Meanwhile in Ukraine... Revolution.

[Nemo1024]

French Navy’s destroyer Dupleix won’t enter Black Sea in 2 days – Russia’s ministry

The French Navy destroyer, Dupleix, is unlikely to enter the Black Sea during the next two days, the Russian Defense Ministry said on Tuesday. The French anti-submarine frigate was expected to join the country’s vessels in the Black Sea on Monday. However, the French military’s plans changed for some reason, and the ship is still in Limassol, Cyprus, a source in the Russian ministry told ITAR-TASS. Meanwhile, US destroyer USS Donald Cook and French surveillance ship, Dupuy de Lome, which entered the Black Sea on April 10, are now docked at the Romanian port of Constantsa. The French rescue ship, FS Alize, which has been in the Black Sea since March 26, has now left, the source said.

I wonder why..?

[Balthazar]

http://rt.com/news/yatsenyuk-flag-switzerland-denmark-400/

Erich 15.04.2014 01:55
Lets hope they can run a country better than pick a flag. This whole thing is almost as stupid as clinton and her red reset button.

Ilya Yagolnikov 15.04.2014 02:02
Lol...I bet they couldn't find a Swiss flag and used a Danish one hoping nobody would notice or care! Just like they hoped nobody would notice all the Nazi thugs they used to topple the legitamate government...great job stupids!

dracorex 14.04.2014 22:08

For those who actually know something about the world, this is news. For you, you'd probably be better off watching Cbeebies, it might suit your level more.

Anyway, this shows a large lack of competency, if they do not even know the flags of not so distant countries. This is really something that everyone gets taught in geography in primary school. It just further demonstrates that the Ukrainian coup-imposed "government" is a total joke and have no idea how to run a country.

 

[Nemo1024]

Erich 15.04.2014 01:55
Lets hope they can run a country better than pick a flag. This whole thing is almost as stupid as clinton and her red reset button.

She was at least right in picking the word, considering her future plans - not "reset" (пepeзaгpyзкa), but "overload" (пepeгpyзкa) 

[Bit_Happy]

Have all Americans left the area now?
We have no business being there.

[dogechode]

So am I correct in assuming from the content of the thread so far, that most of the users here support Russia's actions and believe that the new Ukrainian government is illegitimate/illegal?

I'm a little surprised that there aren't more people expressing the opposite point... do you really all think it's that black and white?

[Nemo1024]

The leader of the resistance in Kramatorsk reported that the shooting at the airport was done by Blackwater, when a few resistance members came forth unarmed to conduct negotiations. but we are in the fog of war now, do wait for any further news. Oh, and there was no word of evacuating that closed off floor of CIA Shu'ulathoi (Advisors) in Kiev.

[hdbuck]

So am I correct in assuming from the content of the thread so far, that most of the users here support Russia's actions and believe that the new Ukrainian government is illegitimate/illegal?

I'm a little surprised that there aren't more people expressing the opposite point... do you really all think it's that black and white?

thats the whole point. its not.

[Nemo1024]

So am I correct in assuming from the content of the thread so far, that most of the users here support Russia's actions and believe that the new Ukrainian government is illegitimate/illegal?

I'm a little surprised that there aren't more people expressing the opposite point... do you really all think it's that black and white?

You are partially wrong there.

I don't support Russian inaction. Russia should have sent in peacekeeping troops long ago, and Yanukovich could have made an official request for it. He is the legitimate president of Ukraine. Those sitting in Kiev are traitors.

Russia should not let South-East Ukraine become another Kosovo.

But I do support ethnic Russian Ukrainians, who demand to be heard in the South-East of Ukraine, asking for federalisation and the right to use their language.

It's never black and white, but there are limits, when brown enters the picture.

USA called Kiev coup government's unconstitutional actions in South-East of Ukraine, which resulted in loss of life, for "balanced".
http://ria.ru/world/20140415/1004053685.html

Some people ask, if Yanukovich conducted a similar operation in Lvov, would USA also call it "balanced". They flipped when he didn't use Berkut in Kiev, failing to respond to provocations.

Putin called on UN to condemn Kiev's military operation:
http://ria.ru/world/20140415/1004053318.html

[Ebrelus]

THE SAME Russian soldiers who were taking part in assault on Georgia NOW ARE IDENTIFIED IN Ukraine disintegrating it with russian GRU and FSB special services, postKGB forces. Shame on you imperialistic Russians.

Posting only russian sources won't make this dirty agression any less dirtier.

You don't remember time when there were no Russians in Ukraine at al? And who made East Ukraine Ukrainians russian speakers? That's russian way of doing things right? Invasion and russification. Over and over, no matter what historic time it is.
Ukraine is not Russia, as Belarus and any other indeprendent slavic state of Europe. You want Poland to remind you who's Królewiec is? You will later after Crimea and Ukraine call Kosovo serbian when you act as Albanians there?

Now if any citizen of Ukraine isn't happy of living in Ukraine he has free choice to change citizenship into russian and leave. Occupation of Crimea isn't enough for you? You want to disintegrate whole country? Maybe start a domestic war? Or maybe you prepair to a full scale attack like in Georgia when only support of few east-europe presidents in Tbilisi forces Putin to stop tanks in Osetia? You want economic destabilisation in your own country, win by not matter what costs? Are you the same as Soviet commies, bolshevics, as murderer Stalin , as murderer Hitler as murderer Lenin?

I know what is black, white and grey about this whole situation and still there is only one country which becames new NaziLikeState in Europe (maybe pushing Israel into second on list). We don't want asian style state moving into Europe people. Don't think this will end without consequences and i'm not talking about USYankees or EUGeys. You declared war to all East Europe. Actually we should thank you for waking us up. Now Intermarium between EU and Ruassia is possible to be created. God job! 

[Nemo1024]

THE SAME Russian soldiers who were taking part in assault on Georgia NOW ARE IDENTIFIED IN Ukraine disintegrating it with russian GRU and FSB special services, postKGB forces. Shame on you imperialistic Russians.

Your source?

Now if any citizen of Ukraine isn't happy of living in Ukraine he has free choice to change citizenship into russian and leave.

When that becomes mandatory for over 50% of the population, it has a special name: "Entnic cleansing". Latest example: Holocaust. If Jews didn't like it in Germany, they should have left. If Russians don't like it in Ukraine, they should leave. Or else it's gas camera.

So, you are advocating a new Holocaust?

You declared war to all East Europe. Actually we should thank you for waking us up. Now Intermarium between EU and Ruassia is possible to be created. God job! 

Declaring war by inaction, while watching as NATO ravages yet another country for slave labour. Hmmm... By your logic, Russia should have become peaceful and have just sent in troops.

[dogechode]

The holocaust examples are getting a little out of hand.

Whether or not the Ukrainians who are now running the government are "good" and "right" is something I do not know. But I do believe they would be much better served by integration with Europe, over integration with Russia, and it seems Russia has been trying to force the latter on them.

[Balthazar]

For Ebrelus and others.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/russian/international/2014/04/140415_ukraine_donbass_view.shtml

Interesting article about anti-maidan movement in Donetsk. It's written in russian, but I suppose that google translate will make it readable enough to understand something. And note that it's written and published by BBC.

[counter]

news has been rather quite hear about Ukraine so that tells me there is alot of shady business taking place on both sides I have no doubt.  I expect this summer to be very "hot" indeed..

[Nemo1024]

The holocaust examples are getting a little out of hand.

Maybe it's an extreme example, but it's born out of the speeches and actions of the current "government" in Kiev.

>Whether or not the Ukrainians who are now running the government are "good" and "right" is something I do not know. But I do believe they would be much better served by integration with Europe, over integration with Russia, and it seems Russia has been trying to force the latter on them.

Why not ask Ukrainians, then? The first demand they put forth was a referendum. Russia didn't ask for their integration. Ukraine has much larger trading volume with Russia, than with Ukraine. Russia offered condition-free monetary help and gas subsidies, Europe - promises of loans and austerity for a population that already lives at the brink of or below poverty level.
In any case, this is a moot point. Russia proposed to EU an three-way cooperation agreement that would benefit EU and protect Russian and Ukrainian trade interests. EU refused. The whole EU debate was just a smoke screen for what followed.


UN fails to mention growing nationalism and neo-nasizm in its report on human rights in Ukraine:
http://www.gazeta.ru/politics/news/2014/04/15/n_6085685.shtml

news has been rather quite hear about Ukraine so that tells me there is alot of shady business taking place on both sides I have no doubt.  I expect this summer to be very "hot" indeed..

I am noticing that too, also in Russian media. There are a few high-level blows between the bigwigs, bet very little of what is happening to the people. I wouldn't be surprised if the outcome of the conflict is predetermined.

[Kiki112]

It is sad, because Ukraine always seems to be stuck between two fighting side, Russia and Europe. It was same during World War 2, when they were stuck between Soviet Union and Germany.

In an economical prospective, it might be better for Ukraine if it joins the Russian-led customs union.

That's the way the USSR worked. Russia and Ukraine together accounted for more than 90% of the total population (and 99% of the productive population). Russia had infinite natural resources, which were shipped to the factories in Ukraine, where the Ukrainian manpower produced world class engineering products. At that time, both Russia and Ukraine were inter-dependent on each other. Russia bartered its oil, gas, timber and mineral ores for food grains and meat produced in Ukraine, Belarus and Moldovia. Now Russia is a net importer of food, while Ukraine is heavily dependent on oil and gas imports.

The reason why the USSR disintegrated is because the unproductive population (mostly Muslims in Uzbekistan and Azerbaijan) increased much faster as compared to the productive population. However, if Russia and Ukraine creates an union state which excludes parasites such as Uzbekistan and Tajikistan, the people on both sides would benefit from it. 

If Ukraine joins the EU, the government will be forced to take up austerity measures. This can include reducing the subsidies and pensions. It will adversely affect the lower middle class and the poor. However, the elite and the urban middle class will gain from new business opportunities. Also, the Ukrainian factories will be forced to adhere to the European standards, which would require new investment worth some $200 billion. No one is having that much money there. So there is a possibility that if Ukraine joins the EU, the Arabs and the Chinese will buy up 90% of Ukraine.

Some of your facts are wrong.

Republic   Population of Republic (000s) 1979   1989    % urban 1979   Titular nationality (1989)   Russian (1989)
Soviet Union   262,436   286,717   67   -   51.4
Russian SFSR   137,551   147,386   74   81.3   81.3
Ukrainian SSR   49,755   51,704   68   72.7   22.1

More like 60% of the population.
The Baltic countries were heavenly industrialized compared to Russia in %.
Their GDP was way higher than soviet Russia , in some cases more than 40%.

Also, Russia is one of the biggest wheat exporters in the world , with double the amount of Ukraine.

and 50x the territory

[bryant.coleman]

Why not ask Ukrainians, then? The first demand they put forth was a referendum. Russia didn't ask for their integration. Ukraine has much larger trading volume with Russia, than with Ukraine. Russia offered condition-free monetary help and gas subsidies, Europe - promises of loans and austerity for a population that already lives at the brink of or below poverty level. In any case, this is a moot point. Russia proposed to EU an three-way cooperation agreement that would benefit EU and protect Russian and Ukrainian trade interests. EU refused. The whole EU debate was just a smoke screen for what followed.

During the past 4 years, Russia spent almost $40 billion in gas subsidies and other grants to the Ukrainian state, without getting anything in return. May be it is time for the EU now to take lead to subsidize the non-productive industries of Ukraine. The EU leaders such as Merkel and Hollande knows about the cost involved, and that is why they are not very keen to join the US in its proxy war. It is the US which is pushing the EU on this issue. All Obama care is to get new military bases in Eastern Ukraine, so that he could station his missiles there.

[Balthazar]

In the meantime...

http://news.xinhuanet.com/english/china/2014-04/15/c_133264622.htm#

Just found on the mainpage here:

http://english.gov.cn/

[bryant.coleman]

http://voiceofrussia.com/news/2014_04_16/Armored-vehicles-of-Ukrainian-army-appear-in-Kramatorsk-media-8246/

Armoured vehicles with flags of Ukraine have appeared in the streets of Kramatorsk, Donetsk region. Some local residents are trying to hold up their movement. Several infantry fighting vehicles have entered Kramatorsk, Interfax informs with reference to the local media. They were blocked by a mini-bus. Two helicopters are flying over the city. In all, according to eyewitnesses, about 300 Ukrainian soldiers are staying in the city, the Agency says.

The Ukrainian troops haven't yet gained complete control of Kramatorsk, despite taking the airfield. If the news about the 6 defected APCs can be confirmed, then it is a complete failure for the Kiev regime.

[niothor]

Why not ask Ukrainians, then? The first demand they put forth was a referendum. Russia didn't ask for their integration. Ukraine has much larger trading volume with Russia, than with Ukraine. Russia offered condition-free monetary help and gas subsidies, Europe - promises of loans and austerity for a population that already lives at the brink of or below poverty level. In any case, this is a moot point. Russia proposed to EU an three-way cooperation agreement that would benefit EU and protect Russian and Ukrainian trade interests. EU refused. The whole EU debate was just a smoke screen for what followed.

During the past 4 years, Russia spent almost $40 billion in gas subsidies and other grants to the Ukrainian state, without getting anything in return. May be it is time for the EU now to take lead to subsidize the non-productive industries of Ukraine. The EU leaders such as Merkel and Hollande knows about the cost involved, and that is why they are not very keen to join the US in its proxy war. It is the US which is pushing the EU on this issue. All Obama care is to get new military bases in Eastern Ukraine, so that he could station his missiles there.

And those 5 bills the US and EU spent in 25 years were a problem .

[Nemo1024]

Why not ask Ukrainians, then? The first demand they put forth was a referendum. Russia didn't ask for their integration. Ukraine has much larger trading volume with Russia, than with Ukraine. Russia offered condition-free monetary help and gas subsidies, Europe - promises of loans and austerity for a population that already lives at the brink of or below poverty level. In any case, this is a moot point. Russia proposed to EU an three-way cooperation agreement that would benefit EU and protect Russian and Ukrainian trade interests. EU refused. The whole EU debate was just a smoke screen for what followed.

During the past 4 years, Russia spent almost $40 billion in gas subsidies and other grants to the Ukrainian state, without getting anything in return. May be it is time for the EU now to take lead to subsidize the non-productive industries of Ukraine. The EU leaders such as Merkel and Hollande knows about the cost involved, and that is why they are not very keen to join the US in its proxy war. It is the US which is pushing the EU on this issue. All Obama care is to get new military bases in Eastern Ukraine, so that he could station his missiles there.

And those 5 bills the US and EU spent in 25 years were a problem .

Well, yes. The US was expecting a NATO base and a goods dump site for EU in return.