Bitcoin Forum
December 05, 2024, 01:01:16 AM *
News: Latest Bitcoin Core release: 28.0 [Torrent]
 
   Home   Help Search Login Register More  
Pages: « 1 ... 82 83 84 85 86 87 88 89 90 91 92 93 94 95 96 97 98 99 100 101 102 103 104 105 106 107 108 109 110 111 112 113 114 115 116 117 118 119 120 121 122 123 124 125 126 127 128 129 130 131 [132] 133 134 135 136 137 138 139 140 141 142 143 144 145 146 147 148 149 150 151 152 153 154 155 156 157 158 159 160 161 162 163 164 165 166 167 168 169 170 171 172 173 174 175 176 177 178 179 180 181 182 ... 329 »
  Print  
Author Topic: Merit & new rank requirements  (Read 167755 times)
JayJuanGee
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 3920
Merit: 11304


Self-Custody is a right. Say no to"Non-custodial"


View Profile
February 11, 2018, 03:25:34 AM
 #2621


By using the system like this, no-one would be born with a "grandparent" advantage, and at the same time no-one would have the right to feel "cheated".
 

Your phraseology of "grandparent advantage" causes a pretty strong inference that you do not understand the basic fairness that is meant to come from the employment of such a principle.  Grandfather clauses are not meant to cause injustices, disadvantage, unfairness or exploitation of new users in favor of old but instead are meant to allow a fair transition in systems that does not prejudice prior membership or prior members' reliance on earlier terms.. it is a kind of basic transitional remedy that is used in a lot of places to cause fairness rather than unfairness.

1) Self-Custody is a right.  There is no such thing as "non-custodial" or "un-hosted."  2) ESG, KYC & AML are attack-vectors on Bitcoin to be avoided or minimized.  3) How much alt (shit)coin diversification is necessary? if you are into Bitcoin, then 0%......if you cannot control your gambling, then perhaps limit your alt(shit)coin exposure to less than 10% of your bitcoin size...Put BTC here: bc1q49wt0ddnj07wzzp6z7affw9ven7fztyhevqu9k
jimmywh
Member
**
Offline Offline

Activity: 140
Merit: 22


View Profile
February 11, 2018, 03:44:57 AM
 #2622

Are you actually saying that all people who became Full Members and above before merit was implemented wrote quality posts? In order to rank up before merit was introduced, you didn't have to write quality posts, they just couldn't be shit posts worthy of deletion.

I didn't say that. But you also can't claim that NO ONE is worth having those merits and should be set to 0. Without going through every post ever made and re-evaluating everything (completely unfeasible) I don't think it's possible to come up with a totally fair formula. Just to make this clear - I would be fine with 0 merits. I don't see any significance in the starting number at all. I'm saying that if theymos had started everyone with 0 the moaning would be just as loud.

I agree that with merit introduced everybody should have started from 0 to make the merit system more transparent. By starting at 0 I don't mean that Hero members would have to earn 1000 merits to become legendary. However, they would need the 500 equal to the difference between Hero and Legendary. What I would prefer is the following:

Jr. Member -> Member 0-10
Member -> Full Member 0-90
Full Member -> Sr. Member 0-150
Sr. Member -> Hero Member 0-250
Hero Member -> Legendary 0-500
Legendary 0-0

By using the system like this, no-one would be born with a "grandparent" advantage, and at the same time no-one would have the right to feel "cheated".

Win/win

This scheme wouldn't work when those old members need to get to the next rank after their first rank-up. Sr. Member who started at zero earns 250 and becomes a Hero Member. Then what?



This is a status quo scenario. Building up to the next rank a person who went from Sr. Member to Legendary would need 750 merits from the introduction of the merit system. It would mean exactly the same in term of rank progression as the current system, but it would separate the good legendaries and heroes from the no good.


By using the system like this, no-one would be born with a "grandparent" advantage, and at the same time no-one would have the right to feel "cheated".
 

Your phraseology of "grandparent advantage" causes a pretty strong inference that you do not understand the basic fairness that is meant to come from the employment of such a principle.  Grandfather clauses are not meant to cause injustices, disadvantage, unfairness or exploitation of new users in favor of old but instead are meant to allow a fair transition in systems that does not prejudice prior membership or prior members' reliance on earlier terms.. it is a kind of basic transitional remedy that is used in a lot of places to cause fairness rather than unfairness.

You fail to see that not all grandparents are worthy of grandparent advantage. That being said, I think you fail to see that my suggestion won’t take any advantages from such. Quite the opposite actually. It will make the worthy people with great seniority stand out even more.
JayJuanGee
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 3920
Merit: 11304


Self-Custody is a right. Say no to"Non-custodial"


View Profile
February 11, 2018, 04:03:48 AM
 #2623



By using the system like this, no-one would be born with a "grandparent" advantage, and at the same time no-one would have the right to feel "cheated".
 

Your phraseology of "grandparent advantage" causes a pretty strong inference that you do not understand the basic fairness that is meant to come from the employment of such a principle.  Grandfather clauses are not meant to cause injustices, disadvantage, unfairness or exploitation of new users in favor of old but instead are meant to allow a fair transition in systems that does not prejudice prior membership or prior members' reliance on earlier terms.. it is a kind of basic transitional remedy that is used in a lot of places to cause fairness rather than unfairness.

You fail to see that not all grandparents are worthy of grandparent advantage. That being said, I think you fail to see that my suggestion won’t take any advantages from such. Quite the opposite actually. It will make the worthy people with great seniority stand out even more.

Again your phraseology of the grandfather situation is a bit much, and even if you have good intentions with your proposal, I fail to see your attempt to question bygones be bygones under the previous system.   

Certainly, I have no intention to protect the bad conduct and abuses of previous posters, but the new system is not an attempt to rectify past bad conduct (to the extent that it existed) but instead to reward future good conduct.  So, I think that any system, such as your proposal that seems to meddle too much with the past, goes too far and creates additional injustices that are not necessary to stir up.

1) Self-Custody is a right.  There is no such thing as "non-custodial" or "un-hosted."  2) ESG, KYC & AML are attack-vectors on Bitcoin to be avoided or minimized.  3) How much alt (shit)coin diversification is necessary? if you are into Bitcoin, then 0%......if you cannot control your gambling, then perhaps limit your alt(shit)coin exposure to less than 10% of your bitcoin size...Put BTC here: bc1q49wt0ddnj07wzzp6z7affw9ven7fztyhevqu9k
suchmoon
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 3878
Merit: 9099


https://bpip.org


View Profile WWW
February 11, 2018, 04:13:37 AM
 #2624

This is a status quo scenario. Building up to the next rank a person who went from Sr. Member to Legendary would need 750 merits from the introduction of the merit system. It would mean exactly the same in term of rank progression as the current system, but it would separate the good legendaries and heroes from the no good.

So this would be a far more complicated system and it would make a blanket assumption (users who earned activity before the merit system are "no good"?) that isn't any better than the current implementation.
Soke
Member
**
Offline Offline

Activity: 101
Merit: 16


View Profile
February 11, 2018, 04:16:31 AM
 #2625

jimmywh.  If everyone started with 0 merits.  How do you expect to receive any merits?  You have to have merits in order to have sMerits.  If you take a look at the merits you have received so far, they are mostly from high ranking members.  Guess what? if they had started with 0 merits, you would probably still be at 0.  Don't fight the system, accept it.  
JayJuanGee
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 3920
Merit: 11304


Self-Custody is a right. Say no to"Non-custodial"


View Profile
February 11, 2018, 04:20:48 AM
 #2626

This is a status quo scenario. Building up to the next rank a person who went from Sr. Member to Legendary would need 750 merits from the introduction of the merit system. It would mean exactly the same in term of rank progression as the current system, but it would separate the good legendaries and heroes from the no good.

So this would be a far more complicated system and it would make a blanket assumption (users who earned activity before the merit system are "no good"?) that isn't any better than the current implementation.

It would be worse, and that is part of the problem with jimmywh's proposal and similarly aligned ones.   

1) Self-Custody is a right.  There is no such thing as "non-custodial" or "un-hosted."  2) ESG, KYC & AML are attack-vectors on Bitcoin to be avoided or minimized.  3) How much alt (shit)coin diversification is necessary? if you are into Bitcoin, then 0%......if you cannot control your gambling, then perhaps limit your alt(shit)coin exposure to less than 10% of your bitcoin size...Put BTC here: bc1q49wt0ddnj07wzzp6z7affw9ven7fztyhevqu9k
evdokimo
Jr. Member
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 40
Merit: 9

Support life!


View Profile
February 11, 2018, 07:31:53 AM
 #2627

jimmywh.  If everyone started with 0 merits.  How do you expect to receive any merits?  You have to have merits in order to have sMerits.  If you take a look at the merits you have received so far, they are mostly from high ranking members.  Guess what? if they had started with 0 merits, you would probably still be at 0.  Don't fight the system, accept it.  

If everyone started with 0 merits, this system would have still worked. Major portion of merits comes from merit sources not senior members.
ozkraut
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 522
Merit: 266


View Profile
February 11, 2018, 07:45:09 AM
 #2628

This is a status quo scenario. Building up to the next rank a person who went from Sr. Member to Legendary would need 750 merits from the introduction of the merit system. It would mean exactly the same in term of rank progression as the current system, but it would separate the good legendaries and heroes from the no good.

So this would be a far more complicated system and it would make a blanket assumption (users who earned activity before the merit system are "no good"?) that isn't any better than the current implementation.

It would be impossible to perform a post mortem review on all previous posts to assess legacy merit. A line drawn in the sand, such as has been decided, is the only way to go. The permutations and wasted energy of any other approach would be mind boggling and futile.

 To me the discussion is over and its time to move on. And I am just a few posts away from hero based on my pre-merit activity. So I am mildly 'disadvantaged' but live goes on and bicycles continue to fall over in Beijing....

Monero - Wir sind die Leute vor denen uns unsere Eltern gewarnt haben!
pvk444
Member
**
Offline Offline

Activity: 252
Merit: 47


View Profile
February 11, 2018, 07:48:47 AM
Merited by ozkraut (10), djangocoin (1)
 #2629

jimmywh.  If everyone started with 0 merits.  How do you expect to receive any merits?  You have to have merits in order to have sMerits.  If you take a look at the merits you have received so far, they are mostly from high ranking members.  Guess what? if they had started with 0 merits, you would probably still be at 0.  Don't fight the system, accept it.  

a) there are still merit sources.  And more importantly,
b) not receiving merits by default, does not mean that sMerits's coudn't have been allocated by default.

But frankly, the fact that merits were distributed does not make a lot of difference from a rank-advancement perspective. Whether sombody needs 500 starting from 250 or needs 250 merits from 0, is practically the same.

I am just personally disappointed, as I was about 3 posts away from becoming full member before the merit system kicked in. So instead of 3 posts, I need now to get 90 merits ... which, is rather a dismotivation. And I know of others who has been in a similar or even worse position.

There was no "grandfathering" of being "almost" at the next level.
ozkraut
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 522
Merit: 266


View Profile
February 11, 2018, 07:52:59 AM
 #2630

jimmywh.  If everyone started with 0 merits.  How do you expect to receive any merits?  You have to have merits in order to have sMerits.  If you take a look at the merits you have received so far, they are mostly from high ranking members.  Guess what? if they had started with 0 merits, you would probably still be at 0.  Don't fight the system, accept it.  

a) there are still merit sources.  And more importantly,
b) not receiving merits by default, does not mean that sMerits's coudn't have been allocated by default.

But frankly, the fact that merits were distributed does not make a lot of difference from a rank-advancement perspective. Whether sombody needs 500 starting from 250 or needs 250 merits from 0, is practically the same.

I am just personally disappointed, as I was about 3 posts away from becoming full member before the merit system kicked in. So instead of 3 posts, I need now to get 90 merits ... which, is rather a dismotivation. And I know of others who has been in a similar or even worse position.

There was no "grandfathering" of being "almost" at the next level.


Well here is 10 if it makes you feel better. Cheers

Monero - Wir sind die Leute vor denen uns unsere Eltern gewarnt haben!
sonulrk
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Activity: 266
Merit: 100


View Profile
February 11, 2018, 08:36:30 AM
 #2631

This is Bitcoin forum. Not a bounty forum. The fact that most complainers seem to be focused on making money is a good indication that the merit system is a step in the right direction.

You re missing one point out there, which is, an account cant give merits all the time, they will run out of their merit points, unless they are a "merit sources". So there will be no much biases on this merit system i guess. The key here is obviously to give merit to the right person, and who is that right person?
1. Who posts a quality posts.
2. Has a great forum manner.
3. Can decide a good posts out of bias.
I guess they must fulfill this 3 category to a user before they give the merits. So the person who are given the merit can pass the merit to the right person too, and in the end the merits will be circulated in to right person and will diminish people who only join this forum to rank up and gain money. And for now, i guess the old high rank members/users are persons that have enough knowledge in crypto and have good forum manner so thats why some of them are sources, so just let them do their job and hope they will do it perfectly.
Dont get me wrong, i love getting money from this forum, but i am not like people who only focusing this forum to earn money, and when they can not get the money, they will whine about it in this forum because of merit. For all people who whine about it, you are a worker not a boss here, the boss can search other people who has more knowledge and experience and replace you, in fact, there are lot of people who can do that besides you, if you dont step up your game, no one will hire you in the end.

Your whole argument just don't have any value and collapsed on its own weight when you have inserted just one word above (in red). There is spamming because this forum can be used to make money. This merit system is introduced to control the spamming and shit-posting and it's only retarded the speed of users to be ranked up. It is just like to give opium to control a naughty kid.
pugman
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 2383
Merit: 1551


dogs are cute.


View Profile WWW
February 11, 2018, 10:32:57 AM
Last edit: February 11, 2018, 10:47:45 AM by pugman
 #2632

I don't know if this has been discussed before or not,but I think I might have found a little bug while sending merits.
What happened is I gave 1 merit to a user and when I refreshed my merit page to check my sMerits count,another merit is automatically sent by the system to the last user I sent the merit to! This has happened twice so far,can't think of it to be coincidence or an accident.
Am I the only one who faced this bug? Are there others too?

Also stop whining and fighting like kids about the merit system. Grow up already. You came to this forum for learning about bitcoin(at least 5% of the people did). So do that instead of non-stop whining.

Oh Ffs,it has happened thrice now.  Angry

TheQuin
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 2576
Merit: 883


Freebitco.in Support https://bit.ly/2I9BVS2


View Profile WWW
February 11, 2018, 10:47:13 AM
 #2633

I don't know if this has been discussed before or not,but I think I might have found a little bug while sending merits.
What happened is I gave 1 merit to a user and when I refreshed my merit page to check my sMerits count,another merit is automatically sent by the system to the last user I sent the merit to! This has happened twice so far,can't think of it to be coincidence or an accident.
Am I the only one who faced this bug? Are there others too?

This has been reported by other people earlier in the thread. You can try the Enhanced merit UI [1.1] to avoid the problem or just always remember to close the tab after sending merit.

freebitcoin.TO WIN A  LAMBORGHINI!..

.
                                ▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄███████████▄▄▄▄▄
                    ▄▄▄▄▄██████████████████████████████████▄▄▄▄
                    ▀██████████████████████████████████████████████▄▄▄
                    ▄▄████▄█████▄████████████████████████████▄█████▄████▄▄
                    ▀████████▀▀▀████████████████████████████████▀▀▀██████████▄
                      ▀▀▀████▄▄▄███████████████████████████████▄▄▄██████████
                           ▀█████▀  ▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀  ▀█████▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀
                   ▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀
pugman
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 2383
Merit: 1551


dogs are cute.


View Profile WWW
February 11, 2018, 10:50:02 AM
 #2634

I don't know if this has been discussed before or not,but I think I might have found a little bug while sending merits.
What happened is I gave 1 merit to a user and when I refreshed my merit page to check my sMerits count,another merit is automatically sent by the system to the last user I sent the merit to! This has happened twice so far,can't think of it to be coincidence or an accident.
Am I the only one who faced this bug? Are there others too?

This has been reported by other people earlier in the thread. You can try the Enhanced merit UI [1.1] to avoid the problem or just always remember to close the tab after sending merit.

Unfortunately,I can't use it. As I always use incognito mode on my pc and on my phone also such is not possible Sad
Thanks though!

binuk
Newbie
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 294
Merit: 0


View Profile
February 11, 2018, 11:12:03 AM
 #2635

Where is the button to give out Merit?
Do that disappear because my merit is 0? :thinking:
Vod
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 3906
Merit: 3167


Licking my boob since 1970


View Profile WWW
February 11, 2018, 11:14:27 AM
 #2636

Where is the button to give out Merit?
Do that disappear because my merit is 0? :thinking:

You need (s)Merit to give it out.  :/

Since you have zero merit, you also have zero sMerit to give out.  

The link will not appear until you have sMerit to send to others.   You will get one sMerit for every two Merit you receive.  Smiley

(This may not be allowed, but please send me all your current sMerits!  Please!)

I post for interest - not signature spam.
https://elon.report - new BPI Reports!
https://vod.fan - profitable/free image sharing - coming early 2025
pugman
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 2383
Merit: 1551


dogs are cute.


View Profile WWW
February 11, 2018, 11:15:43 AM
 #2637

Where is the button to give out Merit?
Do that disappear because my merit is 0? :thinking:
It is right there,look:
Just click the +merit button Smiley
You have sMerit to give out - he doesn't.  The link won't show for him.
Didn't know about this,thanks for letting me know.

Vod
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 3906
Merit: 3167


Licking my boob since 1970


View Profile WWW
February 11, 2018, 11:17:04 AM
 #2638

Where is the button to give out Merit?
Do that disappear because my merit is 0? :thinking:
It is right there,look:
Just click the +merit button Smiley

You have sMerit to give out - he doesn't.  The link won't show for him.

I post for interest - not signature spam.
https://elon.report - new BPI Reports!
https://vod.fan - profitable/free image sharing - coming early 2025
binuk
Newbie
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 294
Merit: 0


View Profile
February 11, 2018, 11:37:04 AM
 #2639

Where is the button to give out Merit?
Do that disappear because my merit is 0? :thinking:

You need (s)Merit to give it out.  :/

Since you have zero merit, you also have zero sMerit to give out.  

The link will not appear until you have sMerit to send to others.   You will get one sMerit for every two Merit you receive.  Smiley

(This may not be allowed, but please send me all your current sMerits!  Please!)

Thank you. I've merited you.....in my mind  Cheesy
Mommynigabby
Member
**
Offline Offline

Activity: 588
Merit: 10


View Profile
February 11, 2018, 11:58:58 AM
 #2640

Where is the button to give out Merit?
Do that disappear because my merit is 0? :thinking:

You need (s)Merit to give it out.  :/

Since you have zero merit, you also have zero sMerit to give out. 

The link will not appear until you have sMerit to send to others.   You will get one sMerit for every two Merit you receive.  Smiley

(This may not be allowed, but please send me all your current sMerits!  Please!)
Thank you. I've merited you.....in my mind  Cheesy

If you give out merit, will that be taken against your own merit? I was really wishing to be up-ranked to the next level. I thought I was near that... but then... i have only 10 merit at the moment...

The Merit button should be right next to the post number. upper right.
Pages: « 1 ... 82 83 84 85 86 87 88 89 90 91 92 93 94 95 96 97 98 99 100 101 102 103 104 105 106 107 108 109 110 111 112 113 114 115 116 117 118 119 120 121 122 123 124 125 126 127 128 129 130 131 [132] 133 134 135 136 137 138 139 140 141 142 143 144 145 146 147 148 149 150 151 152 153 154 155 156 157 158 159 160 161 162 163 164 165 166 167 168 169 170 171 172 173 174 175 176 177 178 179 180 181 182 ... 329 »
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.19 | SMF © 2006-2009, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!