[ANN][CLAM] CLAMs, Proof-Of-Chain, Proof-Of-Working-Stake, a.k.a. "Clamcoin"

[Jbanna]

No, it's like this:

The bankroll is 90k, you deposit 100 and say "I have 9900 locally and want to invest the whole 10k with you". That makes the bankroll 100k in total, and you are 10% of it. You risk up to 0.5% of your total investment per roll, ie. 50 CLAMs. You get 10% of all losing bets, and lose 10% of all winning bets. If the site makes a net loss of 1000, you suffer 100 of that loss, and your actual deposit is all gone. You get divested at that point, and have lost your 100.

I can't tell, and don't care if you really have 9900 locally or not. You were risking up to 50 CLAMs per roll. If you only really had the 100 you deposited, then that's really risky behaviour. But it's only risky for you, not for JD. Once it's gone, you're divested.

But if you really DO have 10k CLAMs, it would make sense to send just 100 of it to JD and just tell it about the other 9900 you hold locally. Then your counterparty risk is vastly reduced, since only you have control of the majority of your coins. And the centralisation issue is moot, since 99% of your coins are no longer in the JD wallet.

This is absolutely brilliant and revolutionary. Margin investment on gambling dice? holy shit. Doog, I greatly hope you go through with this implementation  

Other dice sites already had this option that lower the risk of losing all your coins in case of the site disappearing.

damn.. i'm outta the loop then

[pawel7777]

New service to add to the OP please:

https://fortunejack.com/

They now accept CLAM.

(I have not made a deposit/withdraw yet, but plan to do so after Christmas.)

They are a Bitcoin Foundation member and the website is fully licensed by Law of Saint Kitts and Nevis, owned and operated by the "Nexus Group Enterprises", LLC.

Great, one more good website is accepting CLAM.

This will certainly attract more people to start using CLAM and make this coin even stronger. 

Not only they accept CLAM, but they also launched Coin Swap service, that means you can trade CLAM for other coins.

CLAM & Coin Exchange service have been officially added to our website. Good luck playing and let us know if you will have any questions

[seedtrue]

New service to add to the OP please:

https://fortunejack.com/

They now accept CLAM.

(I have not made a deposit/withdraw yet, but plan to do so after Christmas.)

They are a Bitcoin Foundation member and the website is fully licensed by Law of Saint Kitts and Nevis, owned and operated by the "Nexus Group Enterprises", LLC.

this is very good news.

[SuperClam]

Announcement and link concerning FortuneJack added to the OP post.

The service appears to be legitimate and have a history/user base.

We rely on user reviews of services to verify addition to the OP post, and look forward to hearing about your experiences.

[dooglus]

Announcement and link concerning FortuneJack added to the OP post.

The service appears to be legitimate and have a history/user base.

We rely on user reviews of services to verify addition to the OP post, and look forward to hearing about your experiences.

I just tried it. I was able to make an account, and found the dice game.

When I clicked on 'my bets', I got a spinning circle of dots that never stopped spinning:



When I hit reload I got this:



I guess they're having some problems at the moment.

[FortuneJack]

Announcement and link concerning FortuneJack added to the OP post.

The service appears to be legitimate and have a history/user base.

We rely on user reviews of services to verify addition to the OP post, and look forward to hearing about your experiences.

I just tried it. I was able to make an account, and found the dice game.

When I clicked on 'my bets', I got a spinning circle of dots that never stopped spinning:



When I hit reload I got this:



I guess they're having some problems at the moment.

Hi,

There was a minor problem, it is solved now.

[lumeire]

ForttuuneJack loooks cool. 

[J. J. Phillips]

I wrote some python code to simulate what might happen with different coinage possibilities.

https://privatepaste.com/ae9dfdbb6c

It starts with 69917 txs staking, 75% of which are "JD" and are distributed with values based on the stats published by dooglus a couple of days ago. The remaining 25% are "Not JD" and have a similar distribution of value. It starts assuming the block count is 69917 and every tx is marked with which block it appeared, chosen at random.

The code is slow. I ran it with 5 different coin age algorithms for 1500 "ticks" of a clock. This takes about 5 minutes but it corresponds to what would be a few hours of really staking. I'll give the results below, but they really should be run for much longer to get more reliable numbers. So far it doesn't seem like there is any difference between the algorithms. In every case JD stakes about 80% and there in about 4% of cases Not JD could have staked but got orphaned.

Each coinage function assumes coins mature after 510 blocks. After that the age is either (1) constant [like clams is now], (2) depends on the log of age (i.e., how many blocks old it is), (3) depends on the square root of the age, (4) depends linearly on the age, (5) depends on the square of the age.

(1) Constant, like now:

clamsim.sim(1500,clamsim.coinage_const_mature510)

Total blocks: 270
JD would stake: 218 -- 80.7407407407%
Not JD would stake: 52 -- 19.2592592593%
Not JD would get orphaned: 13 -- 4.81481481481%

(2) Log age:

clamsim.sim(1500,clamsim.coinage_log_mature510)

Total blocks: 368
JD would stake: 295 -- 80.1630434783%
Not JD would stake: 73 -- 19.8369565217%
Not JD would get orphaned: 13 -- 3.53260869565%

(3) Square root of age:

clamsim.sim(1500,clamsim.coinage_sqrt_mature510)

Total blocks: 389
JD would stake: 310 -- 79.6915167095%
Not JD would stake: 79 -- 20.3084832905%
Not JD would get orphaned: 13 -- 3.34190231362%

(4) Linear:

clamsim.sim(1500,clamsim.coinage_linear_mature510)

Total blocks: 732
JD would stake: 594 -- 81.1475409836%
Not JD would stake: 138 -- 18.8524590164%
Not JD would get orphaned: 31 -- 4.2349726776%

(5) Square of age:

clamsim.sim(1500,clamsim.coinage_square_mature510)

Total blocks: 779
JD would stake: 633 -- 81.2580231065%
Not JD would stake: 146 -- 18.7419768935%
Not JD would get orphaned: 33 -- 4.23620025674%

If someone wants, I'll run one or two of these (or some other coinage algorithm) overnight to get better numbers.

[dooglus]

There was a minor problem, it is solved now.

Nice.

My other problem is that I don't see a way of verifying my dice rolls without doing a lot of work.

Do you really change two seeds every roll? And if so, do I have to make a note of the hash and change my client seed before every single roll to make sure the game is fair? That doesn't seem like something anyone is going to bother with.

Take a look at how Just-Dice does it - players only need to make a note of a single server seed hash because the same server seed is used for every roll until they ask for it to be changed. Using a similar scheme on your site would make it practical for players to really check out the game's provable fairness.

[BayAreaCoins]

So far two Charities now accept CLAM. I personally believe that both of these are OP worthy!  

______________________________

The widely known SeansOutpost now has a CLAM address that we can all donate to.  

x9RFmWHjGXDgUqpXz6jTxp6XVHFcjkfjQb

Proof of ownership:

12/26/2014
Just-dice troll box
22:14:09 (412848) <SeansOutpost> KK, Sean's Outpost CLAM address is... [x9RFmWHj]

(Seans will not be able to add the address publicly until they all vote it at a board meeting. Adding it to the OP will be one of the only ways ppl can find it.)

______________________________

Dabs has been a member of the Bitcoin community for some time and I've always been personally impressed with him + he just comes off as a fuck of a guy.  He runs a food charity in the Philippines.

xGyiXkSUzGLmaCYr9FtnEALGzx1RdvKTXc

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=300631.0

[dooglus]

(Seans will not be able to add the address publicly until they all vote it at a board meeting. Adding it to the OP will be one of the only ways ppl can find it.)

I wonder if he could sign a message that states their CLAM address with their public BTC donation address.

That would be much more convincing than 'some guy calling themselves "SeansOutpost" on JD chat said it'.

[SeansOutpost]

Yep, that's our address.

[prospect]

So you announce, on the first page that "clam speech" is some fucking huge thing haha,

https://github.com/nochowderforyou/clams/blob/master/src/clamspeech.cpp

This is just retarded.

[dooglus]

This is just retarded.

Tell us what you really think.

[Vortex20000]

This is just retarded.

Tell us what you really think.

Note the diff in usernames, I'm not him, but...

"Expression of Religious Freedom: Invisible Pink Unicorn"

Wtf.

[dooglus]

This is just retarded.

Tell us what you really think.

Note the diff in usernames, I'm not him, but...

"Expression of Religious Freedom: Invisible Pink Unicorn"

Wtf.

I think the idea is that you fill in your own speech rather than use the pre-filled values. Or maybe that someone submits a pull request changing to the default template strings to something more sensible?

Edit: I just noticed I nearly used 'religion' and 'sensible' in the same sentence!

[ymod123]

if i dont have much coins about 60 only...is it impossible to stake it right?

[dooglus]

if i dont have much coins about 60 only...is it impossible to stake it right?

No, it's still possible.

At the moment, the network stake weight is around 280k. So your 60 is 1/4667 th of the total.

That means you can expect to earn 1 CLAM every 4667 minutes or so.

That's once per 77.77 hours, or 3.25 days.

Luck plays a huge part, but that's the kind of staking frequency you can expect with 60 CLAMs.

[garthkiser]

Note the diff in usernames, I'm not him, but...

"Expression of Religious Freedom: Invisible Pink Unicorn"

Wtf.

I've maintained a pretty tough skin as far as this thread goes.....up until now. This attack upon the Invisible Pink Unicorn is going too far.

[jwinterm]

if i dont have much coins about 60 only...is it impossible to stake it right?

No, it's still possible.

At the moment, the network stake weight is around 280k. So your 60 is 1/4667 th of the total.

That means you can expect to earn 1 CLAM every 4667 minutes or so.

That's once per 77.77 hours, or 3.25 days.

Luck plays a huge part, but that's the kind of staking frequency you can expect with 60 CLAMs.

Sounds about right, I have like 85 and staked two in a bit less than a week.