely to have a significant effect on BTC demand therefore driving down the exchange rate.

I don't understand what your "regular" comment is supposed to mean.

I don't think gox has anything to do with the current price trend. What we are seeing is farms making 'regular' sell orders - nomatter how small; exchanges pick up on patterns and react accordingly, it is my firm belief that the recent (and ongoing) price drop is mainly to do with patterns in the sell orders, caused (in part - not solely) by mining farms btc to fiat cashouts. You don't think this is inevitable?
anyhoo, going off topic really, KnC are just one of many farms, and I very much doubt they are mining this volume of btc to hold onto. Unless you have other information?

[sbfree]

i've been saying for long enough, as soon as these farms start to sell coins, the price is going to slowly drop. nomatter how tactical or how much a spread they try to make on the sell orders, regular volume on exchanges will make exchanges devalue the commodity. KnC and others like them are only making a rod for their own backs (and kicking us in the teeth in the process) - but you can guarantee that once they have mined BTC to double digit$, they will try and sell off all those used blades.

New coins make up a tiny

regular

percentage of trades.  Besides, the number of bitcoins minted doesn't increase just because someone has a lot of hashing power. 

but sell orders do when organisations have more than the lions share

That's why there are difficulty adjustments. 

which has nothing to do with how an org sells it's stock.

.

Way to cherry-pick my quote.  You misrepresented or didn't understand my comment about difficulty changes.  I simply meant to point out that the number of bitcoins minted doesn't increase just because some organization has a lot if hashing power.

Each block still takes approximately 10 minutes.  A big organization will take more of the blocks.  But I don't see how this is going to significantly drive the price of BTC down.  There are many other things that can do that much more easily like the failure of the premier BTC exchange.  I actually think that a major decrease in people investing in new hardware bought with BTC is likely to have a significant effect on BTC demand therefore driving down the exchange rate.

I don't understand what your "regular" comment is supposed to mean.

early on in the asic game, it was BTC ONLY as form of payment....no btc meant you had to go out and buy some to get the hardware...price goes up??

with vendors now all taking wire transfer, paypal, credit cards and btc, then we have the likes of BITMAIN looking to dump btc is 1000 minimum quantities does not help price

[raskul]

early on in the asic game, it was BTC ONLY as form of payment....no btc meant you had to go out and buy some to get the hardware...price goes up??

good point. I had viewed the big rally up ($1200) to be partly due to the fact that our BTC was something that we were holding onto. markets also react to no-sell in this way. many holders makes the value.

[DPoS]

one thing to remember is that the AML rules are firmly in place everywhere to where coinbase, etc had to enact $1000 daily instant caps instead of 10 btc (which was over $10000 during the heyday) of instant daily buying support

losing 90% of instant support reduces the amount of players to protect drops...  sure you can still buy 50 if you care to wait 4 days in freeze mode while the price does whatever.. 

that is just one of the many examples..  okpay,etc getting forced out of the USD $$ markets...  many many inflows were crimped while more and more ways to spend btc opened up with tiger direct, overstock, and so many others..

there isn't real price discovery at the moment...  hardly has been, but was closer to that last fall into the runup for sure

[Phoenix1969]

Auroracoin "airdrop" in about 13 hours too... I expect most Icelanders will be trading for btc, and cashing out.

[jelin1984]

i do not think so

if airdrop will be success

auroracoin will be going very well

[jegersmart]

yay......a KNC scrypt miner delivering in 2014 at some stage....lend us $10k now though!!!lololololol

J

[joeventura]

If they would sell that Boden hashpower at a decent rate, or fulfill orders with it...it would create a huge diff increase offset, and be a huge benefit to Neptune holders and the community as a whole, because it's already a part of the cloud, and would cause zero diff increase, yet at the same time offer a great deal. They do have the ability to turn it into a HUGE customer advantage in this way. I hope they "Do the right thing"
That would be HUGE imho, and may even happen.

SO you are KNC you have hashpower, it creates $x an hour, your customers can do math and will not buy it for more than $x an hour,
show me a business model where it makes more sense to sell it for $x minus a little to make it profitable for your customers vs. just keeping it all your self and making raw profit?

The KNCcloud is just there to appease you when Neptune comes in late, then they will go back to using it for their own profit, why are you expecting anything customer centric when their focus has clearly changed from that lonnnnng ago?

[Tigggger]

The KNCcloud is just there to appease you when Neptune comes in late, then they will go back to using it for their own profit, why are you expecting anything customer centric when their focus has clearly changed from that lonnnnng ago?

KNC's new direction and orama's abscence, connected ?

[joeventura]

The KNCcloud is just there to appease you when Neptune comes in late, then they will go back to using it for their own profit, why are you expecting anything customer centric when their focus has clearly changed from that lonnnnng ago?

KNC's new direction and orama's abscence, connected ?

no

[jegersmart]

If they would sell that Boden hashpower at a decent rate, or fulfill orders with it...it would create a huge diff increase offset, and be a huge benefit to Neptune holders and the community as a whole, because it's already a part of the cloud, and would cause zero diff increase, yet at the same time offer a great deal. They do have the ability to turn it into a HUGE customer advantage in this way. I hope they "Do the right thing"
That would be HUGE imho, and may even happen.

SO you are KNC you have hashpower, it creates $x an hour, your customers can do math and will not buy it for more than $x an hour,
show me a business model where it makes more sense to sell it for $x minus a little to make it profitable for your customers vs. just keeping it all your self and making raw profit?

The KNCcloud is just there to appease you when Neptune comes in late, then they will go back to using it for their own profit, why are you expecting anything customer centric when their focus has clearly changed from that lonnnnng ago?

I think this is a bit naive tbh.....

J

[SyRenity]

Spoondoodles or whatever their name is has said they don't plan to mine, other than 24 hours of burn in testing which they donate to charity.

Any manufacturer that mines has an inherent conflict of interest with its customers especially when it can delay shipment (and keep mining for itself) without any real consequences.

Let's face facts here.  Conflict or not, every manufacturer mines with their own equipment.  This is no secret.  I'm pretty sure even BitMain has a farm of some sort.

I don't think they've denied it. In fact I think they've been open about it. "Spoondoodles" denies it.

While I don't feel very comfortable jumping into a competitor thread, I do would like to emphasize that we are committed to what we have have said before - none of our client units will be used for self-mining, beyond a standard burn-in test, with resulting proceeds will be publicly donated to a charity. Moreover, these clients who decide to use our upcoming hosted plan, will have the burn-in proceeds going immediately to their own set-up wallets.

This is part of company ethos, insisted by our investors and one of the reasons that I personally have joined them in the first place. We are (still) a start-up sized team, so any generated BTC during testing, tuning, etc... are completely transparent and being accounted in for the future charity proceeds.

[BitchImightbe]

Spoondoodles or whatever their name is has said they don't plan to mine, other than 24 hours of burn in testing which they donate to charity.

Any manufacturer that mines has an inherent conflict of interest with its customers especially when it can delay shipment (and keep mining for itself) without any real consequences.

Let's face facts here.  Conflict or not, every manufacturer mines with their own equipment.  This is no secret.  I'm pretty sure even BitMain has a farm of some sort.

I don't think they've denied it. In fact I think they've been open about it. "Spoondoodles" denies it.

While I don't feel very comfortable jumping into a competitor thread, I do would like to emphasize that we are committed to what we have have said before - none of our client units will be used for self-mining, beyond a standard burn-in test, with resulting proceeds will be publicly donated to a charity. Moreover, these clients who decide to use our upcoming hosted plan, will have the burn-in proceeds going immediately to their own set-up wallets.

This is part of company ethos, insisted by our investors and one of the reasons that I personally have joined them in the first place. We are (still) a start-up sized team, so any generated BTC during testing, tuning, etc... are completely transparent and being accounted in for the future charity proceeds.

But you do have a farm, just not clients units?
Don´t lie 

[kendog77]

Spoondoodles or whatever their name is has said they don't plan to mine, other than 24 hours of burn in testing which they donate to charity.

Any manufacturer that mines has an inherent conflict of interest with its customers especially when it can delay shipment (and keep mining for itself) without any real consequences.

Let's face facts here.  Conflict or not, every manufacturer mines with their own equipment.  This is no secret.  I'm pretty sure even BitMain has a farm of some sort.

I don't think they've denied it. In fact I think they've been open about it. "Spoondoodles" denies it.

While I don't feel very comfortable jumping into a competitor thread, I do would like to emphasize that we are committed to what we have have said before - none of our client units will be used for self-mining, beyond a standard burn-in test, with resulting proceeds will be publicly donated to a charity. Moreover, these clients who decide to use our upcoming hosted plan, will have the burn-in proceeds going immediately to their own set-up wallets.

This is part of company ethos, insisted by our investors and one of the reasons that I personally have joined them in the first place. We are (still) a start-up sized team, so any generated BTC during testing, tuning, etc... are completely transparent and being accounted in for the future charity proceeds.

But you do have a farm, just not clients units?
Don´t lie  

Right, here is what most hardware manufacturers do to get private customer funded farms:

1.) Sell a miner to a customer at 4x the cost of production.
2.) Add 3 miners to a private farm with profit from the sale of the customer unit.
3.) Rince and repeat thousands of times.

I'm almost certain that Knc and BuzzDave (BitFury) followed this business model.

[SyRenity]

But you do have a farm, just not clients units?
Don´t lie  

Again, the hosting capabilities that we have are intended for the hosted plans, which we are going to introduce shortly.