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Author Topic: Gold collapsing. Bitcoin UP.  (Read 1806854 times)
cypherdoc
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October 08, 2014, 02:07:52 AM
 #13501

Recently discovered this thread to be the most interesting and meaningful in the forum. Nice signal to noise ratio.

Thanks Cypher&Co.  Wink

but you have to promise to allow me to get into the occasional food fight with the trolls.  they are what give me my inspiration.

Dude, don't fool yourself; you are one of the biggest trolls around.  Some of my favorite people on this site are inveterate trolls.  And some of those who are the most relevant and worth paying attention to I might add.  You being one of them for sure.



from you, i'll take that as a compliment. Smiley

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cypherdoc
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October 08, 2014, 02:16:21 AM
 #13502

this is really not good for pm's:





and my trusty leading royalty trust just broke an even longer term trend line:

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October 08, 2014, 02:18:28 AM
 #13503

nice graph from Pantera.  Bitcoin continuing to gain on altscams:

https://cdn.panteracapital.com/wp-content/uploads/Pantera-Bitcoin-Letter-September-2014.pdf






This is my new favorite chart.

you see that dip in march, that's my alt portfolio right there. (not my volume, just the following depreciation)  Smiley

I'm thinking the same thing is going to happen during the next run up.

This is legitimately good news. I hate altscams

Very true... Everyone is realizing alt coins are a scam anyway. If we just all stuck to BTC I bet the price would be a lot higher & it would have way more attention from the media and others in the financial industry

Bitcoin has an inelastic supply, if you think about that in a typically adoption curve the first adopters are you're technically literate consumers they are the ones who know and do as opposed to follow. Now given Bitcoin also has limited space for technically literate innovators one would expect some way to contribute.

What the alt coin development cycle represents is Bitcoin's still in the innovation stage of the adoption cycle.

While I have made mistakes what happened on a technical level is many new innovations who developed altcoins exchanged them for Bitcoin. The net result is Bitcoin distributing to the innovators in the adoption cycle.

So it's good news for Bitcoin and typically one would see all stages of the adoption cycle happen in alts (driven by Bitcoin's cycle)

Ultimately one needs to learn that it's about Bitcoin while alts may outshine Bitcoin during the growth spurts they will crash hard, and most will not profit from this the big oporunity.

Thank me in Bits 12MwnzxtprG2mHm3rKdgi7NmJKCypsMMQw
cypherdoc
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October 08, 2014, 03:49:42 AM
 #13504

this is messed up man; oil going off the cliff after hours.  notice how we've slid off the mountain, breaking support and are in freefall essentially in the 3y daily chart:

fff13
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October 08, 2014, 04:13:31 AM
 #13505

Lately its been gold down AND bitcoin, do you see it decoupling soon?

BTC: 1GtZdBxbNpsLRUPcrHzDjCycEF7rkJ4Agh
cypherdoc
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October 08, 2014, 04:58:04 AM
 #13506

Lately its been gold down AND bitcoin, do you see it decoupling soon?


i do
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October 08, 2014, 05:43:04 AM
 #13507


I love Bitcoin, but it seems they might love it even more than I do.  Wow.  

Edit: market cap potential of $75 trillion?  I think the S&P 500 passed $15 trillion last year, which would still put it at probably less than $17 trillion in cap. 

$4,291,060 per coin

and they call me bullish

 Grin Grin Grin Shocked


Heh. Yeah, weird when a price-per-bitcoin target in a research report about bitcoin-vs-gold gets people in *this* thread to say "uhhh....that's just too bullish". Myself included.

Bitcoin is the first monetary system to credibly offer perfect information to all economic participants.
But Bitcointalk & /r/bitcoin are heavily censored. bitco.in/forum, forum.bitcoin.com, and /r/btc are open.
Best info on Casascius coins: http://spotcoins.com/casascius
tabnloz
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October 08, 2014, 05:52:32 AM
 #13508

Rickards latest:

Deflation. Everything down including gold because of strong USD (similar to what has been suggested in this thread)

Increase in USD was in part planned, to help struggling EUR, JPY; problem being that US economy not as strong as thought.

Dollar will fall Mar - Jun 2015 as people realise US recovery is not real.



It will be interesting to see if bitcoin can decouple from the downtrend while everything else continues down in the face of USD strength.



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October 08, 2014, 06:00:01 AM
 #13509


I love Bitcoin, but it seems they might love it even more than I do.  Wow.  

Edit: market cap potential of $75 trillion?  I think the S&P 500 passed $15 trillion last year, which would still put it at probably less than $17 trillion in cap. 

$4,291,060 per coin

and they call me bullish

 Grin Grin Grin Shocked


Heh. Yeah, weird when a price-per-bitcoin target in a research report about bitcoin-vs-gold gets people in *this* thread to say "uhhh....that's just too bullish". Myself included.

Wow, they're essentially saying if bitcoin became the future reserve monetary asset globally, replacing all currencies and all gold, then it's valuation would be the sum total of all gold and worldwide M2 monetary supply, which comes to $4.2M per coin.

Even _if_ this happens (and that's a big if because there will always be holdout countries and gold bugs who refuse to join the bandwagon), their $4.2 valuation still probably greatly overshoots for a variety of reasons. For example in a true sound money system that lacks CB bailouts the total M2-to-RealGDP ratio would probably be much lower than today due to lower leverage and significantly lower fractionalization by whatever banks exist then.
Melbustus
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October 08, 2014, 06:10:46 AM
 #13510

...
For example in a true sound money system that lacks CB bailouts the total M2-to-RealGDP ratio would probably be much lower than today due to lower leverage and significantly lower fractionalization by whatever banks exist then.


Well, they used M2, not M3 or some other bigger measure... It's probably not unreasonable to count M2 as the target, since that comprises what we really think of as core money; ie, what's in our bank accounts. The weird leveraged stuff doesn't come into play until higher-order aggregates.

And note that the fact that banks create most of the bank-account money through fractional reserve doesn't matter for the validly of using M2 as bitcoin's target... M2 is effectively the sum of the real base *money*; ie, balances of the thing we use directly as the unit of account/exchange. In a bitcoin world, we would still need exactly these balances in bitcoin.

Bitcoin is the first monetary system to credibly offer perfect information to all economic participants.
But Bitcointalk & /r/bitcoin are heavily censored. bitco.in/forum, forum.bitcoin.com, and /r/btc are open.
Best info on Casascius coins: http://spotcoins.com/casascius
Hunyadi
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October 08, 2014, 06:27:30 AM
 #13511

Rickards latest:

Deflation. Everything down including gold because of strong USD (similar to what has been suggested in this thread)


Quote
It will be interesting to see if bitcoin can decouple from the downtrend while everything else continues down in the face of USD strength.


If everything else would be going down and bitcoin going up, that could mean super hyper mega bubb...ramp up in bitcoin price  Grin The Manipulator, make it happen!

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smoothie
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October 08, 2014, 06:50:40 AM
 #13512

"The Dollar is strong"....lol

I'd say that "The Dollar is less weak than it was a little while ago but only temporarily."

$1000+ for an oz of gold....1000 dollars to one ounce of gold....i'd say that the dollar is pretty weak.

 Grin Grin Grin

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October 08, 2014, 07:03:18 AM
 #13513

"The Dollar is strong"....lol

I'd say that "The Dollar is less weak than it was a little while ago but only temporarily."

$1000+ for an oz of gold....1000 dollars to one ounce of gold....i'd say that the dollar is pretty weak.

 Grin Grin Grin


EUR/USD= 1.2636



pretty weak indeed..
inb4 the euro/dollar 1/1 parity Grin
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October 08, 2014, 07:57:34 AM
 #13514


I love Bitcoin, but it seems they might love it even more than I do.  Wow.  

Edit: market cap potential of $75 trillion?  I think the S&P 500 passed $15 trillion last year, which would still put it at probably less than $17 trillion in cap. 

$4,291,060 per coin

and they call me bullish

 Grin Grin Grin Shocked


Heh. Yeah, weird when a price-per-bitcoin target in a research report about bitcoin-vs-gold gets people in *this* thread to say "uhhh....that's just too bullish". Myself included.

Wow, they're essentially saying if bitcoin became the future reserve monetary asset globally, replacing all currencies and all gold, then it's valuation would be the sum total of all gold and worldwide M2 monetary supply, which comes to $4.2M per coin.

Even _if_ this happens (and that's a big if because there will always be holdout countries and gold bugs who refuse to join the bandwagon), their $4.2 valuation still probably greatly overshoots for a variety of reasons. For example in a true sound money system that lacks CB bailouts the total M2-to-RealGDP ratio would probably be much lower than today due to lower leverage and significantly lower fractionalization by whatever banks exist then.

"Pantera Capital is an investment firm focused exclusively on Bitcoin, other digital currencies and companies in the space."
https://panteracapital.com/about/

It is called "talking your book".

FREE MONEY1 Bitcoin for Silver and Gold NewLibertyDollar.com and now BITCOIN SPECIE (silver 1 ozt) shows value by QR
Bulk premiums as low as .0012 BTC "BETTER, MORE COLLECTIBLE, AND CHEAPER THAN SILVER EAGLES" 1Free of Government
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October 08, 2014, 08:06:57 AM
 #13515

this is messed up man; oil going off the cliff after hours.  notice how we've slid off the mountain, breaking support and are in freefall essentially in the 3y daily chart:



I am skeptical about the downward TA breakthroughs on all of these charts, including the PM just because they are dollar denominated and dollars are high. (maybe too high?).  It may still be a little too soon to tell, but certainly 3rd world resource exporters are getting crushed.

Dollar is all jacked up on overextended QE which has pushed equities into the stratosphere.  This is just now starting to unwind, but is going to take a long time.
The worst of it is that QE is now deemed a success so we will probably see a lot more of it.
Banks are still holding on to all the cash and not lending (not at these rates, they aren't crazy).  When they do start lending, it will be a delicate balance between productive investment (on their part, they have all the money just now), and inflation.

There is some incentive to be first out of the gate in this so that the competition's cash assets get inflated more.  There are potential cascading risks, and complexity issues, which can get compounded if there is a reverse run on banks (fighting to profitably lend). 

Things can get weird.  So happy for Bitcoin just now.

FREE MONEY1 Bitcoin for Silver and Gold NewLibertyDollar.com and now BITCOIN SPECIE (silver 1 ozt) shows value by QR
Bulk premiums as low as .0012 BTC "BETTER, MORE COLLECTIBLE, AND CHEAPER THAN SILVER EAGLES" 1Free of Government
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October 08, 2014, 10:13:34 AM
 #13516


I love Bitcoin, but it seems they might love it even more than I do.  Wow.  

Edit: market cap potential of $75 trillion?  I think the S&P 500 passed $15 trillion last year, which would still put it at probably less than $17 trillion in cap. 

Call it an "upper bound" on price .... but if btc ever gets near $4.3 mill then you'll be wiping your bottom with dead presidents faces and the world will be a very different place, hopefully for the better.

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October 08, 2014, 10:48:06 AM
 #13517

EUR/USD= 1.2636



pretty weak indeed..
inb4 the euro/dollar 1/1 parity Grin

Excellent time to be earning dollars, spending euros and saving in bitcoins Smiley

It's all bullshit. But bullshit makes the flowers grow and that's beautiful.
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October 08, 2014, 11:08:51 AM
 #13518


I love Bitcoin, but it seems they might love it even more than I do.  Wow.  

Edit: market cap potential of $75 trillion?  I think the S&P 500 passed $15 trillion last year, which would still put it at probably less than $17 trillion in cap. 

$4,291,060 per coin

and they call me bullish

 Grin Grin Grin Shocked

those wet dreams about becoming a bitcoin millionaire...

new goal: becoming a bitcoin billionaire

 Grin
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October 08, 2014, 11:49:19 AM
 #13519

All your coins are belonging to us: http://abcnews.go.com/Business/judge-10-rare-gold-coins-worth-80-million/story?id=17159793

The last 24 hours were critical but the next 24 hours are criticaller!
btcney
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October 08, 2014, 12:09:28 PM
 #13520


I love Bitcoin, but it seems they might love it even more than I do.  Wow.  

Edit: market cap potential of $75 trillion?  I think the S&P 500 passed $15 trillion last year, which would still put it at probably less than $17 trillion in cap. 

$4,291,060 per coin

and they call me bullish

 Grin Grin Grin Shocked

those wet dreams about becoming a bitcoin millionaire...

new goal: becoming a bitcoin billionaire

 Grin
I'd be okay with 100k too.
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