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Author Topic: [BitFunder] Moving Forward/Resolution Process  (Read 290742 times)
minerpart
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February 10, 2014, 06:47:26 PM
 #1101

It that is what happened (malleability attacks) both Ukyo and Danny Neobee are lieing because they have both said they are working on technical solutions that will lead to the return of the BTC.

I think Ukyo gambled the BTC away speculating on a fall in BTC/USD. Unfortunately for him price took off shortly after he sold everyone's BTC for FIAT. Only a return to sub $200 levels will allow him to buy all the missing BTC back.
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February 10, 2014, 06:51:50 PM
 #1102

As far as I know weexchange was using an old version of bitcoind and the weexclaims portal was rewritten using a newer bitcoind software. It's reasonable to rewrite it in order to prevent the same thing to happen with the 6+% withdraws.

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February 10, 2014, 08:06:31 PM
 #1103

If the coins were stolen or missent then ukyo would prevent us from helping. If it turns out his silence kept us from solving this all... (dont know what to add)
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February 10, 2014, 08:24:38 PM
 #1104

If the coins were stolen or missent then ukyo would prevent us from helping. If it turns out his silence kept us from solving this all... (dont know what to add)
Yes indeed.
The "Sorry I gave your coins away by mistake" options doesn't reduce Liability either.
However, as you are suggesting, letting the owners of those coins (us) know the details would certainly help a lot more than hiding the details.

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February 10, 2014, 10:50:53 PM
 #1105

This thread... you guys are so masochistically obsessive.

Do really need to fill the internet with hot air, recycled over and over?

Say something new, do something new, or stop talking please.

Some of us are owed hundreds of thousands of dollars. Do you expect us to just sit there and wait for our coins to simply reappear magically?
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February 10, 2014, 10:53:56 PM
 #1106

This thread... you guys are so masochistically obsessive.

Do really need to fill the internet with hot air, recycled over and over?

Say something new, do something new, or stop talking please.

Some of us are owed hundreds of thousands of dollars. Do you expect us to just sit there and wait for our coins to simply reappear magically?

No, but that's also not what I suggested.
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February 10, 2014, 10:57:22 PM
 #1107

This thread... you guys are so masochistically obsessive.

Do really need to fill the internet with hot air, recycled over and over?

Say something new, do something new, or stop talking please.

Some of us are owed hundreds of thousands of dollars. Do you expect us to just sit there and wait for our coins to simply reappear magically?

No, but that's also not what I suggested.

I think we are out of new ideas. And since there has been 0 information from Ukyo in at least a month, there is nothing new to talk about. People are frustrated and angry, and I think it is good that they are. We deserve more information than we have been getting.
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February 10, 2014, 11:03:23 PM
 #1108

No, but that's also not what I suggested.
Well, even though, I think you're wrong. Keeping those threads alive with useless bumps have at least 2 advantages:
- they let newcomers know that they should not trust anyone, especially people with imposing +trust ratings
- they let newcomers know that they should not deposit on weex (remember deposits were still allowed on coinlenders/inputs weeks after he admited being a scammer? Remember that people could deposit on weex AFTER the bankruptcy announcement?)

Actually, there should be a mod-maintained sub with a single post for every known big scam, and a sticky one to reference them all.
It's such a mess that it takes too much effort to sort out, now.

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February 10, 2014, 11:47:06 PM
 #1109

No, but that's also not what I suggested.
Well, even though, I think you're wrong. Keeping those threads alive with useless bumps have at least 2 advantages:
- they let newcomers know that they should not trust anyone, especially people with imposing +trust ratings
- they let newcomers know that they should not deposit on weex (remember deposits were still allowed on coinlenders/inputs weeks after he admited being a scammer? Remember that people could deposit on weex AFTER the bankruptcy announcement?)

Actually, there should be a mod-maintained sub with a single post for every known big scam, and a sticky one to reference them all.
It's such a mess that it takes too much effort to sort out, now.
I think the original poster couldnt keep up!..... https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=83794.msg923921#msg923921
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February 10, 2014, 11:48:17 PM
 #1110

This thread... you guys are so masochistically obsessive.

Do really need to fill the internet with hot air, recycled over and over?

Say something new, do something new, or stop talking please.

Some of us are owed hundreds of thousands of dollars. Do you expect us to just sit there and wait for our coins to simply reappear magically?

No, but that's also not what I suggested.
You know more than most TAT. Indulge us.
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February 11, 2014, 03:42:15 AM
 #1111

If WeExchange lost money because it was unable to handle transaction malleability, then this would certainly leave a trace in the blockchain.

An attacker would request a withdrawal of amount X to address Y, send a modified transaction to an affiliated miner, and then open a support ticket complaining about the withdrawal not being processed.
If the attack was successful, WeExchange would issue a new transaction of the same amount X to the same address Y, leaving a trace in the blockchain.

Of course the attacker could also request cancellation of the withdrawal; however, there would be no incentive to do so because the attacker would want to quickly take the money and run.

Everyone can check WeExchange's transaction records and convince themselves about the (un)likelihood of this scenario...


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February 11, 2014, 05:58:10 AM
 #1112

I doubt this is what happened (a problem do to do with transaction malleability). It's possible, but doesn't add up for me. Mainly because I don't see why Ukyo would keep this such a secret for months. (And then seemingly disappear).  If the coins were stolen he would be less legally liable at best, and at worst, he'd at least get some understanding from the community.

If you look at his behaviour, when the crisis occurred, how he dealt with it, how he accepted deposits knowing he couldn't pay them back, what's going on with his loans, and the threads showing him using some users' deposits to pay for others, and now most recently, disappearing incognito, I believe the most likely thing that happened was that he was treating peoples' deposits as his own personal investment wallet, gambled, and lost.

Of course this all guesswork.

If you are going to pursue legal action I just suggest you do it sooner, rather than later. I don't think anyone will get their money back from this, but at least it would be good to know what happened, and if Ukyo did something criminal, he should be punished. At the least it'd be nice to see him have to go bankrupt.

I would bet though that if there is no prosecution or lawsuit, he'll never tell any of us what happened. He's given no indication that he intends to. Unless he's sued all we'll ever probably know is that 'the coins are gone'. We've made no progress at all in what, the last 45-60 days? In fact, we are hearing progressively less.

My sincere condolences to those owed more than 10 btc. I'm royally pissed at losing 1 btc, I can't imagine what state I'd be in if I had a significant amount of money on the line.
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February 11, 2014, 07:33:44 AM
 #1113

This means that on 11th of August 2013, more than half of WeExchange's funds were transferred into some other wallet, where they became intermixed with funds that probably did not origin from WeExchange.

Sigh! It looks like no one dares to say the obvious conclusions. So, I'll do that for you:

  • Ukyo sent most of WeExchange's funds knowingly to a third party.
  • The WeExchange wallet was fractional since at least August 2013.

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February 11, 2014, 09:17:23 AM
 #1114

This means that on 11th of August 2013, more than half of WeExchange's funds were transferred into some other wallet, where they became intermixed with funds that probably did not origin from WeExchange.

Sigh! It looks like no one dares to say the obvious conclusions. So, I'll do that for you:

  • Ukyo sent most of WeExchange's funds knowingly to a third party.
  • The WeExchange wallet was fractional since at least August 2013.
Was this an attempt to obviate moves by an authority? Would have been the time that notifications were sent out to exchanges, im guessing.

Also, Jon was advertising for a dev (cant remember the precise date). Was that post filled? Anyone know who?
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February 11, 2014, 11:24:50 AM
 #1115

This thread is so full of wishful thinking. How sad...  Undecided

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February 11, 2014, 04:55:43 PM
 #1116

This thread is so full of wishful thinking. How sad...  Undecided

I know what you mean. It's like this:



However, not everyone is in denial. More and more are getting out.

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February 12, 2014, 01:45:07 AM
 #1117

Just noticed that I made backups of https://bitfunder.com/assetlist.json every few hours between 14.10.2013 17:30 and 07.12.2013 00:07. After that date the list was no longer available.

In case you ever want to check specific entries -> PM. Wink

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February 12, 2014, 08:21:54 AM
 #1118

Just noticed that I made backups of https://bitfunder.com/assetlist.json every few hours between 14.10.2013 17:30 and 07.12.2013 00:07. After that date the list was no longer available.

In case you ever want to check specific entries -> PM. Wink

https://btct.co/history-bitfunder/

I'm not a Coinbase fan -- I placed a buy order, they took the funds out of my account, then a week later the price went up and they canceled the buy and closed my account.  You've been warned.  Use a different exchange.
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February 12, 2014, 04:21:47 PM
 #1119

Jon apparently posted on IRC about 9 hours ago. Nothing new but still better than pure silence.
Code: (#bitfunder)
<imsaguy> still stuck at 6%?
<Ukyo> still stuck at 6% -_-
<Ukyo> Not in hiding
<Ukyo> Things have been hectic trying to make arrangements
<QG> HI HOOOOOOOOOO Silver..
<QG> hello Ukyo
<Ukyo> hey
<Graet> hi
<Graet> :)
<whitty> Ukyo said something
* whitty runs off to post it on teh forums
<whitty> oh wait no, I have other shit to do...
<Ukyo> lol
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February 12, 2014, 06:00:27 PM
 #1120

I spoke to him on Skype earlier. Things are progressing but my guess is it'll be a fair while yet unfortunately. As has been said before, some things are out of his hands and they impact the time period involved. Don't ask me how long or if it will work out because I don't know. As long as I feel there is progress then I'll wait.


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