Meanwhile in Ukraine... Revolution.

[Nemo1024]

Sanctions on autopilot:

Five more European countries have joined the row:
Montenegro, Albania, Iceland, Norway and Lichtenstein. All renowned world powers.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/russian/rolling_news/2014/05/140526_rn_eu_sanctions_new_countries.shtml

Yet none so far has condemned the rigged elections in Ukraine.


More double standards on the Western part:
Yanukovich allegedly ordered Berkut to disperse Maidan with force. It was later proven to be wrong, yet the West cried out and gave green light to displace Yanukovich.

Valtsman (aka Poroshenko) ordered to intensify the massacre of civilians in the South-East, and the West hails it as the triumph of democracy.

Fresh images:



Up to 100 killed in Kiev military op, Donetsk E. Ukraine - anti-govt forces
http://rt.com/news/161592-donetsk-truck-grenade-killed/


Terrorist Kolomojskij, asked everyone to talk to him only in Ukrainian (as opposed to Hebrew, I presume):
http://lenta.ru/news/2014/05/27/mova/
According to this item, he started to expand his dictionary, learns pronunciation of Ukrainian words and their meaning.

So, in other words, he suddenly started to learn Ukrainian. Hopes to please the Right Sector?


New Op-Edge at RT:
Europe and Ukraine: A tale of two elections
http://rt.com/op-edge/161664-elections-in-eu-ukraine/

Few in Europe would have noticed how this process is so far away from “democracy” –instead enshrining intolerance and an ideology of blind confrontation, as represented by this “debate” in Kiev driven by a clueless Yale historian.

Key facts that should be understaood are how the West ignored the Odessa massacre, as well as the detention of Russian journalists; and how the West dismissed the aspirations of eastern and southern Ukrainians as the work of “pro-Russians” or “terrorists.” These people simply became objects of repression - fully supervised by the West, with now the whole regime change theatre of the absurd in Kiev legitimized through an election charade.

Another long (sorry) relevant quote from the Op-Edge:

There’s no evidence Right Sector and Svoboda will cease to be crypto-fascist, racist and intolerant just because Poroshenko – the King of Ukrainian Chocolate – is now the president. By the way, his margin for maneuver is slim, as his own markets – not to mention some of his factories – are in Russia. Heavy industry and the weapons industry in eastern Ukraine depend on Russian demand. It would take at least a whopping $276 billion for the West to “stabilize” eastern Ukraine. The notion of the EU “saving” Ukraine is D.O.A.

Moscow, once again, just needs to do what it is doing: nothing. And make sure there will be no economic or political help unless a federalized – and Finlandized - Ukraine with strong regions sees the light of day.

Even the Brookings Institution has reluctantly been forced to admit that the US neo-con gambit has failed miserably; there’s no Ukraine without Russian help.

So it’s up to the Chocolate King to prove himself a leader of all Ukrainians, and only then will he have a shot at entente cordiale with – and even help from - Moscow.

Signs so far are mixed. Poroshenko said Ukraine could “possibly” become an EU member state by 2025 (it won’t happen). He ruled out entering NATO (wise move). He rejects federalization (dumb move). He believes that with a strong economy Crimea would want to be back (wishful thinking). Still, he believes in reaching a compromise with Moscow (that’s what Moscow always wanted, even before regime change).

[bryant.coleman]

Reinforcements from Lugansk are arriving at Donetsk. This is just a beginning.

Ukraine unrest: Dozens die as Donetsk airport 'retaken'

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-27584718

[blablahblah]

Reinforcements from Lugansk are arriving at Donetsk. This is just a beginning.

Ukraine unrest: Dozens die as Donetsk airport 'retaken'

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-27584718

I understand that you guys are trying to provide balance to a mostly 'Western' corner of the Internet, but -- just like many conspiracy theories -- your one doesn't make sense.

Please explain why a newly elected president would want to destabilise his own country?

Creating friction between nationalist groups, as has been occurring in the Ukraine, does not seem like a tactic that any government would want to use on itself, unless it's suicidal. It makes far more sense that some kind of organised opposition has been giving the orders. But who? And when did it all start?

Rather than blaming the Americans for some elaborate scheme (yes, I know it's satisfying), we should use Occam's Razor and cut away the crap to find the simplest answer. When it became clear that Ukraine would not be joining the Eurasian Economic Union, it was an embarrassing and costly defeat for Putin. So when you mix emotional pride and financial pressure, you find that Moscow is behind the unrest.

[Nemo1024]

Please explain why a newly elected president would want to destabilise his own country?

Creating friction between nationalist groups, as has been occurring in the Ukraine, does not seem like a tactic that any government would want to use on itself, unless it's suicidal. It makes far more sense that some kind of organised opposition has been giving the orders. But who? And when did it all start?

Rather than blaming the Americans for some elaborate scheme (yes, I know it's satisfying), we should use Occam's Razor and cut away the crap to find the simplest answer. When it became clear that Ukraine would not be joining the Eurasian Economic Union, it was an embarrassing and costly defeat for Putin. So when you mix emotional pride and financial pressure, you find that Moscow is behind the unrest.

1. The newly selected resident, you mean.
You can start here:
http://rt.com/news/161276-ukraine-election-useful-facts/
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=624416.0
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=624416.msg6945608#msg6945608

It also helps reading the previous posts. The whole election was a farce, with half-Ukraine not voting, all candidates that somehow were positive to federalisation of the Russian-Speaking half of the population being eliminated from the run, often violently.
And the statement from Valtsman (Poroshenko), that he didn't receive any information that the operation in the South-East should be stopped. It sounded like he didn't get any instructions to that end.
He really does not have any power as per the revised constitution or any power base in the parliament, so he will be doing as he is told.
Besides, he needs to recapture the South-East, as all his factories are there.

Also, Valtsman (Poroshenko) got approximately 6 million votes. With the population of 35.5 million people that could vote, it constitutes 17% of the population voted for him. Majority?

2. You are turning it upside down. The whole thing started when it became clear that Ukraine would not be joining EU. Russia offered EU and Ukraine a three-way agreement that EU refused, after which Ukraine had to decide, whether to ditch its own economy, as most of Ukraine's export went to Russia and become a dumping ground for EU, or whether to keep the status quo. The latter option was taken, which didn't suite the West.

[blablahblah]

2. You are turning it upside down. The whole thing started when it became clear that Ukraine would not be joining EU. Russia offered EU and Ukraine a three-way agreement that EU refused, after which Ukraine had to decide, whether to ditch its own economy, as most of Ukraine's export went to Russia and become a dumping ground for EU, or whether to keep the status quo. The latter option was taken, which didn't suite the West.

No, you've got it upside down and what you're saying doesn't make economic sense.

Firstly, the Ukraine is far too poor to be a dumping ground for EU products. They can't afford to buy anything, except for maybe a few agricultural products like pork after Russia imposed sanctions on Poland.

The Ukraine is not a gateway to Russia either, they would never make much money by selling EU products to Russia. Businesses are always trying to pressure their governments to impose tariffs or somehow reduce the amount of competition from neighbouring countries. That's normal. The difference with Russia is that Putin seems more interested in being popular rather than economically sensible, so he keeps Russia insulated from unwanted competition.

"Ditch its own economy" -- that's a ridiculous claim, completely twisting around Russia's threats to punish the Ukraine with sanctions if they didn't make the right "choice". And I suppose women ask to be raped if they don't want sex? Apart from that, the smart thing for any economy is to go where there is the most potential. Slightly better integration with Russia would just be a minor optimisation, compared to the potential of completely new industries from the west.

If you look at examples of other, former USSR puppet states such as Poland and East Germany, what would actually happen is that the west would 'dump' new jobs and infrastructure into the Ukraine. In return, the richer western countries would get cheap labour for a few years until it got too expensive.

[Rassah]

Because, I believe that removing a democratically elected government and replacing it with some neo-Nazis does not augur well for the future of global democracy.

I need to remind people, AGAIN, that Hitler was democratically elected.

By the way, a public opinion poll conducted from 25 February to 4 March 2014 by the Ukrainian Center for Social and Marketing Research shows that, in the presidential election scheduled for May 25,

only 2.5% of respondents say they will vote for Tyagnibok of “Svoboda”; and only 1.6% will  for Yarosh of “Pravyy sektor” (Right Sector), the two far-right Ukrainian parties.

Which is what I have been saying all along: the whole "OMGF THE NAZIS!!!!" bullshit is just MASSIVE propaganda staged by Russia to scare eastern ukrainians into a fighting frenzy.

Ukraine bans RT crew from covering presidential election. Lol... not entirely unexpected. Who wants foreign media to cover a sham election?

That's not exactly a "foreign media" ban. Just a single specific previously-busted-for-propaganda ban. Your bias and propaganda is so blatant and blinding it's making me sick   Like this for instance:

Andrei Mironov, the journalist killed by Right Sector yesterday...

You say killed by right sector, every other news media in the world says "mortar shell fired by Ukrainian government troops fighting pro-Russian insurgents." Not only are Ukrainian government troops not in any way a Right Sector militia, a mortar isn't exactly a precise weapon.

or this

Doesn't matter that half the people didn't voted at all.

International observers applaud Ukraine election
http://news.yahoo.com/international-observers-applaud-ukraine-election-114033297.html

Yeah, because the actual people doing all the fighting and killing (hint, not Right Sector) forced polls to close as gunpoint and destroyed and burned election materials. Yet only one person on this thread even mentioned that fact. I wonder what those pro-Russian violent murdering thugs were they afraid of? At most it would have shown that their region rejects the Kiev government and supports whoever wants them to split off. Or would it?

Yanukovich allegedly ordered Berkut to disperse Maidan with force. It was later proven to be wrong...

ROFL! OMFG WTF?! So those heavily armed and armored Berkup forces with the riot shields were just going to Maidan to have a picnic? Are you fucking nuts?


You guys should consider getting a job with these guys https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z3ltHXUkkG4 At first I thought you were just misinformed, or too deeply brainwashed by Russian propaganda, but it's blatantly obvious that you are just godamn fucking morons! I'm glad this thread exists to expose your propaganda and bullshit for what it is.

[Nemo1024]

Rassah : I need to remind people, AGAIN, that Hitler was democratically elected.

And so is now Valtsman (Poroshenko).

only 2.5% of respondents say they will vote for Tyagnibok of “Svoboda”; and only 1.6% will  for Yarosh of “Pravyy sektor” (Right Sector), the two far-right Ukrainian parties.

Exactly. They don't have the popular support, yet, it's them who are calling the shots. Valtsman is more or less a puppet.

Ukraine bans RT crew from covering presidential election. Lol... not entirely unexpected. Who wants foreign media to cover a sham election?

That's not exactly a "foreign media" ban. Just a single specific previously-busted-for-propaganda ban.

Check your facts. The bans/journalist deportations touched ALL Russian news channels.

Oh, well, I know you do not want to see even the most glaring facts. 

[Balthazar]

Rassah : I need to remind people, AGAIN, that Hitler was democratically elected.

Hitler have used a blackmailing against Paul von Hindenburg and his administration to get a position of reich chancellor, in exchange for forgetting about tax evasion. But even after that his party was unable to reach a majority, that's why he removed all competitors before the next elections. Later in 1934 he illegally proclaimed himself as a reich president, even without performing any elections. So stop feeding us with propaganda, please, he wasn't democratically elected.

[bryant.coleman]

Here are those Ukrainain soldiers and Right Sector militants who are preparing to exterminate the citizens of Slavyansk and other cities in the Donetsk and the Lugansk oblasts.

[stompix]

Here are those Ukrainain soldiers and Right Sector militants who are preparing to exterminate the citizens of Slavyansk and other cities in the Donetsk and the Lugansk oblasts.

Pretty sure that the right sector militants or the Nazis are letting civilians get close to those launchers and take photos of it.

Just like the dead child in the bombardments that later reveled to be a victim in 2011 , I'm pretty sure this picture will be debunked also.

[Nemo1024]

What's hard to debunk, are the videos of residential houses with half-demolished walls and burnt out flats.

As for Ukrainian army pics, not all soldiers there are happy with what is happening. And many of them have cameraphones


Former Georgian minister and businessman Kaha Bendukidze is appointed as presidential advisor in Ukraine:
http://lenta.ru/news/2014/05/28/advisor/

[bryant.coleman]

Seems like Ukrainian soldiers from the central province of Poltava have also decided they will not obey the orders from Kiev junta and don’t want to fight in Eastern Ukraine.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sX2s3hwOVis

(Officer is scaring the soldiers with court charges, because they don't wish to fight their own people and the awful conditions.)

[Nemo1024]

Poroshenko asked to have some time to think before signing of association agreement with EU:
http://top.rbc.ru/politics/28/05/2014/926930.shtml

"Have some time to think" can be interpreted as "postpone". Wasn't it one of the reasons why Yanukovich was displaced in the first place..?


Yatsenjuk asks Putin to close Russian-Ukrainian border "to prevent entry of Russian soldiers on Ukrainian territory":
http://www.gazeta.ru/politics/news/2014/05/28/n_6189961.shtml

[bryant.coleman]

OK... now we have the first confirmed foreign interference in Ukraine.

CC-130J Hercules aircraft assists the Canadian Armed Forces Open Skies observation flight over Ukraine.

[Nemo1024]

Obama boasts in success of international isolation of Russia:
http://www.interfax.ru/world/378493
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/05/28/obama-west-point-speech_n_5404181.html


French Frigate Surcouf entered Black Sea this evening:
http://itar-tass.com/mezhdunarodnaya-panorama/1223123?utm_medium=rss20


Now Poroshenko promises to sign the EU association agreement after the inauguration:
http://top.rbc.ru/politics/28/05/2014/926936.shtml

[bryant.coleman]

Donetsk miners march at pro-Russian rally:



A large "Battalion Vostok" convoy moves in the Donetsk oblast. Look at the last picture in the collage.  Kolomoyskyi won't be very happy.

[Rassah]

Rassah : I need to remind people, AGAIN, that Hitler was democratically elected.

And so is now Valtsman (Poroshenko).

Why is it significant that he has more than one name? I never understood what the point was. It's like people using Barry Sotoero for Barack Obama... Who cares?

only 2.5% of respondents say they will vote for Tyagnibok of “Svoboda”; and only 1.6% will  for Yarosh of “Pravyy sektor” (Right Sector), the two far-right Ukrainian parties.

Exactly. They don't have the popular support, yet, it's them who are calling the shots. Valtsman is more or less a puppet.

Sure he's a puppet. All heads of state answer to someone. Why do you think he's a puppet of the group tat has less than 2% of the popular support? If anything, he's the puppet of the Batkivshchyna party. Or do you still believe in the Russian fairy tales about fascists controlling Ukraine?

Ukraine bans RT crew from covering presidential election. Lol... not entirely unexpected. Who wants foreign media to cover a sham election?

That's not exactly a "foreign media" ban. Just a single specific previously-busted-for-propaganda ban.

Check your facts. The bans/journalist deportations touched ALL Russian news channels.

Yes, Russia. Not "foreign media," as Germany, Italy, France, Poland, USA, and others could still come in. Only Russia. You know, the country that Ukraine is practically at war with which was in large part Russian propaganda's fault in the first place. It'd be like yuo morons complaining about Poland banning Nazi Germany reporters coming in to do a news report on the success of German invasion.

[Rassah]

Rassah : I need to remind people, AGAIN, that Hitler was democratically elected.

Hitler ... illegally proclaimed himself as a reich president, even without performing any elections.

Yeah, that's kinda what Yanukovich was going for, and why he got kicked out.

[Rassah]

Here are those Ukrainain soldiers and Right Sector militants who are preparing to exterminate the citizens of Slavyansk and other cities in the Donetsk and the Lugansk oblasts.

Care to point out which ones are Right Sector? I don't see any identifying marks. Or is anyone who is fighting against Russian invaders and pro-Russan criminals Right Sector now? If US was to come in and you had pictures of US troops, in US uniforms with US flags, would you say "Here is Right Sector" too?  

[Rassah]

Former Georgian minister and businessman Kaha Bendukidze is appointed as presidential advisor in Ukraine:
http://lenta.ru/news/2014/05/28/advisor/

Quote from Wikipedia:
"Bendukidze does not belong to Putin's circle of friends and he understood sooner than everyone else that everything would be taken away from him..."  
"He is known as a committed libertarian[1] and strong supporter of market economy, deregulation and privatization"

Sounds like a great choice! Maybe with him Ukraine will finally start moving away from Russian-style socialism, towards a more open and wealthier market economy.