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Author Topic: Gold collapsing. Bitcoin UP.  (Read 1956555 times)
cypherdoc
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October 15, 2014, 06:59:10 PM
 #13901

every Bitcoiner who's had to endure the "volatility" argument surrounding Bitcoin over the last few years needs to take this opportunity to shove that same argument regarding the stock mkt back into the face of whoever said that to you.

Lol, the DOW moves < 3% in one day ==> OMG VOLATILITY!!!
Bitcoin moves > 5% on the same day ==> sideways trading...

Keep trying Cheesy

Bitcoin is only 5.5 yo.

the Dow is over 100 yo.  what's your excuse?
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October 15, 2014, 07:11:51 PM
 #13902

every Bitcoiner who's had to endure the "volatility" argument surrounding Bitcoin over the last few years needs to take this opportunity to shove that same argument regarding the stock mkt back into the face of whoever said that to you.

Lol, the DOW moves < 3% in one day ==> OMG VOLATILITY!!!
Bitcoin moves > 5% on the same day ==> sideways trading...

Keep trying Cheesy

Bitcoin is only 5.5 yo.

the Dow is over 100 yo.  what's your excuse?

just ignore the troll cypher. Not worth your energy.

Bro, do you even blockchain?
-E Voorhees
sidhujag
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October 15, 2014, 07:15:14 PM
 #13903

every Bitcoiner who's had to endure the "volatility" argument surrounding Bitcoin over the last few years needs to take this opportunity to shove that same argument regarding the stock mkt back into the face of whoever said that to you.

Lol, the DOW moves < 3% in one day ==> OMG VOLATILITY!!!
Bitcoin moves > 5% on the same day ==> sideways trading...

Keep trying Cheesy

Bad comparison. Look at market caps... if they were equal > 5% wouldn't happen.

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NotLambchop
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October 15, 2014, 07:23:48 PM
 #13904

every Bitcoiner who's had to endure the "volatility" argument surrounding Bitcoin over the last few years needs to take this opportunity to shove that same argument regarding the stock mkt back into the face of whoever said that to you.

Lol, the DOW moves < 3% in one day ==> OMG VOLATILITY!!!
Bitcoin moves > 5% on the same day ==> sideways trading...

Keep trying Cheesy

Bitcoin is only 5.5 yo.

the Dow is over 100 yo.  what's your excuse?

Excuse?!  The level of insanity in this thread...
I don't pimp DOW, i don't feel any need to make up excuses for it as you do for Bitcoin.
But hey, if Bitcoin's not mature enough, point taken.  I'll consider it an investment once it matures Smiley
cypherdoc
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October 15, 2014, 07:26:08 PM
 #13905

16000 crossed 9x today.
FNG
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October 15, 2014, 07:26:22 PM
 #13906

Dow going under 16,000???


 Grin
sidhujag
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October 15, 2014, 07:27:13 PM
 #13907

every Bitcoiner who's had to endure the "volatility" argument surrounding Bitcoin over the last few years needs to take this opportunity to shove that same argument regarding the stock mkt back into the face of whoever said that to you.

Lol, the DOW moves < 3% in one day ==> OMG VOLATILITY!!!
Bitcoin moves > 5% on the same day ==> sideways trading...

Keep trying Cheesy

Bitcoin is only 5.5 yo.

the Dow is over 100 yo.  what's your excuse?

Excuse?!  The level of insanity in this thread...
I don't pimp DOW, i don't feel any need to make up excuses for it as you do for Bitcoin.
But hey, if Bitcoin's not mature enough, point taken.  I'll consider it an investment once it matures Smiley

Sure... by then it may be $100k.. that is the point of taking risk of an immature investment.. it is high risk high reward, like a penny stock.

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NotLambchop
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October 15, 2014, 07:32:41 PM
 #13908

^
Not arguing at all.  Just like penny stocks.
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October 15, 2014, 07:36:12 PM
 #13909

16000 crossed 9x today.

That was a nice call on 16K you made earlier. The fed is the only thing between DOW 16k and DOW 3K, where it should probably be about now. I'm pretty sure they'll keep it above 16K today but they're going to be busy tonight wondering what the hell to do in Asia and Europe. Every time the DOW dips, someone is moving significant money out and the fed is pumping money back in using one of its many hidden channels. I wonder where the money that's taken out is being parked.
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October 15, 2014, 07:50:12 PM
 #13910

^
Not arguing at all.  Just like penny stocks.

Gotta start somewhere... we are in the early adoption phase aren't we.

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Pay with Bitcoin, ZCash and many more
For more visit Syscoin.org  ★☆★
sidhujag
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October 15, 2014, 07:53:29 PM
 #13911

16000 crossed 9x today.

That was a nice call on 16K you made earlier. The fed is the only thing between DOW 16k and DOW 3K, where it should probably be about now. I'm pretty sure they'll keep it above 16K today but they're going to be busy tonight wondering what the hell to do in Asia and Europe. Every time the DOW dips, someone is moving significant money out and the fed is pumping money back in using one of its many hidden channels. I wonder where the money that's taken out is being parked.

Yea I know.. its funny in 2011 pretty much it was BOTS and banks trading at the promise of the fed backing them and the market tried to crash so many times but was bought with big volume everytime... like a hidden hand... fundamentals were pretty rough then... however as fed bought (and now owns most of the market) they have to distribute somewhere too... and wonder if they slowly did as it rose. Now that they stepped out of asset purchases there are no buyers left and any bad news shows the real intent of the market (to dump).. until magic wand comes back... its just like currency intervention, until there are enough shorters to make money off of for big fish to eat them up it wont rise. Once shorters come back with margins... it might go back up... right now I think they aren't shorting thinking there is support so  I think there is room to go down still.

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zeetubes
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October 15, 2014, 07:58:59 PM
 #13912

16000 crossed 9x today.

That was a nice call on 16K you made earlier. The fed is the only thing between DOW 16k and DOW 3K, where it should probably be about now. I'm pretty sure they'll keep it above 16K today but they're going to be busy tonight wondering what the hell to do in Asia and Europe. Every time the DOW dips, someone is moving significant money out and the fed is pumping money back in using one of its many hidden channels. I wonder where the money that's taken out is being parked.

Yea I know.. its funny in 2011 pretty much it was BOTS and banks trading at the promise of the fed backing them and the market tried to crash so many times but was bought with big volume everytime... like a hidden hand... fundamentals were pretty rough then... however as fed bought (and now owns most of the market) they have to distribute somewhere too... and wonder if they slowly did as it rose. Now that they stepped out of asset purchases there are no buyers left and any bad news shows the real intent of the market (to dump).. until magic wand comes back... its just like currency intervention, until there are enough shorters to make money off of for big fish to eat them up it wont rise. Once shorters come back with margins... it might go back up... right now I think they aren't shorting thinking there is support so  I think there is room to go down still.

I'm guessing the <CTL> P key on the Fed's keyboard is looking a little worn out. 
cypherdoc
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October 15, 2014, 08:04:00 PM
 #13913

16000 crossed 9x today.

That was a nice call on 16K you made earlier. The fed is the only thing between DOW 16k and DOW 3K, where it should probably be about now. I'm pretty sure they'll keep it above 16K today but they're going to be busy tonight wondering what the hell to do in Asia and Europe. Every time the DOW dips, someone is moving significant money out and the fed is pumping money back in using one of its many hidden channels. I wonder where the money that's taken out is being parked.

along with the end of day ramp.  altho it those ramps can get even more intense than it was.

it can get truly ridiculous.
NotLambchop
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October 15, 2014, 08:10:13 PM
 #13914

^
Not arguing at all.  Just like penny stocks.

Gotta start somewhere... we are in the early adoption phase aren't we.

Again, not arguing.
If you look back, I simply commented on the hilarity of cypher's "every Bitcoiner who's had to endure the "volatility" argument surrounding Bitcoin over the last few years needs to take this opportunity to shove that same argument regarding the stock mkt back into the face of whoever said that to you."
zeetubes
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October 15, 2014, 08:15:27 PM
 #13915

16000 crossed 9x today.

That was a nice call on 16K you made earlier. The fed is the only thing between DOW 16k and DOW 3K, where it should probably be about now. I'm pretty sure they'll keep it above 16K today but they're going to be busy tonight wondering what the hell to do in Asia and Europe. Every time the DOW dips, someone is moving significant money out and the fed is pumping money back in using one of its many hidden channels. I wonder where the money that's taken out is being parked.

along with the end of day ramp.  altho it those ramps can get even more intense than it was.

it can get truly ridiculous.

Yup. It would be an interesting exercise to look at the last seven years of DOW history and work out on days when it was both down and falling at 3.30pm what you would make if you had invested at ~3.35pm and then pulled out at ~3.55pm.
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October 15, 2014, 08:15:57 PM
 #13916

Actually,  if we had 15 or 30 sec charts, it would have crossed 16k probably 20x.

The algos will hunt you down.
cypherdoc
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October 15, 2014, 08:21:07 PM
 #13917

16000 crossed 9x today.

That was a nice call on 16K you made earlier. The fed is the only thing between DOW 16k and DOW 3K, where it should probably be about now. I'm pretty sure they'll keep it above 16K today but they're going to be busy tonight wondering what the hell to do in Asia and Europe. Every time the DOW dips, someone is moving significant money out and the fed is pumping money back in using one of its many hidden channels. I wonder where the money that's taken out is being parked.

along with the end of day ramp.  altho it those ramps can get even more intense than it was.

it can get truly ridiculous.

Yup. It would be an interesting exercise to look at the last seven years of DOW history and work out on days when it was both down and falling at 3.30pm what you would make if you had invested at ~3.35pm and then pulled out at ~3.55pm.

Back in 2008,someone did that study, or something very similar; buying/selling in the last half hour or so based on some such strategy.

My favorite one; wait for the Warren Buffett rumor to come out hinting that he was going to buy out Hovnanian, or some other tanking home builder. Guaranteed for a 300 point ramp in 10 minutes. Must have happened half a dozen times.
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October 15, 2014, 08:28:03 PM
 #13918

Do you follow Soros at all?

George Soros Is Betting on This Risky Stock: Should You?
sidhujag
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October 15, 2014, 08:35:25 PM
 #13919

16000 crossed 9x today.

That was a nice call on 16K you made earlier. The fed is the only thing between DOW 16k and DOW 3K, where it should probably be about now. I'm pretty sure they'll keep it above 16K today but they're going to be busy tonight wondering what the hell to do in Asia and Europe. Every time the DOW dips, someone is moving significant money out and the fed is pumping money back in using one of its many hidden channels. I wonder where the money that's taken out is being parked.

along with the end of day ramp.  altho it those ramps can get even more intense than it was.

it can get truly ridiculous.

Yup. It would be an interesting exercise to look at the last seven years of DOW history and work out on days when it was both down and falling at 3.30pm what you would make if you had invested at ~3.35pm and then pulled out at ~3.55pm.

Back in 2008,someone did that study, or something very similar; buying/selling in the last half hour or so based on some such strategy.

My favorite one; wait for the Warren Buffett rumor to come out hinting that he was going to buy out Hovnanian, or some other tanking home builder. Guaranteed for a 300 point ramp in 10 minutes. Must have happened half a dozen times.

Aside from the manipulations I came up with an option strategy that would take advantage of the volatility of the market opens/closes... essentially capatilizing on the fact that the theta did not price in volatility at market open on days where options were set to expire in 2 to 3 weeks and previous days didnt have crazy volume. Essentially you would straddle both sides and sell the profitable side once you double up or more depending on what time it is.... and then hold the losing side until expiry or you see fit as a free trade... idea is you would hit homeruns with no risk other than the theta of the option but you are only holding for a few hours so the theta vs the potential to have unlimited gains was a win win for me... I did some paper trades and noticed that alot of mornings the theta would drastically change and gave up but I know its a killer strategy as out of 10 days it would give me more than half profitable days (an edge)... I just didn't have the time to really automate it or put a large sum of cash in an exchange to try it out.. would mean getting up at 5am every morning too so I left it for a rainy day... wonder if anyone has had experience with a system like it? I know some start up trading firm in NY was highlighted after it raked in millions for doing something very similar.

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For more visit Syscoin.org  ★☆★
cypherdoc
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October 15, 2014, 08:59:16 PM
 #13920

16000 crossed 9x today.

That was a nice call on 16K you made earlier. The fed is the only thing between DOW 16k and DOW 3K, where it should probably be about now. I'm pretty sure they'll keep it above 16K today but they're going to be busy tonight wondering what the hell to do in Asia and Europe. Every time the DOW dips, someone is moving significant money out and the fed is pumping money back in using one of its many hidden channels. I wonder where the money that's taken out is being parked.

along with the end of day ramp.  altho it those ramps can get even more intense than it was.

it can get truly ridiculous.

Yup. It would be an interesting exercise to look at the last seven years of DOW history and work out on days when it was both down and falling at 3.30pm what you would make if you had invested at ~3.35pm and then pulled out at ~3.55pm.

Back in 2008,someone did that study, or something very similar; buying/selling in the last half hour or so based on some such strategy.

My favorite one; wait for the Warren Buffett rumor to come out hinting that he was going to buy out Hovnanian, or some other tanking home builder. Guaranteed for a 300 point ramp in 10 minutes. Must have happened half a dozen times.

Aside from the manipulations I came up with an option strategy that would take advantage of the volatility of the market opens/closes... essentially capatilizing on the fact that the theta did not price in volatility at market open on days where options were set to expire in 2 to 3 weeks and previous days didnt have crazy volume. Essentially you would straddle both sides and sell the profitable side once you double up or more depending on what time it is.... and then hold the losing side until expiry or you see fit as a free trade... idea is you would hit homeruns with no risk other than the theta of the option but you are only holding for a few hours so the theta vs the potential to have unlimited gains was a win win for me... I did some paper trades and noticed that alot of mornings the theta would drastically change and gave up but I know its a killer strategy as out of 10 days it would give me more than half profitable days (an edge)... I just didn't have the time to really automate it or put a large sum of cash in an exchange to try it out.. would mean getting up at 5am every morning too so I left it for a rainy day... wonder if anyone has had experience with a system like it? I know some start up trading firm in NY was highlighted after it raked in millions for doing something very similar.

i don't trade options as i'm very averse to time pressure.  of course, the flipside of that is i'm exposed to infinite losses in either direction if i'm stubborn.  i prefer to rely on a mixture of fundamentals and swing trading using cycles and other assorted indicators. 

as far as your theta trade, i've never understood how taking both sides of a trade and then selling the profitable one is any different than just shorting or buying a put after the underlying has gone up 2x or so.

there are all sorts of strategies like this and they usually work until they don't.
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