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Author Topic: [BitFunder] Moving Forward/Resolution Process  (Read 290742 times)
SebastianJu
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March 16, 2014, 04:45:32 PM
 #1261

If I didn't make myself clear:

There is no plausible scenario in which *anyone trying to get money from Jon* would to tell you to sue.

Those planning to file a civil (tort) case against Jon would not tell you to sue him because you would be competing for the same (limited) funds.  The more people sue Jon, the less money each one will be able to get back, the messier the case, etc., etc.

Those looking for a solution outside of the legal system obviously don't want you to sue, but assuming that you'll somehow benefit from their efforts is unreasonable.  Backroom deals are seldom done to benefit the public.


*lol* Multiple accounts are confusing right... Wink

Theoretically i think youre right but ukyo not only owes privately but with a company too. The debtor's with ukyo loan could sue ukyo directly for the money. They have an advantage in sueing. But all weexchange debtor's have the problem that they only can sue when they sued weexchange first. Depending on if the company catches the problem or if ukyo made a legal error that makes him personally liable you have to sue then weexchange or ukyo in a civil case to seize funds.

Though i think ukyo wont have riches you can sue him for. The only hope is to find out where the coins went and get them back.
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NotLambchop
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March 16, 2014, 05:40:37 PM
 #1262

Something tells me that an American knowingly running an illegal business from US soil shouldn't count on being protected by the corporate shield.  But regardless, I'm not suggesting you should sue, merely that there is no scenario in which any of the people involved would advise you to sue.  That's all.
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March 18, 2014, 03:30:35 AM
 #1263

@glendall 
You're right, what should we do next? I'll back you up
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March 19, 2014, 04:33:48 AM
 #1264

@glendall  
You're right, what should we do next? I'll back you up

Unfortunately I don't have the money for legal options, I'm quite poor.

Jon Montroll will get what is coming to him, I do not forget.  I also don't even care about money much, but just on principle, I can not let someone steal from me and get away without with experiencing repercussions. They might even be a long time coming but he has something coming for him. I don't live in the U.S but I have a great memory.

Besides taking it upon myself to try to wake people up around here to smell the coffee (that they have been taken advantage of), there is not much publicly more I can suggest. I just hope the bigger bag holders take him to the courts or press criminal charges, and then instead of Jon Montroll's bullshit, we can actually hear how (or why) the community lost over 5 million dollars of BTC entrusted to him, and instead of living comfortably off of stolen funds, Jon could try out poverty, such as he brought to his customers.  This vampire really fucked over a lot of people and justice should find him.  
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March 19, 2014, 05:33:56 AM
 #1265

Balance Stuck   53.28289435   Available   0.00000000   Withdrawn   3.50676123

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March 19, 2014, 08:43:04 AM
 #1266

So ... since with Weex, it was an exchange where the $ balance in the exchange can never get less than the balance of $ in every account ... who stole the $ out of Weex?

You see, if someone puts $ into Weex, and then buys BTC, those $ (less a fee) go to the other person.
Thus it's not possible for the balance of $ in the exchange to get below the account $ balance of all accounts ... unless someone was stealing the $ ...

So ... anyone got more bullshit to spread about Weex and their scam associates Neo & Bee?

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thy
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March 19, 2014, 09:25:07 AM
 #1267

So ... since with Weex, it was an exchange where the $ balance in the exchange can never get less than the balance of $ in every account ... who stole the $ out of Weex?

You see, if someone puts $ into Weex, and then buys BTC, those $ (less a fee) go to the other person.
Thus it's not possible for the balance of $ in the exchange to get below the account $ balance of all accounts ... unless someone was stealing the $ ...

So ... anyone got more bullshit to spread about Weex and their scam associates Neo & Bee?
Ukyo hasen't exactly been detailed about what actually has happened, if funds got stolen or if he did use some of other peoples funds to invest in something that diden't work out as planned or if something other strange is preventing him from accessing the funds at the moment.
But if somehow funds actually got stolen from weexchange/bitfunder it would most likely have been on the BTC side and not on the USD/fiat side then i think.

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March 19, 2014, 12:10:48 PM
 #1268


I will fly to Dallas by this sunday ,and have a pointment with a lawyer by the following Monday. I think I need someone to gathering all people to against Ukyo, not only myself. However because I am not living USA, It is really costly for me to fly from London to Dallas again and over again.

Is there an update to this?
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March 19, 2014, 11:56:11 PM
 #1269

So ... since with Weex, it was an exchange where the $ balance in the exchange can never get less than the balance of $ in every account ... who stole the $ out of Weex?

You see, if someone puts $ into Weex, and then buys BTC, those $ (less a fee) go to the other person.
Thus it's not possible for the balance of $ in the exchange to get below the account $ balance of all accounts ... unless someone was stealing the $ ...

So ... anyone got more bullshit to spread about Weex and their scam associates Neo & Bee?
Ukyo hasen't exactly been detailed about what actually has happened, if funds got stolen or if he did use some of other peoples funds to invest in something that diden't work out as planned or if something other strange is preventing him from accessing the funds at the moment.
But if somehow funds actually got stolen from weexchange/bitfunder it would most likely have been on the BTC side and not on the USD/fiat side then i think.
That's my point Tongue

What happened to the fiat?

It's either there or was spent/stolen.

Oddly enough, bank accounts in the fiat world have VERY clear transaction histories.
So any vagueness about that is a DIRECT line to it being all a load of complete crap and lies.

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pascal257
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March 20, 2014, 02:35:29 AM
 #1270

Any signs from Ukyo or was he able to escape and hide somewhere?

Are there any lawsuits planned right now? I would start suing from Germany, but I think it's more effective if some US-based victim would start a lawsuit. I am certain we could collect some coins for legal fees. Anyone (preferably reputable) willing to lead/start a lawsuit?
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March 20, 2014, 02:58:59 AM
 #1271

Any signs from Ukyo or was he able to escape and hide somewhere?

Are there any lawsuits planned right now? I would start suing from Germany, but I think it's more effective if some US-based victim would start a lawsuit. I am certain we could collect some coins for legal fees. Anyone (preferably reputable) willing to lead/start a lawsuit?
Ukyo was last active on the forum March 15, 2014 so he's still around even if he dont post in the open.

SOSLOVE868 https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=111108 for example was traveling over from China a few days ago to talk to some local lawers in Dallas USA to try to at the least get some information from ukyo or possibly go further with lawsuit against ukyo if there is no progress i think. Maby people can join in on a joint venture if there isen't starting to come some meaningfull information soon, i think it's extremely bad handling of things from Ukyo and Graet sofar, that people for this long hasen't got more information on whats going on, especially for those that has 100 000's USD worth of BTC ivested in the Ukyo/Graet/Weexchange matter.

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March 20, 2014, 01:38:52 PM
 #1272

After speaking to someone in the know but who wouldn't divulge much, I am now convinced that Ukyo is being investigated along with others by the U.S. SEC and was forced to withhold people's funds and not talk about it until the investigation is complete. I further speculate that it is the same investigation into Satoshi Dice that is coming to light.

P.s. If you don't fully understand english and can't see the words "I am now convinced" and "further speculate", don't reply saying "this is bullshit" and look like a moron. I never said it is true, I am only sharing my current belief.
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March 20, 2014, 02:04:15 PM
 #1273

After speaking to someone in the know but who wouldn't divulge much, I am now convinced that Ukyo is being investigated along with others by the U.S. SEC and was forced to withhold people's funds and not talk about it until the investigation is complete. I further speculate that it is the same investigation into Satoshi Dice that is coming to light.

P.s. If you don't fully understand english and can't see the words "I am now convinced" and "further speculate", don't reply saying "this is bullshit" and look like a moron. I never said it is true, I am only sharing my current belief.

After speaking to someone in the know but who wouldn't divulge much, I am now convinced that the moon is made of cream cheese. I further speculate that it is the same cream cheese is responsible for the alien capture of Apollo 11 and the consequent lizard invasion.

P.s. If you don't fully understand english and can't see the words "I am now convinced" and "further speculate", don't reply saying "this is bullshit" and look like a moron. I never said it is true, I am only sharing my current belief.

jackmaninov
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March 20, 2014, 02:04:39 PM
 #1274

After speaking to someone in the know but who wouldn't divulge much, I am now convinced that Ukyo is being investigated along with others by the U.S. SEC and was forced to withhold people's funds and not talk about it until the investigation is complete. I further speculate that it is the same investigation into Satoshi Dice that is coming to light.

P.s. If you don't fully understand english and can't see the words "I am now convinced" and "further speculate", don't reply saying "this is bullshit" and look like a moron. I never said it is true, I am only sharing my current belief.

Ahh, so SatoshiDICE passthroughs have come back to bite us all in the ass. Beautiful. This also makes sense when you start reading the PDF that the MPEX founder posted yesterday.

I therefore blame MPEX and their 30BTC account signup fee! Of course, I probably would have been trading there without it... Tongue

Will tutor physics or perform DFT calculations for Bitcoin (PM me!): 1jackkHHCLtxryJFAnPhrbvfcomtvXSzg
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March 20, 2014, 02:55:47 PM
 #1275

After speaking to someone in the know but who wouldn't divulge much, I am now convinced that Ukyo is being investigated along with others by the U.S. SEC and was forced to withhold people's funds and not talk about it until the investigation is complete. I further speculate that it is the same investigation into Satoshi Dice that is coming to light.

P.s. If you don't fully understand english and can't see the words "I am now convinced" and "further speculate", don't reply saying "this is bullshit" and look like a moron. I never said it is true, I am only sharing my current belief.
And around we go.  Cry
thy
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March 20, 2014, 06:34:05 PM
 #1276

After speaking to someone in the know but who wouldn't divulge much, I am now convinced that Ukyo is being investigated along with others by the U.S. SEC and was forced to withhold people's funds and not talk about it until the investigation is complete. I further speculate that it is the same investigation into Satoshi Dice that is coming to light.

P.s. If you don't fully understand english and can't see the words "I am now convinced" and "further speculate", don't reply saying "this is bullshit" and look like a moron. I never said it is true, I am only sharing my current belief.
Some of what you say is resonable but not all, surely AMC & ken slaughter was beeing looked at by the SEC and it seems likely that SEC looked at BTC-TC and Bitfunder to.

But if what you said where the case, then why would Bitfunder be that different from how BTC-TC worked when they winded it down ?
I could possibly see that what you say would be the case in a few specific cases for some of the issuers of stocks like for Activeminer/Ken Slaghters or TradeFortresses account/holdings/funds on Bitfunder/Weexchange that there funds would be frozen during a possible investigation, but for 99% of the normal users/investors on Bitfunder/Weexchange there would be no reason whatsoever to lock there funds up for this amount of time as there shouldn't be any problem for them to clear practically all users within a week or two.

What you say either don't make sense in relation to the fact that all users were allowed to withdraw 6.17% of there Weexchange balances, so possibly Ken Slaughter(that we know that SEC have been looking at) and Trade Fortress for example could have withdrawn funds then to.

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March 20, 2014, 06:54:37 PM
 #1277

... Ken Slaughter(that we know that SEC have been looking at)...

Just a couple of nit-picking corrections:

1.  Ken claimed that he's being investigated by his state, Missouri Securities Division, not the SEC.
2.  There is no evidence of this claim being anything more than an excuse to keep his "shareholders" from trading, just Ken's word.  Ken Slaughter's "shareholders" have been subsisting on a steady diet of lies.  It's unreasonable to assume this claim to be an exception.

/sorry if a bit OT.
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March 20, 2014, 07:11:40 PM
 #1278

... Ken Slaughter(that we know that SEC have been looking at)...

Just a couple of nit-picking corrections:

1.  Ken claimed that he's being investigated by his state, Missouri Securities Division, not the SEC.
2.  There is no evidence of this claim being anything more than an excuse to keep his "shareholders" from trading, just Ken's word.  Ken Slaughter's "shareholders" have been subsisting on a steady diet of lies.  It's unreasonable to assume this claim to be an exception.
Ok thought i saw he mentioning SEC somewhere, i must have remembered it wrong then, maby it was someone else, Ukyo? or so that mentioned SEC then in relation to Ken and AMC, but your right unless SEC officially states there investigating Ken or ActM or you work for them you can't know for sure whether it's true or not.

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March 20, 2014, 09:22:29 PM
 #1279

What you say either don't make sense in relation to the fact that all users were allowed to withdraw 6.17% of there Weexchange balances, so possibly Ken Slaughter(that we know that SEC have been looking at) and Trade Fortress for example could have withdrawn funds then to.
Ukyo said he allowed the users to withdraw the ~6% because he believed it was the right thing to do. The word "believed" makes it sound like he got into some trouble for dispersing those coins.
Did he open for withdrawal of the ~6% again btw?

Source:
Quote from: #weex
<nsa_> Are you able to say where the available coins came from btw?
<kanoi> yes but he wont Tongue
<Ukyo> Kanoi is correct that this get's into issues where I have to tread very carefully. Those were paid out because I believed it was the right thing to do.
thy
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March 20, 2014, 09:53:37 PM
 #1280

What you say either don't make sense in relation to the fact that all users were allowed to withdraw 6.17% of there Weexchange balances, so possibly Ken Slaughter(that we know that SEC have been looking at) and Trade Fortress for example could have withdrawn funds then to.
Ukyo said he allowed the users to withdraw the ~6% because he believed it was the right thing to do. The word "believed" makes it sound like he got into some trouble for dispersing those coins.
Did he open for withdrawal of the ~6% again btw?

Source:
Quote from: #weex
<nsa_> Are you able to say where the available coins came from btw?
<kanoi> yes but he wont Tongue
<Ukyo> Kanoi is correct that this get's into issues where I have to tread very carefully. Those were paid out because I believed it was the right thing to do.
I thought the withdrawal was still awaliable for those that haven't got there part of it yet, not sure thou.
Only 6.17% in total as far as i know thou so no second withdrawal(yet) of 6% or any other percentage and ukyo loan shareholder that requested a redeem yet havent(with a small exception, a few got some redeems the first days) got there coins and no interest has been payed after bitfunders closing, Ukyo owes around 2033btc to the shareholders in the loan as far as i know.

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